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The Big & Dandy 4-HO-MET Thread - Part 2

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I'd say those are both among the "lightest" of the common 2c-x & 4 sub tryptamines. They both (to me) feel more user directed than some of the more intense substances in those classes. As a general rule I've found tryptamines to have a bit more of the profound quality mentioned in the OP, and IMO that holds true for comparing 2c-c & 4-HO-MET.

Don't get me wrong, any psychedelic has the potential to go awry, but it's substantially less likely with these two.
 
any major dude said:
I'd say those are both among the "lightest" of the common 2c-x & 4 sub tryptamines. They both (to me) feel more user directed than some of the more intense substances in those classes. As a general rule I've found tryptamines to have a bit more of the profound quality mentioned in the OP, and IMO that holds true for comparing 2c-c & 4-HO-MET.

Don't get me wrong, any psychedelic has the potential to go awry, but it's substantially less likely with these two.
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Great to know, thanks for your input. I'm looking for something deeper than 2c-c but less profound than LSD because I don't know if I'm equipped to handle a difficult emotional trip right now. That being said, I also want something that becomes more insightful at higher doses should I decide I'm ready for it. IME 2c-c didn't gain depth at high doses, just intensified visuals and body high, but it sounds like 4-ho-met becomes more complex at doses +20mg.

My plan for working my doses up is to start with 8mg, then 12mg, then 20mg. Is this about right, or does this seem like too timid of a plan, and thus a waste of product? Also, is the jump from 12 to 20mg too great?
 
@HighestWhenLow

I think you will be dissaponted with metocin because I think it's a pretty shallow psychedelic aswell, don't get me wrong, I love metocin, but mostly for the visuals and the good humour it imbues. I never laughed so much from a drug before.
I think you should consider 4-aco-dmt. in small doses it won't give you a mindfuck.

HighestWhenLow said:
My plan for working my doses up is to start with 8mg, then 12mg, then 20mg. Is this about right, or does this seem like too timid of a plan, and thus a waste of product? Also, is the jump from 12 to 20mg too great?
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if I were you I'd start with 15 mg. If you could handle 100 mg 2c-c, I'm sure you'd be fine with 15 mg metocin.

For me metocin doesn't really get interesting until 25-30 mg. And I'm no hard head.
 
Sounds like a solid plan to me. I found 4-HO-MET surprisingly active @ 8mg. Not mind blowing or anything, but definitely active. And IME tryptamines, especially this one, have a fairly linear dose/response curve, as opposed to the more exponential ones you get with the higher potency PEAs. So that 8mg jump from 12-20 shouldn't be too overwhelming. Could probably double it to 24 if you wanted, but always best to err on the side of caution.
 
Fagott said:
@HighestWhenLow

I think you will be dissaponted with metocin because I think it's a pretty shallow psychedelic aswell, don't get me wrong, I love metocin, but mostly for the visuals and the good humour it imbues. I never laughed so much from a drug before.
I think you should consider 4-aco-dmt. in small doses it won't give you a mindfuck.


if I were you I'd start with 15 mg. If you could handle 100 mg 2c-c, I'm sure you'd be fine with 15 mg metocin.

For me metocin doesn't really get interesting until 25-30 mg. And I'm no hard head.
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I agree completely! Rather than upping the dose of Metocin, might be worth trying 4-aco-dmt for a deeper trip. I also found 4-ho & 4-aco-mipt both a little deeper & a little less "light" than 4-ho-met, which really does feel like the Diet Coke of Psychedelic drugs.

I got up to 60mg in 20mg doses on 2c-c & I felt pretty immersed at that level. Not necessarilly "deep", but pretty intense.

So far, ime, these two are the easiest of psychedelics but they still have the capabilty of throwing a curve ball, as is the case to some degree with all "tripping", regardless of compound.
 
All great pieces of advice, much appreciated. Obviously the answer varies from person to person, but in general at what dose have some of you found metocin to shift from the "light-hearted eye candy" character to more immersive states? Do deeper levels of insight begin at these doses or are even intense/immersive doses still shallow?
 
In my experience, 4-HO-MET is only marginally deeper than 2C-C, unless one pushes the dose considerably. In my opinion, 4-HO-MET shines at common and (normal) high doses, rather than very high ones. Instead of ingesting very large doses of this compound in order to achieve deep experiences, I suggest using a different 4-sub tryptamine for that purpose. 4-AcO-DMT and 4-AcO/HO-MiPT have already been mentioned, and these are excellent choices. However, since you said that you're not ready for something too heavy, I recommend that you try 4-AcO/HO-MiPT before 4-AcO-DMT. During the course of my trials, 4-AcO-DMT has shown more potential for "mind-fuck" than 4-AcO/HO-MiPT; the latter compounds are more "recreational" (yet significantly deeper than 4-HO-MET). Once you get a good feel for 4-AcO/HO-MiPT, then go for 4-AcO-DMT. I should also mention that 4-AcO/HO-DET are great compounds, although some folks don't enjoy them very much. As for me, I regard them as superior to 4-AcO/HO-MiPT and on par with 4-AcO-DMT.
 
