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  • TDS Moderators: AlphaMethylPhenyl | paranoid android

So my detox starts tomorrow. Going to need some support.

if you fuck up you fuck up. you cant carry that shit on your shoulders. remember when i started my thread, went 5 days and then took a low amount of suboxone? i got high then. but i felt guilty. the guilt was what helped me in the end though. what did i say then? i told the guy i gave the rest of my suboxone to and i told this forum. i also said im gonna forget about it and i did. because of that i tell people i have 26 days instead of 21 and that makes a big difference in my mind. thats what counts too. fuck everyone else, i did this for me. if i need to lie to myself (to stay clean) i will. lying to rationlize getting high is another story.

i dont think about my slip up. i dont consider it anything. i pretend it never happened and its not something i will remember 1 year from now. we all fuck up. if we didn't then we wouldn't be addicts.

take your time man. make sure your really ready. theres nothin wrong going back to seeds or anything if you aren't ready because it ain't going anywhere. if you think everything will be better when your off then your mistaken. its gonna be harder then to stay clean because you WILL rationalize to yourself that you went this far, you deserve a treat. doing it and failing may discourage you and often times people end up way worse than they were previously. a lot of snorting junkies turn to needles after a failed detox attempt. i dont judge them because i know how it is, and we all understand.

what your doing now is probably one of the hardest things you'll ever do in your entire life. thats not an understatement. i failed so many times and hit it harder each time. plus, what is harder than this? getting married, buying a new car, buying a house, getting the job you want, getting through school to be a doctor, raising kids? i would say kids would be hard but i dont know, anything else is doable by anyone and wont cost you your life. this is a battle you will have to deal with for years to come and nobody will truly understand how your feeling at that time and moment when you really need it. not even us.

theres no shame going back to it. you'll feel shame and guilt for awhile but it passes. then again so does the worst parts of addiction.

its your life. you do what you WANT to do. and you do it for yourself and fuck the rest. call me selfish or whatever you want but i made up my mind after 6 or 7 years and didn't care what came from it. fortunately when you do something like that everyone feels the need to "support" you and tell you "it gets better" and "it"ll pass" but really they dont have a fucking clue and can suck the smallest part of my white cock. we're all individuals. i made it through but i failed so many times prior. i had to be a zombie for 14 months to decide ok now im ready to be off this and try the "right" thing. and yeah suboxone made me feel shittier than drugs because at least then you have emotion. didn't score? pissed. got it? joy. etc. suboxone? wake up feeling like shit. take tab. watch tv. go to work. come home. get in fight with girlfriend because i cant give her the affection she deserves. it didn't matter. the only time i felt actual emotion was when she told me to get out and i thought we were done, and even then it was more worry about what i was gonna do. i literally was a zombie but it broke the habit of calling people to score, feeling the sickness, etc. it was necessary for me. it got me so sick of it that i decided fuck it i'd rather feel emotional pain and distress than keep this bullshit up.

i dont see how it can be said suboxone is an antidepressant. unless it takes away shit feeling and replaces it with nothing.

do what you want. dont feel like you let us down if you cave. if you dont, were here to give you support. but truth be told most of us aren't withdrawaling. if we are it doesn't matter because my withdrawal was nothing. i've had it before where i jammed my thumbs in my eyes to feel something that wouldn't hurt as much. i posted a reply to every post in my thread at times because i was so desperate for someone to tell me they are in the same situation as me, but nobody was. just to relate to someone is key. you were actually the one i figured i could relate to at the time and that was it. but this is not a partner deal. you gotta be ready youself or else its fucked from the get go.
 
Truer words have never been spoken man, I totally agree with you. I'm at a crossroads right now and I can't shake the feeling of anxiety I get as if time is running out. Like I have to get on this shit NOW or it's never going to happen. It's driving me insane and I need to just take a step back for a minute. All my thoughts and reasons for wanting to quit are becoming lost in a sea of pessimistic thoughts and fear of never being okay again. I'm feeling so much pressure even just from myself to just fucking stop already, and it's not helping a damn thing. In fact, it's making me want to quit this whole fucking charade, move back to the city and say fuck it for now. But I'm not going to. I should not have to feel like I'm failing myself day after fucking day so I'm not going to.

