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The Big and Dandy Ketamine Thread (Archived start - 11-20-07)

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fastandbulbous said:
THC & ketamine have a lot in common IMO
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I agree, as with cannabis, i get creative when composing music on k. of course using small doses, what i love...
what i really like is the kick it can give you when going out. I have a 25 min bus ride from my place. So a small bump (30-50mg) before going to take the bus (usually 5 min...) then at the bus station i pretty much plateau, and then the bus arrives and i can sit down relax, drink a beer 0.5l and then i'm all happy/energetic when i get out of the bus and for the rest of the evening!
 
Has anyone tried taking Ketamine before taking a traditional psychedelic, to help ease the come-up?

Ideally the timing would be optimized so that the psychedelic is kicking in after the primary effects of Ketamine have worn off and the anti-depressant effect has been established.

My thinking is that since for some people, it has such an immediate anti-depressant effect, it might be useful to get into a positive mindset for tripping.


Nature vol. 443 said:
So, by jamming the NMDA receptor, could ketamine be correcting a toxic glut of glutamate that is harming brain cells and causing depression? It is already known that stress floods the brain with glutamate, says Zarate. “It might be that these neurons are struggling to regulate glutamate, and if you stress them over and over, they become injured.”
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Does anyone know how/if psychedelics effect glutamate? Assuming the hypothesis is correct, by "jamming" the NMDA receptor, perhaps ketamine could even reduce the likelihood of a "bad trip".


Any thoughts?
 
E1, you must have had similar thoughts to mine. As I was sitting on the couch at about T+1 hour from the ketamine, it occurred to me this would be a very good time to take a psychedelic, given my very relaxed and positive frame of mind.

I imagine it would be quite nice.

The antagonism to the NMDA receptor (blocking glutamate and NMDA) also has anti-nociceptive properties that seem to linger after the peak effects have disappeared.
 
I think I'll give it a try. Its been a while since I've had 2C-T-2, which has always been an allay. Something that could ease the come-up would be invaluable for me.

It also appears that the neuro-protective effects of ketamine are useful to reduce the risk of MDMA induced neurotoxicity. I found the following abstracts regarding MDMA and NMDA antagonists but some of its a little technical for me. I think ketamine might also help with the depressive effects of MDMA that many people report in the days/week afterwards.

...These methods combined demonstrated that the glycine-site specific NMDA antagonist ACEA 1021 (4 x 30 mg/kg, i.p., 2 hourly) given 30 minutes before (S)-MDMA (4 x 10 mg/kg, i.p., 2 hourly) was able to prevent the depletion of both 5-HT content and uptake site density but unable to prevent the depletion of 5-HT content and uptake site density caused dexfenfluramine (4 x 15 mg/kg, i.p., 2 hourly).

http://www.mdma.net/acea1021/index.html
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...These data support the proposals of others that NMDA receptor antagonists are neuroprotective against MDMA-induced degeneration only if they induce hypothermia and further suggest that increased glutamate activity may not be involved in the neurotoxic action of MDMA. 6. These data further demonstrate that a proportion of the neuroprotective action of clomethiazole is due to an effect on body temperature but that, in addition, the compound protects against MDMA-induced damage by an unrelated mechanism.

http://www.ionchannels.org/showabstract.php?pmid=9647471
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The N-methyl-D-aspartate (NMDA) receptor antagonist, dextrorphan, prevents the neurotoxic effects of 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine (MDMA) in rats.

...Dextrorphan totally prevented the serotonin-depleting effects of MDMA in the straitum, with a lessened but still significant blockade noted in the hippocampus and cortex. These findings may provide a clue to the molecular events underlying MDMA-induced neurotoxicity.

http://www.ionchannels.org/showabstract.php?pmid=2574428
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In my limited experience, the anti-depressant effects of low-dose ketamine are radically different than anything else I've tried (5-HTP, St. John's Wort etc.). It seems to be going straight to the source. It seems to allow me to dissociate from negative thought patterns and remember more positive, natural ways of thinking. The dissociative effects also allow me to take a step back from my ego and combine well with meditation. There seem to be parallels between the state of "detachment" advocated by many spiritual traditions and the state of "dissociation" produced by low dose ketamine. I guess time will tell.
 
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e1evene1even said:
Has anyone tried taking Ketamine before taking a traditional psychedelic, to help ease the come-up?
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I've done this with salvia to great effect, so I'm sure it would work well with a traditional psychedelic. Ketamine comes on so quickly when using it IM that even when I dissolve psilocin into the ketamine and inject them both at the same time the ket buffers the lagging stimulation of the psilocin onset quite well. (This combo is a really wild ride, even moreso than ketamine and IM DMT in my experience (note that I've always tripped on psilocin alone at >10mg oral before the combined injection, which uses >5mg psilo and > 50mg ket)). I personally would combine ketamine with a more complementary, highly introspective tryptamine, not a phenethylamine, as my 2C-E/ket combo was not that spectacular. Still, others claim to have had good experiences with the latter combo.
 
e1evene1even said:
Has anyone tried taking Ketamine before taking a traditional psychedelic
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Very interesting idea. Worth a try I'd say.
 
