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The Big & Dandy Oral DMT thread (Ayahuasca/Pharmahuasca)

What does it look like modified? Usually if it's pharmahuasca it's going to be some kind of MAOI - so it'll either be a 300mg tablet of moclobemide, or some yellowish extract of syrian rue seeds/caapi bark. And then you'll have the DMT which will be a yellow/orange crystal powder.

It's yellowish, you can see the goldish DM in it, and then there's another shade of yellow/orange as well which I'm assuming is the MAOI. 300mg sounds about right, but the capsule wont open for some reason, so I fear that if I keep trying I'll throw it all over the place.

Any known issues with diet pre-dropping?
 
Well the 300mg would be the dose for moclobemide - but that would be a white tablet. For syrian rue I thought the dose would be several grams. Then you'd need 100-200mg of DMT freebase on top of that.

Is it all just in one capsule? It's always better to take the MAOI about 45 minutes before the DMT because otherwise your body just deactivates the DMT before the MAOI stops that happening.

Not sure what you've got there mate. If it's all just yellow/orange maybe it's all DMT freebase?

Dietwise try and stay away from tyramines which is usually strong cheeses and aged beers. Nothing too major.
 
Wanting to try Ayahuasca

Ok so I am new to phycadelics completely. I had looked up other phycs, but thought this was the best. I have pretty bad anxiety and can get really bad sometimes with weed. Do you think this will amp up anxiety? Or can it cause permant phycosis? Also I'm on celexa and I heard about this substances anti depressant like qualities. Would there be a interaction? Thanks!
 
Yeah, I've heard it can be very strong but my cousin (and others) bad mushroom trip she tried to kill herself. LSD I know you can get brain damage and that would really fuck up my anxiety.I was thinking salvia because it only lasts 2 min but I heard that can hit really hard too.
 
Classic psychedelics like mushrooms and LSD are physically very, very safe, there is no reason to fear brain damage from using them. Psychosis can occur, but is extremely rare and is mostly if not always caused by either extreme dosage or predisposition (or both, naturally). Bad trips on the other hand can occur, most often because of unsuitable set / setting - people, place, general situation, mind set - but can be avoided. Psychedelic experience in itself can be difficult and painful when one is forced to deal with long buried issues, this is something that is good to keep in mind, IMHO. Like slimvictor suggested above, Erowid is a great resource for trip reports to get a little feel of what the substance in your mind would be like, though the experience in itself can not be conveyed in words.

Ayahuasca / DMT is EXTREMELY powerful psychedelic / entheogenic agent, and I too would suggest starting with something else. I personally know people who used Ayahuasca for their first trip and everything went beautifully, but mushrooms would in my opinion be a much safer starting point. You can start low, like around 1-1,5g of dried P. Cubensis (the most commonly grown and sold magic mushroom) to get a feel what psychedelics are really like, without much risk of serious freak out, though some people are much more sensitive to these. It would be also good to have benzos at hand as they can pretty well ground you if things go sour.

SSRI meds like Celexa (citalopram) are known to kill the effects of psychedelics. It is likely that while you're on the medication you can't trip or will at least need much more than others to achieve the same effects. However, if you decide to try, still start low as everyone reacts differently. Be safe!
 
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Taking ayahuasca while on an SSRI like celexa may lead to serotonin syndrome, so that's not a good idea.
 
Because Ayahuasca brew contains MAOIs to allow DMT to be active orally, and MAOI + SSRI = bad news.
 
hey guys, I've been researching the subject of pharmahuasca for about a week now in order to learn the basics and determine my personal recipe for it, and I have a few questions.

I was talking to someone who sent me a link regarding what not to eat 24 hours before the trip, and they also filled me in on fasting the day of (or only eating some fruits) so I think I have the diet bit down. I have written a whole bunch of information in my notebook regarding the diet, SSRIs, trip setting and mental state. I have also begun to try and figure out exactly what amounts of each ingredient I will need for a first time.


