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  • Film & TV Moderators: ghostfreak

TV: Lost

but no writer in the world can create a whole story with a definite, planned ending (which I hope you agree is a very important aspect) without knowing when exactly they will be allowed to finish it.
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i'll just focus on that because i think its the most important. your having christmas this year right? maybe you should have a christmas party... that'd be great fun. or wait, this year at christmas you could organise a huge party for next year! or a small one for this year... or... I could do this all day. the point is the same, i'm trying to have fun.
the lost writers most likely have a very good idea of the plot, and where it will end, and have had this idea for quite sometime. sure, jack might die instead of sawyer, or kate might end up with sun... depends on what the public wants i guess... and ultimately the only true plot that exists is the one that has been published so far... that doesn't stop the show from being written to fulfill the writers fantasy.
The funniest part, your understanding of the storyline and plot of the show appears to be exactly the same as the characters within that storyline. maybe the writers meant it...
 
the lost writers most likely have a very good idea of the plot, and where it will end, and have had this idea for quite sometime. sure, jack might die instead of sawyer, or kate might end up with sun...
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Ah, just like all the world's great stories then... Did you know, for instance, that Shakespeare originally wanted Romeo to end up with Juliet's nurse, and for Tybalt and Mercutio to become best friends, leave Verona for Mantua and set up a hotel to facillitate peace among feuding families whilst holidaying... In fact, the only reason he changed it was because the manager of The Globe wanted an extra act - so Willy tagged on a few extra love scenes and a suicide bit at the end. Luckily for him it all worked out, eh?

Honestly, I can hardly believe you made that comment with a straight face. You just said 'the writer's do know where the plot is going, however, they may not know if the main character is going to die or not' - is the life or death of the biggest character just some incidental detail? If they don't have those details to hand, what can they have? Basically, Lost has turned into a Soap Opera. In fact we're already starting to see the familar pattern of old characters dying, new members being drafted in. It's just bad. Bad bad bad. But honestly, let's not talk about it anymore, we're obviously not going to persuade each other...
 
i'm glad you brought up romeo and juliet... we can analyse the many film versions, particulaly the baz luhman version, and discuss how allthough the middle of the movie was chopped and changed the story was, ultimately, the same...

wait, in the baz luhman version, the whole final two scenes are mashed into one scene... and yet... we still call it shakespear... wait... umm... hey baz, we need another scene... "ok, i'll make mercutio dance around in drag..." ok i'll let you go on now unless you stand by the whole 'lets not talk about it anymore'...

oh, and it's funny who you see as the main characters... perhaps this is where you miss the whole 'philosphical' part of the show. look beyond their characters, at their steroetypes, and then compare it to how they act. it's a fun little experiment, especially considering modern pop-culture and this shows place in it. i suspect it will get better but who knows... i seen rumors of references to bhuddism (the 'ultra-violet map' looks like the bhuddist wheel). my character point being... there is no main character or main hero... i thought u'd have noticed seeing as it's an extremely exploitable writing trick, possibly allowing the network to keep the show on forever, if that were possible.

i write too much...
 
OK, screw it, I admit it, I can't resist a debate... I'm back in.

I don't understand your argument here because it seems to prove my point more than harm it. I made a point about R&J. I used this becasue, whether people like it or not, it's still generally accepted as one of the greatest stories of all time. But you come back with the point that in 1998 (or roundabout, not really sure) a director comes up with a new 'chopped and changed' version, Romeo + Juliet. This version was bascially panned by critics, was not a success and has pretty much vanished from history already. So what does this show us about taking a good original story and changing it around? It shows us it makes it worse.

Your next point is that I should look beyond the characters. OK, so we look to the Bhudda inspired map. Let me ask you this - how many people watching this program would not have realised that the map was based on said wheel? Answer, almost no-one. This, essentially, is my problem with this program. I have no doubt it is highly entertaining and adictive stuff, but the philosophy elements are so absurdly dumbed down as to be meaningless. So what if it looks like a Bhuddist symbol: will that teach the average viewer anything about Bhuddism? No, it will merely pander to their sense of intellect... Because the truth is that no-one could possibly have failed to spot the style of the map - and the character's debates about religion/science could have been written by five year olds. There is no depth or real meaning to any of the philopsphy expressed in this program. The truth is philospohy is a damn difficult subject, and it takes a hell of a lot of effort to understand even the basic concepts. Just out of interest here, you say that I have missed a huge amount of the philospohy going on under the surface - so could you tell me, in your opinion, what is the most important or meaningful concept touched on by the program, and how exactly it sheds new light on it? What has it taught you about the subject of Philosophy, and how?