Truth is, I feel like I have the seeds under control now, for the most part anyway. This is the longest I've gone without doing them since I started doing them and God Dammit, Codeine or not, I should be happy about that. I'm no longer getting high. But on the other hand, I don't feel like I'm ready to quit the Codeine... I never was... Why else would I keep picking up bottle after bottle, hopelessly trying to taper and failing every fucking time? Yeah I switched addictions but I'm a lot better off than I was. It's a step in the right direction. I don't have to wake up every day wondering if I'm going to be able to get a fix that day, the next day, every fucking day. I can pick up a bottle and not have to worry about it for a week. The withdraw from the seeds has subsided enough that one dose of Codeine will keep me totally withdraw free for 24 hours now, so I'm no longer drawing out any physical pain. I know I'm just trying to justify maintaining a habit, but as long as I'm not getting high, I can learn to live my life by another accord. Start figuring out how to cure the boredom. Pick up some new hobbies, get a new life going and then, when I'm ready, quit the Codeine.

Unfortunately this is a fucking pipe dream since there's only two drug stores in town and you can't buy more than one bottle per month so either way, I'm going to be forced to quit pretty soon... That's the dreadful reality of it, ready or not, for better or for worse, it's coming to an end. Time IS running out. There's nothing I can do except taper, and in my last post I said I had enough to last till Tuesday, tapering properly. Well I'm already out, so much for that. Shows how ready I am... If I REALLY wanted it, I would be comfortably withdrawing not attempting to remain totally withdraw free.

It always helps to find someone you can relate to, in any situation. It's the connections we share with one another as humans, and relating in any situation that I believe we live for. Language came from our desire to transcend our isolation and feel connected with one another. It's one of the most primal instincts. I want you to feel like you can talk to me no matter what, if you ever need to but you seem to have a much better handle on all this than I do.
 
you should probably go the suboxone route if possible. you sound like me 2 years ago. didn't wanna quit really but was fed up with it. those days i did get high were nice but they were few and far between and getting that high meant i spent 3 weeks chasing it and failing to get it. i kept it up, had those weeks i had money and splurged and got high 2 days then my tolerance went up so high it didn't matter how much extra money i had. the feeling afterwards was hell too. doing all the rest expecting one good high and not getting shit.

codeine can be used to taper but i couldn't. i tried tapering on other shit and its too easy to cheat. suboxone eliminates this and lets you stablize without being able to cheat. want to cheat? you gotta wait 24 hours at least and more often than not you dont feel shit. i've seen idiots take 16 mg a day, not take it that morning and do 300 dollars in oxy or more bragging they have such a high tolerance (who cares? your a loser for that in my eyes) and not understanding that shit takes 3 days till they can get high. it gives you time to think about it.

you'll do it eventually. it might not be the right time for you or maybe it is. only you know that and finding it out for yourself is hard. i thought i knew so many times, crying to my self or whatever. i was wrong all those times or tempted too much. i just decided one day that it was it, called my doctor, made the appointment to get the valium and clonidine, and went at it. its not gonna work out that way for you because your a different person than i am.

just take it as it comes.
 
Shady, it is going to be alright. You are so clear and focused and of course you are going to have the old voices of fear come up and of course your mind is going to throw out the temptation to just take the easy way but the good thing is you have this weapon to use--this other strong voice in your head that can say it's not the easy way and I know it (from your experience you do).
 
Just another update, still daily dosing on Codeine but I will be out and unable to pick up more after tomorrow. I picked up some Loparamide (12 2mg pills) and I was wondering, how much should I be taking? I understand I need to wait until I'm in full withdraw but I've never used Loparamide for withdraw before, so I really have no idea.
 
shady4091 said:
Just another update, still daily dosing on Codeine but I will be out and unable to pick up more after tomorrow. I picked up some Loparamide (12 2mg pills) and I was wondering, how much should I be taking? I understand I need to wait until I'm in full withdraw but I've never used Loparamide for withdraw before, so I really have no idea.
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you dont need to wait at all. i found it takes a good 3-5 hours till i really feel it. not feel it but dont have to run to the bathroom

take 6mg to start. you should prob have gotten the big bottle lol.
 
