Suboxone Users

[sixpartseven]

Hello all, I was recently put on 8mg suboxone, once a day. I was 8 days clean off a 4 year daily heroin habit. The first couple days I dosed I personally had issues with the pill dissolving in my mouth, and still do to some extent. It takes a long time for it to dissolve (30mins-1hr) and it's hard to even tell if it is all dissolved I usually look in the mirror.

First off, congrats. Good to hear another one has made it to this side.

medicine cabinet another user told me to keep it under my tongue for about 1 hour or less after it dissolves, which I think helps absorb a lot of the buprenorphine in the juices/saliva built up in the mouth. I was just wondering if anyone on this forum that takes suboxone has creative ways to take the pill, crush it up and put it in the under (faster absorption ?), etc.

From my experience, 'medicine cabinet' knows what hes talking about, so try out his advice and see how that works for you, if it doesnt, keep reading.

I snort my suboxone on a daily basis. I cant stand the taste so there is no way you will ever get me to put that shit in my mouth again, unless maybe they come out with some better flavors that dissolve faster (search for thread titled "new suboxone pill" for related reading.)

I know this could probably be fucking my tolerance, but it doesnt really matter. Im in the process off tapering down now, and I just have to take in to account that I snort it and Im still able to taper properly. I started at 12mg 3 months ago and am down to 1mg currently, and its true what they say, less is definitely more.

Another thing about snorting, I dont know what type of long term damage daily insuffulation could be doing to my nose/sinus so I dont know if its a healthier alternative, but I do know bioavailability is higher, so you do get a little bit more bang for your buck.

Now to another question/s I have, I talked with some using buddies that told me they had no opiates in there system at the time they snorted/shot the pill (Suboxone) and received effects from the buprenorphine. I personally have not snorted or shot the pill but was wondering if you do NOT have opiates in your system then you will feel the buprenorphine because it's the dominate opiate grabbing on to the receptor and not throwing anything off thus no precipitated withdrawal, correct?

Snorting suboxone after using other opiates, the worst that will happen is youll feel about 20 - 30 minutes of mild withdrawal (mild shits and mild discomfort)

IVing suboxone is a very delicate subject. The short answer is, if you are still using other opiates (heroin in both of our cases, which btw I am not still using), yes you can be thrown into nasty withdrawals. If, however, you wait 36 - 48 hours after your lost dose of heroin and then shoot your suboxone, chances are you will be safe and not experience withdrawal. Now, if you are not using any other opiates, but use suboxone daily, you shouldnt go in to any type of withdrawal after IVing a dose.

The thing with IV use of suboxone is, it is incredibly dangerous. Withdrawals should really be the least of your worries. If you miss, I dont even want to describe the possible results of that (check Phrozens beautiful "suboxone/buprenorphine" thread for further reading. Lots of great info.)

I also was wondering if anyone here has used suboxone for 3-4 days then taken a break and went back on to achieve effects again? Personally I achieved and am still achieving effects but this is only my 7th day taking 8mg/once a day. The effects I personally receive happen about 2 hours after I take the pill. Smaller pupils, a sense of well being, energy, irritability, constipation, and some glowing / feeling of a small dose of 400-600 tramadol (I guess). I have also heard dosing in smaller amounts 2-4mg (suboxone) gives better effects?

Yes, suboxone will still work if you take a couple days break from it and the amazing part is you wont even need to raise your dosage. The dosage you were on before you took the break, possibly even less (less is more is an understatement with this drug, its incredible really), should still work as it did before. Its an incredibly dynamic drug, to which the complete details of how it works and why and when it works I will never fully understand. Its one of those things that if you did understand it, to me, would take away the beauty of it.

I have heard for some people they do not feel anything (euphoria/opiate characteristics), and again I was put on the drug NOT in withdrawal so for everyone out there who thinks you need to be in withdrawal, and websites that say you need to be in withdrawal to go on the drug, that is bullshit at least in my situation my doctor wrote the script after I told him I was 8 days clean from all substances.

