True opium powder from poppy seeds..

[rachamim]

MellowFellow: We have talked about this over and over in this Forum. There is one single case of OD and it is bogus ("PoppySeed Tea Can Kill" a website PURPORTEDLY made by a youngman's grieving parents). IF it was possible do you not imagine there would be others dying?

It is a scientific fact that seeds contain NO alkaloids. As I said, you can find SOME with a SLIGHT coating but that is hit and miss and most often a BIG MISS.

As for the question. It will never be opium powder. It can be a powderised vegetable product with a very slight admixture of alkaloids in it. That however is not soemthing that can be efficiently smoked. I will try to be simple about it as I explain it. With substances that are smoked there 2 main issues you need to deal with.

I) Malting Point. This is the temp. at which a substance burns.

II) "Vapourisation Point.": this is the point at which a substance vapourises. When you amoke soemthing you need to inhale its vapours, not the smoke per se (smoke being what happens when it is burned/melted).

So, your MP and your VP need to be very close together, and ideally the VP will be just under the MP if any difference is neccessary. This way, when you "smoke" oit you will be able to inhale the vapour before the substance burns.

The vegetable powder you describe is going to have the same exact MP as a dried pod and NOT opium. Its VP is too far out of synch to make it effective in smoking.

As for the second question, no, sorry to say that there is no way to get any truly smokable materiel from a pod, other than as opium.

As for your 2nd post, the kid di not OD from 2 pounds of seeds. Whoever created the website says he did. IF the case even happened, and I cannot say if it did or did not because I would not waste my time or money calling the Country Coronoer in California, the figures offered in the tox screen give a reading that is 3 times higher than my own tox screen.

I have ben a hardcore opiat/opioid addict for 25 years. I currently take only 400 mgs of morphine a day but was taking 600 a day when I first bothered to review that data and even then the figures had mine beat. A man with 600 mgs of morphine daily is not going to have less metabolites than a very young man with a Seed Tea "habit."

I am sure that you do not need me to tell you that most of what you read online is nonsense. I can produce a few sites that maintain that 9/11 was an isnide job and that the planes were holographs. The existence of a claim on a website does not equal truth, it merely represents a waste of time.

Unfortunately, IF some young man did die, his parents never imagines that their effort would be taken the opposite way and encourage people to TRY and get the same results. If it is sincere they certainly hoped people would not. Either way they are mistaken.

 

[bsnyder]

I) Malting Point. This is the temp. at which a substance burns.

II) "Vapourisation Point.": this is the point at which a substance vapourises. When you amoke soemthing you need to inhale its vapours, not the smoke per se (smoke being what happens when it is burned/melted).

Jesus christ why do you pretend to be so well informed. Clearly 25 years of hardcore opiate addiction has left you fucked in the head. MP is when a substance melts. E.G. The MP of water is 0 C. If something burns or degrades, it is referred to as 'point of decomposition'. The vaporization point of a substance is the point at which it boils. E.G. the vaporization point of water is 100 C.

I have looked at a few of your posts and almost all of them contain some amount of misinformation. Please stop playing expert - you aren't one! I might not be either, but at least I can recognize this fact!

Also, it is completely possible to OD on tea. In fact, it would probably be easiest to OD on tea because it does not contained a metered amount of opiates.

Basic moral of the story: don't take rachamim's word as truth...

 

[rachamim]

Bsnyder: I realise you are rleatively knew so let me help you out with a little tip. Confront the post, not the poster. The thread OR the forum are not about Rachamim. THIS thread is about your claim. Keep it focused and keep your insults to yourself.

I "pretend" to be informed? If you say so.

I find the "25 years of addiction" comment a bit funny though. Here you are, on a drug board, talking about YOUR use of opiates and you cricise another user for...USING? Precious, absolutely precious.

"MP.": Most people on this site, let alone this forum have no real concept of what a melting point is. Ergo I tried to give it in a digestable format.

You are one of those sad people who cannot discuss issues. If soemone dares to question soemthing you say then they are deficient in some way. Tell you what, instead of insulting me why not try something actually useful, dispute information I have provided. You say almost all my posts have "misinformation" in them, then prove it. Of course this is from a person who thought they discovered soemthing when telling us about asprin as a precursor but never the less, be my guest. Pull anything you want, and debunk it. Why not start with my dismissal of your claim that homemade opiated preperations are common in SE ASia. Surely you can prove that.