I know, it was all they fucking had, and the keep it behind the counter and wouldn't sell me more. Maybe people have begun to steal/abuse it hahahaha
 
well wait till like 4-8 hours after your last codeine dose. then take 6 mg. you'll still feel shit but the next day you can take more or the same. i found i needed like 6-8mg the first day then i went to 4 mg for a week then 2mg a week then eventually stopped. it was actually hard to stop too lol cause i knew the diahrea was comin and it actually made me feel better mentally and physically.
 
I shouldn't need any until at least 24 hours after my last Codeine dose, but wicked man thank you.

And meh, I'm doing alright. I basically haven't even been trying to quit for the last week or so, just giving myself a break. I'm pain free now maintaining on Codeine, been almost two weeks since I've last done seeds and just got my drivers license re-instated yesterday, so I can start looking for work soon. Tomorrow will be my last dose (should be for sure this time, they won't sell me more till the end of the month) then on to the Loparamide and hopefully kick this shit finally.
 
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shady4091 said:
I shouldn't need any until at least 24 hours after my last Codeine dose, but wicked man thank you.

And meh, I'm doing alright. I basically haven't even been trying to quit for the last week or so, just giving myself a break. I'm pain free now maintaining on Codeine, been almost two weeks since I've last done seeds and just got my drivers license re-instated yesterday, so I can start looking for work soon. Tomorrow will be my last dose (should be for sure this time, they won't sell me more till the end of the month) then on to the Loparamide and hopefully kick this shit finally.
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Congrats! You're doing so well, you should be very proud :) let us know how it goes.. <3
 
Good luck, man. It's cool that you chose not to get involved with a Subutex or Methadone program; they start off great, with free drugs and such, but it ends up getting very dull, very quickly.

I'm sure that you'll be able to taper off, but you honestly need to spend as much time as you can attempting to work up a sweat, with exercise or anything else that causes the release of endorphins - however, even though it's a good thing, you'll probably not want to attempt any sort of exercise or to even move from your bed. Try and eat: small snacks and sugary stuff is good and easy to keep down, rather than a big meal that you might end up spewing all over.

Hopefully you won't end up back on the tea. I'll be thinking of you and I wish you the very best of luck!

EDIT: Ah! Looks like you're coming to the end of your withdrawal. Well, that's fantastic, though don't underestimate any opiates with the power to cause addiction; they're apt to try and seduce you regardless of why, when and how you're taking them. Kratom may be a decent substitute for a while, and any muscle-relaxants (I personally used to get incredibly stiff muscles when withdrawing, especially from the 'done) will likely help, though they'll probably do more harm than good.

You said that you've got 'Seroquel', right? Maybe remaining unconscious - or at the very least unable to notice much about what's happening to your body - would be the best for you over the next few days, and you'll emerge feeling normal. It's truly a shame that the human brain can't adapt to changes more quickly, at least for the sake of coming OFF!

Take care. Love and Peace.
 
shady4091 said:
It always helps to find someone you can relate to, in any situation. It's the connections we share with one another as humans, and relating in any situation that I believe we live for. Language came from our desire to transcend our isolation and feel connected with one another. It's one of the most primal instincts.
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Shady, those are the truest words. I'm puttin' em over in the Quotes from Bluelighters thread right now.

And, also, I've just got to say, you and Larson are both inspirations. You guys have everything you need in life, right now; you've got wisdom and heart and you just need to stay focused on this one goal. So glad you have each other to bounce stuff off of---life does give gifts!
 
I'd start out with 2mg of the loperamide and then see if you need more. I don't think I ever took more than 4mg during WD. I like to have a lot of weed around though for stomach issues, so that may have reduced my use of loperamide.
 
Thanks guys, and thanks herbavore but I kinda got the idea from Waking Life so it's not necessarily my quote haha.