I plan to start with taking about 200mg of capsuled syrian rue extract, obtained from a local sacred herb shop. I'm assuming that the extract contains harmaline, correct? If it's actually harmine, I'll be taking 300mg.

After about 20 or so minutes after that, I will be taking around 60mg of DMT. I plan to mix the DMT freebase with a shot of lemon juice or cola and converting it to a salt first prior to ingestion. Once I have taken that, I will be eating a piece of bread that's either been buttered or dipped in olive oil. I was told that this may push the DMT through my liver and speed up metabolism.

And then I will lay down and wait for about 30-45 minutes, with a bucket nearby, just in case I feel nauseous. I'm hoping that I have the correct dose of the MAOI and DMT so that any nausea will be reduced. I was also told that converting the DMT to a salt will also help to reduce any sickness.

I guess what I want to know is if I am taking the right dose of rue extract and DMT for a beginner, and if I have the route of administration correct. Are there any other things I should be looking out for? Is my recipe correct? Any help is appreciated, I would like to make sure I am doing this correctly and as safely as possible, with as little side effects.
 
hey guys, I've been researching the subject of pharmahuasca for about a week now in order to learn the basics and determine my personal recipe for it, and I have a few questions.

I was talking to someone who sent me a link regarding what not to eat 24 hours before the trip, and they also filled me in on fasting the day of (or only eating some fruits) so I think I have the diet bit down. I have written a whole bunch of information in my notebook regarding the diet, SSRIs, trip setting and mental state. I have also begun to try and figure out exactly what amounts of each ingredient I will need for a first time.


I plan to start with taking about 200mg of capsuled syrian rue extract, obtained from a local sacred herb shop. I'm assuming that the extract contains harmaline, correct? If it's actually harmine, I'll be taking 300mg.

After about 20 or so minutes after that, I will be taking around 60mg of DMT. I plan to mix the DMT freebase with a shot of lemon juice or cola and converting it to a salt first prior to ingestion. Once I have taken that, I will be eating a piece of bread that's either been buttered or dipped in olive oil. I was told that this may push the DMT through my liver and speed up metabolism.

And then I will lay down and wait for about 30-45 minutes, with a bucket nearby, just in case I feel nauseous. I'm hoping that I have the correct dose of the MAOI and DMT so that any nausea will be reduced. I was also told that converting the DMT to a salt will also help to reduce any sickness.

I guess what I want to know is if I am taking the right dose of rue extract and DMT for a beginner, and if I have the route of administration correct. Are there any other things I should be looking out for? Is my recipe correct? Any help is appreciated, I would like to make sure I am doing this correctly and as safely as possible, with as little side effects.

I think the only major part of dieting in regards to aya/pharma is drugs. Food is less important, and oftentimes the risks w/ combining harmala alkaoids with certain foods is greatly exaggerated. Just eat a basic diet the day you dose, without any drugs/metabolites in your system beforehand. Avoid meat, cheese, dairy, and foods that are harder to digest the day you dose. Things that feel healthy for you too eat has been a great tool for me. I fast 3-4 hours before pharma.

As far as how much harmalas, it depends on the purity of the extract. If its a yellow crystalline solid that dissolves almost completely in water to make a yellow semi-transparent solution, i'd say 200mg of rue extract is a good place to start. If its a red, brown, crude extract you may need more. Doing a manske on whatever you buy by dissolving it in hot vinegar water, filtering, and adding the same amount of water saturated with salt when hot will greatly clean up your extract and should precipitate crystals when cooled.

For the dmt, take it 20m after the rue, i would recommend 50mg freebase dissolved in a acidic liquid, or 75mg fumarate for a first excursion.

