Neo-Doves test results

[IWillHostIt]

One thing i found tho, when the initial buzz wore off it was like i was completely straight again, but very WIRED at the same time, lol.

^ Same with me.

I think ND's are nice. Its puts you in a really nice mood but not in that really really good mood like e's do, which is good because I felt that I could hide my high easier. I don't feel like it took away all my serotonin and I felt alright the next day. The comeup was smooth and the comedown was awesome.

I think doubling ND's is the way to go for me.

 

[sinbad]

/long long time lurk mode off

OK, thought I'd share my experiences last night at home with the Neo Doves and a couple of close friends. We're all long time piller / substance experimentors (in our 40's) and consider ourselves pretty "hardcore" and not easily impressed. Hadn't dropped anything for about 8-9 weeks as we work more than when we were hitting the clubs twice a week.

Being a little cautious and as noone seems to know what's in these things we started off with 1 cap at 10, nothing flash so had another at 10.30, still nothing to write home about other than a lot of chatting and some minor eye wiggles so had another about 11.30 (I'm also impatient). Pretty cruisey but if they were illegals I would have complained. So, at this stage, feeling ripped off (especially as I had a bottle of 50 caps).

So about 1.30am dropped a good pill (I was concerned that mixing e's with these could be a little silly but wanted to get off so went ahead anyway, as you do) followed by another about 3am, so nicely off our chops. Then to double check that I had indeed been ripped off we double dropped a couple of ND caps at about 4.30am, Kapow! Completely different experience to the earlier singles and equal to a pretty reasonable pill.

I also don't like going to bed once I've started so about 10am dropped another 2, again, Kapow! Off my face and nicely loved up, rolling around being a lush with all the things we like about illegal gear.

Never one to say die we dropped another 2 at about 3pm and wowsers! Full on rushes, eye twitches, and super lovey.

No clenching or grinding to speak of, and a clean finish. Some body temperature problems but only in that good sweaty e sort of way.

Pretty impressed but you have to double drop or they're pretty dull. With a double drop you get the goods and has me thinking I need to get some more before they disappear (and at ~$ a cap it's good value). Recommended! (and appear safe to use as supplements to pills)

Yes I admit to being a piggy but ... I have no willpower!

/long long time lurker mode on

[EDIT: Prices removed. Thanks for sharing and please don't go back to lurking hoptis]

 

[phase_dancer]

Being a little cautious and as noone seems to know what's in these things....

...So about 1.30am dropped a good pill (I was concerned that mixing e's with these could be a little silly but wanted to get off so went ahead anyway, as you do)....

...(and appear safe to use as supplements to pills)

Thanks for your report but I have to also say....

No-one knows anything about the safety of mixing these with MDMA as the ingredients have not yet been fully investigated. If the NDs affect the serotonin system - which they undoubtedly do - then it's potentially dangerous advice to be suggesting or encouraging that they be taken with MDMA. An important thing to also remember is that not everyone reacts the same way to particular combinations of drugs.

Sorry to bitch, but I've been involved in too many rescue missions resulting from poly drug use which included unknown substances. Suggesting polydrug use per se is not sound HR practice.

 

[Doooofus]

So the general consensus seems to be that the "new and improved" ND2s and SC2s aren't much good? At least compared to the originals...?

Also most users are reporting that double dropping seems to get the desired effects. Has anyone tried dropping a ND and a SC at the same time? Any synergy, or different effects compared to double dropping two of the same?

Thanks

 

[akshenethno]

I don't know about ND2 but SC2 are awesome

 

[3 to the 3]

I can't believe that some people are finding these weak or mostly inactive??? I have plenty of experience with all sorts of substances, and these work so well for me everytime...

NDs (tried twice, swallowed whole) to me are almost exactly like a very good clean e, with only a third of the pain the next day, and no end of week blues.... 2 is more than enough for a great night for me.

SCs for me ( 3 diff occasions) are brilliant, and def strong. I usually have one (swallowed whole) followed by another about an hour and a half later and am fucked... The aphrodisia is off the scale.... Hornier than G.

