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My view on junkies (and related hard-core) drug addicts.

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If there is one thing worse than a cop, it's a fucking hypocrite cop who chooses to only follow the laws he agrees with, but is happy ruining the lives of those who did the same.
If you become a cop and don't uphold the law yourself or with others when it suits your needs, you can rot in hell as far as I'm concerned.
 
The law is not a tool that is used to help people, it is a tool to lock poor people as well as minorities down and keep them in their place. It is our generations slavery and proves how shitty our system is. If you become a cop, do so cause you think you are better then everyone, do it cause you are a scumbag that wants to boss people around, don't do it for a "noble" cause because theres nothing noble about being a cop.

That is by far the dumbest, most retarded thing I have ever read. You sir, are an idiot.
 
inimical said:
But for this posts sake, we will stay on topic here. Now I'm not going to speak for the inner-city folk, but where I live (upper-middle class suburban neighborhood) in Wisconsin, crimes for drugs dont happen. Now, travel into the city (and by all means is no where close to the size of even Milwaukee) and you can get robbed at gun point over a ounce of coke. But the people who I have experianced first hand who would try some stupid shit like that are all strung out junkies.

Considering the fact that you are educated, studying these issues and living in an upper class area it would follow that you could realise the association between poverty, crime, drug addiction and minorities.

Although junkies come from all walks of life they are over represented among those below the poverty line and minority groups. The probability of serving time in jail or being arrested are also correlated with income and education.

The solution to these problems (as a whole) is not to lay blame on anyone or thing other than society. If people had equal access to education, economic prosperity and rehabilitation things would be a lot nicer. If the criminal justice system was not tied up prosecuting and incarcerating drug addicts stealing to get their fix, the funds would appear to realise these aims.
 
go-ee said:
Originally posted by twgburst
The law is not a tool that is used to help people, it is a tool to lock poor people as well as minorities down and keep them in their place. It is our generations slavery and proves how shitty our system is. If you become a cop, do so cause you think you are better then everyone, do it cause you are a scumbag that wants to boss people around, don't do it for a "noble" cause because theres nothing noble about being a cop.

That is by far the dumbest, most retarded thing I have ever read. You sir, are an idiot. [/B]
It's not dumb at all actually. The primary function of law is to protect property and privelage. The primary function of the police is to uphold law.
Since property and privelage is determined by the amount of capital one possesses in a capitalist society, thie function of the police is arguably one of protecting the interests of the rich from the demands of the poor.
It's not rocket science, but then you're no rocket scientist I suppose.
 
blahblahblah said:
NG-

Would you also group somebody that enjoys having a cup of coffee each morning but cant go with out it or a sex addict looking to get off, in the same addiction category as somebody banging oxycontin daily?

I know I wouldn't...

Oh REALLY ? What if they made coffee illegal or very hard to get and that cup of coffee would suddenly cost $50 not $1 ? And you'd have to go to shady dealer to get some for cash only ? You'd be surprised...
 
^^^
Exactly...'legal' drugs do not cause as many problems as illegal ones becaues they are widely available...cocaine, heroin, and weed etc, however, are NOT widely available.

Weed is not physically addictive but it is VERY psychologically addictive as can be seen by the LARGE number of daily weed smokers.

I am a tea addict. I get annoyed if I don't have my cup of tea every morning. I do consider this an addiction of sorts.

I'm not saying (necessarily) that addiction is bad; I'm saying that you and many others regularily give weed (and often alcohol) some sort of 'special exemption' from addiction/abuse. Sorry, but these drugs are just as much, in fact more so, abused than heroin and cocaine.
 
