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The Big & Dandy N-Ethyl-Norketamine Thread

It is indeed quite lacking in the psychedelia department. If you try to "hole" with this substance, I believe you will reach unconsciousness before you achieve a sufficient state of psychedelia on top of the dissociation (atleast when compared to the depth of ketamine or mxe). It's a powerful anesthetic with analgesic properties, it WILL fuck you up, though not necessarily in a good way. Recreational value is much lower than that of ketamine imo, however the bodyhigh is rather unique so YMMV. Be careful with this stuff, I'd say it has a quite narrow 'recreational index' (think of therapeutic index). I believe this substance is simply not capable of doing what ketamine or mxe can do with larger doses, and if you try and chase that expected high you will quite probably end up blacking out. The more you take this substance, the less you can resist it's moreish qualities, it's easy to go out of control so be careful...

I'd say n-ethyl-ketamine kinda feels like what ketamine should feel in a medical environment, anesthesia with less psychic side effects. I'm guessing if someone made propyl-ketamine it would be a step backwards when it comes to recreation.

I'm still having some lingering confusion as an after effect of consuming an unknown but substantial amount of kethyl so try bear with my possibly incoherent writing.
 
Hammilton said:
I don't care if they're calling it pineapple. They are selling N-ethyl-norketamine. There's no debate. Or rather, there should be no debate. if this were a different subforum this nonsense wouldn't have continued nearly so long.

The "nor" prefix properly refers to the removal of an alkyl group from a nitrogen. I'm not entirely sure if this can refer to amides or only amines. I believe it can properly refer to either but someone else would have to comment on that. Norketamine is ketamine without the N-methyl group. It is a primary amine. N-ethyl-norketamine is absolutely, unequivocally the compound that has been described here. Insisting on it being N-ethyl-ketamine is like saying that heroin is diacetylcodeine.

I was expecting my comment to be met with "we know it's N-ethyl-norketamine, but we prefer to call it n-ethylketamine because it's easier" or something similar, not actual opposition to the truth of the matter. Calling this N-ethyl-ketamine (which is isn't) only confuses what we should be calling the REAL n-ethylketamine which is a real compound and may be active enough to be used.

kneknenk.jpg



Eventually people need to start getting away from abbreviating everything and actually name compounds. Generally whole classes of compounds are given a single ending (the 'pams, the 'zolams, the 'orphans and 'odones, the 'barbitals, the 'caines and 'qualones etc etc) and new compounds are just given new starts to that ending. Unfortunately ending in amine is overly common. Perhaps something based on phenylcyclidine. Ethylcyclodone perhaps. I don't know, I don't really care, but a systematized naming system instead of what has become and endless run of acronyms. This worked good for the drones, actually, with the obvious exception of methedrone, which was a terrible, moronic decision.

This isn't the right place for THAT conversation, but it's unfortunately relevant.
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Thank you for taking the time and effort to explain this complex issue so clearly and lucidly -- I'm sure that we all appreciate it (deep-down)!
 
Thanks for the report FnX. I too found that the recreational scope for this substance is fairly narrow. However, one thing that concerns me about N-EK is that due to the strong anaethetic propertites, I feel that the LD50 for this compound would be alot lower compared to ketamine. This is rather worrysome, as compared to ketamine where you can do grammes in a session, I have a feeling that a high does of N-EK would be dangerous for many. Obviously, I don't have solid fact to back this up, but I experienced strong anaesthetic effects, which while weren't dangerous at all, gave me the feeling that you cannot binge on N-EK like you can on K. On the upside, I felt no compulsion to redose on this substance at all.
 
@Rockstar: What is this like on the cardiovascular side compared to real ketamine? I have a low resting Heart rate and low blood pressure, so I'm curious to know before I get my wonk on!
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I've not noticed any effect on heart rate whatsoever mate. I did 90mgs around 11am this morning, went for a lovely walk with the headphones in, felt good.

I've just done 100mg maybe a bit more. It hits very quickly but the kind of hype up to what would usually end up in la la land with ketamine never really comes, its just clean and functional, but it is euphoric. I really like it but I think 100mg is about the least it's worth dosing. I also have my doubts about any K-hole type experiance being possible.

FnX
It is indeed quite lacking in the psychedelia department. If you try to "hole" with this substance, I believe you will reach unconsciousness before you achieve a sufficient state of psychedelia on top of the dissociation (atleast when compared to the depth of ketamine or mxe). It's a powerful anesthetic with analgesic properties, it WILL fuck you up, though not necessarily in a good way. Recreational value is much lower than that of ketamine imo, however the bodyhigh is rather unique so YMMV. Be careful with this stuff, I'd say it has a quite narrow 'recreational index' (think of therapeutic index). I believe this substance is simply not capable of doing what ketamine or mxe can do with larger doses, and if you try and chase that expected high you will quite probably end up blacking out. The more you take this substance, the less you can resist it's moreish qualities, it's easy to go out of control so be careful...
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Yeah man I can kinda see what you are saying. I don't see the hole being a possibility either. I did 170mg when I first got it and couldn't hole. I have about 300mg left at the moment which I will be doing today but I'm not so sure I'll go mad high with the dosing, 170mg never really felt much different from 100mg in all honesty.

Also what are people saying to using this orally, any good? It is a bit short lasting sniffed, probably 30-40mins max of fun. I do like this drug though.
 
ungelesene_bettlek said:
everything can be exaggerated, including precision. why not insist on calling it (RS)-2-(2-Chlorophenyl)-2-(ethylamino)cyclohexanone when we're already at it? everybody knows what is meant, you are just confusing people by insisting on your point that much.
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NO! Hammilton is certainly right, his post is necessary and I am thankful that he invested the energy to write it in such detail.