The only negative effects I have encountered were mild anxiety when mixing with weed, (one of the only drugs I have had no positive benefit from mixing with weed in fact) and they seem to mess my stomach up for a day or two, and taste terrible.

If you take drugs every few days, or go hard every weekend, and feel the need to be wasted for 12 - 24 hours per session, then I could understand these seeming a little weak, but for me and my friends these are an amazing product to put in a shopping cart online and sent to your door!

N.B First package sent to Adelaide, inspected by customs, one SC missing.

Second package, straight through not inspected. Average delivery 10 days.

 

[Doooofus]

Thanks for the post! Great information Have you tried combining NDs and SCs? Tried snorting them? I've heard good things about SC2s after doing a bit of reading as well..

 

[juice_soldier]

Hmm, need to get me some more nds really.. i miss them.. lol.

But agreed, dont bother with ND unless double dropped imo... I've given them to a few people, and all agreed - i noticed little to no effect from one on a few people - and extreme effect when double dropped

 

[3 to the 3]

I have combined one ND and one SC and enjoyed it for sure....

Don't think I would mix these with illicits at this stage though...

I am only specualting but it seems to me that perhaps the doses are not uniform? I still get quite a good buzz from one ND, although the peak is quite short... The shorter peak might explain the lack of serious hangover from these products? (Unless you have 6 )

(Does anyone else feel that these might act on both dopamine and seratonin at a similar levels, perhaps 50% less than speed and e does individually? Scientists please have your say..)

BTW:

Tried the Spirits last night, 1 followed by another an hour later.. I highly recommend these.... Very good to take by yourself, clear ultra-positive thought as well as a peak much like a clean smacky pill for an hour +. Still got major pupil dilation, and a little headache this afternoon though.. Sleep was not an issue.

 

[sinbad]

Thanks for your report but I have to also say....

No-one knows anything about the safety of mixing these with MDMA as the ingredients have not yet been fully investigated. If the NDs affect the serotonin system - which they undoubtedly do - then it's potentially dangerous advice to be suggesting or encouraging that they be taken with MDMA. An important thing to also remember is that not everyone reacts the same way to particular combinations of drugs.

Sorry to bitch, but I've been involved in too many rescue missions resulting from poly drug use which included unknown substances. Suggesting polydrug use per se is not sound HR practice.

You are absolutely correct and I was dubious about this for the reasons you've stated. I think it is very concerning that the contents of these are unknown, making the whole drug taking experience rather more risky than it already is.

Until we're allowed to buy things in blister packs from the chemist with all active ingredients listed and a description of contraindications then any usage should be considered a high risk activity.

I do not recommend anyone follow my example, I gathered as much information as I could on these things and took what I considered to be a calculated risk (within the constraints above). Without some form of hard information all we are left with is people's experience, I provided my experience to build upon this admittedly unreliable and sketchy knowledge base.

 

[potato]

I've been out of the scene for a bit lately so I feel quite distant from all of these developments and was quite baffled by all of this talk of Neo-doves et al filling ADD over the last few months. I really only have one question

Does anyone know what is in any of these things? I mean, aside from Starboys fairly approximate-only test results? And if not, why do people not have more qualms about taking it?

Edit; okay, that's two questions. so shoot me

 

[Doooofus]

^ People have guessed at methylone, ethylone, bk-MBDB, amfepramone... no-one can put their finger on it. Some people have suggested that it is the "mystery phenethylamine" that is having a big effect. I too find the reckless usage of these alarming - on another unnamed forum there are people dosing multiple pills day and night for weeks at a time... stuffing them up their noses too. If this were a new RC coming in powder form I don't think we'd see this reckless use, I think the packaging of it in a capsule has a LOT to do with it However, I should say that there have been no hugely negative reports from going hard at these pills - there are tolerance issues when using for a few days, and it has been said that the user's body will tell them when to take a break... but imagine if people used MDMA like this when it first came out?

 

[juice_soldier]

Potato: I think alot of it is to do with marketing to be honest.

