Christians and Aliens

[Journyman16]

Or you could like... I don't know... post on topic? Your beliefs are yours and it might surprise you to know I don't actually 'hate' any Religion, I just find it difficult to find believers who can think for themselves. Apparently, and by definitions, 'believing' stuff turns off the critical faculties - vis-a-vis the only person to bother responding ON TOPIC is KittyKat5. All the rest of the posts come from 2 people who do NOT actually follow Christian belief who think it is OK to spam a thread with lectures about things they actually don't believe anyway.

One wonders what that says about you two - apparently instead of having a discussion you prefer to decide what I do or don't believe (in spite of you both responding to a thread where I tell people I try to NOT believe in anything) and then you tell me what I can or can't say based on YOUR beliefs.

Maybe go start a thread where we can talk about how your 'Chrisitan' beliefs vary from normal Christians?

Or you could... like... you know... address the actual topic?\

And my relationship with'god' of any description is something neither of you have ever bothered asking so telling me how it should be is a little presumptuous.

 

[Ninae]

LOL. I was only trying to get you out of a rut (and stop encouragening it in others).

 

[Journyman16]

Just some random ideas.

Believers in aliens often describe various morphologies of these beings (the Grays, Reptilians, and of course humanoid). Seeing as the bible says we are created in Gods image, and we take that as literally our human form is a replica of Gods form, than our God is either only truly our God or the God of the humanoids. The others either were natural consequences of the Universe or had their own Creator. I do not think this destroys Christianity per se, as we still have a unique creator/God and all of the teachings of the holy books come after creation. Maybe this is the true meaning of the first commandment. Not dont believe in other Earthly Gods, they are all cultural adaptations of me. Just dont follow those other Gods if you ever learn of them through communication with aliens not of our kind.

Perhaps some did pass and fail the original sin test. I can imagine various histories of either scenario. Maybe those who passed didnt need a Christ or had a Christ who did not need to be killed for our sins but only to fully enlighten the people on the mysteries of the Universe. Perhaps some failed but reconciled with God without a Christ having to save them. And those who are like us, got a similar history to ours. I dont think this necessarily disproves Cbristianity or religion more generally, just shows there may be many paths to the same end.

So... for normal people (as opposed to those who get so into defending the faith they choose to alter to suit themselves - go figure?) how about the Alien question?

OK... if God is only the God opf Earth, Christianity, Judaism and Islam are all pretty much nuked - they all claim God is the God that made the Universe and everything, including the restaurant at the end, so a God strictly for humans doesn't quite work as they would like to believe.

In 'our image' as a physical model would seem a touch human-centric - I've always thought it was more about the spiritual 'image' than the physical - God has always seemed to be a Consciousness rather than a body.

There are numerous references in the Bible about other gods and pluralist descriptions - God even has a wife. Even the story of Lucifer seems to imply a palace revolution rather than some insane minor deity thinking he could replace the Creator of all.

But I am curious as to what the possibility of Aliens means to the Christian message about redemption? To me it seems to offer several unpalatable options for those who believe, and I am wondering how they reconcile those options with their belief. It is similar to how people wonder how a physicist might still believe in God, or any Christian who works with Evolution as a subject.

If you have a belief in how things are, how do you reconcile possible facts that turn the belief upside down?

I mean, apart from lecturing about how I am not allowed to have a conversation because their beliefs, which don't actually coincide with normal Christians', are somehow seen as being offended... :D

 

[Journyman16]

LOL. I was only trying to get you out of a rut (and stop encouragening it in others).

I'm not actually IN a rut. The question is soon to go HUGE in the public arena - the Pope has opened the door to maybe Aliens are encompassed within the Christian message, but as near as I can tell that is a can of worms he maybe shouldn't have opened.

While you might think you have a Christian view, both you and fea are fringe dwellers as far as Christianity goes. For most Chrisitians, the Bible IS the word of God. Adam and Eve were real people. The stories are NOT allegorical, similes or metaphors but real descriptions of factual events.

And now the head of the Catholic Church has dropped a bombshell into the midst of the faithful.

So maybe stop judging me (something your beliefs should tell you is wrong anyway) and talk about the topic.

 

[ForEverAfter]

I'm not a Christian, as I've stated repeatedly.
Neither is Ninae, as she's stated repeatedly.
We haven't "altered (any) belief systems to suit us".
And my beliefs do not dictate that I shouldn't judge.

I'm not actually IN a rut.

You come across (in many threads) as having a lot of anger towards Christianity/religion.
This blinds you, IMO, in the sense that you have an agenda.
Kitty Cat is not the only person to contribute to this thread.
My contributions just didn't fit into your agenda.

Keep calling people Christians, because they defend Christianity, and you will continue to derail your own thread.

The possible existence of aliens isn't a bombshell, for Christians.
There are a LOT of Christian scientists, involved in the space program.
Christians are not ignorant and Christianity / aliens are not mutually exclusive.

