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How young is too young?

scureto1 said:
I'm not even sure what Pharcyde is talking about in his post - I raised a theoretical question and he's saying that I did something and he's going to smash me? Sure, sounds like a perfectly reasonable person with a valid opinion.

And Genericmind what I'm getting at is the question of when you think a girl/woman is capable of making the decision for herself whether she wants to have sex. Is it at 18, simply because that is the cutoff for adulthood here in the US? Does that mean its okay for a 12 year old girl to have sex as long as she's Japanese (age of consent in Japan is 12)? I agree that you have that right and authority if we are talking about your own daughter - that puts her under your protection and authority. But what makes you think you have the right to decide for a sister if she is to be allowed to have consensual sex or not? Don't you think that is pretty insulting to her, for you to assert that you know better than she does what is okay for her to do? (I am referring to 1 teen to another teen sex here, not child/adult sex).

I also notice that no one answered about whether they'd want a female friend to smash a 21-24 year old woman for having sex with their 14-16 year old brother.
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Look, as a woman I can definitely say that girls in junior high and even high school are not prone to making good decisions when it comes to sex. They are almost always never able to handle what it really means on an emotional level. I'm not saying they hate it, but a lot of them regret how it went down during their teen years later on down the road. I was 16 when I lost my virginity and I think I was too young to make that kind of decision. I don't regret it and it was far from a bad experience but I still think that waiting would have made it so much better for me. Basically, a lot of my girlfriends as well as myself ended up giving it away to some guy we felt truly loved us; we thought that it really meant something and it didn't. This sort of thing can be devastating to a young girl so... yeah.

Also, I do not think they are getting at the idea of deciding for their sister. What I am getting from GM's post is that he would want to influence her in a positive manner; not make her feel stupid by making decisions for her. I'm not sure how you got that out of what he said. Anyway, obviously you cannot make decisions for another human being but you can definitely urge them to make a better decision. It's especially meaningful when it comes from someone who is close to the girl in question.

Oh and, it's not okay for a 21-24 year old woman to "smash" a 14 year old BOY. Hell, they can't even drive yet and most haven't even finished puberty. That's completely fucked up on so many levels, and whether you believe it's okay or not doesn't change the fact that this practice is VERY illegal.
 
mludd said:
Someone who wants to have/is having sex with a 14-16 year old is hardly a pedophile.
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This is true. Just as long as the other party is 14-16. A 30 year old who wants to have sex with a 14 year old is a pedophile imo.


OP- I felt strange dating a 16 year old when I was 19. I'm 21 right now as well and probably would pass on the 16 year old.
 
User Name Here said:
Oh and, it's not okay for a 21-24 year old woman to "smash" a 14 year old BOY. Hell, they can't even drive yet and most haven't even finished puberty. That's completely fucked up on so many levels, and whether you believe it's okay or not doesn't change the fact that this practice is VERY illegal.
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You misunderstood what I was talking about there. I wasn't saying that the woman would be "smashing" the 14 year old. Pharcyde had used the term smash for what he'd want to do to a 21 year old trying to get with his 16 year old sister. I was asking him if his response would be the same if the genders were reversed.

As for what Genericmind was talking about - I definitely did not take what he said in the same way as you took it. If he meant put a stop to it by talking to his sister and convincing her its a bad idea and then letting her make what she finds to be the best decision after his input, then I'm all for it.

But what he pretty plainly said was that he would "put a stop to it", in the context of what else he has said, I am very certain he meant by stopping it from the other end, by stopping the guy from seeing her, or finding some other way to exert dominant power over her and take her desires and wishes out of the equation.
 
Threads like these seriously remind me why the World is such a fucked up place. It scares the shit out of me that people like you are actually out there breeding and raising children. Your arguments do nothing more than convince me that being as protective as I am is justified.

Taking her desires and wishes out of the equation? THEY'RE FUCKING KIDS. Good parenting to you consists of what? Giving your kid whatever they want? Not telling them 'No' when they try to do something that could be detrimental to their wellbeing? When I was a 16 I wanted to stay out getting high until 4am. I wanted to get in fights. Not do my homework. Skip school.

My parents didn't let me.

Does that make them bad parents? Should they have let me do whatever I wanted after "giving me their input and letting me decide what the best decision was"?
 
The difference between those things and having sex is that those things inherently harmful, either directly or indirectly. The only time sex is harmful is when it is violent or abusive (both of which should be, and are, punished very severely), or when the participants are uneducated about appropriate precautions. Otherwise sex is a perfectly healthy pastime that people should stop trying to exert control over. Before you fire up another wave of ad hominem attacks, don't forget that I'm still talking about teen-to-teen sex, not teen-to-adult.

When I am a parent I am going to base the rules that I lay out and enforce around the RESULTS and CONSEQUENCES of what will happen to my children if they do or don't do things, absolutely not about how those things make me feel. Probably every father feels hurt, rejected, or angry when they find out their daughter is having sex. But how you raise your kids shouldn't be based on how things make you feel, it should be based on doing what is best for them, and I absolutely believe that what is best for them is self-determination in as many things as it is possible and reasonable for them to self-determine. As long as it is safe sex, sex is most definitely one of those things.

Skipping school and not doing homework have the obvious consequences of doing poorly in school, not being responsible, and hurting their education in the long run. Getting in fights and staying out getting high - obvious disciplinary and legal consequences, etc.