Well, first, you were 8 days clean, which means you were technically in withdrawal at one point, but took yourself out of it. What they mean is, you cant still have other opiates in your system when you first take bupe. Since you were 8 days clean, obviously you didnt. They say you have to be in withdrawal because most people go in a lot sooner than you did. I was in 12 hours after my last dose of heroin, which is similar to other people. So as I said, you were in withdrawal, and then some, before you took your first dose.

About getting high on Bupe, people with little to no tolerance should have no trouble getting "high" on bupe. I know when I barely had a tolerance, I would get high from it. If you are opiate dependent, the most you will feel is a general feeling of well being with your first few doses, and from then on youll just feel normal.

Hope this helps you out. I dont know how many other people have responded in the time this took me to type this up, and I dont know if anyone else beat me to it because I just read your original question, but hey, it never heats to repeat information.

Anyways, good luck. If I think of anything else to add that Ive forgotten now, I will.

 

[thugpassion]

Iv never tasted a suboxone pill, but have bee on subutex for a number of years. Snorting fine lines of it is my favorite MOA, once Im on a low dose. And Iv found with buprenorphine less IS more......it still tastes like shit though.

 

[j3ong]

i use buprenorphine purely recreationally. its pretty fucking serious. anyway, if youre sick of waiting for it to dissolve, just break it up and put it under your tongue. i usually just chew it up and swish it around. its unpleasant, but its way quicker. like massively quicker. if you dont lke the taste of it you may as well just get it over with.

 

[thugpassion]

For best sub-linguel results; crush pill and put under tounge.

 

[AlphaOdure]

Buprenorphine's varied pharmacology can account for why most users typically believe that less is more with this drug. Bupe's unique neurological action results in many added effects in doses above approximately 4 - 8 mg. I'll explain...

Bupe has action at ORL1 nociceptin receptors, acting as both a partial agonist and antagonist. Additionally, Buprenorphine's active metabolite, Norbuprenorphine, displays action as a full agonist at these same receptor sites. In low doses, this can result in a novel, anti-depressant like effect; but when sudden, higher doses are used during maintenance therapy, this can result in feelings of lethargy, sedation, and mild dysphoria.

Buprenorphine also inhibits the reuptake of serotonin and (to a lesser degree) norepinephrine from the synapse, preventing transporter cells (DAT and NT, respectively) from "reusing" these neurotransmittors. The result is a slight increase in serotonin and norepinephrine levels. Whether or not this pharmacological effect is a direct action of Buprenorphine or an indirect action of some of its other neurological processes is not known. Either way, this action can result in mood enhancing effects at low maintenance doses, while concededly contributing to adverse reactions at higher maintence doses.

 

[GlassAss420]

Yeah just eat or plug your suboxone I can't imagine snorting that much material is good for your nose, esp everyday. IV'ing it can kill you, its right in the sheet you get from the pharmacy, I know, who cares what they say but I IV'ed it twice by itself with ok results, felt good even. Then another time I IV'ed it before I was truly sick and I felt like I had just fucked up and was gonna die for abbout 15 min to half an hour, I mean really thought I'd done it and was gonna die laying there on my bed over shooting some stupid pill. Esp avoid shooting it with benzos or coke, man hope that kid who always iv's benzos dosen't read that and feel compelled to go out and IV some benzos with suboxone, really it says right in the directions that combination IV like has caused instant deaths.

Don't IV the shit really just eat it or plug it if you can't stand the taste, I got new grape tasting stuff made by Troche lately and I don't mind the taste, not sure where else its available, it wasn't at Walgreens here just this small off name pharmacy.. weird.

 

[motts]

Thanks for responses everyone. So far being on this drug a little over a month, it substantially stops cravings. But at least for me when I am on 8mg say compaired to 2-4mg, I cannot urinate and my bowels basically don't move. I don't know if anyone else has experienced this.

