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Sexual Preferences vs "Transphobia"

For me it's just a matter of preference. I happen to be a man who is attracted to naturally-born women.

It has absolutely nothing to do with my feelings towards them as people. Everybody has the right to their own sexual identity. Just like I wouldn't expect a strict lesbian to want sex with me.
 
I wanted to respond to this but the mods have not reopened the other thread. It was a dumpster fire anyway and I'd start a new civil conversation because I think it's important. Whomever decides to partake in this thread, please avoid name-calling and passive-aggressive nonsense.

I don't agree that not wanting to sleep with a trans person makes one transphobic, if the reason they're not sleeping with them is because of genital configuration. Transphobia implies prejudice and hateful discrimination. I'm personally a gay male and I won't sleep with a man who doesn't have a penis. Some other gay males may feel differently. For example, I know gay men who would accept a blowjob from a woman under certain circumstances because "a mouth is a mouth," but I wouldn't. It doesn't mean I hate women. I want everyone to be happy and end up with someone who is into them.

Claiming that because I won't sleep with trans men that I am transphobic is like saying I'm misogynist (or "heterophobic") because I won't consider sleeping with cis women. If I am not attracted to vaginas then why would I have sex with somebody who has one? There is no -phobia involved. It is literally about where my carnal attraction does or doesn't happen. There is no ideology driving it.

I also don't agree that this is exactly the same as refusing to be with someone based on their race. If you are not physically attracted to someone then you're not physically attracted to someone, but if you specifically have ruled out an entire ethnicity then that is racist because people come in all kinds of configurations within an ethnicity. Trans men on the other hand all have vaginas (or fake penises) and if my requirement is a natural penis then that naturally means I will not be able to be with trans men -- anymore than I would be able to be with cis women. It is physically impossible for me to be turned on by a vagina.

Claiming this incompatibility is equivalent to racism is delusional. It is also the erasure of sexual orientations. It's pretending that human nature isn't real.

The double-standard here is interesting. Trans social movements claim that gender and sex are separate issues yet I am not allowed to say that I value trans men as people even though I am not attracted to their vaginas without being called transphobic. To me that is cognitively dissonant and a tell-tale sign that there is something wrong with the politics and psychology driving this.

SJB, I understand your sentiment about how in an ideal world you could be with anyone. I think that is very ideological, and the kinds of people who tend to talk that way are somehow bypassing animal realities. Sexuality is very hard wired and also very personal/individual. A pansexual person who can be with anyone is not more enlightened than someone who has very narrow sexual criteria. They are just different species in the same ecosystem and they are both valid.
As a gender non confirming person myself, my take is always that preference itself isn't where transphobia is located, it's the way in which that preference is articulated. If you're declaring "no trannies" or saying smth like transgender women are just dudes, etc then yes it's discrimination.

There's no reason to announce those things. And when it's in person, you can just say you're not into that particular individual, that they're not your type. And you don't even have to explain further. Just say thank you, but we're not compatible!
 
Whenever did rationality become 'old-fashioned'...

You are absolutely right; and it's a cohort of a certain type of unhinged so-called 'progressives' (who are ironically being extremely backwards) that are screeching xyz-'phobia' about every damn thing. You call a black guy a lazy arsehole because he happens to be one, that's 'racist'. You mention the fact that being 200 pounds overweight is going to lead to serious health problems, bingo you're 'fat phobic'. Say you don't like to see random strangers in fetish gear at a pride parade, you hate gays. Oh and making a clumsy pass at a woman is apparently right up there with sexual assault. All this hysteria is idiotic and it's trivialising the victims of REAL homophobia/transphobia/racism/sexism.
Leather has been part of pride since the beginning of the gay liberation front, deal with it lol.
 
This to me as a bi guy depends. I also don't like silicone breasts, whether on a regular or a trans woman, but depending on how lucky someone is in the genetic lottery and how well the body responds to oestrogen, many trans women actually grow natural breasts. Also there's several surgical techniques that don't use intestinal tissue, and with a skilled surgeon you can get results that are almost indistinguishable from natal genitals unless you shoved your face right up there with a magnifying glass.

Again I would say for me it depends. Phalloplasty is far less advanced than vaginoplasty because recreating a penis is in many ways more complicated, and only a few surgeries I've seen approximate a natural look. On the other hand chest scars won't always be present. With smaller sizes the tissue can be removed through lifting the nipple without a need for a double incision (I'm an intersex male who developed small breasts at puberty and this is the procedure I had, you can't tell my chest from that of any other man). While some men who aren't trans do have those scars in cases of severe gyneacomastia.

Yes I prefer the function and look of a normal dick, but I also would fuck a man who's had to have a reconstruction due to losing his dick to cancer or some accident, if I thought he was hot in general. So I'd also fuck a trans man with a phallo. (there's one fashion model for instance, he's smoking and I'd do him in a heartbeat Xd).

I'd like to ask how would you feel about sleeping with a 'standard model' man or woman who has surgically constructed genitals? For instance there's a rare birth defect where people can be born literally without them, called penile or vaginal agenesis. Would you be put off by that if the woman was otherwise super-hot? Would you also call her vagina 'fake' ? I find that term quite insulting because a genital construction or re-construction is still made from real flesh and blood and in many cases will have erotic sensation.