Having protected sex? What are the consequences? Possibly hurt feelings and rejection down the road, but that is something every person in the world has to face and learn to deal with - putting it off until later and continuing the fairy-tale fantasy of what sex is supposed to be is just going to make it worse when it finally does happen.
 
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scureto said:
The only time sex is harmful is when it is violent or abusive (both of which should be, and are, punished very severely), or when the participants are uneducated about appropriate precautions.
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This statement is completely untrue. I can even give you a recent personal example of how untrue that statement is. Sex is one of the most emotionally investing acts someone can participate in. It involves complex interpersonal interactions and feelings, some of which some adults don't even understand and/or can barely handle themselves. With that in mind, I highly doubt most children are more capable of handling the emotional and psychological responsibility of sex than their adult counterparts.

scureto1 said:
Before you fire up another wave of ad hominem attacks, don't forget that I'm still talking about teen-to-teen sex, not teen-to-adult.
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Not three posts up you asked about a 21-year-old and a 16-year-old having sex. How is that teen-to-teen sex?

scureto1 said:
it should be based on doing what is best for them
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That's exactly what I'm doing.

scureto1 said:
When I am a parent I am going to base the rules that I lay out and enforce around the RESULTS and CONSEQUENCES of what will happen if my children do or don't do things...

I absolutely believe that what is best for them is self-determination in as many things as it is possible and reasonable for them to self-determine
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If your kid(s) make it to 18 without ending up dead, in jail, homeless, or fucked up in the head I'll be the first to congratulate you.
 
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GM when you confront these people they always have an excuse and try to talk their way out of the situation........if this was real life Im sure you (and me) would have probably hit this guy already............
 
I'm sure you would have too, and it cracks me up that you are proud of that. You take everything out of context and twist it into your very small worldview. I don't even know what you think you're "confronting" me about.

The 16-to-21 was a theoretical question for you, but not the sort of sex that I am advocating that should be permissible. Anyway, you just talk in circle, take things out of context, and throw up straw men to knock down that aren't even what I've said, so there is no point to continuing the discussion. Best of luck with your Islamic view of sex and women.
 
scureto1 said:
You misunderstood what I was talking about there. I wasn't saying that the woman would be "smashing" the 14 year old. Pharcyde had used the term smash for what he'd want to do to a 21 year old trying to get with his 16 year old sister. I was asking him if his response would be the same if the genders were reversed.

As for what Genericmind was talking about - I definitely did not take what he said in the same way as you took it. If he meant put a stop to it by talking to his sister and convincing her its a bad idea and then letting her make what she finds to be the best decision after his input, then I'm all for it.

But what he pretty plainly said was that he would "put a stop to it", in the context of what else he has said, I am very certain he meant by stopping it from the other end, by stopping the guy from seeing her, or finding some other way to exert dominant power over her and take her desires and wishes out of the equation.
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My bad for misreading your post. Sorry about that.
 
scureto1 said:
The difference between those things and having sex is that those things inherently harmful, either directly or indirectly. The only time sex is harmful is when it is violent or abusive (both of which should be, and are, punished very severely), or when the participants are uneducated about appropriate precautions. Otherwise sex is a perfectly healthy pastime that people should stop trying to exert control over. Before you fire up another wave of ad hominem attacks, don't forget that I'm still talking about teen-to-teen sex, not teen-to-adult.
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This couldn't be further from the truth. Teen girls generally start off quite naive and become very emotionally involved, especially when it comes to losing their virginity. Emotional pain can be as bad as (if not worse than) physical pain, and this is most definitely a negative effect.
 
We're two different people, by the way. We just have the same avatar.

scureto1 said:
The 16-to-21 was a theoretical question for you, but not the sort of sex that I am advocating that should be permissible
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Then why ask the question? It certainly seemed to be something you assumed would appear acceptable and that you thought should be permissible. If not, then why try to make the analogy of adult male/teen female and adult female/teen male?

scureto1 said:
Anyway, you just talk in circle, take things out of context
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You just make excuse.

scureto1 said:
throw up straw men to knock down that aren't even what I've said
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scureto1 said:
Best of luck with your Islamic view of sex and women.
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The irony is bleeding out of my eyes.
 
I'm 17 and a junior, a normal age at the time, as most people lose their virginity at 15-16 where I'm from I don't really see a problem unless there's drugs involved. Also there shouldn't be an age gap of like 5-6 years if they're under 18 IMO.
 
hyroller said:
^^^^ I forget you guys have weird laws overseas.... lol

well yeah sex offender certainly isn't a title I'd be knowingly toying with

tough call! :\
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uh dude, it's much the same laws over in AUS too.
Numerous states list the age of consent at 16, but an adult (18+) having sex with a minor (u18) is still a crime.
Funnily enough, age of consent for anal sex in several AUS states require both parties to be 18+, but lesbian and vaginal sex is ok at 16 :S
 
MaddTime said:
. Are you serious? Did he really? And I don't know why people keep telling me. That it's a bad idea when I had already realized that a long time ago. There is a lot of bullshit going on and maybe this thread should be closed... To generic mind, I hope you were not implicating ME as a pedo in your argument with coolio 8(
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yep i'm cerial!
 
User Name Here said:
Look, as a woman I can definitely say that girls in junior high and even high school are not prone to making good decisions when it comes to sex.
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Are you trying to say that boys in junior and high school are better at making those decisions? If not, then what does this matter?
 
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