Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine FAQ & Megathread v2; 2010

[Znegative]

So I lowered my dosing down to .5 mg... it's weird, its totally true that bupe at lower doses works better. It holds me just as fine, and I therapeutically get a lot more out of it!! It's kind of a dumb question to ask, but do you think I should tell my sub doctor I've been tapering down? I'm not planning on getting off, I just want to be on a low dosage, and think it would be easier to cut up the 2mg pills.

 

[HdoubleODeezy]

I've been on suboxone for about 3 years and over the past year i reduced my dose from 16mg/day sublingual to about 3mg/day snorted or micron filtered and IV'd..
I recently got a script for tramadol and I also take valium (which i make sure i take anytime i take tramadol) and i figured since I lowered my dose so dramatically that tramadol would maybe give me at least a little buzz (beyond the anti depressant effects) but sometimes it just makes me tired and other times it makes me really hyper.. i don't get it.
people say that it works great with subs, and i figured with my new low tolerance i would get high but not really.
is there something i'm missing about it, or am i just one of the people that aren't meant to enjoy it?
i remember back in the day when i was on OC's that it could curb my w/d's and give a feeling of "well-being" but i'm not even getting that now..
sorry for the long post, but these things are starting to piss me off.
any help or advice (if there is any) would be appreciated.
Thanks!

forgot to mention.. im bi polar. could that have something to do with it since it has anti depressant properties? and it might affect me differently?

EDIT: i also posted this in BDD on accident, i didn't realize that the thread i was in was from there since i found it through search. but i just wanted to post it here too just in case i forget to go back to BDD to see if i got any responses, since im usually (almost always) in OD.

 

[Ashley26]

So I had about 4 drinks at the party last night and had no ill effects with the subs. I'm not going to make a habit of drinking of subs since I don't even really like alcohol but I'm glad to know I didn't have any baf side effects.

I'm still missing oxy like crazy, emotionasly. But I know that's part of the process.

I notice that after about 8 hours after I take the subs I start to feel kind of crappy again and have to redose. I'm only taking 2 mg in the morning anf 2 in the afternoon or evening. When I told my doctor he said its a once a day medicine and I should take the 4 mg in the morning instead.

Why would it matter if I spread out the dose?

 

[Znegative]

that's bullshit. Go with whatever feels like it holds you.

According to the info here, only about 30% of buprenorphine is absorbed when taking it sublingually... which means that a 2.5 mg I.V dosage is = 8 mg sublingual dosage? Am I correct when saying this? I had been proud of myself for thinking that I had tapered down, but if this is true, then my tolerance is almost exactly where I started.

 

[Ashley26]

that's bullshit. Go with whatever feels like it holds you.

According to the info here, only about 30% of buprenorphine is absorbed when taking it sublingually... which means that a 2.5 mg I.V dosage is = 8 mg sublingual dosage? Am I correct when saying this? I had been proud of myself for thinking that I had tapered down, but if this is true, then my tolerance is almost exactly where I started.

wow really? so If I'm taking 2mg sublingually I'm nly really getting 30% of that 2mg?

 

[Suboxone]

wow really? so If I'm taking 2mg sublingually I'm nly really getting 30% of that 2mg?

Yes and no. The thing is, in all reality, you shouldn't feel sick 8 hours later. The half-life of buprenorphine is far too long, some people don't feel withdrawal until 3 days after their last dose. Based on your recent posts I think it's safe to say that the effects you're feeling are mostly mental. You need to stick to what your doctor tells you until the psychological effects of your drug use finally subside. Doctors are idiots, but they're doctors. If you keep taking hydrocodone and messing with your bupe dose you're just feeding your addiction. Remember, if you take bupe while you're in withdrawal it doesn't "cure" the withdrawal, it just makes it easier to deal with. If you're constantly using opiates with your regular bupe dose then you're going to start to feel some withdrawal symptoms even though you're on the bupe.

