Opioids Why Opiate addicts opt for Methadone?

[weekend addiction]

I can't imagine they would even consider methadone if you were not physically dependent on opiates. Sounds like a good way to make the situation worse.
Did you have to lie and say you were physicallly dependent?

Ya I told them I was doing opiates every day. In reality I was going there because I wasn't able to afford them everyday. I had been physically dependent a year before but my life was in shambles at this point.

I went in an hour after taking a large amount of morphine and talked with the docs. I got approved. I got the blood work and shit done. And I even took a safety class. I had one last hoop I had to make it through and I was in. I had to make it for my first dose where they observe me after I dose. After that I would be on the program and they wouldn't kick me out willy nilly. I was crashed out from a speed binge and missed the appointment. Best thing that ever came out of a speed binge for me.

 

[RTrain]

^Yea I'd say you were probably better off. I've been considering doing the same thing, going to the methadone because I can't afford using everyday and I want to. I am completely open with myself in knowing I would use methadone not because I want to get clean but because I can't afford to not be clean. I can't go anywhere in life, I just meander as a paycheck to paycheck waste of space. If I can't go without something but want to be financially stable I might as well go for the methadone.

My only issue is the whole having to go the the clinic everyday. I've been using Suboxone with the plan that its just to hold me over until I can afford to go on a heroin binge, but the Suboxone is very unsatisfying, I am constantly craving the heroin. I have started using the Subs about 4 or 5 times in the last year only to relapse back to heroin in less than a month. The only good thing about the Subs is you just pop in the doctors office and get a script, and they tend to prescribe way more than I feel is necessary or worth taking. So I've saved a good amount of those from doctors who I burned bridges with. If I really wanted to get clean I think I'd use the Subs, they are great for tapering because after a week they barely do anything for you so its not a big deal tapering down. I think I might try the methadone maintenance road now and if I decide to really kick things altogether I will switch to oxy or H for a week and then to Subs and taper off those.

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

I can't imagine they would even consider methadone if you were not physically dependent on opiates. Sounds like a good way to make the situation worse.
Did you have to lie and say you were physicallly dependent?

Yeah, zero chance somebody without a psychical dependence would be allowed to get on methadone.. more importantly.. why the hell would somebody want to do that? I can't imagine such a person has never known what it's like to be psychically addicted to something or would never so nonchalantly say, fuck it, I'll take a life-changing dependency because I have cravings... Sounds ridiculous to me.

 

[Slum Survivor]

ok i got sick of reading this mess..... anyone mention the difference between a physical dependence and an addiction?? sry if they did but umm yeah... that has a lot to do with justifying opiate replacement therapy

 

[-Guido-]

I almost got on methadone but they kicked me off before I started for missing an appointment. I wasn't physically addicted to them but I took opiates 4-5 times a week on average and was very psychologically dependent on them. I quit without the subs or done. But I do insist on kratom occasionally. I can't totally get past the whole opiate thing. I still wonder how my life would have been on subs\done.

Methadone is for people who are physically addicted to opiates and have been addicted to them for years. If you can't get past the whole opiate thing and your not dependent you just need some counseling.

 

[-Guido-]

The comparison of opiate maintenance drugs to insulin for diabetics is a bit skewed. I am sure if that comparison was made to a type 1 diabetic they would be insulted. They need the insulin, they get no pleasure from it, it just keeps them healthy. But I have an idea, go up to a insulin dependent diabetic and tell them about how you can relate because you need to take methadone everyday.

It's not skewed. I need the Methadone. It keeps me healthy. I get no pleasure from it. Just like a diabetic needs insulin; It keeps them healthy. They get no pleasure from it. Without it they would get sick.

It's a totally solid argument and I'm sure if I did go up a insulin dependent diabetic they would agree.

 

[dopemegently]

I remember the subutex craze in the UK around 10 years ago; it was seen as the magic bullet for opiate addiction, and prescribed without reservation. A friend of mine was prescribed 12mgs of subutex because he was addicted to 120mgs of dihydrocodeine a day!

