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  • Trip Reports Moderator: Cheshire_Kat

Opioids - first time - Fun

The one time I had a good Kratom experience, I used half an ounce of "private reserve" leaf to make tea. I still have 2 packs of super-strength powder I have yet to play with, not sure if I should just mix it into something and drink it or make tea/strain it.

Well, as far as the dillies go, at least I learned to stop wasting them by plugging so much! I read the bioavailability was only 30% or so rectally, vs 53% nasaly. No wonder I was getting nowhere with all that plugging! I read a lot of people talking about how plugging was "the next best thing to IV," but either they weren;t talking about dillies or were full of it.

So now at least I'll be keeping my doses down to two.

Had trouble sleeping again last night... didn't feel anxious or stressed as the night before thank god, so I think a lot of my "withdrawl symptoms" were mostly based on work-related stuff. I've calmed down a bunch about that since having 24 hours to deal with it.

On the other hand, maybe it's just because we've been talking about it so much here, but I do think I can sense early-warning signs of withdrawls creeping in. Personally, I think I have a ways to go before things get serious, but I can feel that it's time to start reeling it in.

Now that my back pain diminshing, let's see if I can start skipping the drugs altogether for a few nights here and there. It's been at least a week since I skipped a day.

By the way, my hydro pills are only 4mg, I didn't know they also came in 7.5mg size. If everyone here thought my pills were 7.5mg, that might explain why people think I've been "massively dosing!"
 
Saw the doc today, the back pain is gone but it has transformed into purely sciatic nerve pain. It's not end of the world pain, but it makes the days a lot less fun. Hopefully it will lessen over the next few weeks or else I'll have to consider surgery.

Doc seems more than happy to keep me fully stocked on Dillies. Last time the pharmacy wouldn't fill a script for 300, so I had to chop it in half. This time the doc gave me another script for 150, so my supply is now probably close to 350.

Man, the fun we could have with that much Dilaudid!

In any case, I asked the doc what the dangers were of addiciton to this stuff. He said that if I had any history of addiction in my past (cigarettes, alcohol, anything) he would not of perscribed them, but since I don't, he wasn't worried (also, if it helps, I am "over 35").

At the moment I'm taking between 3 and 5 a day, usually nasaly. Much more effective that way.
 
Thanks Boi, monday I have a follow-up with a back surgeon so we can figure out the best plan of attack for me. I'm still keeping my fingers crossed that, as in the past, the pain will slowly fade away over the next few weeks. Although this time it's far more pronounced than it was 3 years ago, so I'm a little more concerned.

And I agree, the dillies don't seem to completely get rid of it. I wonder if there is a better choice?
 
PLUGGING REDEUX

So after hunting around online and reading more about opiate plugging, it seems like quite a few folks swear by it, so I did some more research to see if maybe I had been doing something wrong (my experience was very sub-par, and I had tried 3 or 4 times. Snorting beat it by a mile).

Anyway, looks like I may have done two things wrong - first of all, I didn't plunge the syringe deep enough! Apparently you have to REALLY ram it in there, so you can plan the opiates past the sphincter and deep inside the colon, where all the happy butt-veins are.

Secondly, although a lot of people would stay laying down for a few minutes to make sure nothing leaked out when they got up, I learned that nothing leaks out anyway so I'd get up right after injecting. HOWEVER, several "plugging guides" said you need to lay there so the veins have enough time to soak up the juice, otherwise the goods ain't getting to where they are supposed to.

So, tonight I decided to give it another whirl.

I crushed up 20mg worth of dillies in about 5ml of warm water, laid on my side and REALLY jammed that puppy home. And, sure enough, I can see what I had done wrong - previously I had only inserted the syringe an inch or two, just enough to get it "in there," but this time I pushed a little harder and WHAM, the damn thing went in so far I thought my arm was going to go with it! "up to the plunger" is what was recommended (about 4 inches) and I could tell that THIS time I was squirting the happy-juice where no man has gone before (homos, bite your tongue).

I laid there for about 15 mins, got up and started this post. I can DEFINITLEY feel the rubbery warmth of opiate bliss setting in. They say that plugging diminishes the rush (and yes, the onset is very different than if I had railed it) but the buzz should be stronger and last longer (and there is no doubt that the railing buzz doesn't last all too long).

Another thing I'm noticing is that the railing buzz is a little more hyper/speedy (I just want to get on the phone and gab), but so far, the plug buzz is more mellow and serene.

More as the situation develops!

UPDATE: Ok, I have definitely reversed my stance on plugging - we're at about 2 hours since I treated my A-hole to some dillies and we're all still feeling very, very happy. Possibly my best trip thus far. I can't say if I've been "nodding" because, honestly, I'm so new at this I don't even really know what it means, but I see it refered to a lot around here as probably being an indication fo a very strong trip. Does it mean involuntarily nodding off into an opiate-coma with your eyes half closed like you see if movies? I'm not quite at that point (I assume typing posts wouldn't really be possible in that state) but I can see how that stage might be possible if I upped the dose.
 