I totally see that nomenclature shouldn't be exaggerated (i.e. IUPAC names instead of more convenient trivial names) but we absolutely can not accept giving substances names that obviously do not correspond to their correct structure!

It's a pity that we need to actually discuss this (several times).
 
SilentRoller said:
Thanks for the report FnX. I too found that the recreational scope for this substance is fairly narrow. However, one thing that concerns me about N-EK is that due to the strong anaethetic propertites, I feel that the LD50 for this compound would be alot lower compared to ketamine. This is rather worrysome, as compared to ketamine where you can do grammes in a session, I have a feeling that a high does of N-EK would be dangerous for many. Obviously, I don't have solid fact to back this up, but I experienced strong anaesthetic effects, which while weren't dangerous at all, gave me the feeling that you cannot binge on N-EK like you can on K. On the upside, I felt no compulsion to redose on this substance at all.
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but ketamine is very anasthetizing too, haven't tried or heard of anything more anasthetic ?
 
Did around 120mg orally and got absolutely nothing

I then waited a while and did 100mg plugged which i thought would be a total waste of time but was actually rather effective, reminded me of the feeling of a low MXE dose plugged, warm and euphoric, then again it couldve been that the oral takes a while to kick in but its a bit of a coincidence how it happened about 5 mins after plugging:)

I'll try again tonight :D
 
Indeed, Ketamine most certainly induces anaethesia. However (I think my point came across wrong here) IMO, N-EK isn't a very recreational substance; in that the line between pleasent euphoria and strong anaethesia isn't much. Perhaps this is because I have no K tolerance at all, and therefore am very sensitive to this compound (this is most likely, as others are reporting 100mg + and still functioning). However, I did 80mg in total, and I felt like I was melting into the sofa, and trying to walk just ended up in me nearly falling over myse

EDIT: Just saw the comment about nose bleeds. Does anyone know if it would be possible to hydrate N-EK (much like you do K) to make it easier on the nose etc. Crushing the crystals is one thing with a card is one thing, but I feel rehydrating N-EK would do wonders for our nasal passages.
 
I feel like this does more damage to the nose than Ethylphenidate. Ethylphenidate begins to hurt about 5 seconds after snorting then the pain lasts for about another 15 seconds. With Ethyl-Ketamine it instantly hurts your nose for about 10 seconds then suddenly stops, but then you're left with a really, really blocked nose afterwards for several hours.

It's possible that the only reason I got a nose bleed from Ethyl-Ketamine is because I smoked some weed during the trip. Possibly because of the vasodialation?
 
I would say any bleeding from the nose is a sign to stop that MOI. This is why I suggested hydrating the N-EK, and then crushing into a fine powder. Many users of K find that hydrating their ketamine before use makes it experience alot easier on the nose.

I suggest covering your N-EK crystals in a small bit of warm water, and then boiling it off. Then crush your N-EK into a fine dust with a razor blade/card, and you should be set.

EDIT: I would like to add that my profile picture isn't me :D
 
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wayab said:
but ketamine is very anasthetizing too, haven't tried or heard of anything more anasthetic ?
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The thing is, unlike most anesthetics, ketamine actually stimulates the respiratory system instead of depressing it making it a very safe anesthetic. The substance sold as n-ethyl-ketamine felt different though, it didn't feel like it was stimulating the respiratory system to a similiar degree and death via overdose felt like a possibility. If the duration wasn't as short as it is, I think we might be looking at a very dangerous substance to abuse. Also, having a terrible headache the day after binging ~700mg or so in an evening, and no, I didn't have any particular tolerance to dissociatives before dosing. Never at one point during the binge was I satisfied at the effects I got, it felt like something crucial was missing.
 
FnX has hit the nail on the head here. There is something slightly dark about this substance, because (as already said), it didn't feel stimulating respiratory wise at all. This for me rings massive alarm bells regarding safety, and I certainly won't be ordering any more. I don't think the risk is worth taking with this one.
 
FnX said:
consuming an amount of kethyl
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Uh, that's nice nomenclature as well eh.

The short duration of this arylcyclohexylamine is good but it seems that people want something with more fireworks'n sparkle.
 
I am very disappointed all round.
If you have a ketamine tolerance I wouldn't bother. Just felt like piss weak k but the sting on the nostril well outlasts any feeling from the drug. I hope the sting is from impurities otherwise it's a no go for me.
If the following batches are a bit kinder on the hooter and the price gets down to £10-15/g then it might be worth a look.

The info regarding breathing depression is worrying though. If this product doesn't share a similar safety profile to ketamine it could be very dangerous. The only reason why k is so abusable is because it keeps you breathing no matter how much you have. If this substance depresses breathing at anaesthetic levels it will be extremely dangerous. Please be careful
 
If this product doesn't share a similar safety profile to ketamine
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It doesn't. Well, it may do in terms of LUTS etc, but in terms of breathing, I would say less so. The problem with this compound is that there is something quite dark about it, but you can't quite put your finger on it. For example, where as with K, you could sit and do grammes without concern of RD, something in he back of your mind stops you from pushing N-EK, as you know it will end in tears.

N-EK is going to bring more negativity to the RC scene, as kids are going to get hold of this who have no K tolerance, and treat it with the same safety profile as K.
 
Yeah I hope this one doesn't end in tears. It's not exactly going to get added to the WHO list of essential medicines alongside ketamine is it?

It's no surprise to me that this chem was a fall back option when 2mk became unviable. They couldn't just drop it without something similar to sell in its place after the hype that had built up around it.
 
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