I am not infallible by any means but I will say this, there is a verygood reason why I rarely if ever post ina thread that is not about opiates/opioids OR Kratom. The reason of course is because I only post about what I know. You say you have read wome of my posts so finding something to disprove should be extremely easy.

A person who provides correct facts that counter your "ideas" is not soemone trying to be an "expert."It is also not someone trying ot insult you. If your feelings get hurt that easily you ought to keep your mouth sut. This is a FORUM, not your Blog. If you want to talk unchallenged do not do it in a Harm Reduction forum where people need to get ACCURATE information. It is often a case of life or death, literally. People like you are dangerous.

"It is possible to OD from tea.": Right, because of a website sUPPOSEDLY manufactured by one set of grieving parents. Teoretically is is certainly possible to OD from ANY opiate/opioid but probability is next to nothing. the amount of alkaloids contained in Tea is minimal and by the time you consumed enough to OD on you would have evacuated your previously consumed dosage. in other words, it is merry go round and would never happen and it would certainly NEVER happen with Tea.

An opiatenive person will love Tea, more power to them. I am jealous to be honest, sure wish I could feel it but I cannot and neither can most long term addicts and that s what it is. If it upsets you, learn to live with it.

Oh, and YOUR science lesson, it is only true with water. We are discussing solids. If you cannot even get that right maybe you ought to try talking about something else. I enjoy discourse, but this is not the place ofr insults. This is a place ofr accurate information ABOUT subject matter, not your perceptions of me as a person. Try learning that lesson first.

to others: One thing the poster said though WAS correct (you know what Shakespeare said about monkeys and typewriters, right?). "DO NOT LISTEN TO RACHAMIM; You should never listen to a person online. You SHOULD however take the info given and use it as a starting point for your OWN investigation. In this way you will be fully confident in your knowledge.

 

[rkline]

nobody seems to have answered mellow fellows question as to where or how to get opium pods legally and I'm wonderign the same thing..
I thought (at least in the us) that the only way to get pods is through illegal means or by growing the plants yourself. If this is not true, than my question is the same, where can one legally buy pods with residue that can be scraped?
If his question wasn't answered because its against BL forum rules, I apologize for re-posting it

 

[mellowfellow420]

I'll amuse your thoughts of the OD' website not being credible...

...there are hundreds of people who have experienced the effects and claim that it works...Just because you have a high tolerance to morphine does not mean the tea cannot work..

Can you quote any scientific stuff that will tell me the seeds have NO OPIATE/OPIOID ALKOLOIDS ...i think its much more plausible they have small amounts which is why bulk is necessary..

"It will never be opium powder." ya i said that in my previous post i think...but it still will have a lil bit of goodies in it


SO...NEXT QUESTION...
Do florist shops carry poppy pods!?(for decoration purposes of course not for other stuff..)

 

[Informer112]

Here in Van City that shit is legal.

It's called dota or something. It's not opium or heroin but poppy seeds grinded into powder. Indians hook you up with it phat in corner stores around here for 10 bucks.

It's not bad when you rail it. Orally swallowing it makes it a waste. Don't recommend it unless you've done opium before or oxy. Shit's addicting as hell after two times.

 

[mongman]

Firstly I find the discussion here to be interesting and amusing to say the least. The Poppy Seed debate has raged in a number of forums here on bluelight for a few years now.

Personally I believe an Opiate naive individual could easily overdose on Poppy Seed Tea. I developed an addiction to seed tea around 6 years ago which lasted for around 4 years. Escalating to the point at which I was consuming the results of a 2 kg wash per day. While the morphine content of seed can vary greatly I live in a country that produces a moderate amount of opioids and is well know of the top 1 strain (irrelevant, top1 is a thebaine producing strain who's seed is not put into circulation as it's a huge asset to the company producing these products. im merely hinting at the source of the seed I was consuming) . At that point in time most seed was not washed and I suspect morphine content was toward the top end of the spectrum. Based on this and an assumption that the seed contained around 200 microgram/gram of morphine [1] my intake of morphine orally would have been between 300 and 400 milligrams per day in one dose.
There is absolutely no reason someone with no tolerance who ingested a similar or larger amount in one sitting would no OD.