What I usually do now is put the pull under my tongue and use the tip to move it around...making it dissolve faster, but keeping the juices in there for up to an hour. I don't know if this happens with others...some days I feel the bupe, other days nothing....very strange and spotty.

As far as a grape flavor still getting the orange ones, I had no idea there were different flavors?

 

[Carl Landrover]

Thanks for responses everyone. So far being on this drug a little over a month, it substantially stops cravings. But at least for me when I am on 8mg say compaired to 2-4mg, I cannot urinate and my bowels basically don't move. I don't know if anyone else has experienced this.

What I usually do now is put the pull under my tongue and use the tip to move it around...making it dissolve faster, but keeping the juices in there for up to an hour. I don't know if this happens with others...some days I feel the bupe, other days nothing....very strange and spotty.

As far as a grape flavor still getting the orange ones, I had no idea there were different flavors?

If you split your doses up or if you don't want to split it up throughout the day, cut the pill into little pieces and take them right after each other. The smaller pieces dissolve very quickly. I have the 2mg ones and am only on 2mg a day now, but I never take more than .25 (.5mg) at a time. It usually dissolves completely within 2-3 minutes tops (or even faster).

When I was over 4 mg, I did notice more difficulty using the bathroom, occasionally feeling very tired yet difficulty sleeping, among a few other slightly annoying effects. As I've moved down in dose (was at 8-10mg originally) I've noticed I'v felt as if I can feel real happiness more. Sounds kind of odd, but if I feel pleased about something, I can feel good more naturally on lower doses, almost like it was partially blocked when taking more.

 

[ellua]

Thanks for responses everyone. So far being on this drug a little over a month, it substantially stops cravings. But at least for me when I am on 8mg say compaired to 2-4mg, I cannot urinate and my bowels basically don't move. I don't know if anyone else has experienced this.

What I usually do now is put the pull under my tongue and use the tip to move it around...making it dissolve faster, but keeping the juices in there for up to an hour. I don't know if this happens with others...some days I feel the bupe, other days nothing....very strange and spotty.

As far as a grape flavor still getting the orange ones, I had no idea there were different flavors?

wow, for the past 2-3 weeks i thought i was getting a UTI, it hurts to pee... i just realized, it started up when i got on the suboxone maintenence again. come to think of it, i had the same feeling when i was in rehab/detox, i could never pee right, it always got cut off before i was done & thats what makes it hurt... >.<
it's still going on, any ways to get rid of it?
i think drinking a lot of water helps, but i'm not positive...

 

[AlphaOdure]

^ ^ ^
This is a common problem w/ bupe. Since opioids relax internal, smooth muscle; this results in constipation. OTC laxatives could provide minor relief, but some people don't respond well to them. You can also try daily fiber supplements.

Fortunately, most doctors who prescribe suboxone are also trained to deal w/ the extreme constipation it can cause. So talk to your doctor and he should give you a Rx for an appropriate strengthed laxative.

 

[RockWell]

I had extreme constipation for about a week. The Dr never did give me a Rx for a laxative. Worse feeling ever.

 

[AlphaOdure]

Yeah just eat or plug your suboxone

Umm, No. Have you bothered to read any of this thread at all? Buprenorphine has very low bioavailability when taken orally ( 2 - 15% ); it goes through extensive first pass metabolism. There aren't even any bupe pills on the pharmaceutical market that are manufactured for oral consumption- they're all sublingual tablets.

Snorting can also be OK; but i've found it almost identical to the sublingual method.. if not even a bit weaker (it does bring the peak effects on faster though). Some people believe that snorting suboxone will make the naloxone active, but this is false--bioavailability of insufflated naloxone is very low. And even if it weren't, naloxone has less affinity for mu opioid receptors compared to buprenorphine. This means that even when IV'd in combination w/ bupe, naloxone will have little to no effect in doses below 2 mg (thats the amount present in a 8 mg suboxone pill). Its even highly questioned in the medical community as to whether or not naloxone would be effective in reversing the effects of bupe in the case of an overdose. Diprenorphine could theoritically reverse the effects of highly competitive opioid agonist drugs; but this medication isn't available in most medical hospitals.

