Ethnobotanicals The Big & Dandy Datura Thread
- Thread starter lsdod
- Start date
I'm actually wondering now...if someday I would like to do it...just to see if it's possible to remember it...and learn something from it along the same lines as LSD, but maybe much more hardcore knowledge.
I dunno, I'm definitely not even considering it right now. Maybe a couple years down the road when I am over things like LSD...and adjusted better spiritually, or whatever you wanna call it.
Anyone have any thoughts like this?
Also, I don't place any distinction between drugs and poisons. Drugs are just poisons that have a really high LD50.
I've always wondered what kind of hallucinations or amazing insights you would get if you took a lethal dose of some slow-acting poison or something.
*shrugs*
But yea, it kinda turns me off, cause almost all of the reports I've read on erowid result in ER visits and lack of vision for several days. Which leads me to believe that it can't be very good for ya...![:\](https://bluelight.org/xf/BL_Images/Orig_Emoji/wrygrin.gif "wry grin :\")
I dunno, I'm definitely not even considering it right now. Maybe a couple years down the road when I am over things like LSD...and adjusted better spiritually, or whatever you wanna call it.
Anyone have any thoughts like this?
Also, I don't place any distinction between drugs and poisons. Drugs are just poisons that have a really high LD50.
I've always wondered what kind of hallucinations or amazing insights you would get if you took a lethal dose of some slow-acting poison or something.
*shrugs*
But yea, it kinda turns me off, cause almost all of the reports I've read on erowid result in ER visits and lack of vision for several days. Which leads me to believe that it can't be very good for ya...
-=ReD-hAzE=-
Bluelighter
If you want to sample the dileriants, eat 300mg of Benadryl. Which is the daily limit for a 24 hour period.
Psilo707
Bluelight Crew
Datura is the drug in which I most want to do but at the same time, will still never touch it... ever.
It amuses me so much how a plant can make us go totally insane like that. I just HAVE to know what it feels like/if I really do lose all control.
Are there any studies that show what it's doing to the brain during that time?
It amuses me so much how a plant can make us go totally insane like that. I just HAVE to know what it feels like/if I really do lose all control.
Are there any studies that show what it's doing to the brain during that time?
VictorBorge
Bluelighter
^^ I feel exactly the same.
TO RESPONSIBLE PEOPLE ONLY.
So, here is some info about datura use (Datura spp.)
Note that it's exactly the same thing for any solanaceae plant as Atropa Belladonna aka Belladonna, Mandragora Officinarum aka mandrake, Hyoscyamus Niger aka henbane, Brugmansia spp. aka tree datura...I mean same risks, same effects (exepting that belladonna and mandrake are the most toxic ones: they have also been used as deadly poisons to kill people), same preparation (not tea!! make an ointment!), same advice about increasing dose progressively...the same.
MOST USED SPECIES OF DATURA:
Datura Inoxia (also called Datura Meteloides):
this is the one mexico shamans use for visionnary purposes, probably the best specie to be used
Datura Metel (also called Datura Fastuosa):
another specie used by shamans
Datura Strammonium:
said to be more toxic than the two other species, it's the one that was used by european middle age witches
Note that there are many other species of datura but these are the most famous one (and "tree datura" is refering to another specie of solanaceae plant: Brugmansia spp.)
HOW TO USE DATURA:
Datura ?
Well, I believe all of you are responsible people. So I know all of you
have been making lots of researches (on bluelight AND erowid.org) before even thinking about using such a dangerous (who did say poisonous ?) drug.
So, I would say that any of you who would think about using datura is aware of this:
Datura potency vary greatly from one plant to another (including between two plants of the same strain)...
MUCH better using the seeds since their potency vary much less than leaves & flowers (wich potency may vary greatly from one to another)
This doesn't mean seeds aren't dangerous. They are.
Note that roots portency also doesn't vary much so it's ok too.
BUT (!!) as someone previously said that
" the root has an adittional additional alkaloid, apoatropine, which is extremely toxic, and likely to prove lethal even when taken in very small amounts, and by small amounts, we are talking 0.5-1mg or so"
then I guess that for belladonna you should REALLY avoid using the roots (I think that considering this, if you're not stupid, you won't use the belladonna root).
