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The Big and Dandy HBWR/MGS/LSA Thread (Archive start - 4-14-2008)

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I have no personal experience of these seeds, but have seen them sold as something like "HWBR - madagascar variety" in many ethnobotanical catalogues where it is claimed their alkaloid content is 2-3 times that of normal HBWR (from Hawaii, South Asia, etc). They are also more expensive. Would be interesting to know whether their side-effects are the same.

Om Shanti
 
the original HBWR seeds are the best. Others are fine but there LSA content is less consistent (some seeds are reallyp otent while others are minorly potent).
 
rammstein2k said:
Hey everyone.

So I saw these on a website and it said that a typical dosage for an LSA trip would be 3-6 seeds. That's insane! Does anyone have any previous experience with this type of seed for LSA?
Click to expand...



I too would like to add to this. Does anyone know anything about the Tahitian (?) strain of HBWR? I too have heard (or seen it advertised on two different sites) that these seeds are more potent, though there is little info about them around.

On an unrelated topic does anyone have any info on the B. caapi 50x extract? I'm getting 5 grams but have no idea of the potency or the dose, of that shit. It was rather expensive, so I am hoping at least 5 doses? Is that feasible?

inwards
 
rammstein2k said:
Hey everyone.

So I saw these on a website and it said that a typical dosage for an LSA trip would be 3-6 seeds. That's insane! Does anyone have any previous experience with this type of seed for LSA?
Click to expand...



I too would like to add to this. Does anyone know anything about the Tahitian (?) strain of HBWR? I too have heard (or seen it advertised on two different sites) that these seeds are more potent, though there is little info about them around.

On an unrelated topic does anyone have any info on the B. caapi 50x extract? I'm getting 5 grams but have no idea of the potency or the dose, of that shit. It was rather expensive, so I am hoping at least 5 doses? Is that feasible?

inwards
 
I tried Madagascar HBW seeds on 3 or 4 occasions. I've also used HBW of Hawaiian origin many, many times. The Madagascar seeds were as potent, if not more potent than some Hawaiian HBW seeds I tried. I've heard that India and Ghana have very weak, shitty HBW. Dunno anything about Tahiti seeds.
 
You'll notice a huge variation online in prices for HBW seeds. Some sites will sell the seeds for much, much cheaper than others. However, sometimes these ultra cheap seeds are really shitty. I hear beware of the India strain which sometimes goes for really cheap. The Hawaiia and Madagascar strains have been the most reliable for me.

Prices on HBW have varied for me from as cheap as 100 seeds for $25 to as pricey as 50 seeds for $20. The site that sold 50 seeds for $20 was WELL worth it as their seeds were fresh and straight from Hawaiia and extremelyyy potent. $20 aint bad considering 5-10 seeds can make for a satisfying trip and 10-20 seeds can be a balls to the wall trip (especially if you've preloaded on an MAOI).

Make sure to store your HBW in a cold environment like a fridge and in a sealed container protected from air. It's very important that Lysergamides (the alkaloids in the seeds) be kept away from light, heat, air and moisture.

I wish more research would be done on the effects of the individual alkaloids in HBW/MG/Rivea. For some reason Hoffman focused on Ergine which is actually one of the more boring, sedating components of the seeds. It leaves me to wonder how much Isoergine, Ergonovine, Methylergonovine and the other seed alkaloids contribute to the psychedelic effects...
 
I wonder if the prescription MAOI, Moclobemide, could potentiate HBW in a manner similar to preloading on Rue/Harmala...
 
There is a lot of debate about this. I was from the school-of-thought that held since ergine was so boring, the d-lysergic acid a-hydroxyethylamide, and other alkaloids acted in synergy to produce results. I was further convinced this was true because only d-ergine and d-isoergine are water-soluble. I reasoned that since water extracts (I made) were always sedating, and far less psychedelic...that only ergine was removed in a water-wash...and because the trip was always so narcotic in action...this proved that other alkaloids moderate the effects.

But the Peter Webster came along with the theory that the best trips come when all of the alkaloids break down into ergine, which then reaches a 50/50 equilibrium (over time) with d-isoergine. It is this mixture of d-ergine/isoergine that causes the full psychedelic effects of the brew commonly consumed in Central America (those guys never eat the seeds, they always do a water wash.)

I really don't know which is true. Most of my ecstatic experiences involve the whole seed, and most of the times I made an extract...the trip was blah and somatic in nature...little psychedelic effect. But there was one water-wash trip I had that was different than all others. It was a fully visionary experience that was also free of most of the nausea from eating the seeds, and the somatic effects I had always associated with drinking a water-wash. Perhaps with that brew, I soaked for the right time...and reached the equilibrium. Perhaps brewing potent ergoline-containing brews from morning glory seed is a lost art...or an unknown art in the West.

I don't know which is correct, but I am beginning to believe there is something to Mr. Webster's theory and would also wish there be more study.

The Wizard said:
I wish more research would be done on the effects of the individual alkaloids in HBW/MG/Rivea. For some reason Hoffman focused on Ergine which is actually one of the more boring, sedating components of the seeds. It leaves me to wonder how much Isoergine, Ergonovine, Methylergonovine and the other seed alkaloids contribute to the psychedelic effects...
Click to expand...
 