Finally, I trawled back through this post and found your entry and what you think may be going on with the island: here it is.

the island is in fact a 'nirvana' created by someone, possibly a collaboration of governments, to protect humanity in the events of a nuclear holocaust. Underneath the island is a vast city, advanced beyond that of the outside world in all scientific fields. The 'others' are simply the scouts of this city, and protect the secrets of the city in accordance with their orders. As a utopia, it does have strict moral and ethical laws, and an even strciter policy on introducing people to their society.

The 'monster' is god knows what... probably either an automated defence mechanism which has gone out of control (since the 'others' have receeded into their nirvana), or a stupid spiritual idea that the creators decided would be cool.

The healing powers of the island are derived from its magnetic field... somehow (i'm not into biology/medicine at all)

The lost cast are not being accepted into the utopic society because it is unknown whether they are truly worth it (so far everyone on the island has a questionable past), with the exceptions of certain peoples, such as the kids, and the unborn baby.

All hatches with the exception of the main hatch (the hatch in the middle of the island) are purposeless... they served a purpose during the construction of the island, but are now obsolete, and simply used to test those on the island... the exception to this is the hatch that the cast has occupied, as it controls the magnetic field generator and its overload. Of course, no one in the utopia wants to be subjected to this job, and it is given to someone who is dumb enough to mindlessly control it.

as for how the island remains hidden (from google.earth :P) or how it managed to trap people trying to escape... its beyond me... i mean they should really be follwing the stars anyway... its not like they have a whole bunch of compasses. but this doesn't discredit the theory of a utopic society living underground on the island, protecting themselves from the outside world due to a belief that A) the outside would is doomed anyway; and B) there's not enough room in their city for everyone.
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If this is how you think the program will end, what do you think this ending represents? What are the main philosophical concepts it supports or reputes? How does it do this?
 
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maybe its just an australian thing, but we study the original text and baz's version in our final year of high school, or at least a lot of schools do. personally i don't think it has vanished from history, and although it might one day vanish, a day long before the original text, it wouldn't discredit the work itself. if you have seen the movie, do you personally feel it hasn't taken a classic text and adapted it into a form that is presentable to massive pop-culture oriented audience? in fact it's probably in the perfect form to present the story to 15 year old girls. but this is a matter of opinion, and not just the critics opinion, so the point is mute. unless u haven't actually seen the movie, in which case it's time to stop reading and just shut up.

next... the 'philosophical' value of the show... i won't get into too much detail. basically, philosophy [the rational investigation of the truths and principles of being, knowledge, or conduct. - dictionary.com] is a point of view, as what is rational is a matter of personal opinion. therefore, all humans have their own philosophy. this philosophy is developed by exposure to new thoughts, idea's, visions, drugs, whatever... basically by new experience, or more importantly, the interpretation of experience (the new bit being incidental of its existance). i believed all this before i watched the show.

so, why is lost philosophical valuable? to me, it's not really... a few concepts have popped up from watching it. you are right... the whole bhuddist thing I don't get. as i said, i've heard/read rumors of connections. funny to think someone could see so far into the show and pull so much from one image. maybe it was simply in their head from a day of meditation. i tangeant sorry.
the point is, as u said, philosophy is a difficult subject, and i could argue anything has philosphical value, merely in its existance. what makes lost interesting too me is, once again, it's pop-culture orientation. let me summarise the show as i see it:
"A plane crash lands on a mysterious island, where a tribe of apparently savage humans are for some reason abducting survivors of the plane, while those survivors investigate the pressing of a button which apparently controls the fate of the world. Meanwhile, a heroin junkie kicks his habit, a new mother experiences the newly possible ultimate terrors, a doctor learns what pride is all about, a miracle loses faith, two lovers are reunited in trade for their lives, a criminal finds rightousness, another criminal finds god, and a third finds the man she's being dreaming of, all while a fat kid stays fat, and runs out of batteries. And all told in traditional 21st Century style."
if the show was how you see it... written entirely season to season, the point would be even more relevant, but as it is... Lost is a portrait of western society, it's values, and how it see's certain issues. isn't this potentially the most important philosophical tool? the points of view others hold? the majority holds? to me... the most important idea it has looked into would be the utopia idea (unless i'm pulling that out of thin air) and the portrayal of it being fake to a certain degree. the idea hasn't been explored yet, so i might be just crazy.

