☛ Official ☚ The Big & Dandy βK-2C-B Thread - Part 1

[foolsgold]

typical should of read the post above mine lol

 

[adder]

It's not necessarily a prodrug. If it is, then imagine it would have to go through 2 steps of metabolism, first a reduction to the alcohol (BOHB) and then methylation of the alcohol to give BOB. Some people may metabolise through methylation more effectively than others and this would explain why some people can't feel psychedelic effects of bk-2C-B at all. But then again you can't really rule out a possibility that people who can't feel it at all let it dimerise before ingestion.

It's possible that it's active on its own. If people who feel psychedelic effects of bk-2C-B didn't find BOHB as powerful, then the only explanation would be that bk-2C-B is active on its own. I've had this second possibility on my mind for quite some time now, however it's not a safe place to discuss such stuff. I'd rather have this lead to more knowledge about 5-HT2A receptors and their ligands than let the grey market make some money on it which would then be wasted anyway and which would inevitably lead to banning of some potentially beautiful compounds.

 

[Jonneh]

That's fascinating adder. Some (lucky?) people get to try a new psychedelic drug (BOHB), albeit not on its own, but you've got to have the right relative activity of a couple of enzymes to feel it. Judging by its siblings, it might not be that fun though. I haven't seen anything to indicate that hypotensive effects of the beta-ethanolamines are present in the effects of bk-2c-b, so perhaps it is active after all, or people are bad methylators in general, or rarely both good reducers and bad methylators!

Some people may metabolise through methylation ...

Do you mean 'beyond BOB' here? Otherwise, wouldn't good methylators and poor 'steppers beyond' do well out of the deal?

I've never thought of the ketone group as a potential threat to psychedelic action, but I suppose that's what they call 'blissful ignorance' (especially if it turns out well, as you hint at)!

 

[adder]

I don't know whether BOHB is somewhere on its way to the RC market, but obviously this is the main metabolite of bk-2C-B. BOHD was found by Shulgin to be inactive at 50mg with BOD being active in the 15-25mg range. Clearly BOHB doesn't seem to hold much potential, but the fact that BOHD has no psychedelic activity at 50mg doesn't mean BOHB is completely inactive as a psychedelic (cf. 2C-D vs. 2C-B). It may be more of a perception enhancer/empathogen though rather than a full-blown psychedelic.

Bk-2C-B is not as energetically stable as its corresponding alcohol, it should be metabolised into BOHB fairly quickly, this reduction is obvious. It's amazing that people report bk-2C-B to be so long-lasting, perhaps it triggers something and then is rapidly cleared anyway. It's unlikely that BOHB is the metabolite responsible for bk-2C-B's psychedelic effects, so either BOHB is further metabolised into BOB (which isn't a certainty either, I haven't found any papers stating that ephedrine-like drugs are metabolised through methylation, but there are plenty of O-methyltransferases) or bk-2C-B is active on its own. If someone researched pharmacodynamics and pharmacokinetics of bk-2C-B, everything would be more clear. I'm very curious about this, earlier I was sceptical about bk-2C-B being active but it's quite possible.

Do you mean 'beyond BOB' here? Otherwise, wouldn't good methylators and poor 'steppers beyond' do well out of the deal?

I've never thought of the ketone group as a potential threat to psychedelic action, but I suppose that's what they call 'blissful ignorance' (especially if it turns out well, as you hint at)!

I don't really understand what you mean by "beyond BOB". BOB isn't further metabolised by methylation because there are no more hydroxy groups that could be methylated. Actually, BOB is most probably metabolised into BOHB just as bk-2C-B is. If methylation of BOHB happens, it's just a small fraction of the ingested dose. It seems that at least 10% of ingested bk-2C-B would have to end up as BOB for the hypothesis to have some ground. As much as I like the idea of BOB being responsible for bk-2C-B psychedelic effects, I somehow doubt that such high amounts of BOB could be produced via methylation.