They are marketed as a safe and legal alternative - a proper alternative, to ecstacy.

Given that there is no information as to hte chemicals producing these effects etc. one would think that people would be more weary - but the fact that remains is no one has reported ill effects from them or otherwise.

I really hate it when ADD gets into these big harm min discussions when the simple ideas put forth most of the time are never followed even by those who preach them.

I myself have, how should i say - binged these products - up to 6 capsules in a night.

And found no ill effect from them. That i would call use to the level of abuse.

But one users anecdotal report of a new drug means jack shit in reality.

 

[hoptis]

They are marketed as a safe and legal alternative - a proper alternative, to ecstacy.

Agreed that the so-called "legality" of these products might contribute to people behaving this way, there's lots of people I've seen on other forums taking these who report never having taken illicits/ecstasy before.

I really hate it when ADD gets into these big harm min discussions when the simple ideas put forth most of the time are never followed even by those who preach them.

Care to elaborate what you mean? I don't mean name names but why you see it as futility to be discussing harm reduction on a harm reduction forum? A few people you know might not follow the principles they talk about here but it doesn't mean everyone on this forum is like that.

 

[Mona Lisa]

Unfortunately, once it's known what's in them, they will end up being banned that much quicker

 

[phase_dancer]

I really hate it when ADD gets into these big harm min discussions when the simple ideas put forth most of the time are never followed even by those who preach them.

I can only assume that was directed at me. If so, please elaborate on your claim? Whoever it's aimed at, it's a BIG statement to make juice_soldier, so back it up or back out pal!

I really hate it when superhero users think they can safely and accurately predict what a drug does and how it metabolizes simply by taking it, then feel they know enough about it to safely advise others.

Just because a compound doesn't produce acute toxicity or a hangover, it doesn't automatically mean it doesn't cause chronic or delayed affects. I know lots of compounds that don't kill for up to 30 years or so after exposure. p-chloroamphetamine for example keeps killing serotonin neurons long after the pleasant experience has come and gone. While I'm not suggesting these products contain such poisons, the thing is, until the compound is correctly identified and some form of peer reviewed assessment can be sighted, we simply don't know what the outcomes could be long term. Mixing MDMA with any drug that has 5HT agonist properties, MAOA or SERT inhibition etc. can present a highly dangerous situation.

 

[Mona Lisa]

I can only assume that was directed at me. If so, please elaborate on your claim? Whoever it's aimed at, it's a BIG statement to make juice_soldier, so back it up or back out pal!

I really hate it when superhero users think they can safely and accurately predict what a drug does and how it metabolizes simply by taking it, then feel they know enough about it to safely advise others.

Just because a compound doesn't produce acute toxicity or a hangover, it doesn't automatically mean it doesn't cause chronic or delayed affects. I know lots of compounds that don't kill for up to 30 years or so after exposure. p-chloroamphetamine for example keeps killing serotonin neurons long after the pleasant experience has come and gone. While I'm not suggesting these products contain such poisons, the thing is, until the compound is correctly identified and some form of peer reviewed assessment can be sighted, we simply don't know what the outcomes could be long term. Mixing MDMA with any drug that has 5HT agonist properties, MAOA or SERT inhibition etc. can present a highly dangerous situation.

I see what you mean, good point%)

 

[juice_soldier]

p_d im speaking in a general sense - 99% of the BLers i KNOW on here, don't practice half of what they preach - that was not directed at anyone - so chill out before acting like i'm taking a personal stab at you.

I really hate it when superhero users think they can safely and accurately predict what a drug does and how it metabolizes simply by taking it, then feel they know enough about it to safely advise others.

I beg your pardon, superhero? Was that directed at me. I never made any comments about drug metabolisation and/or after/delayed effects over time. I made a personal/anecdotal comment about the said drugs immediate effects on me and my friends - and made a comment about abuse of the said unknown compound.

I think everyone needs to take a chill pill - i think we're all better off not knowing whats in these for LEGAL reasons - perhaps it is a safe and legal alternative? who are we to speculate? None of us want to be ignorant, but speculation won't help anyone.