_Xorkoth_ med combo

Hello, I've been searching the intraweb some time for an answer but I cannot find it, so now I've finally registred here. I've been taking 500 mg's of Disulfiram(Antabuse) once a day for a week and Im wondering if its bad to combine Disulfiram with Ketamine? Does it weaken the effects of Ketamine, will i choke on my own vomit or is it "safe"? Thanks in advance.
 
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^ Do not take my word for it, but my guess is that it is safe.

AFAIK, Disulfiram is a poison (IMO) that prevents the proper metabolism of alcohol, increasing the consncentration of aldehyde in the blood.

Ketamine is not affected by the enzyme that disuferam blocks (dehydrogenase?).

I suppose it would be dangerous to take GHB-related things with that poison, though.
 
^ Yeah you are pretty much correct. I've read up on Disulfiram and Ketamine on Wikipedia and lots of other places. Lots of different searches on the combination too. Just wanted to reinforce what i learned (didn't find anything about it being dangerous, didn't find anything saying it was safe either, so asuming its safe since i cannot find any information about it?) by asking around here, since some people here seem to know what they're talking about. Copying some text from Wikipedia:

"Disulfiram should not be administered to patients who take certain stimulant drugs and antidepressants. Disulfiram has been found to inhibit the enzyme dopamine-beta-hydroxylase, blocking the metabolism of dopamine into norepinephrine. Combined with the dopamine agonist and/or reuptake effect of stimulants, this can cause a dramatic rise in synaptic dopamine levels, resulting in sleeplessness, paranoia, and, in extreme cases, stimulant psychosis.

Drugs that are known to interfere with the dopamine / norepinephrine system include, but are not limited to:

* Bupropion (Wellbutrin IR/SR/XL, Buspar, Amfebutamone)
* Amphetamines (Adderall, Dexedrine, etc.)
* Methylphenidate (Ritalin, Concerta, Focalin, etc.)
* Cocaine (Occasionally used in dental procedures, and a known substance of abuse.)

The metabolism of other drugs may be inhibited by disulfiram, increasing their potential for toxic effects. Drugs known to have adverse effects when used concurrently with disulfiram include amitriptyline, isoniazid, and metronidazole (all with acute changes in mental state), phenytoin, some benzodiazepines, morphine, pethidine, and barbiturates."

My english isn't the best so there might be something i've missed here. Thanks again.



*Edit #1

Oh and i was also wondering about tolerance, say i'd take 100-150mg today, would i have to up my dose alot to reach the same level tomorrow?

*Edit #2

Might also add that i use Propiomazine (Propavan) to sleep, did some searches on this too without finding any info. Just making sure im not doing anything stupid. Better safe then sorry ;)
 
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E1, and others interested...using ketamine to start a trip is FREAKING AMAZING.

Last night I snorted 70mg of the S isomer and took a bong rip right after licking 14mg of 4-HO-DMT.

I promptly crawled to my bed and passed out (I don't know if this makes sense to anybody in regards to K, but - KkkkTHUNK....kkkkTHUNK....kkkkTHUNK...).

I woke up about 30 mins later tripping very hard on the psilocin. I actually never swallowed the psilocin, I just licked the 14mg and swished a small amount of water in my mouth to let it absorb sublingually.

I began to squirm in ecstasy as LOVE manifested itself over my bed and entered my body, cleansing me.

Beautiful World.
 
A friend of mine recently mentioned that his family gives ketamine pills to their dog to make him pass out for long car rides. Does anyone think there is any reality to this?
 
GreenMachine said:
A friend of mine recently mentioned that his family gives ketamine pills to their dog to make him pass out for long car rides. Does anyone think there is any reality to this?
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Its certainly possible as Ketamine is widely used as a veterinary anesthetic. Is Ketamine scheduled in your country? It seems a bit silly to have scheduled substances just to give to your pets. :\
 
GreenMachine said:
A friend of mine recently mentioned that his family gives ketamine pills to their dog to make him pass out for long car rides. Does anyone think there is any reality to this?
Click to expand...

Its certainly possible as Ketamine is widely used as a veterinary anesthetic. Is Ketamine scheduled in your country? It seems a bit silly to have scheduled substances just to give to your pets. :\
 
e1evene1even said:
Its certainly possible as Ketamine is widely used as a veterinary anesthetic. Is Ketamine scheduled in your country? It seems a bit silly to have scheduled substances just to give to your pets. :\
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Well I live in the states, so yes it is scheduled, but I thought it sounded funny because I had never heard of ketamine being administered to animals by anyone other than a vet.
 
Does anyone know? RE: ketamine in vials

I'm really concerned. Is this shit still good? The liquid looks clear and it was made in Argentina by a recognized drug company. Is ketamine in vials safe to use after the expiration date 06/06 listed on the vials? I want to have a nice trip like a controled OBE not a trip to the morgue.
 
So long as it is sealed, then there should not be a problem. Pharma. companies are required to put expiration dates on their drugs by law, however the drugs rarely do "expire" on that date, and generally, at worst, simply become inactive.
 
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