 

[Jonneh]

I thought maybe you meant 'through methylation and beyond!'. It wouldn't be methyl-transferases again, but something would attack old BOB. I see what you mean though (no psychedelia for bad methylators), although we'd surely expect some hypotension if beta-ethanolamines were before the bottleneck, and bk-2C-B seems to have vasoconstrictive effects. Or perhaps BOHB is an odd one out in this respect.

Bk-2C-B is not as energetically stable as its corresponding alcohol, it should be metabolised into BOHB fairly quickly, this reduction is obvious. It's amazing that people report bk-2C-B to be so long-lasting, perhaps it triggers something and then is rapidly cleared anyway. It's unlikely that BOHB is the metabolite responsible for bk-2C-B's psychedelic effects, so either BOHB is further metabolised into BOB (which isn't a certainty either, I haven't found any papers stating that ephedrine-like drugs are metabolised through methylation, but there are plenty of O-methyltransferases) or bk-2C-B is active on its own..

Perhaps this fits with the phases people report in their trips: initial empathogenesis (bk-2C-B alone) followed by psychedelia (BOB). Although if smoking provides 'instant visuals' as Dr Greenthumb reported, perhaps it's a one man show. God knows how it staves off the reductase hordes in that case.

 

[DrGreenthumb]

I was wondering about that too, but it seems that it worked for Sir Greenthumb.

Dr Greenthumb, I presume, t'was the HCl salt you were smoking?

As far as I know, but it's not labelled as a salt. It was from a UK RC vendor. Slightly off-white fine powder, soft texture (not crystalline looking), dissolves easily in water, turns purple when wet. It's just labelled as 2-amino-1-(4-bromo-2,5-dimethoxyphenyl) ethanone. I didn't do any chemistry with it, just put some of the powder in a joint. Could it be possible to make smoking/vaporisation more effective? Is it possible to turn it into an active freebase that could be smoked without it just turning purple? I guess smoking the salt is the only real option.

It doesn't smoke easily, my joint kept going out & it felt a bit harsh (nothing like as harsh as trying to snort it), but it was effective. It had immediate effects, slight open eye visuals - a few coloured dots & small colour splashes, and a stimulant effect, but then a stronger psychedelic effect comes a little later, maybe 20 or 30 minutes & it all went cartoonish, lots of open eye visuals - freeze framing, morphing, bending, edges warping with spectrums of colours. It was much more visual than just an oral dose alone. I think it's active on it's own & also produces active metabolites, but it's just a guess. I was also high on an oral dose of bk-2c-b when I got the best effects from smoking it, and it was in a joint with cannabis & tobacco. I'll get a crack pipe for some further experiments, see if I can make it vaporise & find some doses and durations for vaped/smoked alone. Smoking it in a joint doesn't feel particularly healthy for my lungs, I've smoked worse things, but it's not something I want to do too often, done it 3 or 4 times so far (once was at too small dose). Because I was mixing smoking with oral & cannabis, I'm not sure if the effect duration of just smoking it is much shorter, but I'd guess it is, it felt like I came down to my oral dose level in about 2 or 3 hours maybe. Somewhere above 50mg in a joint while already peaking on an oral dose produced effects, I tried a joint with 20mg while sober & it didn't do much at all.

I've noticed some slight effects after about 20 or 30 minutes of oral dosing too, but the main effects don't start for around 2 hours & build slowly, peaking at about 4 hours. There's a delay for the main effects from smoking it too. That's what makes me think bk-2c-b is active on it's own, but produces some more active metabolite(s) later on.

I barely managed to get any effect other than intense burning and purple snot from trying to snort it, I think it's possibly effective snorted, if you could snort a large enough dose (I'm not man enough), but it's very painful, really not worth it.

Had an emotional trip last night on 0.7g dried mushrooms (p.semilanceata) & 128mg bk-2c-b (oral, taken after the onset of effects from the mushrooms). Mushrooms give it more depth & bk-2c-b extends a mushroom trip. The effects combine well at low doses, for me.