It could be dangerous, it could very well also not be. But unless someone wants to ACCURATELY find out whats in these, how about we kill the hear-say on the topic - because its not helping anyone sleep now is it?

 

[potato]

Jeez, chill out both a you. P_D i dont think it seemed like JJ's comments were directed at you - i think he was more trying to express what I too have observed - that despit BL being a 'Harm Minimisation' site the biggest trashbags I know are BLers. Sure some people on here are responsible, others are only responsible sometimes (I'd say >90% fall into this category), and others are drug-pigs looking for a place to hang out.

Taking something you have no real knowledge about is not a smart thing to do imo. That being said, I've done it, twice - with 2C-E. (No-one knows anything about that it seems. Pubmed turned up 16 results, perhaps 6 relevant, and none with even speculation on its toxicology.) I knew the seriousness (and foolishness) of doing so at the time - why doesn't anyone think these draw a parallel? Is it because they're legal? So were the various 2C-s..

 

[phase_dancer]

99% of the BLers i KNOW on here, don't practice half of what they preach

I may of said that in the early days of BL, but the Blers I know in real life these days are in fact very health conscious and afaik practice what they preach.

i think we're all better off not knowing whats in these for LEGAL reasons - perhaps it is a safe and legal alternative? who are we to speculate?

Since when has erring on the side of caution been a bad thing? Sensible awareness of the facts is not so much speculation, but caution based on experience and realistic concerns. From a pharmaceutical perspective (GMP or Good Manufacturing Practices - law in Australia) complience should be demonstatable by any manufacture/supplier and the ingredients should be listed on the packets at the very least.

Hey, even some of the more dodgy RC companies supply a spectral data sheet for their products.


So who or what is this company? The site looks professional enough, but as with any pharmaceutical company or product, it's certainly good to know the background and other criteria associated with their manufacturing techniques, QC etc. For a company to have a manufacturing division in Aus they must meet several criteria - ingredients listing is one.

These regulations are put in place to protect the health of the consumer. Someone might argue that some RC suppliers don't give any guarranttees. That's true, but then again I wouldn't buy any such legal chemicals from any place not already established as a trusted supplier (most can be purchased through the larger suppliers to chem/ bio-medical industries).

Many of the RC suppliers currently operating are doing so in a very clandestine fashion - no doubt to avoid being prosecuted or being caught up in another DEA sweep - and in doing so, can supply product that may be sourced anywhere and be of less than desirable quality making them just as dodgy as illicit drug manufacturers. We know of more than one case where incorrect product has been supplied (DOI instead of 2CI), or product has been contaminated with impurities (MDPV). In my mind, unless such a company details it's operations and discloses relevant information on it's products, they're essentially no better than the clandestine suppliers.

I think everyone needs to take a chill pill - i think we're all better off not knowing whats in these for LEGAL reasons - perhaps it is a safe and legal alternative?

So, it's better not to know and have them remain legal than to know and have them made illegal? Whether these chems are made illegal or not you can betcha there will be a host more to follow from other vendors. I don't believe the legal system will be able to keep up to be frank - I've been saying this for years. Some of the substances now emerging demonstrate a great divergence in chemical structure from the traditional amphetamines.

Personally, I would like to know that any chemical being widely used is safe, or at least that people can make informed choices based on what's known about the drug - the basis of any HR approach.

I plan to contact a group that may be able to comprehensively analyse these products. Maybe it will turn out that these are safe legal alternatives. I'm certainly not against producing/ marketing safer legal alternatives - far from it - but we need to be reassured that these are in fact just that.

Maybe I was a bit harsh with my choice of words in the last post; for that I apologize. But we have to remember that we know nothing of the active contents of these products, and when it comes to mind altering drugs, that is a potentially dangerous thing - no two ways about it.

Having been to their site and seen many disclaimers but only one warning
( for SC2), I'm wondering what warnings are present on the labeling/ packaging e.g. is there anything mentioned about driving while intoxicated, contraindications etc?