Dissociatives The Big & Dandy Eticyclidone / 2‘-Oxo-PCE Thread

[Synthetic_Night]

Hello there, here is my state:
i stopped taking St. Johns Wort since 2 weeks ago.
Now i can take 5-12mg 2-oxo-pce without getting terrible headaches and also the over impulsive reactions are over. Also I am no more in a phase of stress and haste due to my life situation.
The more I get to know this substance, the more I feel it has antidepressant, nootropic and stimulant properties. These are the positive effects. But no positive effect is gifted, so there have to be downsides.
I assume there are some issues with the bladder, but with enough water and healthy food this issue can maybe fixed over the time. I will from now on maybe check more organs with keto-stix or so.


But without other psychoactive substances in my blood and brain I feel less physical downsides. So therefore I will now ask you guys if you have experienced negative effects like addiction, cognitive impairment or even issues with the cardiovascular system. The last time i checked my blood pressure on 2-oxo-pce I had 145/82 with a puls of 62. A little bit high pressure, nothing you want to have constantly, but it has to be considered none the less

 

[StMorningGlory]

I found a mental addiction. No real physical. Some bladder issues.

 

[MSK]

Hello there, here is my state: i stopped taking St. Johns Wort since 2 weeks ago. Now i can take 5-12mg 2-oxo-pce without getting terrible headaches and also the over impulsive reactions are over. Also I am no more in a phase of stress and haste due to my life situation. The more I get to know this substance, the more I feel it has antidepressant, nootropic and stimulant properties. These are the positive effects. But no positive effect is gifted, so there have to be downsides. I assume there are some issues with the bladder, but with enough water and healthy food this issue can maybe fixed over the time. I will from now on maybe check more organs with keto-stix or so. But without other psychoactive substances in my blood and brain I feel less physical downsides. So therefore I will now ask you guys if you have experienced negative effects like addiction, cognitive impairment or even issues with the cardiovascular system. The last time i checked my blood pressure on 2-oxo-pce I had 145/82 with a puls of 62. A little bit high pressure, nothing you want to have constantly, but it has to be considered none the less

Well, addiction depends on the person that takes the drug. For me, nearly all dissociatives are high addictive, while opiates, like high quality heroin HCl like I used to snort in the past, is something I can pass my life without trying ever again. As far as negative effects on the long term, this is a new, unresearched substance. Anybody knows what this can unchain with chronic use. BTW, I was a ketamine/MXE daily user for three years, and now I spare my 3-MeO-PCP and o-PCE usage between 1-2 weeks, and I work as web developer without any problems... I only have good things to say about dissos, they improved my life for a lot better. But probably, in the future, when I'm old, I'll see the damage I made to my body and mind with such irresponsible use in the past. Take care!

 

[Synthetic_Night]

Well, i was using DXM a lot, but this substance is clearly damaging organs over a long period of time. But it also showed me a perspective on life i would never even have seen if i had been sober my whole life. I also have experience with MXE/MXM and now some with 2-oxo-pce. MSK: your information about your long term usage of ketamine/MXE is valuable, i would like to know more details about your prognosis.

And yes, i am absolutely willing to take care of myself, that's why I am asking about the price of this subtances on the body. I have plenty effects on my body and mind, but i would like to know where they are coming from, i would say I had used some substances in the past, there is a very wide palette. Now it is time to differentiate everything and cutting off the bad things like opioids, alcohol and cannabinoids (just for me bad things, maybe someone other has more benefits with those substances).

 

[MSK]

As far as I know my bladder was really damaged with the chronic usage, at my 26 years I go to the bathroom more times than my grandfather, and with some effort. On the mind I feel my memory is fucked up too, but I supose cannabis daily use since teenager affected me more than my disso use on that matter

 

[Synthetic_Night]

Well i am planning to regenerate the memory with Noopept, since it is cleary improving my memory and learning process. But maybe 2-oxo-pce has a higher neuroprotective aspect than MXE, so maybe Noopept is not even necessary. I also will clearly have an eye on the bladder issues, avoiding alcohol and junk food are the first steps to improve the function of mostly organs anyway.

