Negro-kitty
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2001
- Messages
- 3,131
Can we PLEASE at least use terms that are accurate? 'harder' is a absolutely meaningless term.
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OD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | Tryptamino
My view on junkies (and related hard-core) drug addicts.
- Thread starter inimical
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MattPD
Bluelight Crew
NK is completely right, which is why I was attempting to elaborate on his point.
M
M
ace of spades
Bluelighter
cops dont find ppl.. ppl find ppl.. my older sister ran out one night and the next day my parents had a report filed looking for her.. the cops are too fuckin dumb to even find her.. i found her on my own.. didnt say shit to the cops either ........ they are fuckin dumb..
inimical
Bluelighter
ace of spades said:
Did you tell the cops where she could possibly be?
Inimicalisis
Bluelighter
Im sorry Larry, but i will have to agree with him. I know you have this big "vision" in your head about being SUPERCOP, but think about it. How many of my 5 stolen bicycles did the police find, or even look for!! How many missing people in the US get found by the police, none. Its all fishermen and morning walkers. Sometimes it feels like the police are trying to make you feel better by saying-"Well we have filed a report, and we will keep in touch."
But back on track, look at how harmful alcohol is. The dilema we are talking about here, was the exact same dilema discussed in peoples homes and at social events back in the 1920's. Remember prohibition , that was about the illegalization of alcohol. Now that created such a big fuss that is known and taught in all history books around here today. So people cant really say drugs are any worse in some cases than alcohol. The only reason people dont fuss about alcohol is becuase it is legal to most and that is where the bullshit ends. Nobody really cares. And on top of it, look at how much alcohol kills, not just talking about poisoning, but DWI and everything else.
But back on track, look at how harmful alcohol is. The dilema we are talking about here, was the exact same dilema discussed in peoples homes and at social events back in the 1920's. Remember prohibition , that was about the illegalization of alcohol. Now that created such a big fuss that is known and taught in all history books around here today. So people cant really say drugs are any worse in some cases than alcohol. The only reason people dont fuss about alcohol is becuase it is legal to most and that is where the bullshit ends. Nobody really cares. And on top of it, look at how much alcohol kills, not just talking about poisoning, but DWI and everything else.
inimical
Bluelighter
[EDIT - d00d, go baxck to SA with yer stupid image macros and JeffK typing....]
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I think you guys should read my post in DIM about managed illegal drug addiction and how money is related to that...
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=96738&r=0
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=96738&r=0
Killer B A R B i E
Bluelighter
*=Regulator=* said:
Exactly. If the government spent half as much to help further the education and opportunities of the poor as they do on this dumb "war against drugs," that would put an end to a lot of the problems.
CLOUDelta_9
Bluelighter
u sound like a hypocrite; whatever that means, coming from a red-flagged blue-lighter. Can anyone even see what I'm typing here, or have I been edited out. Eh, whatever. You'll just end up being a fuckin hypocritical PIG. Why can't California break away. I don't want to have to leave it just b/c of John Ashcroft and pigs like you.
trippinspirals
Bluelighter
- Joined
- May 7, 2003
- Messages
- 1,020
Cremaster said:
Someone can look for the stats, but consider this
While alcohol maybe doesnt per say kill as many people as heroin due to overdose/overconsumption (although I'm sure more people drink themselves to death than you would think, and I'm sure there are a lot of ER visits due to too much drinking-I can speak from experience at college 8( )
Check out the stats on alcohol involved in deaths, such as DUI, and drunk murders/assaults. I think I remember reading from www.drugwarfacts.org or some such site that 30 percent of Homicides are caused by someone who is drunk.
Harmless......?
Morrison's Lament
Bluelighter
Damn, I missed the best parts of this thread! Haha, this got really heated.
I am studying Criminology in Uni, have about a year left before I get my BS, and my classes are full of people like the original poster of this thread - really well-meaning people with lots of feelings of social responsibility but no common sense or critical mind.
You clearly have your heart in the right place, but how you can get through a course that actually looks at the REALITY of how law enforcement is practiced without being absolutely disgusted with the police is beyond me.
I will probably end up working against the police on behalf of victims of injustice, because miscarriage of justice constitutes more than half of all the truly harmful shit I have to read about for my courses.
If you want to use "social harm" as a definition of crime, you have to fight the police, not join them. If you want to use "the letter of the law" as a definition for crime, then you have to arrest kids for smoking weed at a concert.
Just how exactly do you define the term "crime"? It is less simple than you might think, I once had an exam that alotted one whole hour to answering just that question.
--- G.
I am studying Criminology in Uni, have about a year left before I get my BS, and my classes are full of people like the original poster of this thread - really well-meaning people with lots of feelings of social responsibility but no common sense or critical mind.
You clearly have your heart in the right place, but how you can get through a course that actually looks at the REALITY of how law enforcement is practiced without being absolutely disgusted with the police is beyond me.