this is taking too long... i never said how the show would end... personally, i get the feeling the show will end with something weird, like the mafia rocking up and taking over the island. to those who watch the show, was desmonds wife a mafia daughter or once again, am i crazy.
 
DarthMom said:
Hi, My name is Amy and I am addicted to Lost.
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fuck that. i stopped watching long ago, it got intensely boring and was going nowhere. i would mind someone summing up everything for me though, curious as to what happened, but not enough to watch it :\


edit, nice post knight! that was more interesting than any episode.
 
DarthMom said:
fuck that. i stopped watching long ago, it got intensely boring and was going nowhere. i would mind someone summing up everything for me though, curious as to what happened, but not enough to watch it :\


edit, nice post knight! that was more interesting than any episode.
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They didnt push the button. 8o. Walt and His dad are re-united and they are given a boat by the others to escape the island. Jack Sawyer & Kate are captures by the others.

alot of more sexy stuff :-D
 
why did the others let them escape?? so do they have a clue as to why they are in this experiment, or is it really one, or what??

eh, i should get the series on dvd, and watch it one day when i am sick or depressed, all of em in a row :D

there is nothing better than watching hours upon hours of a great show on a rainy day!
 
DarthMom said:
why did the others let them escape?? so do they have a clue as to why they are in this experiment, or is it really one, or what??

eh, i should get the series on dvd, and watch it one day when i am sick or depressed, all of em in a row :D

there is nothing better than watching hours upon hours of a great show on a rainy day!
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Walts dad [forget his name right now] lead Jack, Hugo, Kate, and Sawyer in exchange for his son and a boat to get home. They let Hugo go back to the other side of the island to tell his mates to never come over to this site.

They don't know why they're in the experiment yet but in the last episode one of the others told jack that they have communication with the outside world [They prove it by telling him the redsocks won the world cup, when he starts laughing they show him a video of it lol] and that he was born on the island. And in exchange from Jacks cooperation they'll take him home.

You can download the show from Torrents, that's what I did! =D
 
yeah i may do that, i had liek 6 episodes dvr'ed for months though and couldn't get into wanting to watch it!!

so walts dad gave them up for his kid? that rocks. and jack born there?! wtf?!

ok guess i will be ordering the dvd's from netflix. i am interested now lol
 
DarthMom said:
yeah i may do that, i had liek 6 episodes dvr'ed for months though and couldn't get into wanting to watch it!!

so walts dad gave them up for his kid? that rocks. and jack born there?! wtf?!

ok guess i will be ordering the dvd's from netflix. i am interested now lol
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no no, not Jack, The lead guy of the others said that.

Next episode is aired (Ep03) tonight I believe

When the stopped pressing the button everything went weird and the hatch might of blown up (we dont know yet) so we don't know if Locke & Eko are dead :(
 
that site is awesome sillyalien, i like that you don't have to download anything, but i can't stand watching stuff on the 20 inch puter screen, i much prefer laying on my comfy couch and watching on a 64 inch tv :D
 
DarthMom said:
that site is awesome sillyalien, i like that you don't have to download anything, but i can't stand watching stuff on the 20 inch puter screen, i much prefer laying on my comfy couch and watching on a 64 inch tv :D
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Couch + Bigscreen + Laptop + Wireless VGA = Ya mon! Ayree!
rastaze1.gif
 
hey... i know my hubby could do that, we put up some neat visuals from the puter one of our little party nights, great idea :D thanks!

awesome, there is a new anime out that i can't find on dvd yet, so this will work for that too. you da man, silly!
 
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