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Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine FAQ & Megathread v2; 2010

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WOW! Mega-thread 8! Awesome!

mike_indy_317 said:
Im new to the board here but I have been on suboxone for about 8 months and i have been taken it like the doctor asks. Under the tounge I dont shoot it only because i got scared that i messed my arms up when i did shoot up other stuff.It still bothers me, sometimes I think i messed them up.

So i was on 2 a day 8 mgs for 5 months and now i have been on 1 and a quarter for 3 months and now he wants to go down to 1 and a half next month and wants the marijuana out of my system then too. I really dont want to go down more and its because i havent been taking 1 and a quarter every day sometimes i slip up and take the extra quarter or half.

I dont know why he wants to get rid of me so fast its not like im bothering him i go there once a month and im there for 20 minutes. Im just scared about going to 1 and half because ill take more then i should then ill run out and that always sucks i dont feel right without it its not like withdrawls its something diffrent for me its like depressing and im really weak.
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I suggest looking into finding another doctor, you have to jump through way too many hoops IMO. Also, have you ever though about snorting your subs? It is an awesome ROA and you will use much less. I snort mine and use half of what I would have to if I took them under the tongue. Try it out.

Also what was your habit prior to subs? 8mg is a high dose, a lot of us here on the boards don't really use more then 4mg daily. Also, sub doctors are notorious for over-prescribing. I am prescribed at 8mg 2x a day (coming off a 160mg daily oxy habit), but I only use about 2mg. I would try snorting them and droping your dose to 4mg a day, 2mg in the morning and 2mg later in the day. Give that a try and see how it goes. Less is more with subxone and you may find no difference in the way you are feeling with a lower dose snorted.

And welcome to bluelight! Hope to see you around and if you need to talk PM me when you get your post count up.
 
whats up fm183 yea I was looking for a place online to talk about suboxone and other stuff and this place is cool although I suck at using forums and threads I get lost.
My habit before suboxone was a lot of methadone but I would take whatever kind of painkillers were around I really loved Oxys the big 80 mg. green ones were my favorite id usually snort about 160 mgs of oxy a night plus smoking a lot of weed.

Then the next day it would diffrent because none of my dealers were consistent with what they sold when I could get some methadone id take 60 to 80 mgs if i had enough money and if i could only get 40 mgs id get some xanax to go with it.
Whenever some percs were around id get them but I never liked them that much.

I would smoke weed everyday and I have been for 5 years I was into a lot of other drugs in highschool then i got kicked out and a year after that I just took painkillers because I liked them the most. Ive done a lot of coke and ex did some crack I used to like acid and shrooms but not so much anymore. Ill always love my weed though and I think painpills will always be in the back of my mind.
 
^ I honestly think you can get buy on a much smaller suboxone dose. I was in w/d for most of the day today and only snorted .5mg of subs and had much relief. It's amazing how small of a dose can work so well. When broken up, .5mg looks like 4 grains of sand put holds the power of the universe.

Give what I said in my above post a shot tomorrow and see how it goes for you. It may take a bit of time to adjust but a smaller dose would do you much better. At a certain point, there isn't much difference in a few mg of subs IMO.

Granted everyone is different, but I think it's possible for you.
 
Ill try it tommorow I have taken two today and I hate taking it that way because no matter what my mouth always gets wet and I have a lot of liquid so i keep it in my mouth for 30 minutes because I want to try and get all of it but its probably just useless.

Alot of people told me that when you snort soboxone your only getting half of the pill I dont know if this is true or not also they say if you shoot it up you will go through withdrawls.
 
mike_indy_317 said:
Ill try it tommorow I have taken two today and I hate taking it that way because no matter what my mouth always gets wet and I have a lot of liquid so i keep it in my mouth for 30 minutes because I want to try and get all of it but its probably just useless.

Alot of people told me that when you snort soboxone your only getting half of the pill I dont know if this is true or not also they say if you shoot it up you will go through withdrawls.
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Snorting the BA% is higher then sublingual, but suboxone is only 2% active ingredient, so you are snorting a lot of filler, but like I said, I get much better results that way personally.

Also, it is possible to shoot suboxone. They say you can't because of the naloxone, but it's basically inactive, as the bupe beats it to the receptors. It's a scare tactic and was put in for approval by the FDA and such. Any type of precipitated w/d caused by suboxone is due to the buprenorphine not the naloxone. It has a higher affinity to the receptors, so if you take suboxone while on another opiate, the bupe will rip of any opiates attached to the receptors and put you into w/d until the bupe attaches. (Which isn't as bad as it seems, I've had precip w/d many times, and it's never unmanageable nor does it last longer then a hour or so.)
 