The naloxone in suboxone is basically used as a scare-tactic to discourage IV use.

 

[ellua]

^ ^ ^
This is a common problem w/ bupe. Since opioids relax internal, smooth muscle; this results in constipation. OTC laxatives could provide minor relief, but some people don't respond well to them. You can also try daily fiber supplements.

Fortunately, most doctors who prescribe suboxone are also trained to deal w/ the extreme constipation it can cause. So talk to your doctor and he should give you a Rx for an appropriate strengthed laxative.

i was talking about pee, not poo. but i had that problem in detox, went 6 days without a bm, eek.

 

[sixpartseven]

Thanks for responses everyone. So far being on this drug a little over a month, it substantially stops cravings. But at least for me when I am on 8mg say compaired to 2-4mg, I cannot urinate and my bowels basically don't move. I don't know if anyone else has experienced this.

Yeah its really common. I usually only shit about 2 times a week, and I achieve that by letting myself withdrawal a little bit, usually on tuesdays and thursdays (I have it planned it. Pathetic, I know.) I dont let myself become "sick", but just to the point where Im uncomfortable and my bowels begin to move. Once they start to move, take care of business then take your dose.

 

[LinZ-E]

^^IForgett, you are taking 1mg sub via insufflation daily, do you do this one time a day or do you do this in intervals throughout the day?

I have gotten down to 2mg/day of sub and am out - been on SMT for almost 2 years 'til the well ran dry (from 16mg-8mg, stable at 8mg majority of time). However, I do have some 'done if needed, but think I might try to make the jump to 0.

 

[sixpartseven]

^ once a day, in the morning before work.

 

[Dr. Beat]

YES SMALLER DOSES = MORE PLEASANT HIGH!

i dose 2mg twice - three times a day. i notice that the naloxone DOES actually inhibit (i think the s0-called amateur wanable chemists are all wrong) and i trust my dr. and he says i will feel best if i take it in smaller doses. I am prescribed 16mg a day, but i only really need a half of an 8t at most.

i've been on suboxone for an entire year now and have no plans to quit. I feel better than ever, I am off heroin coke n' meth. i don't drink much, and i feel sicky when i smoke cigarrets. (THESE I CONSIDER ALL GOOD THINGS!)


I take three prescriptions and smoke weed daily. a small bit of suboxone and some weeed feels great. IF you are in ACTIVE withdrawals take a LOT of suboxone and then smoke weed.

i remember my withdrawals and they were awful, but i felt more alive in a way like i do now. taking too much suboxone just makes you really tired. a small amount is kinda stimulating, and a good mix with some adderall too.


I don't think ill ever quit suboxone. The last time I tried I just got sick to my stomach, had nightmares and depression, felt crappy etc... I'd rather just take a small dose of suboxone than have to be on some anti=depressants again!

spot on man

The more i take, the worse i feel, so even thou i am on 4mg a day, i take only 2mg every 2nd day, to keep the level of BUP down in my body.

In low doses, BUP hits MU receptors, and blocks kappa receptors - that makes you feel stoned (MU) and high (kappa blocked)

In medium doses, BUP hits Mu and blocks Kappa, and also blocks Delta receptors - delta receptors have alot to do with MOOD. Blocking delta receptors makes you feel flatter, no mania, no 'natural' highs (when something good in life happens).

In high doses, BUP does everything above, and also hits the ORL1 receptor - which is REALLY BAD. The ORL1 receptor lowers seratonin, dopamine, noradrenaline, and histamine, and worst of all, stops the MU receptor working!!!

and because BUP (and NorBUP) have a really long half life, if you take BUP everyday (even 4mg a day) the level in your blood (and brain) go up and up and up till after a few weeks the ORL1 receptor is activated most of the time, making you feel flat, depressed, irriated, ect.