Datura dosages often vary greatly from an individual to another.
Some would get complete delirium with 30 seeds, other would need as much as 200 (!!). So if one would need 30 but use 200 as a friend who used 200 successfully told him to do he would just overdose...death can occur in two ways with datura: from cardiovascular troubles (greatly increased heart rate, up to 150bpm, and severe hypertension) leading to haemorrhage, heart failure... OR from overheating up to 42-43°C !
You'll HAVE TO start with low dose (20-30) and work your way up progressively until you find your OWN dose (for me it's around 100 seeds with datura strammonium, the only specie I've tried)
Smoking leaves/flowers is said to be the safest way to use datura but I tried to smoke datura stramonium leaves, flowers and seeds with NO results. Just a very slight high feeling. Maybe this could work if your plant is very concentrated but I doubt it would give any hallucinations, I think at most would you get a high and weird feelings.
So here is how to get hallucinations:
The WRONG & most dangerous way to use Datura (& other solanaceae) is to take them orally (eating the seeds or making a tea)... hospitalisations and death have often happened with oral use.
The ONLY "SAFE" (note the " ") way has to be the way people who used datura for thousand years have choosen:
Shamans & european witches believe the good way to be transdermal use in the form of an ointment wich is spread over specific parts of the body.
The wise guy knows the only way to choose to be the shaman's way (not
the "people on the internet" or "friend of mine" way)
Yess, shamans & witches know what they are doing.
Datura has two active principles. One is "good" for tripping. The other is not. The good one can pass through the skin. The bad one can't. So using datura transdermally is the way to keep the bad one out of you're body (that sounds great because you don't want this one to be in your system)
Don't ask me how could shamans be aware of this, centuries ago...
Ow! People on the internet claim they have been using a tea successfully ? Congratulations ! (note that some didn't had any congratulations for their tea because they are no more here to tell anyone about their own tea-death story )
Fun, isn't it ?
So don't listen to internet people saying stupid things like "make a tea, drink it, that's a great high, it worked for me"...because it was fatal to many.
SO, I hope nobody is fool enough to use datura orally when they know it's not good for them
...& here is the ointment recipe (so nobody has any excuse for not doing it):
-Crush the datura seeds in a fine powder.
-Place the powdered seeds in some lard (= pork fat).
-Add some organic soot (how to make it: see below).
-Blend well.
-Cook over a gentle heat (below 100 °C) for 2-4 hours while stiring regularly.
-Let sit for a week (at least) in a dark place, stir regularly (several times a day).
-Filter (see the note below).
-Keep the fatty ointment in a sealed glass jar, in a dark & cool place.
Note: you'd better handle the ointment wearing gloves (since the ointment is absorbed through the skin).
How to make organic soot ? Just place some lard in some aluminium foil to make a foil parcel. Place it in the ambers until the lard is completely grilled (you should obtain some black organic soot).
How to use the ointment:
Witches used to spread it...
-over their temples
-under their armpits
-over their vagina
-just behind their ears
-over their neck
-over the interior part of their forearm
-over the left part of their stomach
-over their calves
-and under their sole (of the feet).
NEVER spread any on your forehead (risk of death).
I would suggest starting with only the temples & armpits (very suitable areas for transdermal absorption).
Note that the calves & sole are for producing a feeling of flight (I don't know about other areas specificties).
NOTE (!!) that there is a more elaborated preparation (and probably SAFER) for the ointment explained in castaneda's books (in "The Teachings of don Juan" or "A Separate Reality", I don't remember which one exactly)...
I never tried any ointment myself: I only tried 60 seeds orally, and as it didn't produce any hallucinations and was so damn unpleasant, then I just stopped experimenting with it, but many reliable books about shamanism and entheogens I read do claim that making an ointment is the safest way to go if one would want to get hallucinations from solanaceae plants, and they say that oral use is just too risky (the ointment is the shaman & witches method so I just trust it).