I'm not trying to be a douche, these are things that I learned when I first got on bupe. You need to get rid of that mental aspect of chasing the dragon and taking your bupe as a regular medication to letting your body adjust. The mental part is 90% of the illness.

I suggest you watch the episode of South Park when Randy realizes he's an alcoholic. As stupid as it is, it really puts everything into perspective.

 

[Ashley26]

Yes and no. The thing is, in all reality, you shouldn't feel sick 8 hours later. The half-life of buprenorphine is far too long, some people don't feel withdrawal until 3 days after their last dose. Based on your recent posts I think it's safe to say that the effects you're feeling are mostly mental. You need to stick to what your doctor tells you until the psychological effects of your drug use finally subside. Doctors are idiots, but they're doctors. If you keep taking hydrocodone and messing with your bupe dose you're just feeding your addiction. Remember, if you take bupe while you're in withdrawal it doesn't "cure" the withdrawal, it just makes it easier to deal with. If you're constantly using opiates with your regular bupe dose then you're going to start to feel some withdrawal symptoms even though you're on the bupe.

I'm not trying to be a douche, these are things that I learned when I first got on bupe. You need to get rid of that mental aspect of chasing the dragon and taking your bupe as a regular medication to letting your body adjust. The mental part is 90% of the illness.

I suggest you watch the episode of South Park when Randy realizes he's an alcoholic. As stupid as it is, it really puts everything into perspective.

you're not being a douche at all, I totally hear what you're saying. I'm still struggling daily with the mental part of opiate addiction....still holding on so to speak.

I definitely do feel withdrawal symptoms after 8 hours, of 2 mg of subs....so I'm assuming I'm just not taking enough of the dose to hold off all, if not most of the withdrawals. But you're right, that I'm still playing with full opiates at the same time. I'm back on the subs again and going to try and give it a try....that's all I can do

But I appreciate all the advice, especially since I've gone back and forth over the last 2 weeks.

 

[fm1983]

I dose multi times a day. Usually like 2-3mg in the morning, then Depending on how I feel I dose another 2mg, once or twice more that day.

My Dr tells me to dose 8mg 3x a day. Obviously I dont do that but still. the choice is up to you, and however you feel the most comfortable, is the way to go.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

I emailed my sub doc about a taper schedule and asked if he would script me something for the worst of the w/d, mentioned that I have a history of seizures during w/d, etc...... He replied by saying that there is no sub withdrawal because it's not addictive, hurrr durrr.

WTF This is the second "addiction specialist" to tell me that subs aren't addictive or opiates or something equally ignorant. CH needs to have a talk with these dudes or something.

/rant

Er sorry....what I wanted to ask - Isn't it pretty common for sub docs to script Ultram/codeine/Ativan/whatever when you taper? Or is that just wishful thinking? %)

Wow!!! That's ridiculous. Buprenorphine may not be like a full agonist withdrawal; I'm not sure. It may be. However there are definitely still withdrawals.

Plus, you should be able to get at least 10 or 15 pills of a benzodiazepine so that you're able to step off of Suboxone without seizures or uncomfortable side effects. I would also suggest 25mg increments (up to 2 or 4 times a day) of hydroxyzine hcl (Atarax) in order to curb anxiety and a slightly higher blood pressure.

If your "addiction specialist" doesn't want to help you out, you can always go to a different doctor for benzodiazepines. I think the inherent ignorance/stupidity about combining benzodiazepines and buprenorphine within the medical community is inexcusable. I understand some people should only get 5 or 10 pills because if they had 30, 60, or 90 pills they would abuse them. That's very understandable. But thinking it shouldn't be prescribed at all is just closed mindedness.

Other people can easily get 30 benzo capsules/tablets per month, and not have any problem with using them only when necessary, and saving the rest for the long run, for days where you really need them.

As an addiction specialist, if you only felt comfortable for writing for 30 benzos, with only one refill to get the patient fully off of the last two months prescriptions of Suboxone, that's one thing. But to deny them it all together is just going to encourage people to relapse once they are experiencing withdrawal and they're told "there is no Suboxone withdrawal".