So with BUP less is better to all the people out there taking high doses every day !!!!

 

[ellua]

^^ good to know, thanks

 

[jasoncrest]

spot on man

The more i take, the worse i feel, so even thou i am on 4mg a day, i take only 2mg every 2nd day, to keep the level of BUP down in my body.

In low doses, BUP hits MU receptors, and blocks kappa receptors - that makes you feel stoned (MU) and high (kappa blocked)

In medium doses, BUP hits Mu and blocks Kappa, and also blocks Delta receptors - delta receptors have alot to do with MOOD. Blocking delta receptors makes you feel flatter, no mania, no 'natural' highs (when something good in life happens).

In high doses, BUP does everything above, and also hits the ORL1 receptor - which is REALLY BAD. The ORL1 receptor lowers seratonin, dopamine, noradrenaline, and histamine, and worst of all, stops the MU receptor working!!!

and because BUP (and NorBUP) have a really long half life, if you take BUP everyday (even 4mg a day) the level in your blood (and brain) go up and up and up till after a few weeks the ORL1 receptor is activated most of the time, making you feel flat, depressed, irriated, ect.

So with BUP less is better to all the people out there taking high doses every day !!!!

Then why do I get higher (in an opiate-like way) when I take higher doses?

When I had no tolerance, 2mg would do nothing at all, but 8mg would make me warm, itchy, feeling incredibly good, stimulated than noddy, etc......
And now, more than 3 years after, when sometimes I lower my daily dosage to 1mg/day during 3 days, and then shoot a 8mg, I get a good opiate high.....

 

[motts]

Hello everyone,

I am here to talk about what I feel after about 2 months and half of suboxone use. I do not know what to say. I believe the ONLY good aspect of this drug is that I rarely have cravings, if someone brings up opiates etc. My mind does not automatically connect to previous using days or moments, and make start craving opiates.

As far as bowels I have stayed on literally 4mg, 2mg doses for both 1 week and 1/2 at a time, enough for the levels to go down to where the half-life would even out with my dose. Still hard to urinate at 4mg, but not 2mg I could urinate regularly. During these drops I experienced very little withdrawal, basically non noticeable to be honest, but done over 1 week 1/2 drops.

As far as bowels, since the first month on a steady 8mg a day, which still to this day unless you cut the pills in four quarters an 8mg will take basically one hour to dissolve and to receive all the bupe. Back to the bowels, taking 100mg of Docusate Sodium and 15mg Calcium sennosides, every morning, I still had heavy constipation. And certain times there was blood in the stool from just not going as regularly as I should be. Personally, I brought it up to two doctors which really brushed the comment aside?

And another note to the use of recreational suboxone, I do not really think there is such a thing unless you are totally opiate naive or taking this drug for the first couple weeks, BUT there is strange occurrence that does happen and I have talked with other users about this. Some days you will feel nothing off say any dose you take +8,4,2mg...other days...+8,4,2mg will get you completely stoned. Glossy eyes, energy, that "opiate feeling", but I would not call it a buzz.

So I dunno guys/gals something to think and discuss about, I think drug is still very new to people but seems like more and more people are getting on it. I am currently tapering off, but I kind of want to stay at a 1mg (can piss,shit, and do not feel high, which is what I did not want to feel in the first place) for a while because of the non-craving aspect. I really do not want to get back on dope but there is always that junkie mentality I would assume most of us have. And I have always liked the pure/clean aspect of having nothing in my body. Anyways take care to all.

Oh, and one more thing. On the days that the opiate "buzz", or whatever you want to call it does kick in. I find my personality changing into this irritable, rude, fuck the world type of guy, and people notice it, which isn't me. Just another side effect that pisses me off. Thanks again all!