 

[DrGreenthumb]

It's not necessarily a prodrug. If it is, then imagine it would have to go through 2 steps of metabolism, first a reduction to the alcohol (BOHB) and then methylation of the alcohol to give BOB. Some people may metabolise through methylation more effectively than others and this would explain why some people can't feel psychedelic effects of bk-2C-B at all. But then again you can't really rule out a possibility that people who can't feel it at all let it dimerise before ingestion.

It's possible that it's active on its own. If people who feel psychedelic effects of bk-2C-B didn't find BOHB as powerful, then the only explanation would be that bk-2C-B is active on its own. I've had this second possibility on my mind for quite some time now, however it's not a safe place to discuss such stuff. I'd rather have this lead to more knowledge about 5-HT2A receptors and their ligands than let the grey market make some money on it which would then be wasted anyway and which would inevitably lead to banning of some potentially beautiful compounds.

I've never tried either of those compounds. The qualitative comments for BOB in pihkal don't seem to be anything like my experience, except the duration, it doesn't seem like the comments on BOHD either, although BOD sounds similar to the end of the trip, possibly there's just a small amount of BOB or some similar compound & some other things going on too. The effects seem to change quite a lot at certain points in a BK-2C-B trip, after about 8 hours most of the visuals are gone for me & I'm just left with a lingering nice psychedelic feeling. I'm sure it's active on it's own as well, I got instant effects on exhaling when smoking it, it hit me just as quickly as nicotine & just before the cannabis, as far as I can tell, it's just not as strong as the effects that followed. Oral doses seem to be noticeable after around 15 or 20 minutes too, but only very subtly, unless I'm already on something, main effects don't really start for 2 hours. It's possible I wouldn't notice the immediate effects from smoking it if I wasn't already high on an oral dose, smoking ~20mg while sober seemed to do nothing.

I can't find any other reports on BOB or BOHD, pihkal makes BOHD sound a bit poor & nothing like I experienced on BK-2C-B, maybe it's just a scarcity of reports on those compounds.

Even if it dimerises, wont it turn back to bk-2c-b when it hits stomach acid? I'm not sure wrapping it up is necessary, but I have always wrapped it in cigarette paper & swallowed with some acidic soft drink. Should I drink some purple water for science? Water that has turned purple with bk-2c-b turns clear if I add a little vinegar.

It is quite possible to have a sober feeling trip on low doses, like some descriptions of 2C-B I've read, but milder & longer lasting. If somebody tries around 100mg & expects it to hit them like LSD, MDMA, speed or psylocin does, it just wont, it's a very slow & gentle come up, the effects can be quite subtle too, depending on set & setting. It can be quite mild & need a bit of a push with a little meditation or something, if it's not smoked or some huge dose I need to concentrate to get visuals, or it's just slight CEV, still feels very nice though. It's quite possible to sit & work, or sit at a computer and feel very little on it. I was getting great lap times on Gran Turismo, felt very focused, I wouldn't drive a real car in that state, but no problems with the game, I just felt focused. Maybe some people need a few separate doses to learn how to get what they want from it. I'm quite a light guy & sensitive to psychedelics, bigger people will need more, or maybe it's overpowered by some other drug they're on, or by drinking - it's potentiated by the weed I smoke. It's a much more clear headed and controllable trip than LSD, mushrooms or MDMA even, can go from feeling sober to tripping balls in a few seconds if I want to, or just stay sober if I want, on a sub 100mg dose at least. I can see how somebody could take it & feel very little, despite it being quite active if they were in a different setting.