Good luck H.G.! </rant>

So I lowered my dosing down to .5 mg... it's weird, its totally true that bupe at lower doses works better. It holds me just as fine, and I therapeutically get a lot more out of it!! It's kind of a dumb question to ask, but do you think I should tell my sub doctor I've been tapering down? I'm not planning on getting off, I just want to be on a low dosage, and think it would be easier to cut up the 2mg pills.

I was fine with crushing 2mg (a fourth of an 8mg pill) into powder, and separating it into estimated equal piles. Then again, water measuring (micron filtering) is even easier.

If you wanted to tell your doctor you were tapering down so you could get the 2mg pills, you certainly could go for it. If you don't pay a flat rate for all the Suboxone you get (i.e. don't have insurance), then the 2mg pills will likely cost more than the 8mg ones.

I've been on suboxone for about 3 years and over the past year i reduced my dose from 16mg/day sublingual to about 3mg/day snorted or micron filtered and IV'd..
I recently got a script for tramadol and I also take valium (which i make sure i take anytime i take tramadol) and i figured since I lowered my dose so dramatically that tramadol would maybe give me at least a little buzz (beyond the anti depressant effects) but sometimes it just makes me tired and other times it makes me really hyper.. i don't get it.
people say that it works great with subs, and i figured with my new low tolerance i would get high but not really.
is there something i'm missing about it, or am i just one of the people that aren't meant to enjoy it?
i remember back in the day when i was on OC's that it could curb my w/d's and give a feeling of "well-being" but i'm not even getting that now..
sorry for the long post, but these things are starting to piss me off.
any help or advice (if there is any) would be appreciated.
Thanks!

forgot to mention.. im bi polar. could that have something to do with it since it has anti depressant properties? and it might affect me differently?

EDIT: i also posted this in BDD on accident, i didn't realize that the thread i was in was from there since i found it through search. but i just wanted to post it here too just in case i forget to go back to BDD to see if i got any responses, since im usually (almost always) in OD.

So I had about 4 drinks at the party last night and had no ill effects with the subs. I'm not going to make a habit of drinking of subs since I don't even really like alcohol but I'm glad to know I didn't have any baf side effects.

I'm still missing oxy like crazy, emotionasly. But I know that's part of the process.

I notice that after about 8 hours after I take the subs I start to feel kind of crappy again and have to redose. I'm only taking 2 mg in the morning anf 2 in the afternoon or evening. When I told my doctor he said its a once a day medicine and I should take the 4 mg in the morning instead.

Why would it matter if I spread out the dose?

It wouldn't matter *at all* if you spread the dose out. That's what I do! When I used to take it "once a day" I didn't like doing it that way, and would often end up relapsing at the night time.

I would take 2mg in the morning, and another 2mg in the afternoon/evening as needed. There's nothing wrong with doing it this way.

Some addiction specialists stress "once a day dosing" because part of recovery is reducing the drug taking behavior. But you're still craving oxycodone - this is a good reason to take Suboxone as frequently as needed to remove the "crappy" feeling. You're still new to Suboxone; if you feel crappy 8 hours later, feel entitled to take more. You can just tell your doctor you take 4mg in the morning, there's no magical way to find out if that's true or not.

Well, I never really enjoyed tramadol, and I haven't ever combined it with Suboxone, so I can't comment. I would save it for when you feel light WD symptoms, or for when you could use it more than normally. That's just my advice. That, or you could save the tramadol for when you are getting off of Suboxone, so you would be able to taper with something less potent, mitigating any remaining WD symptoms. Just make sure not to get addicted to tramadol, it's antidepressant qualities can be harder to get off of than the opiate ones.

that's bullshit. Go with whatever feels like it holds you.