 

[weekend addiction]

Methadone is for people who are physically addicted to opiates and have been addicted to them for years. If you can't get past the whole opiate thing and your not dependent you just need some counseling.

Hey Guido. I was full aware of what methadone was and how the program worked. I was making an informed decision to check out of life with as much methadone as they would give me. I'd been doing it with illegal drugs and I wanted to continue to do it with legal methadone which my insurance would pay for. I knew at the time methadone wasn't in my best interest in the long run but I just couldn't bear the idea of quitting. It sounded impossible to me.

I haven't done a strong opiate in 11 months. And the year before that only sparingly.

 

[belfort]

ehh ive been on the methadone wagon and just imho, i believe most methadone patients are still chasing that opiod cloudiness..many methadone patients claim they have to have the methadone and i was the same way until i was forced to get clean and now feel better, im no longer in the opiod bubble..i dont care what methadone patients say, the stuff technically may not get you high any longer but you continue to live in a opiod contended bubble..if you dont believe me, just get off the stuff, u will see what i mean..comparing diabetes and insulin to methadone maintenance is shaky at best..

so yeah my feeling is they opt for methadone because it still provides somewhat of a high..

 

['medicine cabinet']

well, because if you are jamming 80$ worth of top quality smack everyday and get violently sick without it to the point you will lie rob steal ect, then a substitute program is a good option. and since suboxone is generally more expensive that methadone, it makes methadone the go to drug. once you get on the right dose and you are not getting all drowsy and sleepy 3 hours after you take it, but are being held and feeling normal, then you can give your mind and body a break from the lifestyle which in reality is ten fold worse than the heroin itself. makes it so you can find a job, get your life sorted out. and just like guido said, its no differeant than an insulin dependent person needing their insulin. you shouldnt get high from it, it just keeps you stable. and when youre ready you can slwoly start to taper your dose down. its just an option for ppl with serious addiction to opiates and it gives you a chance to live a normal life except for having to go to a clinic once a day 6 days a week, or less if you get takehomes.

 

[K-OSS]

You can't say, I was addicted to a drug therefore I have more knowledge about it, because then your opinion/point may not be free of bias. Doctors know from theory, patients know from practice a patient can't turn around to a doctor and say well because I've been taking drug X therefore I know more then you about drug X therefore you should give me a prescription for drug X. That makes no sense at all. I think many users on here are biased and have no reason to stop doing the drug they are addicted to, and come here and try to romanticize about it, how taken an equally addictive drug helps them function in society. Yes in many cases function enough, to stay off heroin or other opiates until they have enough money to get high off them again. Anyone who is serious about getting off drugs, usually doesn't start taking another drug to come off the first one.

For example, swim's been snorting cocaine for the best part of 3 years now, at least a 1 gram a day or two at minimum. Because swim can afford to do it, swim has a high paying job in banking/trading. swim had to recently, stop taking cocaine because swim was becoming complacent on the drug and doing lines in a fashion which started affecting swim's work ethic and it would have only been a matter of time before swims was caught out snorting a line in his office. But the good thing about cocaine is eventually it starts to give you a paranoid feeling, and that can help you to stop for a few months until your body recovers, this is exactly what swim is doing. In the next month or so swims planning on starting back on cocaine and doing it on a spaceship with his giant panda friend, as usual. If swim had the real intention of stopping, swim would simply not touch the stuff, and tell the spaceship to fly off and get rid of the giant ass panda too.

Simply all drugs are bad if you're doing them for recreational purposes.

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

^^^

You are very uniformed on the reality of drug use..

And you're wrong.. having experience with the drugs in questions is exactly what gives you the real qualifications to speak about them.. there is no "bias".. it's called "knowing what you're talking about from real world experience."...

Who would you rather have operate on you? A surgeon who has been practicing and in the business for 20 years... or some guy who just read a lot of books on it yet hasn't ever even held a scalpel..? Whose opinion carries more weight..?

 

[dopemegently]

This is the reason I've never had much luck with drug counselers; many were very well meaning, but all of their drug knowledge came from a textbook, they simply had no actual life experience of both addiction and drug use. Ime the ones who used to be addicts themselves make for the best type of counselar; they know exactly what their talking about.