Wow, Morningglory, you seem to really know your stuff. I am impressed. If I ever do Morning Glory again I’ll prob. simply put the ground up seeds in capsules or mix them with water and Koolaid and chug it. The last few times I did Morning Glory I did a water extraction which gave me no nausea but mild effects.

Although there was one time that I did a water extraction that I got much better results. Dunno why. Maybe because I combined 2 diff. strains of Morning Glory (Heavenly Blue and Flying Saucers I think) and maybe I took a higher dose that time. Like maybe 15 or 20 grams. Also that time I ate a good bit of Bali Kratom and got a wonderful synergy (Kratom and LSA’s mix OHHH so well) I’ve read that when doing a water extraction the longer you soak the seeds, the more potent the end result is.

Burpee brand feels nontoxic and has never caused me nausea. The worst nausea I ever got was from Martha Stewart brand. Rite Aid carries some brand of MG during the springtime that also felt like it was nontoxic.

Do HBW/MG/Rivea contain the same alkaloids just at different concentrations or do they actually contain some compounds that are unique to each type of seed? I’ve heard that a MG trip is more visual and stimulating than HBW, which most people regard as more sedating and stoning and less visual.

The majority of my LSA experience is with HBW. I wonder how combining HBW/MG would work out….I can vouch for the fact that MAOI preloading can make LSA-containing seeds a LOT more intense.

One peculiar thing is I could swear I’ve gotten mildly relaxing effects from smoking the shells of HBW seeds. Yet, the consensus with LSA’s tends to be that they’re destroyed by heat…Hmmm
 
I've compiled a list of references to the effects and/or dosage range for some of the Lysergamides in HBW/MG/Rivea:

LSA (Ergine):

1.) A potency 1/10 to 1/30th that of LSD. It has some similarities in effect to LSD, but is generally considered much less stimulating and can be sedating.
2.) Hofmann tried an I.M. injection of 500micrograms of LSA and found the effects medium-strong. Hofmann later reports that the active oral dose of LSA at "2 to 5 milligrams".
3.) An I.M. administration of a 500 microgram dose led to a tired, dream state with an inability to maintain clear thoughts. After a short period of sleep, the effects were gone and normal baseline was recovered within 5 hours."

Isoergine:

"No entheogenic effect was noticed by Hofmann after taking 2 milligrams of isoergine, although sedative symptoms similar to LSA inebriation were prominent. Hofmann's description of perceiving the 'unreality and complete meaninglessness of the outside world' after taking 2 millgrams of isoergine (Hofmann 1963), however, sounds like the paradoxical depressant effect experienced commonly with the threshold doses of psilocybin and other
entheogens and it is possible that isoergine is entheogenic at higher doses."

Ergonovine:

Has LSD-like action at l2-10 milligrams. Clinical dosages are ten times lower.

Methylergonovine:

Has LSD-like actions above 2 milligrams. Clinical dosages are ten times lower
 
New Techniques

1. Introduction

Swim has tried Morning Glory (MG) on different occasions, always with great succes. Swim believes this is due to a proper cold water extraction (WITH mineral water and Lemon juice) in combination with a tiny smoke of MJ afterwards.
Swim doesn't enjoy Hawaian Baby Woodroose (HWBR) for some reason, it makes him tired and he doesn't get any good sensations or visuals. So Swim sticks to plain old MG.

2. New techniques

Altough Swim is happy with the coldwater technique, he feels the urge to experiment and search for other methods. He wants to share these experiments so he can help fellow psychonauts explore their minds using freely available seeds.

3. Method

Swim will make a post in this thread everytime he want's to try a new experiment. One post will describe the technique, another the results.

Swim hopes he can help fellow psychonauts!
Reply With Quote
 
Rasberry Jam Experiment

Rasberry Jam Experiment

Ingredients:
10 gr Morning Glory (Heavenly Blue, viable)
1 teaspoon of Gingerpowder
3 tablespoons of Rasberry Diet Jam

Preparation:
10 grams of MG are grinded in a blender.
1 teaspoon of Ginger added to the mixture and stirred.
Powder mixture is slowly blended with a spoon in the Jam.
A bit of mineral water was added
Jelly is put in fridge for 1 hour

Using:

Setting will be Swim's room. Swim will be alone in his room and he's not planning of leaving his room during the experience.
To be continued...
 
Hm, I'm actually debating whether I should do LSA again. I was thinking back to my last experience (about 6 months ago) and it really was an amazing experience. The most spiritual experience, ever. It was extremely blissful like an ecstasy experience as well. But due to the 3 hour nausea (literally sprawled over the toilet), I decided I wouldn't repeat the experience.

Beside weed, what do you guys suggest I take beforehand to reduce the nausea?
 
My raspberry experiment failed!

Just take 10gr of MG, grind them. Put them in a glass of mineral water in the fridge, stir, wait, stir (about an hour). Drink it all, including the mush. Wait 20 minutes, smoke some bud ( a little) and you will have no nausea....
 
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