According to the info here, only about 30% of buprenorphine is absorbed when taking it sublingually... which means that a 2.5 mg I.V dosage is = 8 mg sublingual dosage? Am I correct when saying this? I had been proud of myself for thinking that I had tapered down, but if this is true, then my tolerance is almost exactly where I started.

A sublingual dose of buprenorphine lasts longer than an IV dose, so "equating" the two is a bit difficult.

The key thing to remember here is that it's easier to taper down when IVing; you get most of the dose at once, so you still feel a considerable amount of relief, even if you only take 80% of what you took before.

If you're using 0.5mg five times a day, for instance, and you feel stabilized this way, you can switch your dose to 0.25mg. At first, you may not feel 100%. By the second or third dose, you should feel a little better. Within a few days/a week, you shouldn't notice a difference at all.

0.25mg five times a day would be 1.25mg IV, which is closer to 4mg sublingual per day.

The last point I want to bring up is that everyone tapers at their own pace. I have taken about two years to get from a large opiate tolerance back down to a small one. But I finally got here. Other people may have only needed 3 or 6 months to get where I am now, and yet others may need 3 to 6 years.

If you are making progress with maintenance (feeling good about life without full agonist opiates, not craving full agonist opiates or at least reducing your cravings overall, getting past the unpleasant withdrawal symptoms of the full agonist, etc.) then don't feel bad for not tapering yet. When you feel stabilized on a dose, and don't feel any discomfort (other than waking up wanting to do your first shot ) - then you can gradually slowly taper.

This is why I love micron filtering; if I make 2mg/mL solution, and am using 0.2mg at a time in 10 units, I can reduce my dose 0.02mg at a time by reducing 1 unit in my shot. I find it easier to taper this way. Making a new solution with a lower concentration of buprenorphine is another easy way to do this, so that you continue to use a similar amount of units, but gradually you'll be eventually using less and less, and with each batch of solution, you'll stabilize to the lower dose.

wow really? so If I'm taking 2mg sublingually I'm nly really getting 30% of that 2mg?

Yeah. Using 2mg sublingually actually yields 0.6mg in your system. 0.6mg = 600 mcg.

Yes and no. The thing is, in all reality, you shouldn't feel sick 8 hours later. The half-life of buprenorphine is far too long, some people don't feel withdrawal until 3 days after their last dose. Based on your recent posts I think it's safe to say that the effects you're feeling are mostly mental. You need to stick to what your doctor tells you until the psychological effects of your drug use finally subside. Doctors are idiots, but they're doctors. If you keep taking hydrocodone and messing with your bupe dose you're just feeding your addiction. Remember, if you take bupe while you're in withdrawal it doesn't "cure" the withdrawal, it just makes it easier to deal with. If you're constantly using opiates with your regular bupe dose then you're going to start to feel some withdrawal symptoms even though you're on the bupe.

I'm not trying to be a douche, these are things that I learned when I first got on bupe. You need to get rid of that mental aspect of chasing the dragon and taking your bupe as a regular medication to letting your body adjust. The mental part is 90% of the illness.

I suggest you watch the episode of South Park when Randy realizes he's an alcoholic. As stupid as it is, it really puts everything into perspective.

I disagree with this notion, mostly because some people can metabolize drugs much quicker than other people. While some people may not feel withdrawal until 3 days after their dose, I will certainly feel much worse 8 to 12 hours without dosing. Some people may need to use Suboxone every 4 hours, even if they are using the ceiling dose (32mg), sublingually. I have heard of a person using this much Suboxone, and having to transfer onto methadone in order to metabolize the ORT slower, so that ORT was more effective/efficient for them.

Taking Suboxone once in the morning and once in the evening is normal; some doctors advise that you do this, because it assists with tapering. For example, if you are prescribed 8mg per day, I wouldn't advise you take it 8mg once in the morning, unless you know that's what works for you. When first starting Suboxone you may need 8mg at once, or 2mg four times a day, but after being on Suboxone for a while, I eventually got down to taking 2mg 3 times a day, then 2 times a day, and finally once per day. However, most days, I still didn't feel 100% all right if I didn't have a second dose later in the evening.