Taking St.Johns Wort and even more the phase after taking it showed me, that substances with an antidepressant effect are useful to lift up my mood and productivity. I am 27 years old and finished my academic studies at an university despite my irregular drug use of nearly every class. I also know that prescripted AD drugs have equivalent pros and cons, maybe even better than some medical doctors since I am pharmacist. But I also have in mind to visit a doctor for documenting my case. I want to thank you guys for information and you will hear from me in the future, when i gathered more information. Stay safe and greetings

 

[StMorningGlory]

When it comes to AD medication, these don't work because over time the feelings change and both Eticyclidone and 3-meo-pcp; and I suspect 3-meo-pce all become more physical and increase the bladder issues very quickly. I also visit the bathroom frequently but I can manage that.

I also notice a lot of heart issues but I have preexisting conditions from my MDPV and MXE addictions. They have increased a lot since using Eticyclidone to the point that I can't take 4-aco-DMT with it because my heart rate goes down to about 44 bpm at its lowest, which just doesn't feel good on the body.

 

[Hexagon Sun]

I would say the stronger and longer lived the compound, the lighter in the bladder. So K and Fluoro K should be the most damaging, while 3-meos the less. MXE and OPCE would be in a medium to low damaging range.

That would be if all they produce toxic metabolites for the bladder, which only are confirmed, as far as I know, in Ket

 

[derpstuff]

This is a really powerful substance that should be treated with utmost respect and care. I am still feeling some after-effects about 10 hours after my last dose. As of right now I am sitting at work, comfortably typing and capable of speaking pretty clearly, although I know I am still impaired.
This was my second experiment with 2'-OXO-PCE, the first one took place about 7 days ago with a mild trial at around 10-15mg total oral in three separate doses over the course of 2 hours. That evening went by without any problems, and I had noted that this compound seemed to be a worthy NMDA antagonist, from it's effects at very low dosage considering my tolerance.

In 2014 I abused MXE fairly heavily, and before that I used to abuse DXM syrups almost daily, hence I am quite cozy in dissociated headspaces and the motor impairment is no surprise to me. In my time of MXE abuse, there were a few events where I would blackout after a large IM dose, ususally over 120mg. The usual reaction, as noted by those who were around me at the time, was that I was completely unresponsive, had elevated heart rate and tense muscles, severe motor discoordination etc. I had a similar event this night after a final redose of 35mg in my left thigh. Here goes:

4:30PM First dose, about 10mg insufflated. No burn, slight chemical sensation and taste but nothing uncomfortable. Felt an alert around 15 minutes in and the effects started to manifest at 20-25 minutes mark. Slight agitation and mild signs of impending mania, I am feeling very good at this moment because it reminds me of "the good ol' days", that feeling I once had when abusing MXE and feeling confortably out of it, having fun without a care in the world.

5:30PM insufflate about 5-8mg more. I was anxious to get the trip going on but surprisingly I was able to hold out for a good hour while I was waiting to get some sterile injection supplies. I spent some time chatting with my mother, quietly enjoying the feeling in the background while my behaviour wasn't yet completely out of whack.

7PM First IM dose, I decide that I can definitely go for 15mg IM, seeing that 15mg oral did very little but wet my palate. Excellent call, this dose and ROA is everything I'm looking for. Clean dissociation, my mind is stimulated and my body slightly disconnected, this reminds me of IM MXE, to be quite honest, but it was different in some respects.

First off, it is much more potent than MXE. Also I did feel much crazier while I was on 2'-OXO-PCE, my train of thought was pure confusion and mania, and I must admit that I enjoy that.
So throughout the night I had a few more IM shots, always around 20mg; When the plateau was beginning to shoot back down, I would kick it back up again. I had a friend come over a bit later, he understood I was fucked up but I could still manage to hold some kind of conversation, nothing very deep but I could still speak to human beings. Nothing much to say here, I absolutely enjoyed that compound, perhaps even more so than I used to love MXE.

And naturally, it pretty much always ends up like that with me, once I've had a few doses, I usually feel up for a stronger shot, just to get a good feel of the raw power of the molecule I'm experiencing. I couldn't tell you what time it was exactly when I shot up, but I did take my time and make an amusing ritual out of it, giving absolutely no thought to the work day I would have to endure afterwards.

The shot was about 38mg, injected in my left thigh. I remember completing the injection and disposing of the equipment, but afterwards there is a void in my memory. I was sitting at my computer table, watching a video and probably listening to music. The next thing I remember is my sister and mother helping me get up and giving me some breakfast food, since it was now around 7AM.