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Hmm, opiates are not really the proper medication for nerve pain. You should ask your doctor about Lyrica (pregabalin). It actually gets you high too, and works really well for nerve pain. I think tramadol works for nerve pain too... it's a quasi-opiate.

Myself, an opiate lover, also really loves Lyrica a lot... one of my favorite highs. It lasts all day and makes you feel really nice (well, some people do not seem to get high from it, but I do). It's addictive to some extent but not to the extent that opiates are.

Really though, your doctor, while I'm sure many of us would love to have one like him, sounds kind of irresponsible. Opiates do not treat nerve pain very well, and 300 dillies a month it pretty nuts. The main thing though is that there are better medications for nerve pain.
 
Thanks for the tips, guys - on MOnday when I see the back surgeon I'll ask him about Lyrica and Gabapentin.

Boi, I did read the plugging guides, that's why I had so much success last night. And you're right, the dillies don't completely remove the nerve pain, but it does help.

Tonight I plugged 4 dillies (down from 5 last night) and it's still a very good high. I have to say, now that I've done it correctly, plugging is certainly the way to go. I can see why people say it's the next best thing to IV.

I've never IVed myself, but I had a morphine drip once in the hospital and I can see the similarity. What I like most is the nice, long-lasting wave I get from the plug - from what people say, the IV has a great rush, but it's over very quickly. Railing was a bit more like that.

I could see maybe plugging a few, then railing a few to kickstart the whole thing and maybe get the best of both worlds. Perhaps I'll try that tomorrow.

And back on the whole addiciton thing, I don't know, I've been messing around with this stuff for about a month now and I sure don't feel any different... my attitude about the pills and the highs doesn't seem to have changed. In fact, despite my incredible success with plugging last night, tonight I didn't have such a strong urge to repeat. I was almost take it or leave it, but I figured what the hell, it's saturday night :-)

I HIGHLY recommend a good plug for those who haven't tried it yet. Anyone who says dillies are useless unless you slam them are full of crap.
 
Lyrica is similar to gabapentic but generally better in everyone I've talked to who's tried both (including myself). gabapentin is quite a bit weaker and lasts a lot shorter of a time, and it seems to not work for some people. Lyrica seems more reliable and effective. And not to mention it feels better. :)

You'd be highly advised to never try IVing any opiates.
 
Trust me, Xor, I've given considerable thought to the subject of IVing. I always knew I probably wasn't the type who would cross that line anyway, but since jumping on the Dilaudid bandwagon, it's been hard to ignore the onslaught of people who swear by IVing them.

I mean here I am, with a huge supply of the #1 drug people like to IV, and apparently it's one of the SAFEST drugs to slam. It's impossible to ignore.

But still, I just can't see myself doing it. The idea of shooting up and the psychological stigma of being the poster-child of the drug addict is probably the main reason people don't go there, but dealing with the tedious prep work and hardware to be sure you're doing it right and safe and, of course, track marks, makes it very unappealing.

And I'm just not looking for a huge rush that's over in under an hour, tempting you to do it over and over. Sure, some people are probably reading this and cursing the guy who has all those dillies and refuses to slam them, but the buzz I get from plugging them is exactly what I've been after.

I admit I've thought about trying it once just to TRY it, but I know the alarms going off in my head as I started to prep for it would just be too loud to ignore. And, of course, the fear of liking it so much I can't quit is a major consideration.

To be honest, I don't how people actually bring themselves to try that first needle. We have it so impressed upon us how bad it is, and how far down the hole it leads, not to mention just the idea of injecting yourself, how do people overcome all that?

It seems very common around here for people to draw the line at IVing anything, I wonder what brings them to finally cross it.
 
The surgeon said that Lyrica is a good med for the nerve pain, but tomorrow he wants to give me an "epidural injection." Basically, they'll use an X-ray guided needle to inject a huge dose of ibuprofen right into the area surrounding my inflamed disc, in the hopes that the anti-inflamatory will permanently reduce the swelling so the disc is no longer touching the nerves.

Given my condition, he thinks it has a 90% chance of success. If it works, it should get rid of ALL the pain and I'll no longer even have a need for my meds. Fingers crossed.

I guess they are going to use some heavy anesthetic on me, since the insist on me having someone drive me home. Maybe they'll give me a few extras , heh.
 
So today I had my steroid injection, here's hoping it reduces the swelling in the nerves and they no longer touch my disc, thus ending the pain.