Always keep in mind that there is no "safe" datura trip. This is a VERY dangerous drug. Be careful.
HAVE a trip-sitter !!! (you won't be able to control yourself)
WHY IS THERE SO BIG NOISE ABOUT DATURA USE ?
1)because the effect is more like toxik than hallucinogen, it's not much enjoyable (you feel sick, no ophoria effect at all, you vomit, your eyes can't see clear so you can't read anything even if it's writen in big letters, your mouth is completely dry, so you drink a lot but you can't piss anymore, your body temperature rise and you may get feverish (!), so does your blood pressure, your heart rythm become faster, your in complete delirium so you don't understand anything of what's happening around you, you don't realize that your hallucinations aren't real so you don't even have fun hallucinating because you don't know you are, and you almost don't remember your night on the next day,
the only "fun" thing is that later on you can remember "well last night I was really fucked up and I had real hallucinations, I don't remember much of all this, I didn't have fun doing this, but now it's really fun to think about how fucked up I was".
Also unpleasant because the delirium state can last for 3 days (yess with dry mouth and inability to piss...) and then there is an additional period of 3days-1 week you cannot see clear (you can't read) because your eyes are still fucked up.
Note that regular use both fuck up your mental and your body (serious consequences!)...and by the way, there have been a few people who stayed stuck into their trip for month after one single use.
My point is that datura isn't for fun, it has nothing to do with a recreational drug, the only use of interest could be visionary shamanic practices, and even in this case I would rather take something else (shrooms, peyote, salvia are both much more fun and much more safe than datura)
2) because there have been GREAT amount of death with this plant for many reasons:
-dosages can vary greatly from one people to another . for instance, one would need 30 seeds to hallucinate while another would need around 150-200 ! if someone (who would need no more than 30) had no experience with datura and was told by a friend (who successfully used 200) that 200 is the right dose, he may probably die (overdose from heart attack or overheating)
You have to start with low dose (30 seeds at first) and increase progressively (wait 3 days between each trials).
-plant potency can vary greatly from one plant to another, depending on the growing location, the subspecies, the harvesting period...for instance, green fruits of solanaceaes are said to be much much more potent than mature fruits... (so even if you know your dose with one plant you've tried, it can be different with another one)
-different parts of one single plant can have very different potency. Better use seeds because their potency doesn't vary much.
-because people don't know that shamans and witches who used datura for centuries all used to take datura transdermally (absorption through the skin in form of a fat cream) and almost never used it orally
Why? because there are two different active drugs in datura : atropine wich is very toxik and a little hallucinogenic, and scopolamine wich is very hallucinogenic and less toxic than atropine. So the one you want is scopolamine only. The problem is that if you use datura orally, you get both in your body, unless you use it transdermally because only scopolamine can pass through the skin (atropine will stay out of your body this way).
-because people are so delirious that they kill themselves making stupid things (like swimming in such a delirious state, or passing through a window...)
-because people arent' aware of drug interactions and contraindications:
you must never use datra if any cardiovascular troubles, if glaucoma, if on antidepressants.
you must never mix datura with any medecine or drugs (even weed is said to be a bad idea !) because this could rise your blood pressure so hard that you would die.
-also note that doing any physically exhausting activity (such as dancing at a rave) can be dangerous on datura (risk of rise in cardiac rythm(& blood pressure) or rise in body temperature wich are both already much higher than normal when you're on datura)
So : read ALL informations on bluelight.ru AND erowid.org before considering about trying such a dangerous toxic plant!!!
So, here is some info about datura use (Datura spp.)
Note that it's exactly the same thing for any solanaceae plant as Atropa Belladonna aka Belladonna, Mandragora Officinarum aka mandrake, Hyoscyamus Niger aka henbane, Brugmansia spp. aka tree datura...I mean same risks, same effects (exepting that belladonna and mandrake are the most toxic ones: they have also been used as deadly poisons to kill people), same preparation (not tea!! make an ointment!), same advice about increasing dose progressively...the same.