My mother told me she was awoken by my screaming, and she found me face up against wall, loudly moaning uncomprehensibly against it for no apparent reason. My computer space was wrecked, there was pieces of glass on the floor and all sorts of stuff just laying around in a total mess. I spent some of the morning cleaning that up and sobering up before work.
I can only guess that I tried to get up and with the utter lack of motor control I must have ended up falling against the table, smashing everything in the process.
I can say that I have been shown that lesson more than once, hopefully this time I can learn from it. Stay safe, guys and gals. Be very careful with this one.

 

[InterestingFACT]

When it comes to AD medication, these don't work because over time the feelings change and both Eticyclidone and 3-meo-pcp; and I suspect 3-meo-pce all become more physical and increase the bladder issues very quickly. I also visit the bathroom frequently but I can manage that.

I also notice a lot of heart issues but I have preexisting conditions from my MDPV and MXE addictions. They have increased a lot since using Eticyclidone to the point that I can't take 4-aco-DMT with it because my heart rate goes down to about 44 bpm at its lowest, which just doesn't feel good on the body.

For what it's worth, I notice significant cardiorespiratory depression from 4-aco-dmt by itself. So much so that I've generally come to feel uncomfortable combining it with sedatives. Are you sure that what you're noticing is a reaction to the combination of this drug with 4-aco-dmt, and not something that just happens typically for you on 4-aco-dmt (but without you noticing)?

 

[StMorningGlory]

I check my heart rate frequently, I generally get the depression down to about 60bpm from an average 70-75bpm or an upping to 90bpm with 4-aco-DMT by itself. 44bpm is much lower than that, to the point of feeling changes. My O2 levels where 96% from a normal 98%. Again, that's a couple times out of the roughly 55 different days (usually with multiple doses in a day) I've taken it. I wouldn't worry TOO much, but something to take into consideration for those thinking of a combo with benzos or opioids.

 

[InterestingFACT]

Definitely good information to have on record. Thanks for that.

Hmm.

O-PCE does look an awful lot like pethidine or ketobemidone or prodine. I haven't kept much track of reports from this substance, has anyone speculated opioid activity? I would be very willing to believe such a claim--especially at the relatively high doses people are using this drug at.

That would also explain why people are saying the drug is unusual suited for "holing" on, and that it's better at higher (ie. above threshold for subjective opioid activity) rather than lower (ie. subthreshold) doses.

My suspicion is that the N-ethyl chain plus the ketone make a decent enough approximation of the ethyl carboxylate chain on pethidine. Meanwhile, loss of that ethyl chains abolishes affinity (see norpethidine, norketamine), and 3-methoxylation a la MXE likely abolished affinity for the most part as well.

If this is true, then this is one to play with *very* carefully.

 

[Ziiirp]

You mean because of the possible respiratory depression ?

First off, I just wanted to say,the DPT/Eticyclidone combo was a failure. Heart rate around 112-123bpm. I mean, it was enjoyable..... just lackluster. Not what I had expected.

Ziiirp, I am just saying.... it kind of sounds like you dislike the class of drug.

Which dissociatives do you enjoy?

Ketamine and PCP both impair you physically quite strongly. These analogs are all relatively light compared to those two, but maybe the diphenidine/Ephenidine types might be more your style.

In my opinion, anything that impairs you mentally enough to be euphoric or insightful with dissociatives, you would also have severe motor impairment.

I would not say, that I dislike dissos generally, in fact I see great potential for all I've tried as emotional catalysts. 3-MeO-PCP is an incredible functional enhancer for creative processing. Rational thinking and learning abilities might be slightly impaired (didn't try much formal thinking on it), but there was felt a profound connection to some inner eternal truths and the fearlessness and enhanced compassion in morbid reflections/conversations can be useful in evaluating socially evoked superficial relationships towards the concepts of life and death. That is also the reason I did not try higher doses, because this clinical morbidity is nothing to fuck with.
MXP on the other hand was less functional and much more emotional/melancholic for me. It is very good for cleansing yourself of emotional tension. For me it was the best "crying"-inducer, because the tears felt natural and not forced, opposed to sad episodes in 5ht2a-trips, which I did not like.

3-MeO-PCE is good, but a bit too serotonergic for my taste. Reminds me of 4-HO-MET (without visuals).

On the other hand I never tried high doses of any disso. So I could not experience the full mind altering potential (holing). If O-PCE only is useful for holing, then it may be not for me, that is correct.

With all dissos despite (insufflated) O-PCE the mental state could be altered, before the physical sluggishness was predominating.