The best part about the experience was the pain-killer they IV'd me with before the procedure. I don't remember what it was called, but it wasn't so much a pain killer as it was an "instantly drunk" kind of thing. It reminded me a little bit of the morphine I got when I had a kidney stone. It was slightly milky in color.

Within a minute of getting it shot into my vein, I felt nice and woozy and everything was A-OK. I could still carry on a conversation and knew what was going on, but it really relaxed me, which was the whole point. It was very short-lived though, when they were finished 10 minutes later, it was already wearing off. Funny thing was, I talked the anesthesiologist into giving me another hit. "Hey, you guys made me drag a friend here to drive me home, you might as well let me take advantage of it!"

And he actually gave me another half dose! "One for the road" he said.

Maybe I can say it made me violently ill and I can sue them.

I dunno, I'm glad he was so accomadating, but are they supposed to do that sort of thing?

It also made me think about IVing my dillies again, since the whole experience seemed like what dillie-slammers talk about: intense rush that is over way too soon.

To be honest, I still don't think it would be worth it. The fact that it's over in half an hour just seems like a recipie for disaster.

Oh, and the miracle of plugging is already wearing off. That first night last week, when I plugged correctly for the first time, I think I plugged 4 of them and it was really awesome. Tonight I tried 6 and it barely had half the effect. Maybe I can try laying off for a few days and see if it works any better.

I know, I know... "but CAN you skip it for a few days??"
 
dude I want you doctors, they give you extra drug shots and prescribe dilaudid like candy haha
 
Haha yeah I know... well, my doc gives me so much Dilaudid because that was the only painkiller we tried that actually worked. Vikes and Percs sort of worked, but I had to take so many to do the trick he was worried about all the APAP. And, given my size and natural tolerance, it takes 4 dillies to "do the trick," so, based on 4 dillies 3 times a day (which is what he perscribed), it takes 360 dillies to give me a month's supply.

In reality, I'm only taking 4-6 a day, which according to the folks here, is still enough to throw me over the cliff into addict hell. I guess we'll see.

Honestly, the reason I've been getting all this stuff is I ASK FOR IT. Yesterday in the hospital I ASKED the anesthetic guy to give me a little more. It was all in good fun and I made a joke out of it, but he knows it makes the patients loopy and they enjoy it so I guess he didn't mind. I have to assume it's not technically part of the rulebook, but maybe they liked me.

As far as all the dillies, I don't know, a lot of people here say their docs are really stingy with giving out opiates, and they are probably right to err on the side of caution. In my case, the fact is that I'm allergic to aspirin and no over the counter pain meds worked for me. The truth is it really DOES take 2 or 3 vikes or percs to have any effect on me (it's always been that way), so dilaudid was the next logical choice. And it DOES take 3 or 4 to help me with strong pain, so is he really tossing them out like candy for no reason? I don't think so.

Like I said earlier, I even asked him about becoming addcited, but since I'm over 35 and have no history of addiction to anything (cigarettes, booze, whatever), he wasn't worried.

I'm still feeling a little sciatic pain, even after yesterday's steroid shot. They said it takes 3-5 days to fully kick in, but that sounds like bullshit to me. I can't imagine it takes more than 24 hours for an anti-inflamatory to do it's thing, but what do I know, I'm just a drug addict. If the shot doesn't work, my next option is surgery, which I really really would like to avoid.

Of course, it could all just lead to more meds, so who's complaining?
 
You make so many points that are worth refuting. You rationalize your use, claiming that you only take the pills because you're in pain. You contradict yourself, saying that you don't crave for the pills, but also saying that you WANT to get high (which is why you're taking so many -- way above the prescribed dosage).

Anyway, there are just too many to list, so I just picked out this one.
Like I said earlier, I even asked him about becoming addcited, but since I'm over 35 and have no history of addiction to anything (cigarettes, booze, whatever), he wasn't worried.
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How long have you been using drugs? I'd say not so long, since you barely knew anything about withdrawal, tolerance, dependence, etc. when you started this thread. It is possible that the only reason you have not had a drug problem before is because you never tried them before (i.e. you're still unfamiliar with all drugs.) And besides that, just because you haven't had a problem before doesn't mean you can't develop one, especially since you're taking a shitload of pills as if they were candy.

This is pathetic. And as much as I care for you and do not want you do get hooked, part of me also thinks you deserve it. Christ.
 
Thanks, Ngu, so far the sciatic pain has been reduced but not gone away. They said give it 3-5 days to really know what the effect will be, so fingers crossed.

Chimeric, does everything HAVE to make sense? I have plenty of drug experience from my rave days, never got hooked on anything. Everyone tells me opiates are a whole new ballgame, and that's fine, but I'm not a recreactional drug nubie.