I seem to have been getting better & stronger effects after using it regularly, no real significant tolerance except to the stomach effects, no comedowns or real cravings or anything either. Maybe it has just built up in my body, but it feels more like I learned how to use it. My back pain has almost totally disappeared too, I feel happier & healthier, I've got into the habit of doing a little exercise every day, stopped smoking cigarettes. I was improving anyway after going gluten free, but now parts of my back that I haven't been able to move for years & have kept me in pain are free & flexible. Possibly it could be a useful anti-inflammatory at sub-psychedelic doses. For me the first trip turned off my joint pain, depression, tiredness & 'brain-fog', still lingering due to my coeliac disease, I feel as good as when I was 20 again now, maybe better. I'm 33 now & I've been ill for the best part of 10 years, or maybe all my life, symptoms were really noticeable since 25, getting progressively worse until 5 months ago when I changed my diet. The joint/back pain came back a day or two after I came down, but it was much better than before, so I kept using it to stretch & exercise my back, now it's 90% cured even when I'm not tripping. It didn't cure my coeliac, not eating gluten does that, I still can't eat gluten, but it can take 18 months after going on a gluten free diet for some problems to heal. My father has much worse problems, he can't walk now, at least partly due to his coeliac & he has some kind of dementure, I'm his carer so I needed to sort my own problems out quickly to help him more. bk-2c-b was just going to be a warm up for a mushroom binge, I didn't expect it to fix my joint pain & get my mind in order straight away, but it's helped more than mushrooms ever could.

I'm even considering practising some yoga, no way I could've done that a few weeks ago.

Sadly I think the grey market is the only place where compounds like this can be investigated, I can't see many pharmaceutical companies rushing to research psychedelics. Hopefully nobody gets silly on it & tries taking full grams or more, vasoconstriction/circulatory problems & possible bad combinations with other drugs (esp stimulants) seem the main dangers so far, but unfortunately our government doesn't require any evidence of harm to ban a substance. They banned mushrooms despite nobody ever coming to any harm & them growing wild on nearly any open area of grass at this time of year, just that it might be a bit psychedelic seems enough to get it banned.

 

[adder]

Even if it dimerises, wont it turn back to bk-2c-b when it hits stomach acid? I'm not sure wrapping it up is necessary, but I have always wrapped it in cigarette paper & swallowed with some acidic soft drink. Should I drink some purple water for science? Water that has turned purple with bk-2c-b turns clear if I add a little vinegar.

Aryl derivatives of pyrazine react with hydroiodic acid to give alpha-aminoketones (source). However, hydrochloric acid in stomach is diluted, so I don't know if the reversion of pyrazine formation would be complete. It's best to take bk-2C-B encapsulated, I guess. And it's more reasonable to carry out the reaction of 2,5-bis(4-bromo-2,5-dimethoxyphenyl)pyrazine and 0.1M HCl, and see how it works out.

Thanks for your description of subtleness of bk-2C-B. I'm sadly unfamiliar with its effects and it will stay that way for a long time for sure, but it's now easier for me to wrap my head around it. I'm also happy for you that it helped you so much. My life also took a different course after a profound Plateau Sigma experience after DXM. Soon I started meditating and I discovered a lot of stuff about myself and the world around me, which I needed a lot after quitting methadone and benzodiazepines. Now that I'm off benzodiazepines, I wish I could trip on some serotonergic psychedelics but I have no access to them now and I can't really afford spending money on those available as RCs. Certainly psychedelics and dissociatives helped me to open my mind, and I think there's a need for subtle compounds so everyone, even those completely unfamiliar with psychedelics, could try and use them to seek answers in their lives.

Unfortunately all I can do now is sketching molecules and confronting them with research already done. The more I think about bk-2C-B, the more probable it is for me that it's a weak psychedelic on its own. BOHB probably has some background role in effects after bk-2C-B ingestion and it could indeed be an explanation why effects appear in phases. Some minuscule amounts of BOB may be produced as well, but it's unclear at this time whether it has some major role in psychedelic effects. Perhaps bk-2C-B effects are so subtle that many people miss them, I didn't really think about that earlier. The description of BOB effects in PIHKAL may be misleading, I've read some posts of people stating that they had taken BOB and it was rather a smooth compound with little visuals, but definitely not too stimulating. Unpleasant physical stimulation is probably mostly attributable to BOHB to which BOB must be metabolised, effects may vary among people. I'd definitely be interested in trying BOB or BOC, there is much more to psychedelics than OEVs. BTW, I see no reason why bk-2C-B or some metabolite should be a vasodilator or a hypotensive. A structurally related beta-2 blocker, butaxamine, has a t-butyl group on nitrogen and that bulky substitution on nitrogen is crucial for affinity at beta-2 receptors, which makes it a vasodilator. Another related compound, methoxamine (not to be confused with methoxetamine), has a primary amine and it has vasoconstrictive properties being an alpha-1 agonist.