 

[StMorningGlory]

Now that I've gotten over my infatuation with Eticyclidone, I must say that from the way this chemical acts: this is a gem of a chemical.

I really enjoyed it. I also feel, unlike ketamine, that it's more of an escape or social lubricant on par with alcohol. Just in a different fashion.

I find 10-15mg oral solution to be about the same as waking up "happy drunk".

Don't get me wrong, I've had amazing experiences at the higher doses but it's like taking a electric cattle prod to the brain.

When mixed 3-meo-pce, I found to be highly euphoric.

Ziiirp, I'm sorry for calling you out. I hadn't meant to but I did. I apologize.

 

[Solipsis]

I'm pretty confused about the different reactions. Some people make it out to be pretty great, but others seem to strongly warn about it.

Considering I can't weigh it properly for a little while (though volumetric measurement is an option), I decided to skip my order for the time being since I really don't want to risk dangerous trips.
I do have experience in the past with schizo MXE breaks on very high doses, but am not looking for those anymore. On the other hand I have always been able to use 3-MeO-PCP safely, without hazarding into higher doses where people get severely lost... so I'm gonna return to that for now ... volumetric it is - and I'll be going on my extensive experience with it, I have even taken it supplementally and frequently eyeballed ~3 mg without fail. However I must say that I will never take any disso supplementally like that again, and should definitely report it in the 3-MeO-PCP thread because I believe it really dumbs you down + is possibly just not helpful as AD in the long run + it seems to cause something like atrophy.

But doing 3-MeO-PCP occasionally again will be a welcome resort.

Maybe will consider 3-MeO-PCE in the future, which I have *some* experience with but found to be both manic and on the comedown scattering and disturbing..
I wish 2-F-DCK and 2-TFM-DCK werent so expensive / unavailable, cause I miss K and 2-F was quite like it.

Is O-PCE really doable to use with moderation like I am able to use 3-MeO-PCP to just fade away nicely? Losing motor control and K-like trippiness wouldn't bother me, but I am very wary of having to 'titrate' and discover unwanted schizo-ness, or that beastliness you guys are reporting.

 

[crOOk]

I'm pretty confused about the different reactions. Some people make it out to be pretty great, but others seem to strongly warn about it.

Considering I can't weigh it properly for a little while (though volumetric measurement is an option), I decided to skip my order for the time being since I really don't want to risk dangerous trips.
I do have experience in the past with schizo MXE breaks on very high doses, but am not looking for those anymore. On the other hand I have always been able to use 3-MeO-PCP safely, without hazarding into higher doses where people get severely lost... so I'm gonna return to that for now ... volumetric it is - and I'll be going on my extensive experience with it, I have even taken it supplementally and frequently eyeballed ~3 mg without fail. However I must say that I will never take any disso supplementally like that again, and should definitely report it in the 3-MeO-PCP thread because I believe it really dumbs you down + is possibly just not helpful as AD in the long run + it seems to cause something like atrophy.

But doing 3-MeO-PCP occasionally again will be a welcome resort.

Maybe will consider 3-MeO-PCE in the future, which I have *some* experience with but found to be both manic and on the comedown scattering and disturbing..
I wish 2-F-DCK and 2-TFM-DCK werent so expensive / unavailable, cause I miss K and 2-F was quite like it.

Is O-PCE really doable to use with moderation like I am able to use 3-MeO-PCP to just fade away nicely? Losing motor control and K-like trippiness wouldn't bother me, but I am very wary of having to 'titrate' and discover unwanted schizo-ness, or that beastliness you guys are reporting.

See, that is whyy pcp isn't as big as ketamine these days. a lot of people just don't dig it. Me, I do, oh how I do. :D

Regarding our question, I used it IM on my first trial and while 32mg was a good dose, another 20 or 25mg two hours later knocked me the fuck out for eight hours straight. I literally sunk to my knees on my way to the bed. I could not form new memories for hours after I was able to talk again. I have taken a lot of dissociatives in my life and this has never happened before, not even with pcp where I felt the dose response curve was more linear.

