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There is no real point in life.

no, its not assumptions. its obvious you lack some key understanding of the teaching and understanding to how far can meditation can bring you.
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It may seem obvious to you, but I don't think you're seeing clearly.

otherwise you wouldnt dismiss it like you do.
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I never dismissed Buddhism. I never dismissed meditation.
You keep referring to things that I haven't done.

you think you know what it is to live a monkhood and so are able to say that you dont want that.
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I genuinely don't want to be a monk...
I know enough about monks and about my direction in life to know that.
Not everybody wants to be a monk. That doesn't mean they don't understand monks.
Just like not everybody wanting to identify as Buddhist doesn't mean they don't understand Buddhism.
Your logic is wrong.

but you dont even know what it is to reach a jhana or what a jhana is.
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Again, assumptions.
How do you know what I know?

Ive also had profound feeling in psychadelic
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I've experienced something an infinite amount stronger than psychedelics.

just read about the jhanas and the experience they describe will resonate deeply with your psy experience. but again, I doubt you will go and read about the jhanas and hence me thinking you dont seem to want to learn and just want to state your opinion.
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I already have. Stop with the assumptions.
 
ForEverAfter said:
You said you were agnostic, yet you have "atheistic" tendencies as far as the meaning of life goes.
I'm not sure how you can selectively agnostic. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
A lot of atheists misguidedly think they can logically disprove God.
Your logic (disproving the point of life) is as flawed as theirs.



Here's a hypothetical.

If God is everything and exists in a timeless void, perhaps He feels the "need" to split / fragment His consciousness in order to stave off (His version of) boredom/insanity... In other words: perhaps we are fractions of God, with retrograde amnesia. If so, we cannot know we are God for this theory to function and - therefore - the point of our lives involves not knowing the point of our lives... Similarly, when we dream, we do not know that we are dreaming. Becoming conscious of the dream / achieving lucidity while unconscious is analogous to enlightenment. It is a function of dreams, that we are unaware that they are dreams. This does not render them pointless.
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Just because there might be a God or gods doesn't mean that there is a point to life.
Look up Gnosticism, for example.
Even if the universe was created by a diety, why does that prove that there is a point? what if he/she/they just created the universe to see what would happen?
 
I was talking to Trying2Iso...

But, to answer your question, I didn't really have a point.
I just like having discussions.
Why? What's your point?
 
The world and universe itself is so vast, different, strange, wild, etc. People are SO different,
that putting one single "point" to life would be impossible, because there's no way every person on Earth could, would, or should conform to one point.
If there is a point (which i don't believe there is), it would probably be so long and extensive you could fill several libraries with it.
 
Again, I don't really get your logic.
The vastness of the universe doesn't imply anything about the complexity of the meaning of life.
Who said anything about people conforming to one point?

Like I said, we may not even be aware of it.
My hypothetical, above, is an example of how this is possible.
 
Life is extremely complex, people are extremely complex, and different, so i imagine the point of life would be complex as well.
We do not live in a simple universe, and humans are not simple creatures. A large part of what has happened up to this point is random.
I can testify that my life has been random. very random.
The idea that all of this has a point is unlikely.
 
People are varied in many ways - sure - but they're also similar in many ways... We tend to celebrate our differences, and embrace individuality, so we may - generally speaking - have a heightened awareness of the variations and a reduced awareness of the similarities... But, we aren't really that different, if you think about it... We're more similar than we are different...

The point of life pertains to all living beings in the universe, not just humans.
And, yes, life is varied. But that doesn't imply anything about the point of life.
Television shows are varied, but their point is simple: to entertain.

Human bodies are extremely complex relative to their cellular makeup, but that doesn't mean that the function of a blood cell is particularly complex.
Bees are not aware that the point of their relationship with flowers is pollination.

You're making a lot of assumptions about the point.

A large part of what has happened up to this point is random.
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Just because something is beyond your understanding, doesn't - necessarily - make it random... Regardless, randomness implies nothing about the theoretical "point" of life... I can write you a program that generates random numbers, to hack passwords. Simply because the isolated events in the program happen to be randomly generated, doesn't render it (the program) incapable of breaking a simple password and - therefore - having a definite function.

If a cell in your body developed consciousness, would it be able to ascertain it's function?
Would it know it was part of a larger, much more complex, entity?
Does not knowing it's function imply that it doesn't have one?

Your logic is backwards and upside-down.
 
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ForEverAfter said:
People are varied in many ways - sure - but they're also similar in many ways... We tend to celebrate our differences, and embrace individuality, so we may have a heightened awareness of the variations and a reduced awareness of the similarities... We aren't that different, if you think about it. We're more similar than we are different.

But the point of life pertains to all living beings in the universe, not just humans.
And, yes, life is varied. But that doesn't imply anything about the point of life.
Television shows are varied, but their point is simple: to entertain.

Human bodies are extremely complex relative to their cellular makeup, but that doesn't mean that the function of a blood cell is particularly complex.
Bees are not aware that the point of their relationship with flowers is pollination.
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Yeah um there are people who are complete opposites. Jeffrey Dahmer and Mother Theresa, for example... People are very different.

Television shows aren't always to entertain, they are also to inform, educate, etc. TV is a great example of diversity. Everything from porn, to Food network, to the news, to EWTN, vast differences and purposes...