As we have seen, drugs have long been a part of American society. There have been dramatic changes though in the form of drug use takes and in the social consequences associated with drug involvement. Specifically, six elements that have emerged which today cast drug use in a far different light than that of the past:

- The conceptualization of addiction as a physical or medical condition
- The understanding that drug use is associated with other kinds of criminal activity
- Generally widespread social condemnation of drug use as a waste of economic resources and human lives
-Comprehensive and detailed federal and state laws regulating the use or availability of drugs
- A large and perhaps still growing involvement with illicit drugs among the urban poor and the socially disenfranchised, both as an escape from the condititions of life and as a path to monetary gain
-the view that drug abuse is a law enforcement issue rather than a primarily a medical problem.

The last element is especially significant for what it means to the criminal justice system.
 
"Not to criticize, but before you attack me with your "well its my life I can do what I want, when I want" or "I pay taxes, I can do what I want in the privacy of my own home" excuse, think about what you are doing to yourself." -inimical

I don't think he was really attacking you per se...but...how is it your/the law's decision what someone else does in their own home. It doesn't really matter what they decide to do, as long as they aren't negatively affecting others with their actions. If a person decides they want to smoke pot every day, or even shoot junk or use coke, it is possible to control one's use.

You aren't a total coke head now? You've used it...lots of it, apparently, and you're not raping babies and killing women, that we know of anywho... (jk, ;))

Until a person commits an act which directly influences others (robbing, stealing, killing, burning down someones house...) why should the law have jurisdiction over them? Especially if it is in one's own house. The poster was correct in saying we (tax payers) help to pay for police budgets, alot of the rest of their budget comes from seizures and forfeitures of drug dealers property (ever think about a dealer's family? What do they do when everything they've ever owned is gone, now in possession of the US govt.?) Not only do police screw us once, they seem to take pleasure in doing it twice, no option of KY.

If I want to poison myself with something, I should be able too, so should everyone else for that matter. Keep in mind, I want to be an addiction counselor when I get out of school, I've expierienced addiction and know how bad it can be, still, it's everybodies own body.

Your above argument could also be applied to over weight folks. Should we lock them up and force them to do calisthenics and go to Jenny Craig? I'm pretty sure everyone would say no, but it is essentially the same issue (without the correlational increase in crime.)

Also, you made a very good point in recognizing the big issue, that drug abuse is defined as a judicial issue, rather than a public health issue. How does locking up people who've done the same things you have going to help them? We need rehabilitation for non-violent users, not incareceration.

I guess I don't understand your post. If you don't believe in what you will be upholding, how can you? Why not become a politician? A lobbyist? As it's been said, by picking and choosing what laws you follow/enforce you will be just as much a prat as the other cops that people have had difficulty with before.

Where can you draw the line? Do you enforce laws only against certain subclasses (as you've alluded to, such as junkies/crack heads,), certain types of people? Once you start picking and choosing you've corrupted the ideal of law.

It's not dumb at all actually. The primary function of law is to protect property and privelage. The primary function of the police is to uphold law. Since property and privelage is determined by the amount of capital one possesses in a capitalist society, thie function of the police is arguably one of protecting the interests of the rich from the demands of the poor. -SteveElektro

Incredible, incredible quote. Very awesome Steve!

M
 
That was also a very great point. All in all, it still brings us back to the point that if you are going to be a police officer, you should have no prejudice on anyone no matter their drug of choice. Now you say that a crack addict should get caught before an everyday weed smoker, but if you were a crack addict, then you would probably say that you feel for them and that they should go free. All im saying, is that upholding the law is upholding the law.
If someone is using drugs to themselves and safely, then you shouldnt have to worry about having to bust them becuase if they do things the right way, the police will never get called. But if someone is standing on main street shooting up or someone is noticably taking lines or bumps of coke in an open establishment, then they obviously should be brought down.
Very good point made by MATTPD.
"I don't think he was really attacking you per se...but...how is it your/the law's decision what someone else does in their own home. It doesn't really matter what they decide to do, as long as they aren't negatively affecting others with their actions."
 
Negro-kitty said:
^^^
Exactly...'legal' drugs do not cause as many problems as illegal ones becaues they are widely available...cocaine, heroin, and weed etc, however, are NOT widely available.