 

[Solipsis]

Actually I am still sorta surprised that I always have such good self control with 3-MeO-PCP, maybe it's because with K and MXE, I feel like you can get away with abusing them, even if with MXE you can still completely lose the plot, and that's why eventually I often did. But with 3-MeO-PCP and also diphenidine type stuff (but I almost haven't explored them), the reports of people having horrible things happening works so well as a warning that I make damn sure that I stay well on the right side of the police tape so to speak.
Who knows, maybe that means that the same translates to O-PCE, and taking enough care would allow me to take it safely, but for now I'm not taking that chance. The phrase 'most abusable of all' doesn't make me exactly comfortable regarding that.
OTOH, its not like 3-MeO-PCP or 3-MeO-PCE have such a huge therapeutic index either, and you almost doubled your dose... So, I'm sure you are very well versed in these, but you also seem like you love to take it very far, or compulsively do even. Anyway just thinking out loud, trying to answer whether the therapeutic index of O-PCE is doable to tackle without trial and major error.

There are some things that after years I have a hard time learning, and finding out the hard way each time. But fully realizing that with some dissociatives, especially the lipophilic stacking ones, at some point you've just had enough if you don't want accidents even if you are not really satisfied, that fortunately I learned without having to go through a trainwreck myself.
Fortunately, cause it wouldn't exactly have been a huge surprise if I was one of you wrecked guys, think of all the accidents these last years. I mean bladder damage isn't pretty either but banning dissociatives apparently only made people resort to ever more fantastical but hardcore disso's... Maybe the direct ketamine analogues of most recent will be kind of a nice welcome back. Not great for bladders everywhere, but maybe better for the psycho episodes.

 

[MSK]

See, that is whyy pcp isn't as big as ketamine these days. a lot of people just don't dig it. Me, I do, oh how I do.

Regarding our question, I used it IM on my first trial and while 32mg was a good dose, another 20 or 25mg two hours later knocked me the fuck out for eight hours straight. I literally sunk to my knees on my way to the bed. I could not form new memories for hours after I was able to talk again. I have taken a lot of dissociatives in my life and this has never happened before, not even with pcp where I felt the dose response curve was more linear.

Better that way... Only we, the chosen ones, seems to be able to enjoy and be buying them. We seem also to be pretty well formed on harm reducion and with a lot of experience in drug culture and polidrug use in general. That's why I wish those ones don't get popular between the masses and all those teenagers that are making that UK is making a ban now that will probably mean the dissapearence in the future of -phenidine compounds on the market, and that already helped to the making of the last chinese ban that fucked all us up with MXE. So, please, people. Don't take this ones. They're really shitty substances, they don't deserve to be consumed. Just stick to your fucking cheap phenidines kiddos, and don't lead the goverment attention to 3-MeO-PCP, 3-MeO-PCE, 2-OxO-PCE, 2-OxO-PCM, and much more to came (I hope!)

 

[StMorningGlory]

Better that way... So, please, people. Don't take this ones. They're really shitty substances, they don't deserve to be consumed. Just stick to your fucking cheap phenidines kiddos, and don't lead the goverment attention to 3-MeO-PCP, 3-MeO-PCE, 2-OxO-PCE, 2-OxO-PCM, and much more to came (I hope!)

I could see medical value in 3-MeO-PCP (possibly the -PCE too) so MAYBE the government could look at those but I really love your idea. I should stop saying this is any good...

I actually found this one somewhat easy to not go TOO overboard on once I got a feel for dosing, but I feel like you do need to find a sweet spot on this one. Not one I would suggest jumping into, even for the hardheaded. (Compared to MXE and Ketamine; and street PCP which I haven't done in a bit now)

Has anyone found any actual data on any possible serotonin (or other) changes? I am curious as I saw what the difference in serotonin did to 3-MeO-PCE and 3-MeO-PCP. Just interested in the comparison and didn't see it on the chart in the other thread.

 

[MSK]

I could see medical value in 3-MeO-PCP (possibly the -PCE too) so MAYBE the government could look at those but I really love your idea. I should stop saying this is any good...

I actually found this one somewhat easy to not go TOO overboard on once I got a feel for dosing, but I feel like you do need to find a sweet spot on this one. Not one I would suggest jumping into, even for the hardheaded. (Compared to MXE and Ketamine; and street PCP which I haven't done in a bit now)

Has anyone found any actual data on any possible serotonin (or other) changes? I am curious as I saw what the difference in serotonin did to 3-MeO-PCE and 3-MeO-PCP. Just interested in the comparison and didn't see it on the chart in the other thread.

Oh boy, the original PCP... Chasing it for years, never found it. This week I managed to find on the deep web and as I was skeptic as fuck I sent to analyze and it was 3-MeO-PCP... It could be worst, 3-MeO-PCP is a welcome, thought I paid it a bit more than usual from it thinking I was buying PCP