Dosing

So, I "hear" a lot of people talking about suboxone/bupe dosing, and when I previously posting about taking 8 mg people said I should consider a lower dose. I've always been of the mentality that more is more when it comes to pills... is this not true for Suboxone? I know about the ceiling effect at around 32 mgs, but will a lower dose do more than a higher dose? Or is it that I'm only feeling a small amount and the rest is waste? I'm confused on this subject. Anyone who can help out please do.
 
well, the ceiling dose is usually much lower than 32 mg. I think that it probably levels off somewhere around 8-16 mg though some people may find 32 mg to produce more effect than 16.

This also varies depending on what ROA you are using. Sublingual BA is about 30% according to the statistics here, so shooting 2.4 mg is equivalent to the sublingual 8 mg.
The reason people were telling you to use lower dosages, I believe, is because you were talking about I.M'ing or I.V'ing your subs if I remember correctly... shooting 8 mg would be = to roughly 32 mg sublingual. So if you are one of the people that gets more effect up to 32 mg, than yeah, I suppose 8 mg could be ok, but just remember, you'll gain tolerance fast, and after probably 2 days, it wont do shit, other than relieve withdrawals.
Most people, (myself included) find buprenorphine only really produces a buzz when you lower your tolerance significantly. Before I relapsed recently, I was shooting about .15 mg at a time, and I can say that it definately gave me a better effect than when I was shooting even 2 mg a day. I've heard people say that the reason for this is that more norbuprenorphine (the metabolite responsible for euphoria) is able to take effect at lower dosages,, because there is less buprenorphine to antagonize it, whereas at higher dosages, the buprenorphine sort of cancels it out. I'm not sure how true this is, but it makes sense if you think about it. If I'm giving out false information guys, feel free to correct me.
 
that's exactly what i'm talking about. smaller doses have the same function but with less side effects, though dosage always varies between individuals.

for instance, after i've done a certain amount, the psychological part remains the same, but the side effects only continue to increase.
 
This sucks Im always really tense nowadays for some reason my muscles are always really tight and they hurt like hell. Even after work I still dont loosen up I just get more tense and weed isnt helping that much, maybe a massage would help or some muscle relaxers but I dont think my doc will let me get those.

One time I told him about how I was having panic attacks and I really was there were alot of things going on at that time like my dad getting lung cancer. I told my doc I was having family problems and he asked if I was married I said no and he said well then how can you have family problems I was like what are you talking about.

I told him about my dad getting cancer and how me and him have been fighting and him and my mom are divorced and fighting over money and property and how this has all been affecting me and causing me to have panic attacks. All he said to me was youll tough it out, it was just ridiculous.
 
Suboxone pills in Spain are white, the same hexagonal shape but white. I think it's the same flavour "lemon-lime" (awful by the way, and I love lime-lemonade:\).
I was firstly prescribed 4mg/day (low habit of H, but I coudn't mantain by the money and the horrible holes and scars in my veins, I live with my parents, no job... u_u), and then I decided to taper to 2mg/day, because I was starting to IV it, then I read older suboxone megathreads and try with lower dosage and I realised that with doses betwen 0.7-0.3 mg the "full" effects come much earlier and were better.
Actually I'm trying to quit IVing (so fucking hard for me, maybe because sometimes I use to mix with 15-30mg of zolpidem and IVed it gives some sensations that I really like, or maybe because simply I like it and it's hard to leave that "ritual"..) and try to snort 1mg or 2mg sublingual.
My 2 cents.
 
Snugg said:
Man. I'm starting subs next week.... And I'm going to be honest.

...I'm scared fucking SHITLESS, man.

----------------
Now playing: Aesop Rock - Shovel
via FoxyTunes
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Don't be. Suboxone is wonderful. It may seem intimidating at first, I know I didn't really want to start on them when I did. But I am happier now that I have. I don't have to struggle daily to get my fix and support 2 addict (myself and fiance) with habits in the $120 a day range.

Once you make the jump and get into the habit of suboxone things will change. For the better. I feel so much better on subs then I do on oxy. My head is clear and I am just in an all around better mood.

Good luck to you, and if you need anything, PM, we can talk.
 
Thanks for the info

Thanks for the input on Sub doses. Now I understand what people mean about lower doses, and come to think of it when I was snorting suboxone, 2mg would fuck me up in a really nice way. I also didn't even think about the tolerance thing. I guess since I never did heroin regularly enough to build a tolerance I never even considered that I would quickly build a bupe tolerance from daily usage. I R SMRT. After all the advice people gave me and the bad experiences I've had IMming suboxone (I know, bad girl... so spank me), I'm gonna lay off the subs for a while and then maybe return to snorting. The only thing that stops me from doing it is the burn and the NASTY orange drain-cleaner drip. I think I'll head on over to trip reports and see if I can find some info on plugging subs... you can't taste through your butthole!
 
i miss iving my bupe so much. i went bonkers on phenazepam and now my gf gives me 4mg a day. i plug it, still. i miss making 1 mg last all day and the needle took the cravings away. now i have cravings, like right now i want SOMETHING. i used to just take a .3mg chip and slam it, smoke a cig and be fine. maybe i can start plugging small amounts and get that feeling????