To counteract this, I would rather use 1mg sublingually in the morning and 1mg sublingually in the evening, instead of 2mg in the morning, and feeling worse later in the day.

Half lives do not equate duration of effects; Suboxone has the same half life with any ROA, but snorting or injecting Suboxone will have a shorter duration than sublingual use. Half lives refer to how long it takes half of the dose of a drug to be excreted from your system, not how long it takes for half of the effects to wear off.

 

[BrettFavor]

The reason your doctor tells you to do 8mg 3 x a day is because it keeps your tolerance really high so if you do slip you aren't going to be able to get high. If you are taking that dosage it is going to build up in your blood stream since its half life is like 24-72 hours and so if you wanted to get high even on subutex you would have to wait at least 48 hours on that dosage and most likely 72 or even longer to get the full effects. Even then it is going to take like 80mg of oxycontin just to feel normal and you have to feel kinda crappy for a few days just for a barely decent high. SWIM has been on that dosage of Subutex and waited 72 hours and took 160mg's of oxycontin and barely got high. SWIM felt the opiate feeling, but there wasn't much euphoria and no "nod" at all.

If you are serious about getting clean taking 3 x 8mg a day really is the smart way to do it. That doesn't almost completely eliminates cravings for not only opiates, but also studies have shown it can reduce cravings for alcohol, cocaine, amphetamines, and even nicotine.

You don't "need" this amount to feel normal, but this amount allows you to get to fixing your life without having too many cravings. Get rid of bad friends, get a new phone number, hell move if you have to, go see an addiction specialist. This gives you time to do this and once you have done that (it usually takes years) then you can ween your way down safely and slowly and withdrawals won't be that bad. They will exist, but you gotta have a smart doctor and go down slowly.....like .5mg every other day before you go off. Then medicine like benzo's, clonidine, and maybe even something like ondansetron to help with the withdrawals you do have.


SWIM started out taking only some here and there to stave off withdrawals or only 8mg a day to feel normal and still got high sometimes.....still had cravings....Finally SWIM listened to his doctor thinking the whole time this is stupid and you know what the doctor was right. Weird huh?


If SWIY is only taking 2mg, but IV then that is roughly like taking 8mg sublingually, but most people swallow the stuff under their tongue or at least SWIM does so I think 30% is probably a bit low, but no matter. The half life is actually about the same in Suboxone no matter the ROA of course it will vary, but the point is SWIY isn't giving time for the levels to build up. So SWIY is going to feel withdrawal effects sooner and be able to get high on a full agonist sooner than someone who was taking 8mg a day sublingually most likely (again tons of variables here).

 

[Captain.Heroin]

The reason your doctor tells you to do 8mg 3 x a day is because it keeps your tolerance really high so if you do slip you aren't going to be able to get high. If you are taking that dosage it is going to build up in your blood stream since its half life is like 24-72 hours and so if you wanted to get high even on subutex you would have to wait at least 48 hours on that dosage and most likely 72 or even longer to get the full effects. Even then it is going to take like 80mg of oxycontin just to feel normal and you have to feel kinda crappy for a few days just for a barely decent high. SWIM has been on that dosage of Subutex and waited 72 hours and took 160mg's of oxycontin and barely got high. SWIM felt the opiate feeling, but there wasn't much euphoria and no "nod" at all.

Subutex and Suboxone have the exact same effect; the naloxone has a much shorter half life than buprenorphine.

Also, we don't do SWIM here. Please read the links in my signature, thank you.

If you are serious about getting clean taking 3 x 8mg a day really is the smart way to do it. That doesn't almost completely eliminates cravings for not only opiates, but also studies have shown it can reduce cravings for alcohol, cocaine, amphetamines, and even nicotine.

If I took that much buprenorphine, my head would hurt, and I would probably vomit a good bit too. I could use the same 24mg over 6 weeks, which is much more efficient and works fine for me.

but most people swallow the stuff under their tongue or at least SWIM does so I think 30% is probably a bit low, but no matter.