Since this time manufacturers in my country have started washing seed before distributing it to spice companies.

If anyone has access to one of the sites containing papers on pharmaceutical/medical maters you will find many papers supporting the alkaloid concentrations mentioned above.

 

[bsnyder]

Alrighty well I guess we have heard your take on the matter rachamim. I guess these people can decide who to listen for themselves now...

 

[mellowfellow420]

Ok...

So can this same process be done using pods...

I plan to get some pods and grind them to a powder...I will use isoprophyl to get the goodies out...After it evaporates i should be left with a pretty opiate/opioid active substance..Right??

After i have this powder/tar is there another process(relatively easy one at that..im no chemist) that can be used to separate inert plant crap from the good stuff...????

Like make it more base or whatever so it is easier to smoke/snort/consume...and make it more potent???

i would really like to know...so if everyone can take a minute away from arguing about Melting Points and shit lemme know...

Also chime in if you have had any experience with crushing the pods and doing things to them...???

 

[rkline]

can pods be purchased legally in the US? simply for decoration of course

 

[mellowfellow420]

yes..they can

i am pretty intent on getting them...i have figured that florist shops most likely carry them and am calling them tomorrow...just Google florist shops in your area and call them and see if they carry poppy pods for decorative purposes of course...

they are 100% legal but as soon as you try to extract opiates/opioids out of them you are breaking the law(manufacturing controlled substance)..but we are using it for decorative purposes so we don' have to worry bout that...*wink wink

 

[rkline]

are these legally purchased pods the same as you would get had you grown your own opium poppy plants? Essentially I'm asking whether or not these legally purchased pods contain the resin that is scraped for opium? Or have they been cleaned of the resin making opium extraction impossible?

 

[mongman]

Pods bought in florists etc are generally Papaver somniferum, as a result most likely contain the associated alkaloids, however always exercise caution. Sometimes pods are lacquered for example to improve appearance in flower arrangements. There is no way you can know how the material has been treated before you receive it. You may argue this is the same for almost all illegal drugs, however illegal drugs are intended for consumption. The pods you may find in a florist shop are never (officially) intended for consumption, as a result the risk of dangerous adulterants or even something as simple as mould is both significant and serious factors to consider...

 

[rachamim]

RKline: To answer the OP's question, they can be found at floral supply houses and at florists both retail and wholesale with those specialising in dried flowers being the most likely to stock them. While it is true that pods can be enameled, etc for preservation (after all it is a ded on the stalk flower at the best of times), it is exceedingly rare to find any. IF one orders them online, etc all one has to do is find out if they have any preservatives.

Most wholesalers are not retarded, they know what people want and since they are already on the wrong side of the law (pods are illegal in the US mind you BUT widely available just the same and enforcement is highly selective), they overwhelmingly stock natural pods. Indeed, most only sell pods with all but 4 inches of starw cut off underneath. If they are to be used in actual floral arranging they require ALL the straw. One good way to find out, is to inquire how long the stems are (if not already specified in advertising, etc).

To answer the last part of your question, IF the pods have died on the stalk as they almost always do in the case of floral pods, they will have a tiny bit of powderised alkloidal materiel (mixed with vegetable matter) inside the pod. It is not always true, and it is also a point that they are very delicate (hence the rare usage of perservatives) and often incur damage in transit (shipping). A tiny hole can drain all the powder out of the pod so not all the pods bought will have it.

If you have dried pods, take a clean bowl, put it on a table, take the pod in your hand and with a pin poke a tiny hole, big enough say for 3 or 4 poppy seeds, and agitate (shake) the pod over the bowl. A much faster way is to poke a bit larger hole and empy the contents (seeds and powder) into the palm of your hands. Rub both hands together and the powder will fall into the bowl quite easily, while the seeds will remain in your hands.

Since seeds CONTAIN NO ALKALOIDS, and indeed give you GI disturbances due to their fats and acids, place them in a separate container for planting, etc.