One troubling thing I've been noticing is how little is known of the new "RC" type drugs, even highly qualified drug consultants. I tried bringing up my etizolam use with my doctor, and she literally had no idea what I was talking about. Also, many doctors I've spoken to seemed to be worryingly misinformed about suboxone; they all think injecting it will cause precip WD's, and they all think rapid suboxone reductions would be painless, in fact some I've spoken to honestly believe there are NO withdrawals with bupe. And these are experts. So,
actual real-world experience is very important.

 

[BlueHues]

What a lot of people don't realize about being addicted to opiates, especially IV heroin
is that whether you go through a hellish week long cold turkey detox(which is how long it takes at a minimum for a serious heroin user), a taper using other opioids or whatever the fuck you're gonna use, you're gonna end up suffering big time! It may not be deadly, but kicking heroin is a fucking ordeal!

The problem is, you could go through the living hell of getting off dope, take time off from work, hide the fact that you're kicking dope from everyone you don't want to know, be awake for basically 8 days straight and THEN....You start using heroin for only a few fucking days and you're back to square one! This is where maintenance drugs come in!

You know there's a good chance you're gonna probably fuck up the detox, so you get on a maintenance drug so that you can mentally prepare yourself to detox and do it at your own pace...It's definitely better to do a quick detox and not many of us want to be on maintenance but with how long we've been getting high and the stress in our lives and our responsibilities, we can't afford to do a fast detox and fail!

A lot of it comes down to money, you can't even imagine the cash a heroin habit eats up until you've lived it...You can throw dollar figures around, but until you actually see that money leave your hand and go into your arm day after day...it's just a horrible feeling! It starts taking you so much to get high, that even if you can get enough money to maintain for 3 days, in reality it's only gonna last you 2 days because you're gonna use enough to get high, not just "stay well"...And your habit goes up! Add a little crack/powder habit on top of the dope, and no matter how much money you get it's never enough to get you through more than 3 days!

I don't care if you're upper-middle class and your Dad owns 5 businesses, unless you have millions in the bank or your family is deaf, dumb and blind you can't scam that amount of money from anyone for very long. And even when you borrow $200 from someone, which is a lot of money to hit most people up for, it only lasts a day and you don't even remember borrowing it...

It just gets to where, no matter who you are, you're risking a prison sentence pretty much every day just to stay well. Whether you're dealing, stealing or even just buying the shit....

Now, you have your world crumbling down around you, you can go detox for 7 days or so and cross your fingers that you'll just live happily ever after, or go on methadone the next day and be able to keep going to work and living your life....once you're in it that deep and your backs up against the wall the maintenance is the best option...It sucks, but tapering people off heroin is a fucking joke that would never work, it would have a failure rate of 99%!

I should just start a thread:

Why don't meth-heads realize their teeth are getting fucked up and just brush them more, or quit doing it? We should just give them Ritalin for 10 days, a tube of toothpaste, some floss and a brush and send them on their way!

 

[BIGsherm7272]

You can't say, I was addicted to a drug therefore I have more knowledge about it, because then your opinion/point may not be free of bias. Doctors know from theory, patients know from practice a patient can't turn around to a doctor and say well because I've been taking drug X therefore I know more then you about drug X therefore you should give me a prescription for drug X. That makes no sense at all. I think many users on here are biased and have no reason to stop doing the drug they are addicted to, and come here and try to romanticize about it, how taken an equally addictive drug helps them function in society. Yes in many cases function enough, to stay off heroin or other opiates until they have enough money to get high off them again. Anyone who is serious about getting off drugs, usually doesn't start taking another drug to come off the first one.

For example, swim's been snorting cocaine for the best part of 3 years now, at least a 1 gram a day or two at minimum. Because swim can afford to do it, swim has a high paying job in banking/trading. swim had to recently, stop taking cocaine because swim was becoming complacent on the drug and doing lines in a fashion which started affecting swim's work ethic and it would have only been a matter of time before swims was caught out snorting a line in his office. But the good thing about cocaine is eventually it starts to give you a paranoid feeling, and that can help you to stop for a few months until your body recovers, this is exactly what swim is doing. In the next month or so swims planning on starting back on cocaine and doing it on a spaceship with his giant panda friend, as usual. If swim had the real intention of stopping, swim would simply not touch the stuff, and tell the spaceship to fly off and get rid of the giant ass panda too.