I will probably end up working against the police on behalf of victims of injustice, because miscarriage of justice constitutes more than half of all the truly harmful shit I have to read about for my courses.
If you want to use "social harm" as a definition of crime, you have to fight the police, not join them. If you want to use "the letter of the law" as a definition for crime, then you have to arrest kids for smoking weed at a concert.
Just how exactly do you define the term "crime"? It is less simple than you might think, I once had an exam that alotted one whole hour to answering just that question.
--- G.
UnSquare
Ex-Bluelighter
Facing Facts
Originally posted by *=Regulator=*
The solution to these problems (as a whole) is not to lay blame on anyone or thing other than society.
You can't blame society.
You can't blame the individual.
You can't blame.
All you can do is try and come up
with effective management strategies
to deal with the real problems caused by
activities that people have participated
in since the dawn of time.
And illegalising substances don't work.
As all above said, it causes a link between
relatively benine drugs like heroin, and
violent crime (to support the habit)
(in some addicts, who have to come up with
large sums of mony daily, and can't hold a
job because of this addictoin/lack of training/social skills)
How many of them aspired to be addicts when they were kids?
(as many posts have noted [including *=Regulator=*]).
And there are many users of these substances
who are hard working, moral, friendly, decent
memeber of society, too.
Do you think Negro-Kitty is not a smart, well-informed,
productive person?
Isn't she a mod?
BL is a shining example of this:
HONESTY (admittin' people WILL use)
HARM REDUCTION (help people with how to use SAFER)
Peace
Uns.
Originally posted by *=Regulator=*
The solution to these problems (as a whole) is not to lay blame on anyone or thing other than society.
You can't blame society.
You can't blame the individual.
You can't blame.
All you can do is try and come up
with effective management strategies
to deal with the real problems caused by
activities that people have participated
in since the dawn of time.
And illegalising substances don't work.
As all above said, it causes a link between
relatively benine drugs like heroin, and
violent crime (to support the habit)
(in some addicts, who have to come up with
large sums of mony daily, and can't hold a
job because of this addictoin/lack of training/social skills)
How many of them aspired to be addicts when they were kids?
(as many posts have noted [including *=Regulator=*]).
And there are many users of these substances
who are hard working, moral, friendly, decent
memeber of society, too.
Do you think Negro-Kitty is not a smart, well-informed,
productive person?
Isn't she a mod?
BL is a shining example of this:
HONESTY (admittin' people WILL use)
HARM REDUCTION (help people with how to use SAFER)
Peace
Uns.
chickenbone
Bluelighter
I'm a daily user of opiates, and if I don't get any one day or more I am in bad shape...but nothing like a few of my IV'ing buddies.....now sure when they don't get what they need, they're sick and are likely to lay in bed with the sweats and such, i don't know if they would be up to robbing people or killing...I wouldn't think so but I guess you never know.
I Think all this lies on a person to person basis..Sure a will grant that there is a higher risk involved in IV using addicts, but I don't know how much..A drunk is liable to do just about anything. Not to get the drug but while on the drug, its like a crutch..it's ok, I'm drunk, or I didn't know, I'm drunk. but crimes of intent, going for cash, or for things to pawn, these are usually done by people needing the drugs. Which are worse, I don't think one or the other takes a lead in the killing department, car crashes verses robberies gone wrong..
I think that with proper treatment we could smooth alot of things out. but as long as we have a police force that relies on busting drug users for payroll we will be damned to the dark, using "illegally" which in its self makes it a higher risk. I think if we are so free we should be allowed to do as we please in the walls of our own homes. We pay taxes and live normal lives outside, If we aren't hurting anybody else, why should they care. I say stay out of my house...its paid for.
.As for our want to be cop, please don't waste time being a cop, Your morals will come around sooner or later and you won't be able to bust people like you for long. Save your conscience...fight the law the forces people to take things made from floor cleaner...just because they won't legalize certain things...
Chicken
I Think all this lies on a person to person basis..Sure a will grant that there is a higher risk involved in IV using addicts, but I don't know how much..A drunk is liable to do just about anything. Not to get the drug but while on the drug, its like a crutch..it's ok, I'm drunk, or I didn't know, I'm drunk. but crimes of intent, going for cash, or for things to pawn, these are usually done by people needing the drugs. Which are worse, I don't think one or the other takes a lead in the killing department, car crashes verses robberies gone wrong..
I think that with proper treatment we could smooth alot of things out. but as long as we have a police force that relies on busting drug users for payroll we will be damned to the dark, using "illegally" which in its self makes it a higher risk. I think if we are so free we should be allowed to do as we please in the walls of our own homes. We pay taxes and live normal lives outside, If we aren't hurting anybody else, why should they care. I say stay out of my house...its paid for.