The grey market unfortunately is money-focused and they don't care much for results, the only result they're interested in is whether a compound can be popular enough to produce revenue. I don't put much faith in the pharmaceutical industry either, they're money-focused as well and there is no way psychedelics could produce money for their industry. Our best hope is in independent research. In this world there is always going to be someone's interest before everything. Knowledge can't be quantified in the way money is, knowledge can be universal and beneficial for people no matter what system we choose to live in, and money will cease to exist as soon as we admit we live in a biased world and decide to evolve. Reaching knowledge can be uniting, money divides and it will always divide no matter what form it will have. Money is the base of our world now, so we need to completely rebuild it and form a new world on completely different foundations, no excuse is good enough to back up money. We need to stop thinking about life in terms of giving and taking, we need to start thinking about sharing. Humans evolved through co-operation and not hierarchisation. The world today is a cruel place and it is that way because of people, we are people and it's up to us what world future generations will live in. In present circumstances the next step of human evolution must be the revolution of mind. Do people really think all there is to reach is only higher computing power?

 

[DrGreenthumb]

It takes a while to dimerise too, I'd say at least 5-10 minutes until it starts. Just a couple of drops of vinegar is enough to turn the water clear again, it doesn't take much & that reaction is fast. I drank small amounts that I dimerised & then added vinegar to, to test my recent batch & it didn't kill me, but I can't tell if it was active because I consumed some powder at the same time. I've dissolved 67mg of bk-2c-b in a cup of tap water (soft water, used to be ph7-7.5 when I had a meter, don't think it's changed) 90 minutes ago, it's turned slightly pink/purple, I plan to drink it in about 30 minutes.

There really isn't much unpleasant physical or mental stimulation at all, even less than with mushrooms, it's easy to sleep on (pretty easy to stay awake all night on too). I even tried it before bed once, just got pleasant strange dreams & felt trippy in the morning, even a small amount of mushrooms will wake me up in sweats in an intense bad trip if I tried that. Strangely it seems less stimulating at higher doses. I didn't measure my heart rate or blood pressure, but it didn't seem to be racing & I only got palpitations if mixed with stimulants (including caffeine). I didn't notice any effects from low blood pressure either, I'd guess it raises blood pressure slightly. A little vasoconstriction (not dilation - did I type that somewhere?) is noticeable, some mild leg cramps & cold feelings, but nothing that feels really bad, it's nothing like the pihkal description for BOHB. BOD is the only one in that series with descriptions that come close, I think if BOHD plays any role it's a very small one, or the pihkal description isn't accurate for everybody, or it's counteracted by some other effect with bk-2c-b. I've had dizziness from low blood pressure before & not felt anything like that with bk-2c-b, the opposite if anything. Maybe some of it turns into some similar type of compound, without proper research we wont know. I'll buy a BP monitor & see what it says, I think I can get free BP tests on the NHS too.

For me it can be strongly visual between 2-5 hours after oral dosing, but then after about 5 or 6 hours it feels like a different drug & visual effects are greatly reduced. Before 2 hours it's very mild effects & hardly even noticeable unless I'm already on something.

Could insufflating or plugging a slightly acid solution (say ph 6) be effective? Hurt more/less? Some of it turns purple if I insufflate powder, it's not very effective by that roa at all & hurts like hell, I think it hurts more when it turns purple.