MOST USED SPECIES OF DATURA:
Datura Inoxia (also called Datura Meteloides):
this is the one mexico shamans use for visionnary purposes, probably the best specie to be used
Datura Metel (also called Datura Fastuosa):
another specie used by shamans
Datura Strammonium:
said to be more toxic than the two other species, it's the one that was used by european middle age witches
Note that there are many other species of datura but these are the most famous one (and "tree datura" is refering to another specie of solanaceae plant: Brugmansia spp.)
HOW TO USE DATURA:
Datura ?
Well, I believe all of you are responsible people. So I know all of you
have been making lots of researches (on bluelight AND erowid.org) before even thinking about using such a dangerous (who did say poisonous ?) drug.
So, I would say that any of you who would think about using datura is aware of this:
Datura potency vary greatly from one plant to another (including between two plants of the same strain)...
MUCH better using the seeds since their potency vary much less than leaves & flowers (wich potency may vary greatly from one to another)
This doesn't mean seeds aren't dangerous. They are.
Note that roots portency also doesn't vary much so it's ok too.
BUT (!!) as someone previously said that
" the root has an adittional additional alkaloid, apoatropine, which is extremely toxic, and likely to prove lethal even when taken in very small amounts, and by small amounts, we are talking 0.5-1mg or so"
then I guess that for belladonna you should REALLY avoid using the roots (I think that considering this, if you're not stupid, you won't use the belladonna root).
Datura dosages often vary greatly from an individual to another.
Some would get complete delirium with 30 seeds, other would need as much as 200 (!!). So if one would need 30 but use 200 as a friend who used 200 successfully told him to do he would just overdose...death can occur in two ways with datura: from cardiovascular troubles (greatly increased heart rate, up to 150bpm, and severe hypertension) leading to haemorrhage, heart failure... OR from overheating up to 42-43°C !
You'll HAVE TO start with low dose (20-30) and work your way up progressively until you find your OWN dose (for me it's around 100 seeds with datura strammonium, the only specie I've tried)
Smoking leaves/flowers is said to be the safest way to use datura but I tried to smoke datura stramonium leaves, flowers and seeds with NO results. Just a very slight high feeling. Maybe this could work if your plant is very concentrated but I doubt it would give any hallucinations, I think at most would you get a high and weird feelings.
So here is how to get hallucinations:
The WRONG & most dangerous way to use Datura (& other solanaceae) is to take them orally (eating the seeds or making a tea)... hospitalisations and death have often happened with oral use.
The ONLY "SAFE" (note the " ") way has to be the way people who used datura for thousand years have choosen:
Shamans & european witches believe the good way to be transdermal use in the form of an ointment wich is spread over specific parts of the body.
The wise guy knows the only way to choose to be the shaman's way (not
the "people on the internet" or "friend of mine" way)
Yess, shamans & witches know what they are doing.
Datura has two active principles. One is "good" for tripping. The other is not. The good one can pass through the skin. The bad one can't. So using datura transdermally is the way to keep the bad one out of you're body (that sounds great because you don't want this one to be in your system)
Don't ask me how could shamans be aware of this, centuries ago...
Ow! People on the internet claim they have been using a tea successfully ? Congratulations ! (note that some didn't had any congratulations for their tea because they are no more here to tell anyone about their own tea-death story )
Fun, isn't it ?
So don't listen to internet people saying stupid things like "make a tea, drink it, that's a great high, it worked for me"...because it was fatal to many.
SO, I hope nobody is fool enough to use datura orally when they know it's not good for them
...& here is the ointment recipe (so nobody has any excuse for not doing it):
-Crush the datura seeds in a fine powder.
-Place the powdered seeds in some lard (= pork fat).
-Add some organic soot (how to make it: see below).
-Blend well.
-Cook over a gentle heat (below 100 °C) for 2-4 hours while stiring regularly.
-Let sit for a week (at least) in a dark place, stir regularly (several times a day).
-Filter (see the note below).
-Keep the fatty ointment in a sealed glass jar, in a dark & cool place.
Note: you'd better handle the ointment wearing gloves (since the ointment is absorbed through the skin).