In the first bowl you will have a pile of reddish brown poweder that is largely alkaloidal materiel. I would not smoke it because of the MP (it is not "opium" per se although it has much the same content). I would simply use that to brew Tea, as one might use an IceTea mix, etc.

 

[rachamim]

Mellow: Look, if you seriously ask for references on poppyseeds not containing any alkaloids you have a long way to go before arguing over the plant. You can Google like anyone else. I suggest though that you begin because that is one of the most basic things about the plant.

As for "hundreds of others gaining benefit from tea," right you are but then one could say the same about folks smoking banana peels, nodding on Tramadol, and seeing creatures from another planet on LSD. Subjective reasoning is worthless. Just as you argued that the subjective reasoning of hundreds proves your point I can also argue that my own (and others) subjective reasoning proves it does not. The only accurate way to untangle this morass is to look at scientific facts.

As for your second idea about using a solvent to get alkaloids out of ground pods, yes it works. Thing is, you need millions of pods to get any salvageable materiels, to do at least 7 acidic extractions, yuse specialised machinery, etc. Doing an A/B Extraction will not get you naything but wasted time and a huge mess. SOLUBILITY INDEX. Learn the phrase, let it be your friend. ONCE you leanr and understand it you will see why your idea will not work.

Informer: Yes, it is sold both for Tea and for pa'an, which is an Indian recreational psychoactive culturism (although pa'an can also be for non-psychoactive usage). It is pieces of poppy pod mixed with other stuff like tumeric, fennel, etc.

Mongman: "300 to 400 mgs of morphine day from seed washings.": Uh, no it was not. How can I know? Because you have no idea of the number of pods (not to even go further and say seeds that may or may not have slight coatings from the pods) needed to procude that figure.

Seeds have nothing IN them but soemtimes have a tiny bit ON them. SOMETIMES is the operative word. SOMETIMES. So, you would not ever come close to that from less than 2 kilos of seeds, let alone 25,000 pods (as was argued by soemone producing a DEA paper that showed 25,000 pods to have roughly 400 mgs). Let us, for the sake of srgument, now imagine that DEA paper to be correct. 25,000 pods, how many seeds in 25,000> Then figuring, even giving an overestimation that 75% of the pods had seeds with SOME coating. I will not do the clculation but pick a soemwhat arbitrary number...40,000 Pods worth of seeds? ALOT more than 2 pounds.

See, this is what I mean about subjectivity. I have no doubt that you drank Seed Tea, and no doubt that you enjoyed it. However, the mind is an amazing thing (sadly many get insulted at this point that anyone could ever question their percpetion).

I have access to Wiley, Elvesier, and a couple of other data banks so all you have to do is tell me a paper title and/or author and I can easily access it. I would not ask you to believe me but if you can imagine, I spend at least 2 hours of every day (6 days a week) studying the plant so if there had EVER been such a paper I probably would have found it. Since I am not G-D though I am certainly far from infallibel. Ergo, if you provide the info I will be happy to look at any papers you have or know of.

 

[rachamim]

Mello: "Pods rare 100% legal...": NO, THEY ARE NOT. You can go to prison for them just as easy as you can for having a bag of heroin. The only difference is that enforcement is spotty but it is not a case of anyone being able to make a truly informed deicson on the risks. People just take a gamble and usually they win. Be kind of nasty to lose though.

 

[mongman]

rachamim: I did reference one paper in my original post which provides solid evidence on the alkaloid content of seed material.
"Poppy seeds: differences in morphine and codeine content and variation in inter- and intra individual excretion"
by Pelders MG, Ros JJ
Dutch Laboratory for Drugs and Doping,
Hospital Pharmacy Midden-Brabant,
The Netherlands.
J Forensic Sci 1996 Mar; 41(2):209-12

I completely agree, the seed itself contains no alkaloids however depending on the harvesting technique and the strain of poppy the amount found can be significant. This paper suggests between 2-251 ug/g Morphine and 0.4-57.1 ug/g Codeine. Additionally to this I have extensive experience with other stronger illicit and pharmaceutical opiates which subjectively support the strength of the tea. When I initially presented to the medical profession my doctor at my University did some research (as he was sceptical also) he also found literature that suggested my addiction was real. I'm now in treatment using Subutex, 6 mg was where I stabilised at to keep the withdrawals at bay while not feeling like I was increasing my tolerance to opiates.