Adder, it's magic mushroom season if you're in a northern part of the EU, have fun. I never liked dissociatives, or ketamine at least, OK at low doses, but holes are not much fun for me & it leaves me feeling slow. BK-2C-B has a similar kind of emotionally detached feeling without it being totally disabling. Plus, it didn't just fix my mind, it fixed my body, it was a really remarkable effect on the chronic pain I was in. I never tried DXM in anything more than cough suppressant doses, I saw a guy on it in a rave looking in the worst state I've seen anybody get into without passing out & it put me off


added later... I didn't drink much purple water, it tasted horrible, was something I really didn't want to drink & still don't, I'll probably add some lemon to it later... I swallowed 150mg in a rizla paper 6 hours ago as well, and smoked 10mg 5-meo-dalt in a joint. It feels like more though, I think some of the purple water was active & got converted back to bk-2c-b as soon as it hit my stomach acid, but I wasn't very scientific.

 

[PowerFarts]

First time I took bk-2c-b, 80 or so mgs was consumed and I barely felt threshhold effects, then a couple of days ago I popped a couple vitamin C pills (2000mg), took 120mg of bk-2c-b and broke on through.

So, yeah, you bluelighters out there try vitamin C and tell me if it made any difference to you.

 

[DrGreenthumb]

Most important thing I want to get clear about this. I was in chronic pain for years due to inflammation caused by an auto-immune disorder. BK-2C-B just turned it off & it seems to be a lasting effect, I've tried lots of different drugs (never tried 2C-B), but nothing was close to as effective, it seems even better than diclofenac & leagues above opiates for the type of pain I was in. Possible it's effective at sub-psychedelic doses too. I think it deserves some research for treating similar conditions & possibly to investigate which part of the molecule is responsible for that anti-inflammatory effect. As fun as it is recreationally, it's really helped to change my life like no other drug could. I never expected it to cure my physical symptoms. Hopefully my over-use doesn't cause more problems.

PowerFarts, I always found a fat joint helps more than any supplement if I'm not feeling a psychedelic enough. Maybe B vitamins help though, I take a branded 'performance' multi-vitamin with high levels of B vitamins. I've been eating lots of bananas too, maybe there's something in them that helps. Did you take the vitamin C pills at the same time as the bk-2c-b? Maybe it's just that vitamin C is an acid, I usually always swallow it with fruit juice or some soft drink.

I'm really going to have to stop using it for a while after today, getting some slightly worrying vascular problems with high doses & prolonged use, especially later in the trip. Not sure if I'm just being over-anxious since reading about BOHD, but probably best I stop anyway.

 

[PowerFarts]

Ascorbic acid.

Because it breaks down and turns purple (dimerization?)
In my tapwater bk-2-cb didn't turn purple, when I added borax, it made the water more alkaline, then purplification happens.

So I figure since I didn't have anything acidic to drink, I turned to ascorbic acid.

 

[Jonneh]

Most important thing I want to get clear about this. I was in chronic pain for years due to inflammation caused by an auto-immune disorder. BK-2C-B just turned it off & it seems to be a lasting effect, I've tried lots of different drugs (never tried 2C-B), but nothing was close to as effective, it seems even better than diclofenac & leagues above opiates for the type of pain I was in.

That's very interesting. I remember David Nichols found that several psychedelics were potent anti-inflammatory agents. DOI was by far the most potent, but 2C-BCB also worked, so the effect isn't limited to iodated compounds.

Glad it worked for you!


I tried some of this stuff this weekend: 100 mg in a rolling paper, washed down with water. I got mild stimulation (and I'm stimulant-naive) after an hour or so and some empathogenesis and talkativeness. There was then a six-hour plateau of the stimulatory effects (jaw clench) while the empathogenesis tailed off.

Thirteen hours in, the psychedelia took hold. I had been smoking cannabis during the afternoon and evening and had got much higher than usual. Now, in bed, I had dramatic shifting and colour enhancement, although only when I let go. With effort, everything could be normal. This is the only phenethylamine I've taken, so I can't compare effects, but in contrast to others here, I found much in common with the BOB experiences in PiHKAL (I read them afterwards, I might add!). These extracts sum up the commonalities:

"In another couple of hours a neurological over-stimulation became apparent."

"[T]he question of neurological stability became quite apparent. Does one really let go? ... how scared I was to give myself over to sleep. Could I trust the body to its own devices without me as an overseeing caretaker? Let's risk it. I slept. The next day there was a memory of this turmoil."