.As for our want to be cop, please don't waste time being a cop, Your morals will come around sooner or later and you won't be able to bust people like you for long. Save your conscience...fight the law the forces people to take things made from floor cleaner...just because they won't legalize certain things...
Chicken
alostlittlebird
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Feb 8, 2003
- Messages
- 1,554
I like the idea of cops that selectively either bust/don't bust drug offendors based on their own moral standpoints and opinions. It increases my chances of making it home with my stash.
Of course, it will never stand up to my deep seeded ideal of a law enforcement system that relies on the needs of an individual and not on the heartless umbrella laws that in essence choke the destitute of our society and encourage illegal activity at the same time.
We're in a real big fucking mess and I do not believe adequate changes will be made until the users (the only ones who truly understand their own situation) have a say in legal procedures.
Or, perhaps tomorrow the country will start out to legalize drugs and offer readily available treatment to everyone. At the same time, realistic education and applicable facts will be taught to school children and society will come to accept drug use as a form of recreation that can be managed with moderation and not as a disease.
I wish.
Of course, it will never stand up to my deep seeded ideal of a law enforcement system that relies on the needs of an individual and not on the heartless umbrella laws that in essence choke the destitute of our society and encourage illegal activity at the same time.
We're in a real big fucking mess and I do not believe adequate changes will be made until the users (the only ones who truly understand their own situation) have a say in legal procedures.
Or, perhaps tomorrow the country will start out to legalize drugs and offer readily available treatment to everyone. At the same time, realistic education and applicable facts will be taught to school children and society will come to accept drug use as a form of recreation that can be managed with moderation and not as a disease.
I wish.
Partykid12
Bluelighter
^^ I totally agree with Negro and many other posters here. The only reason I think that Heroin is "bad" is because of that stigma that it has. If you can keep the use in moderation then it's really not that bad, alcohol on the other hand fucks your body up left and right but people still think that its ok to drink everyday or even just a couple times a week. I always find it funny as hell when someone tries to tell me that by snorting a line of dope I'm a fuckup, meanwhile they are chugging their 10th shot of grey goose vodka.... weird.
I agree. A drug is a drug. Only diference is some are legal and sociably acceptable. Alcohol kills more people than all other drugs combined (except possibly nicotine) either directly( alcohol induced health problems) or indirectly (accidents-how many auto deaths involve drinking?). Our society (read powers that be) are a little confused in this area. Especially in the US. Throwing people in jail solves nothing. It only makes more people suffer-families etc. They need to use harm reduction and education with alternatives. Like instilling hope for a brighter future. Access to education, proper housing and healthcare. Go to the root cause of the problem. Then if you decrease the demand the supply will decrease. Simple business principle. Not an easy task to embrace though. I am glad I live in Canada where the government seems to have an incling that addiction is not a law enforcement issue primarily but a social one.
*=Regulator=*
Bluelighter
Remember, when comparing the harmful effets of drug A and B, be aware of the total amount of users of each drug.
I.e. it is incorrect to say that drug A (alcohol) is a more harmful substance because it kills more people than all other drugs combined, because more people are using it.
Consider a sample of 100 people:
95 people are using drug A
5 people are using drug B.
10% of all users of drug A will die (9.5 people)
90% of all users of drug B will die (4.5 people)
That means that for the sample, drug A has a more harmful total effect, even though drug B will kill 90% of users, meaning it is relatively more harmful.
Far, far more people use alcohol than all the other illegal drugs combined. So while its total effect is worse than all these drugs, it is not necessarily inherently more dangerous or harmful.
What would happen if as many people used crack or heroin as do alcohol?
My point is that the most impotant factor in assessing the damage a given drug does to society is the total number of users, which is influenced by availability, legality and social attitudes. These three things are all in direct or indirect control of the government.
I.e. it is incorrect to say that drug A (alcohol) is a more harmful substance because it kills more people than all other drugs combined, because more people are using it.
Consider a sample of 100 people:
95 people are using drug A
5 people are using drug B.
10% of all users of drug A will die (9.5 people)
90% of all users of drug B will die (4.5 people)
That means that for the sample, drug A has a more harmful total effect, even though drug B will kill 90% of users, meaning it is relatively more harmful.
Far, far more people use alcohol than all the other illegal drugs combined. So while its total effect is worse than all these drugs, it is not necessarily inherently more dangerous or harmful.
What would happen if as many people used crack or heroin as do alcohol?
My point is that the most impotant factor in assessing the damage a given drug does to society is the total number of users, which is influenced by availability, legality and social attitudes. These three things are all in direct or indirect control of the government.
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tathra
Bluelighter
Originally posted by blahblahblah
Sheeet, Phreex is a mod, so is Tathra and I think they both are abusers of the blissful opiates.
Sheeet, Phreex is a mod, so is Tathra and I think they both are abusers of the blissful opiates.
hey now, dont drag me into this! indeed i indulge, a bit too much lately, but if i wished to discuss it here i would've posted myself
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