This thread is stupid.
I'm not telling you what you can or can't say.
I'm reacting to what you said, which I think is ignorant and potentially offensive.

You might as well start a thread about Zeus burning his palms on lightning bolts, and how stupid the Ancient Greeks were.

 

[Ninae]

I'm not actually IN a rut. The question is soon to go HUGE in the public arena - the Pope has opened the door to maybe Aliens are encompassed within the Christian message, but as near as I can tell that is a can of worms he maybe shouldn't have opened.

While you might think you have a Christian view, both you and fea are fringe dwellers as far as Christianity goes. For most Chrisitians, the Bible IS the word of God. Adam and Eve were real people. The stories are NOT allegorical, similes or metaphors but real descriptions of factual events.

And now the head of the Catholic Church has dropped a bombshell into the midst of the faithful.

So maybe stop judging me (something your beliefs should tell you is wrong anyway) and talk about the topic.

You're just completely missing the point in so many ways.

It's like Rickolasrice, who will show up every once in a while, expressing disbelief that not everyone has been as smart to question conventional religion/Christianity as he has.

When actually more people have been through this stage than who haven't. It's the first reacionary state someone will reach when they don't like the idea of the religion they've been exposed to. Just not everyone gets stuck in this state as it's not that fulfilling.

Some pass through it quite quickly at an early point in their life. It's not an advanced outlook, in any sense, more like the first step in gaining religious independence. But you can also come full circle and come to accept some of those religious ideas you initially rejected because you see them from a higher level now.

The trouble is so many are so comfortable there and have no further ambition besides that. But it's not really something to beat your chest about.

 

[ForEverAfter]

Yep, it's not clever or original.

Like I said earlier, you come across like a smug religious education student with an axe to grind trying to trump your teacher by pointing out the obvious.
You should move on to the flood narrative, and how it's impossible to fit millions of species in a boat... 8)

 

[Erikmen]

I'm not actually IN a rut. The question is soon to go HUGE in the public arena - the Pope has opened the door to maybe Aliens are encompassed within the Christian message, but as near as I can tell that is a can of worms he maybe shouldn't have opened.

While you might think you have a Christian view, both you and fea are fringe dwellers as far as Christianity goes. For most Chrisitians, the Bible IS the word of God. Adam and Eve were real people. The stories are NOT allegorical, similes or metaphors but real descriptions of factual events.

And now the head of the Catholic Church has dropped a bombshell into the midst of the faithful.

So maybe stop judging me (something your beliefs should tell you is wrong anyway) and talk about the topic.

When you mention Aliens, I recall talking seriously about that during Christmas in northern Europe and I swear that my cousin with all of her beliefs that Man kind started in the Scandinavian Countries thousands of years ago.
Don´t mean to get in details, as it might bee really weird. But I swear, when you hear her points of view and from where she gets this sort of info I was astonished.
And believe me when I say Scandinavian people are beyond developed. Not rich not economic sort of talking, but how they evoluted.
Just thought that would be the right place to share this odd and quite unlikely belief.
And, ironically, they have built their world with National Flags with a cross all over Europe.
I really enjoy reading your posts, although you never really answered me about the Global warming including most severe winters (?)
I would really respect your point of view reason I asked you.
You seem to know a lot about that..

 

[Ninae]

And believe me when I say Scandinavian people are beyond developed. Not rich not economic sort of talking, but how they evoluted.

 

[pill_billy]

I really enjoy reading your posts, although you never really answered me about the Global warming including most severe winters (?)
I would really respect your point of view reason I asked you.
You seem to know a lot about that..

SMH.... just because its geting colder in the winter does not mean the earth is not heating up... the weather is completly different from the climate... the nine of the ten hottest years on record have taken place in the 21 century, with 2014 breaking the record, again... man made or natural? doesnt really matter, what does is that there has not been this much Co2 in the atmosphere in the last 100,000 years and thats not good for the human race... its not even a question anymore, the earth is defitnatly wamring up faster then it ever has and america is the only western country to not admit that... fuck even china realizes it and is trying to cut coal admission...

 

[Erikmen]

@Pill_billy,
Yes, I believe you are right. And totally agree with you!
I just wanted to understand, for instance, why we got so much colder in Ottawa last winter. Coldest collection of days lower than freezing than in 47 or 67 years depending on what you read.
How can that happen when we are about to unfreeze the North Pole.
Don´t get me wrong. I wanted to domain the subject to be able to discuss with weirdo co-workers that say to me that Global warning is just something else to make news.
Argh!! How mad I became with people like this!!
Thanks for you post anyway! I´m in your side, and believe that soon we are going to face a major problem now that people are trying to cross the North Pole due to economic reasons..
I need more than words to discuss with these guys. I´m searching for graphics and good argumentation as I´m sure I can contribute.
Thank you!