As I've said before, once a day I take my dillies (at night) for fun and, at the same time, easing my pain. Of course I enjoy the high and of course I hope I don't get hooked. We'll see. It's fun to experiment and so far, as near as I can tell, I haven't been experiencing anything I would recognize as withdrawl.

It's kind of a tough time to be able to really detect withdrawl; I was recently laid off and got dumped my my gf (cooincidentally it was on the same day, fun) so it's kind of hard to tell if the random anxiety and depression I've been experiencing is purely from my situation or has something to do with the drugs. Any emotional difficulties I've been having, however, are generally short lived and I seem to be getting over it pretty quickly.

Today I woke up much later than usual, and was feeling down and just didn't want to get out of bed. I laid there another hour, and as easy as it would have been to just hide under the covers and hope the world would go away, I managed to drag myself out of bed, get out of the house, do some exersize and make a few phone calls. A few hours later I was feeling much better.

As far as physical symptoms, I don't think I've experienced any. No shakes, sweats, fevers, shaking, nausea, etc. I haven't found myself craving my drugs or eager for the next fix. Hell, when I was feeling so distraught and down earlier today, it didn't even cross my mind to take a few dillies to try and make myself feel better.

So, from my inexperienced point of view, I don't seem to be doing too badly. I continue to enjoy my dillies once a day and, thanks to all of you, am keeping a sharp eye out for signs of trouble.

Naturally, my tolerance is increasing, so the worst I can say I've done is take more to see if it works better. Tonight I plugged NINE 4mg dillies, and snorted 3. That is more than double the amount I've every tried at once, but I was just in the mood to get fucked up.

Sadly, although it did make me feel nice and warm, it didn't result in my biggest trip yet. This tells me that I've reached some sort of threshold, and that upping my dosage just isn't going to do much for me. I think all I can really do at this point is either step up to IV (which I am not going to do) or try and lay off for a day or two so my tolerance can dip.

And that's where I'm at! If the cortisone shot works and the nerve pain does go away, it's going to be really hard to justify using this stuff.

Once I get a new job and get some order/routine back in my life, it's going to be MUCH easier to leave the crutch alone... the way I see it, I'm just enjoying the diversion while it lasts.
 
Damn it, tonight I was *so* ready to skip the meds...

I came home around 8pm and was dead tired... it was a chore just to keep my eyes open during the drive home. ANyway, passed out on the couch and figured I'd take a nap.

Woke up after midnight, a few hours later than I would usually hit the pills. So I figured fuck it, the night's almost over, why bother? I've been wanting to lay off a day here and there anyway.

But then FUCK!! For some reason the sciatic nerve pain REALLY kicked in. I took a shower and it was almost unbarebale. Which really sucks, since I had the cortisone shot a few days ago, the pain had really gone way down. I can only guess laying on that mushy couch for a few hours had done something.

Anyway, it was just too much to ignore, so I crushed and snorted 3 dillies. Within 15 mins or so everything was MUCH better. Glad I discovered railing, it really help get the meds working so much faster.

Odd thing is, although I've been plugging maybe 4-6 dillies a night for the last week or so - which SHOULD be a much stronger trip - snorting the 3 tonight seemed to have more effect.

Does the WAY you take a drug have any bearance at all on tolerance? Is there any reason why snorting the dillies when I've been plugging for a week straight would come on stronger?

Would there be any upside to snorting a few days, the plugging, mixing it up, or does it not matter, as long as it just gets into your system?
 
Burrows:

The problem with opiates is that your tolerance never stops climbing, as long as you're taking them.

You'll eventually 'need' more dillies to 'fix' your pain.


Get it? Stop while you can, stop getting high with them so often. You're building up a very bad tolerance. Use them as directed, for pain.

With that said, your doctor is irresponsible for not taking into consideration the tolerance you will build, and have already built to the opiates.

You should taper down to a smaller dosage or at least stop increasing.

Your tolerance is building, and that's bad. Recognize it as such, and explain to yourself WHY that is bad, in real-world terms.
 
listen to what everyone else said. you are abusing the shit out of opiates, which is never a good idea, and at that you are not even injesting them in the safest possible way or most economic.
 
Ok well here is what I don't get... ok, yes, obviously I know I am enjoying these things more from a recreational standpoint than from a pain standpoint (although I am still taking them for very real pain) but what I don't get is this: if my doc has perscribed me to take 3 or 4 pills at a time, 3 or 4 times a day (which equals 16 pills a day) but I am only taking 4-6 a day (albeit at once), how is this such serious abuse?

Despite my *intention*, biologically I am still well within what has been perscribed. In fact well BELOW it because I have almost never even taken HALF the number of pills in a single day that he has perscribed.
 
I have a feeling that your doctor is merely irresponsible. It's that simple. Just because he set certain limitations to how much you should take doesn't mean that those limitations will prevent you from getting addicted. You're still taking them daily.
 
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