Personally I'd have no problem being with a GENUINE transsexual person (forget all the gender bender trenders), because those actually give off the 'vibes' of the sex they've transitioned to; so long as they've had the full procedure done because I'm not attracted to mix 'n match bodies.



PS also just for general info, several years of HRT actually changes the body in some quite fundamental ways. It changes fat distribution, skin texture, body odour and muscle mass. It even influences the way certain parts of your DNA are expressed so it's incorrect to say a fully transitioned individual is still identical to their birth sex. It's more like a medically induced state of intersex.

Biological sex is made up of several factors, namely chromosomal, gonadal, hormonal, genital and phenotypical sex. Chromosomal sex can' t be altered, gonadal sex can' t be altered but can be annulled through removal, hormonal sex CAN be changed (to the point where a transsexual woman with an oestrogen-dominant body will eventually be prone to health conditions typical of her target sex rather than her birth sex, and vice versa for trans men), genital sex can be changed through SRS, phenotypical sex can be massively influenced and in those who transition at puberty be made indistinguishable. Sorry for maybe getting overly medical but it's a medical condition and I'm the son of a surgeon Xd
Gender bender trenders? Bro, fuck right off w that shit lol
 
Agreed. We will cautiously keep this thread open as long as it remains civil.
Well, I've only seen one person throwing slurs and another dunking on nonbinary peeps, so that's refreshing for social media ha
 
Gender bender trenders? Bro, fuck right off w that shit lol
There's a fuckton of them about. Some of them even outright admit it.

Also, go to any group supposedly for transsexual women, and it's overrun by outright porn-brained men who like to wear a debilitating condition like a costume in order to legitimise and get social acceptance for their sissyfication / AGP / lesbian fetish, never shut up about their literal dicks, and call actual lesbians 'transphobic' for wanting nothing to do with dick.

Go to any group supposedly for transsexual men, and most of what you find is teenage girls with blue hair and the obligatory faceful of piercings, that think they can 'identify' their way out of misogyny by declaring themselves 'not-women' while usually looking as hyper feminine as possible, and claim to be 'gay' while having their tits out to Guam. Or alternatively, persuading some less-than-ethical surgeon to chop their tits off, but never pursue long-term hormone treatment, never mind SRS, because 'ewww men gross and dick gross'. And never shut up about how much they love to be fucked in the cunt.

These types are walking stereotypes of right-wing tropes, and are currently giving the right EVERY justification for cutting back legal protections and medical cover for the handful of individuals that actually suffer from the disorder. The attack helicopter meme is now a reality, except that now you're expected to uncritically 'accept' that BS.
And don't even get me started on people wanting to become surgically constructed freakshow examples of what they think a 'hermaphrodite' is, and the doctors who enable that sick fetishisation of a birth defect for cash that ought to be struck off the medical register.

Declaring yourself some flavour of 'trans' absolutely IS a trend right now, that a collection of people jump on for various reasons. It has social currency in certain circles. You get immediate 'validation' for absolutely any outrageous behaviour, sexual inappropriateness, AND you get to throw psychotic tantrums in public while being a permanent 'victim', and feeling special as a stand-in for having a personality.

If you haven't noticed this, you've lived under a rock. And if you think there's nothing wrong with it, you're an idiot.
 
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Leather has been part of pride since the beginning of the gay liberation front, deal with it lol.
Sure. But you are in a public place.
Nobody needs their 5 yr old to see some middle-aged fetish guy's saggy buttocks hang out of his cutaway chaps, cheers.

And I'm a guy with a few kinks. I don't think forcing a display of those on an unconsenting public is going to get us more 'acceptance'. It's going to do the effing opposite, equating being gay with being some type of exhibitionist and being obsessed with sex like a pervert.

Every single stereotype I was condemned for while growing up, I'm now expected to 'celebrate' in the cause of 'inclusiveness' -?

'Inclusive' of WHAT, exactly?
The local granny knitting group is being horrendously discriminated against because the local biker club doesn't want them there for clearly NOT BELONGING -?
 
Personally, I appreciate conversations like this if they are done with respect and genuine interest. However, there is no way possible that two people think exactly alike. No one knows how another person feels and thinks. Therefore, labeling and name-calling people and their preferences that you have no clue about is just plain ignorant and uncalled for.
 
Also, go to any group supposedly for transsexual women, and it's overrun by outright porn-brained men who like to wear a debilitating condition like a costume in order to legitimise and get social acceptance for their sissyfication / AGP / lesbian fetish, never shut up about their literal dicks, and call actual lesbians 'transphobic' for wanting nothing to do with dick.
I take it you’ve been going to lots of groups for trans women to gather this extensive anecdotal evidence for us? Do you identify as a trans woman now, or is the overly detailed description of creepy men referring to yourself?
 
Everyone's perception of other communities these days is driven by out-of-context drama peeping. If you lurk culture war shitposting boards someone will link a thread on a transwomen forum where someone says they got an erection after putting on a skirt and when you spend all your time browsing that content it skews your perception of reality.
 
Everyone's perception of other communities these days is driven by out-of-context drama peeping. If you lurk culture war shitposting boards someone will link a thread on a transwomen forum where someone says they got an erection after putting on a skirt and when you spend all your time browsing that content it skews your perception of reality.
Very well said!
 
I would date a Trans person I guess if like they had the stuff all done. I like really don't care anymore.

Idk if it would be a good thing for a Trans person to date me though because I'm a focking nightmare
 
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