Simply all drugs are bad if you're doing them for recreational purposes.

Are you seriously comparing a cocaine habit to an opiate habit? This show's you ignorance on the matter. I am on buprenorphine maintenence, and without it I would either be dead or living on the streets. It kills all of my cravings and helps with my pain and depression. I could not live a normal life without it. I plan on staying on it for quite some time.

It is not replacing one addiciton for another, because it is not an addiciton. It is a physical dependence which is completely different from addiction. It allows me to feel normal and not have urges to use while I attend 12-step meetings and try to further better myself and my life. Once I have changed my life and how I am, I will start a slow-taper to get off, and use clonodine and maybe a benzo for a couple weeks when I jump off, and thus avoid a seriouse withdrawal that would make me want to use.

I believe it is a valid opiton for those who's life has become completely unmangeable and insane. It is legal, more easily affordable (if you have insurance, even then generic bupe is only ~$4 per pill), and will save your bodies mental and physical well-being.

 

[RTrain]

I don't even get what the OP is trying to prove at this point. All recreational use of drugs is bad? What is this a DARE class or something. And how on earth there is any relevancy of your weekend cocaine use to the use of methadone for ORT is beyond me.

Its obnoxious to sit there and preach about how methadone is useless and detrimental to its users, with no experience to base it off. Then claim users opinions on it are somehow biased. But I guess your opinion is meaningful - although based upon nothing more than the stigmas of methadone - because you are not biased.

 

[fukme]

It's relatively fast acting, absorbed well orally, is very potent, and long acting. it's a toss up which is the real golden boy of opiates between methadone and buprenorphine. both have their boons

 

[golden goal]

Who would you rather have operate on you? A surgeon who has been practicing and in the business for 20 years... or some guy who just read a lot of books on it yet hasn't ever even held a scalpel..? Whose opinion carries more weight..?

Well, in case of heroin and methadone, the one who made the bad choice is the addict. That's the guy who made bad decisions, possibly out of being misinformed, possibly for a bunch of other reasons.

Wouldn't you rather listen to somebody who has avoided the pitfalls, has made the smart choice of not using?

 

[golden goal]

^^^ obviously, my previous post was meant to provoke.

but, seriously, i gotta question the intelligence of everyone who claims that the value of a post depends on the poster's personal experience. That's absurd. Histories cannot learn anything about the past because they haven't been there? One cannot judge child rapists unless one has abused children? One cannot understand and treat a dangerous infectuous disease unless one has been a victim of it?

EDIT: Suppose to the contrary that the quality of a post was in fact determined by the personal experience level of the poster. Suppose all people with personal experience gave good advice and people with no experience gave bad advice. If that was the case, the forum would be useless for most people that need advice. Why? Because this is the interwebs. The personal experience of the poster is unobservable! Anyone can claim to have personal experience, and it's practically impossible to verify if the claim is true or false.

 

[dopemegently]

Obviously, this is a HR site; there are shit loads of people desperately in need of good information so they can avoid hurting themselves. If somebody posts on BL determined to shoot heroin that is dissolving badly and doesn't look right when it cooks for example, this bloke is in urgent need of harm reduction. Who's gonna give the guy good advice here? A blue lighter with a phd in chemistry, and an expert knowledge of pretty much every drug know to man, but has never actually used heroin? Or is it the long term heroin shooter, who's injected just about every opiate drug in the pharmacopeia? In this case, my money's on the old-school shooter-he would have the better advice in this case. Of course, if somebody posts here and needs a safe way to turn otc codeine pills into morphine without risking a fiery end or a toxic final product, the expert is gonna be the only chance he's got of getting good information. So, IMO it's not an either/or situation: personal experience is just as important as technical expertise, it all depends on context.