Check the first post of this thread; you can see the ranges listed for ROA's and BA's there. 30% isn't a bit low, it's just an average. It may be higher for some people and lower for others.

The half life is actually about the same in Suboxone no matter the ROA of course it will vary, but the point is SWIY isn't giving time for the levels to build up. So SWIY is going to feel withdrawal effects sooner and be able to get high on a full agonist sooner than someone who was taking 8mg a day sublingually most likely (again tons of variables here).

The effects of IV buprenorphine wear off quicker because your body starts metabolizing it when it receives the full dose. Sublingual dosing is a gradual onset of the medication, and therefore your body doesn't get to instantly start working on metabolizing all of it. The half life is exactly the same for all ROA's. With IV dosing, as long as you use two or three times within a day, the half lives are still building up within you the exact same way, except at different paces.

Also, you can still always use full agonists on top of buprenorphine. If you are loaded up to the eyeballs full of buprenorphine, the full agonist may just not be able to reach enough of your mu-opioid receptors. For people who take a lower dose of buprenorphine, using a full agonist should be relatively easy and shouldn't have to take multiple days.

 

[Znegative]

thanks Captain Heroin, that post really cleared up a lot of things for me, especially the ROA v. BA... Now it makes sense why if I I.V .5 in the morning and wait ten hours to dose again I start to feel uncomfortable.

I also wanted to say, that although in a way counter productive, I feel that I.V 'ing my subs really takes away a lot more of the cravings then when I sniff/sublingual them.. I mean, I know I have a needle fixation so it makes sense, but I really didn't realize HOW MUCH the fucking spike had a hold on me..

 

[Ashley26]

Yeah. Using 2mg sublingually actually yields 0.6mg in your system. 0.6mg = 600 mcg.

wow! I had no idea. Bupe is some strong stuff

 

[Suboxone]

I disagree with this notion, mostly because some people can metabolize drugs much quicker than other people. While some people may not feel withdrawal until 3 days after their dose, I will certainly feel much worse 8 to 12 hours without dosing. Some people may need to use Suboxone every 4 hours, even if they are using the ceiling dose (32mg), sublingually. I have heard of a person using this much Suboxone, and having to transfer onto methadone in order to metabolize the ORT slower, so that ORT was more effective/efficient for them.

Taking Suboxone once in the morning and once in the evening is normal; some doctors advise that you do this, because it assists with tapering. For example, if you are prescribed 8mg per day, I wouldn't advise you take it 8mg once in the morning, unless you know that's what works for you. When first starting Suboxone you may need 8mg at once, or 2mg four times a day, but after being on Suboxone for a while, I eventually got down to taking 2mg 3 times a day, then 2 times a day, and finally once per day. However, most days, I still didn't feel 100% all right if I didn't have a second dose later in the evening.

To counteract this, I would rather use 1mg sublingually in the morning and 1mg sublingually in the evening, instead of 2mg in the morning, and feeling worse later in the day.

Half lives do not equate duration of effects; Suboxone has the same half life with any ROA, but snorting or injecting Suboxone will have a shorter duration than sublingual use. Half lives refer to how long it takes half of the dose of a drug to be excreted from your system, not how long it takes for half of the effects to wear off.

Do you think that extended use of other opiates (even without feeling effects) could result in withdrawal even while on the bupe? Theoretically, in the terms of your explanation of dependency, it's entirely possible to "grow" more of those bad mu receptors...similar to when you take bupe in full withdrawal and feel somewhat better but not perfect.