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This is just my experience, but 4-AcO-DMT was far far less intense and serious than metocin. 4-HO-MET is incredibly beautiful and deep, you've just gotta step up on the high dive and plug/snort at least 40mg. At that level it is far deeper and intense than any dose of pscilocetin than I've ever had. Same thing with my brother, 4-AcO-DMT is super light, even 55mg insufflated left me wanting much much more..
 
^Those doses are far beyond where the average users wishes to go though (or so I think from reading). Is the experience manageable at that range? Would love an "easy dip" (not the right word, but I hope you get my point) in to the fully enveloping visuals these chems give at higher levels
 
^ to me those are my typical doses, I don't like light tripping, it's anxiogenic and worthless for the most part. It's very comfortable though, as far as tripping goes at least. Maybe I'm just a hard head but anything less would be a waste of material. Sink or swim my friend.

When I said 55mg insufflated 4-AcO-DMT left me wanting more I really meant it. It feels like I could sniff at least 75mgs with no problem. The whole experience is lacking compared to the 4-HO's.
 
Thanks for all the input, it sounds to me like a 22-30mg dose of metocin might be what I'm looking for, which is less than ego-death but more than visuals and silly thoughts, if that makes sense.

Can anyone comment on a 4-ho-met and methylone or mdma combo, especially methylone? My experience with methylone make me think it would combine well with metocin, the only aspect of such a combo I can see being potentially problematic is excessive stimulation, but I'd love to hear any personal experience, especially regarding dosages of each.
 
Somewhat edited for clarity:

HighestWhenLow said:
Can anyone comment on a 4-HO-MET and methylone or MDMA combo, especially methylone? My experience with methylone made me think that it could combine well with metocin; excessive stimulation is the only aspect of that combo that I can see as being potentially problematic, but I'd love to hear any personal experience, especially regarding dosages of each.
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I have no personal experience with this combination yet, but it appears that oral ingestion of 15mg of 4-HO-MET and 150mg of methylone is good (although possibly rather too stimulating for some people). I'm not certain in which order they should be taken though. Can someone please share some information regarding this?
 
I would aid to take the methylone in the second half if I were to take it at all. I wouldn't want to be crashing while tripping.
 
Interestingly I prefer to crash during a trip. I prefer to descend into psychedelia than straight into sobriety, unless the trip is really intense. But 4-HO-MET is nice and gentle at 15mg, so in my experience it would be fine.
 
Oh ROXIanne! said:
I would be weary about mixing this with methylone as m1 itself gave me somewhat severe heart palps which could cause a paranoid type trip. I was also wondering if anyone has mixed 4-ho-met with 4-ac0-dmt? what would be a good dose for a strong but not overwhelming trip? I was thinking 20mgs of 4-ho for some nice visuals and 15-20mgs of 4-aco for that nice shroomy head space?
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I like this combination a lot. It's also great with the addition of 2c-c. The pea changes the nature of the visuals as well as the duration of the trip, without detracting from the tryptamine profundity.
 
4-HO-MET was the first psychedelic I ever tried. It was an awesome experience, although not memorable in terms of what actually happened, it was an experience that will stay with me forever. It wasn't harsh and I'd agree it comes in waves of intensity. I wrote a trip report for erowid for anyone interested :) I took 22-25mg, wasn't completely sure, looking at this thread it makes what I took sound like a strong dosage however after doing 20mg 4-HO-DiPT combined with 4-HO-MiPT I'd say it wasn't extremely intense. I'm average weight height and build.

Btw, not sure if this is good forum etiquette here but search isn't doing too well in helping me find something, maybe someone here could help me find discussions about combinations of 4-HO-DiPT and 4-HO-MiPT and/or just a discussion of all the 4-HO tryptamines in general. I want to learn more about their chemical structure and whether a mix of a few of them would be safe as I'm thinking of combining 4-HOs MET, DiPT and MiPT for the next trip.
 
A couple days ago I was able to try metocin for the first time at 8mg along with 80mg 4-fa. I know trying something for the first time in a combination isn't the best idea, but A) I'm very experienced with 4-fa and don't consider it much of a variable, and B) I went on a long bike ride and 4-fa is my go-to enhancer for biking, so I thought the extra stimulation wouldn't hurt since I would be expending so much energy.

I'll write up a proper TR soon, but the experience far surpassed my already high expectations for this substance. It was a wonderful and surprisingly productive and insightful experience, with much more depth than I anticipated after being disappointed by the shallowness of 2C-C.

As a side note, there appears to be significant cross-tolerance between this substance and other serotogenic compounds, as 150mg good quality MDMA (100mg oral, 50mg insufflated) taken appx. 8 hours after ingesting 4-ho-met had very little effect on me, when normally that much MDMA would have me off the walls.
 
Sorry if this a stupid question but is there any chance the 4-FA caused the tolerance to the mdma?
 
I don't believe so, although it's possible to 4-ho/4-fa combo created greater tolerance than either alone. I've used 4-fa the day of an mdma experience before and it didn't hamper the effects of the mdma at all, but the combo with 4-ho-met is definitely too much of a variable to make any conclusions with certainty.
 
4-FA, as a serotonin releaser would definitely cause tolerance to MDMA, although I expect that HO-MET so close to the MDMA experience would have also played a role.
 
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