i usually sniff like 1mg in the morning and drink coffee, then shit my brains out and plug the remaining 3mg.

you think i should be plugging the IV doses? i mean doesnt it have a 90% BA? no way is it gonna hit as fast, but bupe never did. so why do i feel like getting high? ill try tomorrow plugging 1mg 4 times a day. i think i could do that. ok, homey, lets do this.
 
why can't you I.V it anymore, is someone checking for track marks, or do you just want to save your veins? (btw, I'm not trying to encourage it, just curious.)

chi.christina,
bupe has a long half life. it sounds like you don't have a physical addiction to the buprenorphine, so if I were you (boy i wish i was, I would just STOP taking it for a long time) I would stay off the subs for a week. then sniff 1 mg, or shoot .3 mg, and you should get a nice high. don't just wait two days, because it has a 36 hour half life.

snugg,
don't be afraid to start on the suboxone, it could really work out for you. I don't know what kind of habit you've got now, but if it's not too bad, you might even get a nice buzz out of it. My advice would be to stay as low as you can on suboxone, that way, if you decide it's not for you, you'll be able to get off it easier.

UPDATE:
mom refilled my suboxone script, so I'm back on the wagon... was hoping to escape it, but I just can't with it lying around me all the time. I'm begining to taper again though. yesterday, did 1.25 mg I.V, today, I'm shooting for 1 (litterally!)
 
to anyone scared of starting suboxone...

i have to admit that i was very uneasy about making the switch. after using every opiate in the book for 8 years and the last 5 years on methadone i was pretty comfortable with my routine and having a safe and reliable way to deal with my addiction.

my doc approached me about making the switch and i held off for about 5 weeks. I was already down to 40mg of methadone, down from just over 130mg.

anyways, for the 1st week of methadone detox, my doc prescribed me 300mg of morphine a day for 7 days, Ambien, and Promethazine. The morphine barely kept me from withdrawal, but in essence did nothing. then i had to go 48 hours before starting the Subz.

The first few months were a bit rough because my routine had been changed and i was dealing with alot more freedom and everyone knows that, contrary to what people say, methadone keeps you feeling pretty damn good, especially with the benzos thrown in.

If you can tough out the 1st month or 2, you start really feeling better in the 3rd month. And then you thank yourself for making the switch.
 
"less is more"

anything over 16mg is a waste. suboxone is made to be most effective with its basic dose of 1 or 2 pills. increasing the doses any much more than that will do nothing, this is because its a partial agonist (it only opens the door halfway, and each subsequent dose barely nudges the door a bit further) whereas other opiates like methadone are full agonists (you can keep opening the door more and more with each dose, until the damn door breaks off)


"swallowing vs under the tongue"

im not sure if anyone talked about this, cuz thats alot to read up there, but here is a quick tidbit:
Suboxone has something called First Pass Metabolism. If you swallow it, the bulk of the drug (just over 60% ) will be eliminated by the liver.

it is designed to be taken sublingually and will produce the best results when taken that route....


piece
 
now im getting addicted to sticking things up my butt, great. my needle fixation is gone and so are my tracks but the urge to re dose several times a day is still here, knowing it wont do much. fucking hate it.

i cant IV it because i made a vow to myself that i would not. i took it SL one day and was like fuck this, it barely works and it tastes sooooo bad. its just such a waste. so i started sniffing and i remembered i still had a rig that i had broken the needle off of in an attempt to stop slamming. light bulb flashes that i can plug it with this rig. and here i am. i feel like a failure that i still cant take the shit as prescribed but FUCK IT. i never have. it tastes like shit and you just waste it. so i want to see if i can take really small doses like i used to with IV. i just assumed 2mg butt shots would be good since she gives me 4mg a day and i dont have control over my monthly usuage i just use it all. i am going to start trying 1mg (intra rectal, bwahahaha) tomorrow. thing is i like coffee in the morning and i dont like plugging it unless im cleaned out. wish i could just swallow it like a normal fucking pill. no way could i do take home methadone, i fucking abuse my fucking take home suboxone!!!

but i could always make it last by IVing it. if the BA of rectal is only 10% less than IV then i should be able to dose like i used to, right? .3mg here, 1mg there, maybe .5mg if i feel like it at night. i miss that. so im going to try it like that. i can feel when it kicks in this way but not like the light wave of IV. id shoot it, go to smoke and by the time i was taking my first drag(after 10 mins of cleaning up and walking outside) i could feel the little calm and feel right in my skin again. i feel that still i guess, so fuck it. ill just try smaller doses. 4mg is a lot to have a day so i should be able to play around like i used to. now just with my butt and without a needle on the end of that barrel. sigh. what a feind i am.
 
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