 

[needlejuice]

wait, the half life is the same no matter what roa?? if anyone has any time to pull up a source for that claim id like to see. because i thought for sure the drug leaves your system faster when injecting. i get sick twice as quick daily injecting vs. daily sublingual

 

[HdoubleODeezy]

half life and the length of effects are two different things.

the half life of the nordiazepam metabolite of diazepam is up to 200 hours, but everyone knows that a diazepam high doesn't last 200 hours..

the half life of oxycodone is about 3 hours i believe, but the effects last longer than that.

half life just has to do with how long the chemical lingers in your system. not how long it has pharmacological effects.

so there's 2 different scenarios, one where the half life is longer than the drugs effects, and one where the drugs effects are longer than it's half life.

the time it stays in your system will be the same no matter what ROA, just the effects last a different amount of time. i don't have a source, but thought maybe my examples would help explain it a little better.

EDIT: i could be wrong though.. if someone does have a source to either prove or disprove this theory please post it.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Do you think that extended use of other opiates (even without feeling effects) could result in withdrawal even while on the bupe? Theoretically, in the terms of your explanation of dependency, it's entirely possible to "grow" more of those bad mu receptors...similar to when you take bupe in full withdrawal and feel somewhat better but not perfect.

I think you would have to expose your brain to other opiates for a long enough time to up regulate mu opioid receptors. Then again, I don't think most people take full agonists regularly while on buprenorphine, I think most people either switch back and forth, or stick to one or the other.

wait, the half life is the same no matter what roa?? if anyone has any time to pull up a source for that claim id like to see. because i thought for sure the drug leaves your system faster when injecting. i get sick twice as quick daily injecting vs. daily sublingual

The half life doesn't change, the duration of effects does. A drug can still be in your system, though you may not feel it.

This is why you can test positive for weed two or three weeks after having last consumed it, even though you may have only been stoned for a few hours at best.

 

[Znegative]

When I first took four mg sublingual, i got BLASTED. I was so stoned it felt like I had done a couple bags of heroin, so I know bupe has the potential to create this great effect. I'm guessing when I first took bupe my receptors were completely empty which is why I got so high. Of course after a few days this went away. What I really want to know is what the general ceiling effect for euphoria with suboxone is, when taken I.V. I know people in Europe usually crush up 1 mg and shoot them to get high, so I'm guessing it's a pretty low dose.

I get a nice mood lift from shooting .25 mg, but its really not so different then when i do 1 mg. I wonder if I got my tolerance down to doing a total of say .2 mg bupe everyday (or even went a few days without any bupe at all), and then injected 1 mg, would I feel a significantly better high?

I feel kind of annoying to continuously be asking these questions about suboxone, but its such a strange and confusing drug... I want to know how it works!

 

[Suboxone]

When I first took four mg sublingual, i got BLASTED. I was so stoned it felt like I had done a couple bags of heroin, so I know bupe has the potential to create this great effect. I'm guessing when I first took bupe my receptors were completely empty which is why I got so high. Of course after a few days this went away. What I really want to know is what the general ceiling effect for euphoria with suboxone is, when taken I.V. I know people in Europe usually crush up 1 mg and shoot them to get high, so I'm guessing it's a pretty low dose.

I get a nice mood lift from shooting .25 mg, but its really not so different then when i do 1 mg. I wonder if I got my tolerance down to doing a total of say .2 mg bupe everyday (or even went a few days without any bupe at all), and then injected 1 mg, would I feel a significantly better high?

I feel kind of annoying to continuously be asking these questions about suboxone, but its such a strange and confusing drug... I want to know how it works!

It really depends on your own individual physiology. At 4mg of Subutex I feel a nice buzz, if I drop my dose to 3mg or up it to 5mg I don't feel a difference. For me, at least, it seems that a consistent dose yields the greatest result. If I sniff or inject less than 4mg nothing happens but if I sniff or inject 4mg or more I feel sick. It's a weird drug and is very specific to your body. The thing to remember is that prolonged use will most definitely dull the effects, you may have felt a strong buzz the first few times but later on it got less and less powerful just like every other opiate.

 

[Znegative]

yeah, thats what I've noticed. I'm just wondering what it would take to lower my tolerance to appoint where if I took more, I would notice a high closer to that first time, or if thats even possible really.