How to make organic soot ? Just place some lard in some aluminium foil to make a foil parcel. Place it in the ambers until the lard is completely grilled (you should obtain some black organic soot).
How to use the ointment:
Witches used to spread it...
-over their temples
-under their armpits
-over their vagina
-just behind their ears
-over their neck
-over the interior part of their forearm
-over the left part of their stomach
-over their calves
-and under their sole (of the feet).
NEVER spread any on your forehead (risk of death).
I would suggest starting with only the temples & armpits (very suitable areas for transdermal absorption).
Note that the calves & sole are for producing a feeling of flight (I don't know about other areas specificties).
NOTE (!!) that there is a more elaborated preparation (and probably SAFER) for the ointment explained in castaneda's books (in "The Teachings of don Juan" or "A Separate Reality", I don't remember which one exactly)...
I never tried any ointment myself: I only tried 60 seeds orally, and as it didn't produce any hallucinations and was so damn unpleasant, then I just stopped experimenting with it, but many reliable books about shamanism and entheogens I read do claim that making an ointment is the safest way to go if one would want to get hallucinations from solanaceae plants, and they say that oral use is just too risky (the ointment is the shaman & witches method so I just trust it).
Always keep in mind that there is no "safe" datura trip. This is a VERY dangerous drug. Be careful.
HAVE a trip-sitter !!! (you won't be able to control yourself)
WHY IS THERE SO BIG NOISE ABOUT DATURA USE ?
1)because the effect is more like toxik than hallucinogen, it's not much enjoyable (you feel sick, no ophoria effect at all, you vomit, your eyes can't see clear so you can't read anything even if it's writen in big letters, your mouth is completely dry, so you drink a lot but you can't piss anymore, your body temperature rise and you may get feverish (!), so does your blood pressure, your heart rythm become faster, your in complete delirium so you don't understand anything of what's happening around you, you don't realize that your hallucinations aren't real so you don't even have fun hallucinating because you don't know you are, and you almost don't remember your night on the next day,
the only "fun" thing is that later on you can remember "well last night I was really fucked up and I had real hallucinations, I don't remember much of all this, I didn't have fun doing this, but now it's really fun to think about how fucked up I was".
Also unpleasant because the delirium state can last for 3 days (yess with dry mouth and inability to piss...) and then there is an additional period of 3days-1 week you cannot see clear (you can't read) because your eyes are still fucked up.
Note that regular use both fuck up your mental and your body (serious consequences!)...and by the way, there have been a few people who stayed stuck into their trip for month after one single use.
My point is that datura isn't for fun, it has nothing to do with a recreational drug, the only use of interest could be visionary shamanic practices, and even in this case I would rather take something else (shrooms, peyote, salvia are both much more fun and much more safe than datura)
2) because there have been GREAT amount of death with this plant for many reasons:
-dosages can vary greatly from one people to another . for instance, one would need 30 seeds to hallucinate while another would need around 150-200 ! if someone (who would need no more than 30) had no experience with datura and was told by a friend (who successfully used 200) that 200 is the right dose, he may probably die (overdose from heart attack or overheating)
You have to start with low dose (30 seeds at first) and increase progressively (wait 3 days between each trials).
-plant potency can vary greatly from one plant to another, depending on the growing location, the subspecies, the harvesting period...for instance, green fruits of solanaceaes are said to be much much more potent than mature fruits... (so even if you know your dose with one plant you've tried, it can be different with another one)
-different parts of one single plant can have very different potency. Better use seeds because their potency doesn't vary much.
-because people don't know that shamans and witches who used datura for centuries all used to take datura transdermally (absorption through the skin in form of a fat cream) and almost never used it orally
Why? because there are two different active drugs in datura : atropine wich is very toxik and a little hallucinogenic, and scopolamine wich is very hallucinogenic and less toxic than atropine. So the one you want is scopolamine only. The problem is that if you use datura orally, you get both in your body, unless you use it transdermally because only scopolamine can pass through the skin (atropine will stay out of your body this way).
-because people are so delirious that they kill themselves making stupid things (like swimming in such a delirious state, or passing through a window...)