Kerrigan: Thanks man, but I can't underestimate the power of Codeine withdraw. It's really not a pretty sight from what I experienced a week or so ago... The Serequel doesn't do shit when I'm deep in withdraw, just makes me feel uncomfortably fucked up and still unable to sleep. And Kratom or muscle relaxants aren't really an option for me. Well maybe I could get some Robaxecet or something but I think I'll be okay without it.

I was just wondering, in your guys' experience, how well does Loparamide work on other symptoms besides diarrhea? More specifically, does it help the nausea at all? I'm not expecting some wonder drug here but the other week, when I tried to jump off the Codeine I took 200mg of Dimenhydrinate (not all at once), a seriously uncomfortable amount and I still threw up six times that night. It didn't help one bit. I honestly can't stand vomiting, like I'm seriously afraid of it :s It's hands down the worst part of withdraw and if I could just ease that, I'd have a much better shot at this.
 
Hmm poppies are a bitch just noticed this thread. I was addicted to pods for a while and I'll tell you coming off those fuckers was a BITCH. Even switching to sub I felt relatively fucked up for some time. However I also realized overtime trying again and again to quit that I had health issues that were getting in the way of me coming off them. And worse I had a condition that was giving me hotflashes even if I took my pods so you could imagine how badly the hotflashes were magnified when it came time to taper.

So first thing I'm going to say is the most obvious but also something I'd imagine lots of addicts would neglect. Your health. Since I started eating tons of veggies my coping to stress has increased almost to the point where I feel like I'm on a benzo or something. I can not explain it but I am thoroughly convinced eating tons of veggies can really help neutralize your central nervous system and keep it operating effectively. Veggies give off tons of nutrients that control your hormone levels, things like cortisol and adrenaline, and coming off opiates also impacts cortisol and adrenaline functioning.

All I'm saying is I tried quitting opiates several times. When I was just eating to eat (wouldn't even say I was eating bad) it was very fucking hard to drop my doses or attempt stopping all together. Now however its a completely different story. Although it took about 2 weeks before I noticed my health really changing for the better. Started sleeping better, felt less anxiety overall, so now I am addicted to veggies lol. I am still tapering my suboxone but it is nothing like how it was before. Almost no discomfort at all yet.

Anyway my point is eat as many fucking vegetables as you can. Carrots, cucumbers, peppers, broccli, green leafy veggies, there are basically some of the most potent nutritional foods you can get into your body. If you have issuse eating them or its a time thing sometimes I just throw a whole bunch in a blender, add some stevia, and pound that shit down. Then I divide up the rest of the veggies shake throughout the day. I really want to stress that this has been helping me a ton this is no bs placebo witchcraft type shit I really feel totally different since doing this.

Now depending on how much morphine you were getting into your blood its likely the codiene will do very little at all. But don't forget that loperamide potentiates opiates so if you are taking the codiene I highly suggest taking lope with it (lope will plug up the opiate receptors in your body so when you take the codiene it will not be wasted on those receptors but will travel to your brain and fill the receptors in your brain the the lope couldn't fill, thus having a more potent psychologial opiate effect - and don't forget if you do this you must take the lope 3 hours before the codiene). Still in the end the goal should be avoiding opiates 100%. And taking too much codiene or loperamide you may just find its taking longer to withdraw and get it over with. But for me I prefer slow detoxes so I wouldn't care really. Just do whatever you need to to get through each day and make sure you stay focused on the goal.

Not sure if seeing a dr is out of the question but this is another option that can obviously help a lot. I love the fact you have seroquel as for me when I had it it was a blessing for sleep while in wds. In fact it was just about the only thing that was able to knock me out but I had to take sometimes up to 500mg to get to bed. The thing I did not like was waking up the next day and having no energy from wds, THEN having left over seroquel in my blood which would compound that state and make me feel awful. So be wary that seroquel can have a hangover effect almost like alcohol might.