I never experienced other bodily discomfort, aside for some minor pins and needles at some point. No headache, and a pleasant hangover.

 

[DrGreenthumb]

I think it might well degrade into bohd, which seems to be a strong beta blocker. I'm worried & I'm going to stop taking it. I found other info on another forum that backs up that theory. Occasional low doses only, if anything with this. I'm pretty scared of the physical effects I'm getting now, I'm feeling pretty ill, hopefully it'll be fine, but I'm not going to repeat a large dose of this & will take several weeks or months off it.

 

[Jonneh]

I think it might well degrade into bohd.

Remember that, if anything, bk-2C-B will be metabolised to BOHB, not BOHD. Nothing is known about BOHB.

 

[DrGreenthumb]

Sorry, bohb, it's known that it drops blood pressure & is a similar molecule to several beta blockers. Whatever it is, overdoing it doesn't feel nice, don't be silly like I was.

Any advice on what to do? I'm feeling ill & have no idea how to counter a possible beta blocker, or if I should bother trying. I'm just going to try taking a walk & getting some sugar. I know I need to stay away from weed & most other drugs. Just going to keep with my nicotine e-cig, sugar, salt & liquids.

I'm feeling breathless, a bit dizzy, pains in my lower leg muscles & nausea, almost 16 hours after taking 150mg+. Possible lowered heart rate & blood pressure. Whatever it metabolises into, it feels toxic to me now.

I seem OK now at +19:30h, but it's given me a warning. I didn't turn blue or anything really bad, but it was uncomfortable & not much I could do about it. It felt like the nicotine helped counteract the bad effects & clear it faster. Possibly something bad builds up after a month of abuse? Occasional light use seems OK, but it seems to have more potent effects on the body than the mind & the side effects get worse with continued use. Just a few drags on a joint brought it back on a bit just now too, wont finish it for a while & I'm probably going to have to take some days off weed as well. I think there's a good chance of active metabolites of bk-2c-b that take several days to clear, or longer.

I still think in small controlled doses it could be amazing for auto-immune inflammatory pain, but it does nothing for other types of pain & shouldn't be abused too much. I'd really like to see some drug company study it & maybe produce a cleaner non-psychedelic version that concentrates on that one effect. Maybe it could be really helpful for rheumatoid arthritis or other conditions like that. I wont be recommending it as a light fun harmless trip now anyway, it could be dangerous at recreational doses.

 

[Transform]

What time did you take it? Have you missed sleep as a result? Those symptoms aren't common but aren't unheard of after a relatively high dose trip on something, which I think it's fair to describe 150mg of this as.

 

[DrGreenthumb]

What time did you take it? Have you missed sleep as a result? Those symptoms aren't common but aren't unheard of after a relatively high dose trip on something, which I think it's fair to describe 150mg of this as.

20 hours ago, midnight last night, UK time. I didn't start feeling bad until after 6 hours in. I've had some sleep, but not a full 8 hours in one stretch during the last 36 hours, more like 6 hours of broken sleep, not eaten much for 24 hours & I've been using it regularly for the last month, last time I used before this was Friday. I shouldn't have used yesterday, just the weed I got was crappy & I got bored, I wont make that mistake again. I mixed it with 10mg 5-meo-dalt (smoked) & cannabis too, same time as i swallowed 150mg of bk-2c-b, only 2 joints of cannabis & nicotine e-cig since then, cannabis seems to make it worse. It doesn't feel life threateningly bad, just a bit worrying & uncomfortable, but enough to make me want to give drugs a rest for a while. 150mg is still quite mild mentally & I've had more before without serious side effects, but the physical effects of this chemical scare me, they're very potent at those doses & seem to get worse with regular use.

I think the theory about it metabolising into a drug that drops blood pressure could be correct. They seemed to be mainly low blood pressure/sugar/oxygen related symptoms, although I lack any devices to measure those. I've had low blood pressure before & weed can make it worse. I just hope there's no lasting damage. I'm planning to ride it out with sugary drinks, sweets, a high nicotine e-cig & a bag of salted crisps or two.