-because people arent' aware of drug interactions and contraindications:
you must never use datra if any cardiovascular troubles, if glaucoma, if on antidepressants.
you must never mix datura with any medecine or drugs (even weed is said to be a bad idea !) because this could rise your blood pressure so hard that you would die.
-also note that doing any physically exhausting activity (such as dancing at a rave) can be dangerous on datura (risk of rise in cardiac rythm(& blood pressure) or rise in body temperature wich are both already much higher than normal when you're on datura)
So : read ALL informations on bluelight.ru AND erowid.org before considering about trying such a dangerous toxic plant!!!
Last edited:
psych@delic
Ex-Bluelighter
^^^
people should just extract the shit.
just soak in ethanol, fliter and evaporate, then u can actually dose the shits right
people should just extract the shit.
just soak in ethanol, fliter and evaporate, then u can actually dose the shits right
EnthusiOrgasm
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Sep 6, 2003
- Messages
- 40
Don't use datura please
sk8punk151
Bluelighter
I did datura once a while ago.. I ate 10 seeds from a seed pod.. Nothing happened.. All I got was horrible side effects.. Every HOLE in my body was dryer than a fucking desert. And towards 6 hours after eating it I started to hear voices, but for the most part I got nothing out of it..
STICK TO LSD AND SHROOMS! :D
STICK TO LSD AND SHROOMS! :D
Jamshyd
Bluelight Crew
Datura and Atropa contain Hyoscyamine, Scopolamine and Atropine. Datura has more of the first two and Atropa has a lot more Atropine. It is generally regarded that Atropine is nastier than the other two (thus, deadly nightshade).
I do not know about "acid-like visuals" - what I do know is that these three cause your mucus glads to stop secreting, thus drying up your mouth, throat, trachea, nose, rectum and vagina - severely.
The effects also last for several days.
If that is your idea for a trip, then be my guest.
I do not know about "acid-like visuals" - what I do know is that these three cause your mucus glads to stop secreting, thus drying up your mouth, throat, trachea, nose, rectum and vagina - severely.
The effects also last for several days.
If that is your idea for a trip, then be my guest.
madeofwater
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Feb 29, 2004
- Messages
- 52
^Every drug dehydrates you...Datura is one of the most powerful drugs (Maybe the most powerful?) so it dries you out like no other.
I am thinking of trying Datura. People who have had good datura experiences: did you eat the seeds or the leafs?
I am thinking of trying Datura. People who have had good datura experiences: did you eat the seeds or the leafs?
PlunX
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2004
- Messages
- 197
Seeds are more mental, leaves causes heavier delerium, and flowers seem to be more visual. Be careful with this stuff. You get a really bad feeling from it. I know that sounds blunt, but that's all I can really say. Same thing with diphenhydramine. Like death impending or something, but worse. Anyway, be careful. Peace.
Morninggloryseed
Bluelight Crew
Considering all parts contain scopolamine, I do not see why that would be so.
Achaemenian
Bluelighter
- Joined
- May 2, 2002
- Messages
- 314
I have also heard anecdotal reports that burgmansia is worse than datura... But then, I haven't heard much positive about datura either (except for some new age guy who combines it with deep meditation and has spectacular results).
There was also a death case involving burgmansia around here say, two years ago - some kid drowned in a 30cm deep spring (!!!) - so maybe that's what triggered the rumour.
There was also a death case involving burgmansia around here say, two years ago - some kid drowned in a 30cm deep spring (!!!) - so maybe that's what triggered the rumour.
Jamshyd
Bluelight Crew
madeofwater said:
I am sorry, but there is so much that is wrong with this post!
No, not every drug causes dehydration. I have never felt dehydrated on, say, 2C-I.
And just because a drug is "more powerful" (whatever that is), doesn't mean it will cause more dehydration!
The only way I tried Datura is by smoking a tiny, TINY (about that big [---]) piece of leaf material with a bit of weed and a bit of tobacco. I felt floaty and my mouth was dry for at least 24 hours.
I can't imagine how horrendous it would be if youeat the seeds.