I also suggest you look into industrial farming techniques for the plant as some now use the entire plant (sans seeds). During which the ripe plant (and pods) is beaten and pulverised before chemical extraction begins. An unproven theory of mine is that in area's that use this industrial process the seed alkaloid content may be higher due to rupturing of the pod and slight distribution of latex through the seed itself. Again this is an unproven theory, however I know for a fact this plant collection process is used here in Tasmania.

 

[mellowfellow420]

You seem pretty knowledgeable whoever it seems kind of flawed based on what i have heard from everyone else...

When get pods your not looking to make use of seeds...Poppy seed pods contain latex which is relatively high in active alkaloids...

So my next question is going to be to people who actually use the practice of getting recreational effects from the pods...What method do you use...Could you use the same isoprophyl alcohol extraction to wash away active opiates/opioids from the dried plant material...

Rachamim quit being a fuckin party pooper...^this guy isn't on Subutex for nothing...Obviously some people get very real effects from this...

Don't compare using dried pods akin to smoking banana peels to try to support your opinion...There are not hundreds of document reports of people smoking banana peels and getting recreation effects; there are on the other hand hundreds of documented reports of using poppy seeds pods to get recreational effects such as sedation and euphoria..SERVED

As for your solubility claim...most of the alkaloids that contain active opiates/opioids in the pods can be effectively harvested using alcohol or even water...

 

[mellowfellow420]

hahah....

As for the legality thing...it might be a tiny bit quaisi-legal BUT...

lol...If a cop comes in your home ;having a dried Poppy decoration hung up on your wall is NOT the same thing as having a bag of heroin hung up on the wall...LMFAO

I already said that using the pods to extract the goodies is illegal how ever their use as a decoration is not...

SERVED #2

EDIT: i am not in cambodia so IDK if police forces there will go nuts over some dried Pods hung up as decoration but i can't really see that happening in the U S OF A!

 

[mellowfellow420]

Quote from d-Dexter-25


"Ok I have been a heroin addict for years and have been on 160mg of methadone for a year and a half(been off for just 2 months) and after using just 8 large pods of the arizonia purple variety I got a decent high comparable to heroin and very long lasted like 18 hours!!! I will compare it to 90-100mg of oxycontin and thats no joke as oc's do nothing for me below 80 for some reason. I'm sure your wrong about pods and they are not placebo I can assure you that!!! Also when I was younger I tried them and needed only 2-3 jumbo pods to get so high i'd be throwing up and sick but high as fuck nodding offf!!!

I love poppy pods and after plugging the tea i'll be going that route to avoid drinking the tea but plugging is'nt any more effective just not any less. I tried just eating the pods but it was'nt worth the hassle of chocking it down but it did work even better. I use about 5-10 pods on the weekends and at the price its great!!! It works better then heroin cause it lasts much longer and way cheaper when bought in bulk. Also my tolerence has barely gone up using just once on the weekend!!!"


Quote from ArtVandalay

"Rachamim- This is an ignorant statement. I've been a 'hardcore addict' and get very real, beneficial effects from pod tea. IMO high doses of pod tea are as effective as heroin (smoked). I've experienced horrible WD's from pod tea, took an Oxy 80 and it barely made me feel normal.

You'll probably dissmiss my 'subjective experiences' and I don't have stats to throw around. You usually have intelligent, insightful posts but you're way off base on this one."

Quote From BingeBoy (moderator)

"althoug most commercial pods are neatly inferoir to home grown /collected pods , calling the high you get from them placebo is overdoing it a bit imo , i usually need 1,5 x to 2 times my dose with commercial pods note that this goes for fresh pods as well

and yes Jk 10 strong pods could very well put an opiate naive person into respiratory depression"



At first i gave you the benefit of the doubt as to your claims about the stuff not working...After using the search feature i found your posts straight up fucking annoying...You have tons of experience people and moderators saying that pods work and you blow it of as a placebo...WTF DUDE...if you are just going to go to a thread about trying to use pods recreationally and spew your OPINION of how useless they are do not waist your time man..