This is reassuring that some guy took a gram & survived, but overdoses are not clever: http://www.bluelight.org/vb/threads/720035-Bk-2C-B-1000-mg-First-Time-%28Somewhat-Experienced%29-The-dangers-of-RC-overdose

I'm feeling fine today after a good night's sleep, it did wear off eventually, was just like a 20+ hour comedown for 6 hours of trippyness. I did about 2.5g in six weeks, tripping 3-6 times each week, so almost constant. The trips got worse as I abused it more, there were no noticeable bad side effects the first few times, even at slightly higher doses. I'll leave it at least a month for the drug to clear my system before taking any more. Occasional low doses shouldn't be a problem, but trying to push this drug too far could cause some harm, I got a warning to stop & I will. I think I've got everything I wanted from this drug now anyway, mind & body feel fixed compared to before I started.

Don't try it if you're diabetic, have any heart problems, or take any medications. It doesn't seem quite as safe as I first thought.

Other side effects I got were shallow breathing, sore red eyes & some extra mucus on my chest & nose. It left me breathless, having to concentrate on my breathing & having nicotine in an attempt to increase my bp a bit for most of yesterday.

50mg is enough for threshold effects for me, but not an intense trip with open eye visuals, just like a +, closer to 100mg is a ++ & over 150mg is almost +++ for me. I got close to a ++++ on some trips when smoking it while peaking on 150mg+ oral, and/or mixing it (mushrooms, 5-meo-dalt, cannabis), complete ego loss when mixing with ethylphenidate - but not in a good way, my ego split into several small child-like personalities for about 2 hours. A 50mg first dose was more than enough to get rid of my coeliac back/joint pain too & after a few tries it hasn't come back at all. Maybe 10-20mg would be enough for pain relief without much hallucinations, that pain has totally gone though now & I've already overdone it, so I can't test.

Maybe I was just anxious after reading what little there is about BOHD & confusing it with BOHB, but they did feel like real symptoms. I'll buy a blood pressure monitor before my next attempt. At least one other person has reported similar (but more extreme) symptoms from taking a full gram at once, so I probably didn't imagine it.

 

[suboxone421]

Put it in a capsule and try it from a good supplier. I have some from a great supplier I never tried and some from an OK supplier and the OK one got me feeling nice every time... 3 times.... it's very long lasting around 10 hours maybe some residual patterns while trying to sleep

 

[DrGreenthumb]

Put it in a capsule and try it from a good supplier. I have some from a great supplier I never tried and some from an OK supplier and the OK one got me feeling nice every time... 3 times.... it's very long lasting around 10 hours maybe some residual patterns while trying to sleep

My first 3 times were fantastic too & it got even better for the next few times, but then I started abusing it too much & found a limit.

It is from a good supplier, a relatively reputable UK source & it seems spot on, it's not obviously cut with anything, turns purple & works as described, even in lower doses than other people have got effects from. Seems to be half the price of other suppliers too & the last '1 gram' bag I got was 1.4. I just abused it too much, must have had over 20 trips over the last 5 or 6 weeks, done over 2.5g of the stuff (over those weeks, never over about 300mg at once) & it got too much for my body, I got some bad side effects on my last one & need a rest. It's not as safe as it first seems, it's a relatively new & unknown research chemical, so go easy on it, don't be silly & overdo it like I did. Wrapping it in cigarette papers works as well & so does smoking it. My last time only lasted about 4 hours, with a 20+ hour weird feeling comedown, other times it's been great for 12-16 hours with no comedown & felt very gentle, I guess I finally found a tolerance on it, but not to the bad effects, they just kept getting worse. I'm still not feeling ideal, it'll take a few days, half a joint of weak crappy premature weed still brings the comedown back.

Even though it seems much milder mentally, you should probably treat this with a similar respect to MDMA, the physical effects are stronger. No more than once a month in future for me. It's not something to take in large doses every day.