 

[Ninae]

Norwegian winters are nearly gone...Arcic meltdown

 

[Erikmen]

So true! In Sweden too, including Kiruna (!)
I remember when I was small, the waters in between the neighborhood islands use to freeze every winter.
My grandpa use to fish right in the middle drawing a circle and that was so fantastic being a kid and all.
All the snow that is now off. We discuss that in almost every "Fika"
Have good memories of having the snow making the dark more easy to handle.
You are very right though!

 

[pill_billy]

@Pill_billy,
Yes, I believe you are right. And totally agree with you!
I just wanted to understand, for instance, why we got so much colder in Ottawa last winter. Coldest collection of days lower than freezing than in 47 or 67 years depending on what you read.
How can that happen when we are about to unfreeze the North Pole.
Don´t get me wrong. I wanted to domain the subject to be able to discuss with weirdo co-workers that say to me that Global warning is just something else to make news.
Argh!! How mad I became with people like this!!
Thanks for you post anyway! I´m in your side, and believe that soon we are going to face a major problem now that people are trying to cross the North Pole due to economic reasons..
I need more than words to discuss with these guys. I´m searching for graphics and good argumentation as I´m sure I can contribute.
Thank you!

yea i was really confused there for a mintue... usually when you post shit it makes sense then i saw that and was you gotta be shittin me lol.... but yea vice had some article awhile back about how russia claimed the north pole for theirselves and itll prob end up starting WW3... but its the same way down here, it was 0 for a few days last week (prob not cold for you but fuking freezing for me lol) and all these retards were saying ooo what happened to global warming... but for real i think it has alot to do with the polar caps melting and desaltifing the oceans and fucking up the jet stream in the atlantic so theres not as much warm air being circulated north, cause im sure know, london is as far north as canada but not nearly as cold cause they get alot of warm air comming up from the equator and that messes up then entire flow around artic which in turn means less warm air comming back around to canada... and i was reading that if canada starts digging up the tar sands it will pretty much totally fuck the world cause it put out so much Co2 just to extract the gas from let alone the gas from the gas it will put the climiate over the tipping point it already reached a year or two ago lol.... but yea i worked at this hotel for a couple years and there were so many people fro canada down here to work on natural gas wells and shit and theyd always come in the lobby in the morning and talk about how its all a hoax and this n that and id kinda have to sit there and not tell em their completely fucking stupid

 

[Erikmen]

Exactly!!

 

[Journyman16]

So two people who admit to not being Christian tell me I shouldn't talk about Christian issues because I am not Christian? And one of them happily lectures all and sundry about how to interpret the Christian bible and faith? Riiiight...

@Erikmen - I think many national groups have origin stories that aren't really compatible with what the gene scene tells us. The church I started in was into the British Israel theory and Scandinavians featured as part of the 10 lost tribes - Denmark for example being where the tribe of Dan ended up.

I've also had people tell me quite in earnest that all civilisations were started by fair-hair, blue-eye people and destroyed by dark-hair, brown-eye people.

The cold winters in the recent past are caused by air pressure anomalies over the Arctic. Global Warming has almost nothing to do with it and the average temperatures around the world have ceased to rise and have been static or dropping slightly for 15 years or more. Pretty much ever since the Sun went quiet in Solar Cycle 23.

 

[pill_billy]

The cold winters in the recent past are caused by air pressure anomalies over the Arctic. Global Warming has almost nothing to do with it and the average temperatures around the world have ceased to rise and have been static or dropping slightly for 15 years or more. Pretty much ever since the Sun went quiet in Solar Cycle 23.

you sir are wrong... 2014 was the hottest year on record... and i hope a dingo eats your baby so you cant contaminate the rest of the human population

 

[Ninae]

There's no winter. Just one long autumn-spring. Fine by me, but can't be that good for everything else.

 

[Journyman16]

you sir are wrong... 2014 was the hottest year on record... and i hope a dingo eats your baby so you cant contaminate the rest of the human population

You AGW types are such NICE people aren't you? What is it about your beliefs that makes you all so nasty - conversation is an art form whereas abuse is just lowlife responses.

We will see - there's been no warming for better than 15 years now and Solar Cycle 25 looks like it ain't gonna be a happening thang, which puts us right on track for another Little Ice Age. NOAA, NCDC and NASA have all been caught out altering their data to make the case for warming.

Satellites track almost all of the Earth for 24 hours a day and the data shows that we don’t need to go back to the Medieval Warm Period to find a hotter year, just back to 2010.

So we see the claim about 2014 is just more nonsense from the AGW church. Tell people something over and over and the mud will stick eventually. One day they might even accidentally get one of their claims to be right.

 

[Ninae]

There's no such thing as a AGW cult. People are just noticing the world is getting warmer and the poles are melting down. The arctic pole is melting down and some are even talking about starting drilling in it, which is ironic, but it's not melting down for no reason.