As far as herbs go Id have to say one of the most useful for wds is passion flower. Although you want to make sure you get both fresh and potent leaf. DO NOT buy this stuff from vitamin shoppe or any health food stores. If you want to get it go online and you will see tons of fresh farmers selling it on ebay. I had to try various suppliers before finding one with really superior product. But once I found a quality supplier of this herb I was astonished at how potent it is for sleep. I would make huge batches of passion flower tea (still do it although I'm out right now) and would gulp down a whole bunch with stevia in it. I loved the taste and like clockwork about 30mins later I'd get this very sedating/relaxing feeling come over my whole body. It literally felt no different than taking a few valium. Best part being though there are absolutely no side effects from taking it. I have grown a lot of respect for this herb and now buy it by the pounds. Am stocking up cause the lower I get the more likely I'm gonna get hit with insomnia.

Aside from that can't really think of much more. Well I can think of a ton but somethings I'm not really allowed to write here. Depends on how I say it really. But theres been lots of times in the past where I've ran out and just ordered tram right [edit] *on my computer* legally as a lot of states in US do not treat it as a controlled substance. So this means depending on your state you can go right *on your computer* [not sourcing a specific place] and fill out a script and have it at your house the following day. Just encase you are thrown into a hell you didn't expect and the codienes aren't cutting it. I never felt 100% with the tram but it did definitely get rid of most of the wds. Just remember though things like this are risky depending on your personality. I'm not a very compuslive person though with weaker drugs usually only more potent ones, so I never had issues with regulating my tram use and keeping it going down. Just that I found tram was compounding my health condition (adrenal fatigue and tram fucks with your adrenal glands) so I wound up switching to sub.

Either way though g/luck! If you don't feel horribly bad the best solution is obviously to stay away from opiates like I said already but you should know what is best for you and what you need to do. Keep us posted as things pop up I really wanna see you make it through this man. Its rough but its all about strategy, the better your strategy and the more you plan ahead of time the better of you will be when things come along. Take care - Bo
 
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hello fucking cravings. such a hard night last night. slept like 2 hours if i was lucky. cravings benzos pretty hard but not opiates. benzos i have some access to though so i do get a bit worried.
 
Thanks for writing that Bojangles. Fortunately I'm through the seed withdraw (been two weeks today since I've had any) and I'm kicking the Codeine today. It's been about 26 hours since I've had any Codeine and I haven't taken any Loperamide yet, but I will take some shortly. I didn't know about Loperamide and potentating opiates? Is that actually true and proven? I'm skeptical, but that's not something I should be thinking about right now either haha.

What happened last night, Larson?
 
Hello Shady,

I hope everything goes well! I have not done poppy really, but right now I am W/D through OPANA. It's the worst pain I have every experienced! It's been a week since I had my last dose, 60mg which is really high with Oxymorphone. I grabbed imodium a few days ago and took 3 mg to help with my stomich. It's been hell for me, just like it's been hell for you. No one should ever have to go through what we have to go through and people need to realize what people who are going through W/D are actually going through! Hang in there man, you can do it! And kick that codeine as soon as you can. You don't want to trade one habbit for another right? I'm here for you bud, I read through every page and am pretty updated on whats going on, I will follow as much as I can and get my imput in. And dont worry about the replase, everyone does it pretty much. Hell I did when i wanted off this stuff! I've been clean for a week, but still have urges. What sucks is getting my paycheck on a friday, and having my guy re-up on the days I get my pay... Thats the hard part! Delete anyone in your conacts who help'd you get to your habbit or help support it. Dosn't suck more when you're trying to get and your connect messages you and says, "I'm good with so n' so..."
 
nothing happened, it just kinda manifested itself. it was normally my day off but i was called into work, everything was fine, had tons of energy, got what i wanted for dinner when i got home, etc. i stayed up really late though. it seemed like this time being up alone was not very good. i was thinking a lot about it and wanted something to help me sleep. ended up with 2 hours of sleep and feel so fucked right now but so wide awake.

my bed is not good either. no matter what way i lay i feel like my lower back is bent and it hurts. i have to sleep in a totally different way than i have slept in the past 6 years and that is just weird. sleep has been shit since i got clean for the most part. theres no more waking up, feeling tired and falling back asleep. now its like i wake up and it hits me in the face and im up and just exhausted, no way am i faling back asleep. today is literally the first day i've fallen asleep within an hour of waking up in the month or whatever its been now.
 
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