Weed is not physically addictive but it is VERY psychologically addictive as can be seen by the LARGE number of daily weed smokers.

I am a tea addict. I get annoyed if I don't have my cup of tea every morning. I do consider this an addiction of sorts.

I'm not saying (necessarily) that addiction is bad; I'm saying that you and many others regularily give weed (and often alcohol) some sort of 'special exemption' from addiction/abuse. Sorry, but these drugs are just as much, in fact more so, abused than heroin and cocaine.

NG, I have to disagree with you. The repurcussions of heroin/opiate, meth or coke addictions are usually much worse than the repurcussions of coffee, weed or alcohol addictions. There are many functioning members of society who spend decades addicted to coffee, weed or booze. I know of very few who don't destroy their lives after a decade of coke, meth, speed or heroin/opiate addiction. Because of this, I think it's reasonable that the law treat these substances differently.

Flame away :D
 
twgburst said:
You must not know many alcoholics.

no doubt there are wife-beating, bukowski-type alcoholics - many of them. But there are MANY functioning alcoholics who go for decades hitting the bottle every evening and still upholding serious jobs, and managing to more or less be involved with their families.... I know people who have been functioning alcoholics for 20+ years... the thing is, you'd never know by seeing or working with them.

How many 20+ year functioning opiate addicts are there?
 
I guarentee you for everyone 1 "functioning" 20 year alcoholic you speak of there are 30 others who are in jail or dead because of booze.

A serious alcoholic is *no* better then a serious junkie.
 
Oh, by the way, do you think your liver would rather have you be a 20-year junky, or a 20 year alcoholic?
 
sb twelve said:
I guarentee you for everyone 1 "functioning" 20 year alcoholic you speak of there are 30 others who are in jail or dead because of booze.

A serious alcoholic is *no* better then a serious junkie.

So not true. I'm hitting my late 30s. i know of many functioning alcoholics. I bet the parents of many of those in this forum qualify. And I don't even drink... maybe a glass of wine or two a week....

It's not a question of BETTER. It's a question of damage to oneself, the ones around you and your abillity to function in society.
 
If it is a question of damage to oneself, alcohol definatley beats heroin out.

I'm not saying a lot of heroin addicts arn't complete fucking scum, but it is physically a much safer addiction then alcohol.

As far as "ability to function in society", think about all the people on pain-management who are getting doped up on OxyContin everyday. It is safer for them then alcohol, and I bet they get a lot more accomplished then an everyday drunk does.

As far as hurting the ones around you, any serious addicition fucks with the people around you, being heroin or alcohol. Most people would rather have an alcoholic in their family simply because it is easier saying "Oh, my cousin Jerry is an alcoholic, we don't see him much" rather than "My uncle Jerry is a junky, we don't see him much" in todays society. Junky is a dirtier word then alcoholic, and that is a fact.
 
Cremaster, you conveniently ignored my comments that the ILLEGAL STATUS of drugs like coke and heroin are what cause them to be so problematic.
 
Negro-kitty said:
Cremaster, you conveniently ignored my comments that the ILLEGAL STATUS of drugs like coke and heroin are what cause them to be so problematic.

I didn't ignore it - the point of my posts is to state that there is a rationale for the law to treat different drugs in different ways... In my opinion, alcohol and marijuana are more manageable in terms of being able to function in society...
 
In my opinion, alcohol and marijuana are more manageable in terms of being able to function in society...

Well, in someones opinion it was a great fucking idea to kill 6 million jews.
 
sb twelve said:
Well, in someones opinion it was a great fucking idea to kill 6 million jews.

Honestly folks, I have nothing to add to this... not a god damn thing... so hey, I will post because I like to see the words on the TV thingy, a screen? No, there is some word... like the disks go in the "Hard Drive" so there is some word.... lemme ask my friend Seth ...

Oh, MONITOR!
 
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