The best way to do it though imho, is to get some rue seeds, boil them w/ vinegar, filter and manske it (google for a tek). This will get you fairly pure harmala hcls that should be yellow crystals, and rue seeds are readily available, dirt cheap, contain ~5% alkaloids by weight, and you need vinegar and salt to extract them. You know the purity if you do it this way, and its easier to recommend a dose when you have pureish rue hcl alkaloids. Otherwise, start at 200mg w/ whatever rue extract you get if you buy some, and work your way up 50mg at a time. But extracts are a waste of money imho when you can get 5g of very pure harmala hcl's from 100g of rue, which costs like $10. Vinegar, salt, and effort are all you need to get a ton of pureish alkaloids that are easier to relate to dosage wise.
 
Thank you! I'll be sure not to be taking any other substances for about a week prior to my trip. I am primarily vegetarian and don't consume a lot of dairy anyways, so it'll be easy to stay away from meats/dairy, and I will be following a special diet for 24 hours. I think I will fast for about 4-6 hours before the trip as well.

I'll be going into the sacred herb shop later this week and I'll ask the lady who runs it if she knows the purity of the extract. I know that they have seeds as well, so if the extract doesn't work out, I'll go with that. She will most likely know some more info about pharmahuasca as well as the manske, and if not, they have several booklets containing lots of info on brews, etc.

Thanks again for the help. If I have any more questions I suppose I'll just post here again.
 
Hi everyone, I'm having trouble finding specific techniques in regards to extracting/reducing down the brew. I was planning on using chaliponga for my brew with syrian rue as the MAOI.

Now, in all of the recipes I've seen you need to simmer the leaves in distilled water and then filter out the plant matter through a cheese cloth (or something similar). Then reuse the plant matter in a new pot of water roughly two more times. At this point is where I get confused (I've never done this before and am not the cooking type). The end result is supposed to be just small amount of the brew, but at this stage I have three pots of water, right? How exactly then do you reduce the entire brew down to a small/potent dose?

I apologize if this has already been answered, and I'm sure to a lot of you this is just common sense, but I definitely don't want to waste some of the DMT by steaming out too much (if this is possible), or worse, burning it. -Thank you if can help.
 
The end result is supposed to be just small amount of the brew, but at this stage I have three pots of water, right? How exactly then do you reduce the entire brew down to a small/potent dose?

Mix all the pots and boil them together, until most of the water disappears. Depending on how much dosages you are cooking, try not to have more than 50 ml for each dosage. The taste of Aya is gross, and you do not want to drink a lot of it. Finally, you will nor ruin the actives by boiling them. In traditional ceremonies, they boil it for over 24 hours in very strong fires!
 
I think I will fast for about 4-6 hours before the trip as well.

I'm not sure why this idea of fasting before ayahuasca / oral DMT seems so prevalent. I would never fast for 4-6 hours before taking aya. Feels great to be well-nourished while tripping on aya, and it certainly doesn't inhibit the potency of the brew, IME. I wouldn't eat a *large* meal right before drinking, but I also wouldn't ever trip hungry.
 
I'm not sure why this idea of fasting before ayahuasca / oral DMT seems so prevalent. I would never fast for 4-6 hours before taking aya. Feels great to be well-nourished while tripping on aya, and it certainly doesn't inhibit the potency of the brew, IME. I wouldn't eat a *large* meal right before drinking, but I also wouldn't ever trip hungry.

I disagree on this. Not because of possible health complications due to MAO inhibition. I have fastened and I have eaten moderately before Ayahuasca on several occasions. My take is that the experience is markedly more intense and profound when fasting. 24 hours fasting is the ideal for the "real" Ayahuasca. It is so much more intense that it can even be overwhelming, depending on dosage.
 
24 hours fasting is the ideal for the "real" Ayahuasca. It is so much more intense that it can even be overwhelming, depending on dosage.

I always find you have to eat a little when you've dropped the DMT to make it kick in.
 
I always find you have to eat a little when you've dropped the DMT to make it kick in.

You don't have to. But occasionally I also do it when dosing on pharmahuasca, when the MAOI is taken before the DMT. To stimulate the gastric secretions and improve the MAO inhibition all over the GI tract, I occasionally take a little plain cookie with the MAOI. It certainly does not ruin the experience or make it weaker.
 
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