Btw did you know that the human brain is so far the most complex object in the known universe? Neurology is just only beginning, there is so much we don't know.
look it up, the scientific community agrees, human brain is THE most complicated.
 
Fair point.
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What? We were involved in a mutual discussion. Why do I have to have an agenda?
If you go back and read our discussion, from the beginning, it's pretty clear that I was being civil and patient throughout the entire discussion...
 
Trying2Iso said:
Yeah um there are people who are complete opposites. Jeffrey Dahmer and Mother Theresa, for example... People are very different.
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Jeffrey Dahmer and Mother Theresa aren't complete opposites.
They might have completely opposite personalities.
Like I said we embrace our individuality.
But, in the end, we're all apes.

Television shows aren't always to entertain, they are also to inform, educate, etc. TV is a great example of diversity. Everything from porn, to Food network, to the news, to EWTN, vast differences and purposes...
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I think you're missing the point. I'll rephrase slightly.
Fictional comedic television shows are varied, but their point is simple: to entertain.
It is a simple example that disproves your logic. Variability doesn't imply the absence of a unified function.
I can give you thousands of examples.

Btw did you know that the human brain is so far the most complex object in the known universe? Neurology is just only beginning, there is so much we don't know.
look it up, the scientific community agrees, human brain is THE most complicated.
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I'm not sure what your point is, here... and technically your statement is incorrect.
The human brain may be the most complicated organ, but it isn't the most complicated object.

A whale brain would have a similar density of neurones as a human brain, and is physically larger, so wouldn't that make a whale brain more complex than a human brain? A human contains a human brain, so wouldn't that make a human more complex than a human brain? The Earth carries many humans and whales, so wouldn't that make the Earth's ecosystem more complex than the human brain? The (Milky Way galaxy) holds many planets, stars and other objects (including the Earth), so wouldn't (that make the galaxy more complex than a human brain)?
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http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=51418.0
 
ForEverAfter said:
Jeffrey Dahmer and Mother Theresa aren't complete opposites.
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Jeffrey Dahmer raped boys and men, then killed them, then raped their dead bodies again, then ate them.

Mother Teresa spent her life in the slums of Calcutta feeding the poor and running charities all over India. For free.

If you say that these people are even remotely similar, i can't really respect your intellect at this point.
You seem to be pretty detached from logic.
 
1. They are both descended from apes.
2. They both have a mother and a father.
3. They were both born on the planet Earth.
4. They both urinate.
5. They both eat.
6. They both shit.
7. They both wear clothes.
8. They both rape boys and kill them. (Wait, no, scrap that one.) ;)

I agreed they may indeed have opposite personalities, but they're not opposite in many other ways.
You said there are people who are complete opposites. This is not true.
The complete opposite of a person would not be a person.

Variation in personality does not have any bearing on the point of life (or human life, for that matter).
I can see this is going nowhere with you, so I'm going to go to sleep.
Goodnight.

You seem to be pretty detached from logic.
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Indeed you do.
 
ForEverAfter said:
1. They are both descended from apes.
2. They both have a mother and a father.
3. They were both born on the planet Earth.
4. They both urinate.
5. They both eat.
6. They both shit.
7. They both wear clothes.
8. They both rape boys and kill them. (Wait, no, scrap that one.) ;)

I agreed they may indeed have opposite personalities, but they're not opposite in many other ways.
You said there are people who are complete opposites. This is not true.
The complete opposite of a person would not be a person.

Variation in personality does not have any bearing on the point of life (or human life, for that matter).
I can see this is going nowhere with you, so I'm going to go to sleep.
Goodnight.



Indeed you do.
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lmao. you are indeed grasping at straws.
If there was a point to life, it would involve more than bodily functions and being the same species.
Human's aren't just any organisms.
There's a reason that if someone is declared brain-dead, they pull the plug.
What makes us human is our personality, intellect, decision-making, morals, consciences, ideas, and emotions.
Reducing humans to shitting, urinating, clothes-wearing creatures does not mark any similarities in these two people's personas.

but i would love for you to write again that you think Jeffrey Dahmer and Mother Teresa are similar. i need a good laugh.
 
My God, you're being silly.

1. I didn't say Dahmer and Theresa are similar. I said they aren't complete opposites, and they're not.
2. I didn't reduce the human race to biological functions, either. I listed some as examples of the many similarities that all humans share.
3. I never said, or implied in any way, that the point of life was directly related to bodily functions.
4. And, for the third time now, I said that they may well have opposite personalities.

You are not reading what I'm writing.
This conversation is pointless.

I'll try one last time.
Don't be so quick to reject everything I say. Actually consider it for a moment.
If you think my logic is flawed, maybe try to explain why...

I'll keep it really simple.
Reply to the following:

me said:
Variability doesn't imply the absence of a unified function.
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The cells in our body vary enormously, but they have a unified function.

me said:
I can give you thousands of examples.
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...

If you'd like examples, you're going to have to wait till tomorrow.
If you cannot refute the logic, then it stands.

Good night.
 
So if they have opposite personalities, a point of life would be futile because this proves that not all humans are able to live up to it.
Humans are so vastly different from each other in so many ways, expecting them to live up to a single point of life (you keep saying point as singular, implying that there is only one) would be ridiculous.
That's why i don't believe there is a point to life.
 
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