Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine FAQ & Megathread v2; 2010

[Pegasus]

^Yeah, it would give me a buzz too, just one very untypical for an opiate. I should have clarified in my post more that I meant an antidepressant that gives pleasant effects!

 

[fistful_of_needles]

ehehe ,just did some research on Temazepam and we actually have it over here under the name Normison ...already itching for my next visit to my licit dealer.

 

[Idi0tequ3]

damn guys!back to the GBL and sub combo.... around 3mls with 4mgs of suboxone is incredable.... intensely poteniated the sub. Im high as a fucking kite. 2mgs plugged 2mgs under the tongue and 3mls of gbl in three seperate doses. Dont know how safe this is but it feels damn fucking good. Not a care in the world right now.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

damn guys!back to the GBL and sub combo.... around 3mls with 4mgs of suboxone is incredable.... intensely poteniated the sub. Im high as a fucking kite. 2mgs plugged 2mgs under the tongue and 3mls of gbl in three seperate doses. Dont know how safe this is but it feels damn fucking good. Not a care in the world right now.

I'm glad it worked well for you man! Enjoy the combo.

 

[dopiate]

Do you get hydroxyzine prescribed CH? And do you want to go in on some bac water with me? What was the place you got it from again?

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Do you get hydroxyzine prescribed CH? And do you want to go in on some bac water with me? What was the place you got it from again?

I'm good on bacteriostatic water for the time being. Thanks though.

I have gotten hydroxyzine hcl prescribed, yes. It's not OTC in america, though I don't see why.

The links on where I get my stuff are in my micron filtering mega thread but I'll link you here too.

http://www.mountainside-medical.com...For-Injection-Bacteriostatic-Water-30-ml.html

 

[fistful_of_needles]

Try to imagine a Psychiatrist who will prescribe me both Loprazolam and Midazolam in the same Rx (on top of Subutex and Lexotan of course) and then for some reason denied me access to Hydrozyzine ...hahah,just goes to show these people do have a very peculiar sense of humour if anything I guess.

 

[Georgie25]

Can u still feel IV coke while on suboxone? Like the rush and everything?

How bout other drugs? I'm sure some will still work like LSD obviously, but does subs only block other opiates or do they affect other drugs as well is what Im getting at.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Try to imagine a Psychiatrist who will prescribe me both Loprazolam and Midazolam in the same Rx (on top of Subutex and Lexotan of course) and then for some reason denied me access to Hydrozyzine ...hahah,just goes to show these people do have a very peculiar sense of humour if anything I guess.

LOL what? They said you can't have hydroxyzine? Um...did they give you a reason why?

Hydroxyzine is just an antihistamine, it's great to reduce itchiness, and also is a great anxiolytic/hypnotic agent.

I guess they figured midazolam and loprazolam are enough?? Weird??? My doctor was *so* against giving me any benzos, but hydroxyzine was so easy for me to get. Huh.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Can u still feel IV coke while on suboxone? Like the rush and everything?

How bout other drugs? I'm sure some will still work like LSD obviously, but does subs only block other opiates or do they affect other drugs as well is what Im getting at.

Yeah but I don't really like IV coke enough to do it ever again.

Most other drugs are OK for Suboxone. I can even take other opiates if I felt like it but I don't.

Most psychedelics and uppers work fine for me on Suboxone though. I can't think of one that would have a problem to be honest with you.

I would be interested to see what salvia is like on Suboxone, but allegedly it should work still.

 

[Dankycodone]

I prefer bupe (1-2mg IV'ed) over heroin any day. I love the high bupe has it is just as euphoric for me with a longer duration. It is my favorite opiate after Trimeperidine It really depend's on the individual and I have a lot of experince with opiates/oids

 

[fistful_of_needles]

QUOTE=Captain.Heroin;8076765]LOL what? They said you can't have hydroxyzine? Um...did they give you a reason why?

Hydroxyzine is just an antihistamine, it's great to reduce itchiness, and also is a great anxiolytic/hypnotic agent.

I guess they figured midazolam and loprazolam are enough?? Weird??? My doctor was *so* against giving me any benzos, but hydroxyzine was so easy for me to get. Huh. [/QUOTE]


haha , I just gave him some bullshit about being up till late cause of bupre and that stuff like Lendormin and lexotan weren't helping much cause I'd still wake up in a mess in the morning (most likely due to these drugs's effects)and then suggested we should perhaps try a short acting benzo and that I'd heard that Hydrozyzine worked ok as well ...after this he prescribed me Midazolam and Dorminoct and told me to try both and figure out which one would work better for me since they were closely related ..."Hmmm, Ok ,since it's all about "trying"may I try some hydroxyzine too?" "Hmmmm ,GET FUKKED!!"

 

[needlejuice]

anyone agree brand name subs work better IV than generics

brand sub>gen. sub>suboxone

for some reason suboxone doesnt do much when shot... supposedly the naloxone is inert and there isnt that much difference in ingredients but i can def. tell the difference in effects. it holds me the same but doesnt provide any extra comfort using iv roa. (dose 1-2mg tops a day)

 

[Captain.Heroin]

anyone agree brand name subs work better IV than generics

brand sub>gen. sub>suboxone

for some reason suboxone doesnt do much when shot... supposedly the naloxone is inert and there isnt that much difference in ingredients but i can def. tell the difference in effects. it holds me the same but doesnt provide any extra comfort using iv roa. (dose 1-2mg tops a day)

Suboxone works just fine, I still get a rush and a high each time. I haven't tried Subutex or its generic.

 

[Cloud_9]

Suboxone works just fine, I still get a rush and a high each time. I haven't tried Subutex or its generic.

I know buprenorphine has a higher affinity for the receptors than nalaxone does, but could switching to subutex, which doesn't have the nalaxone preparation be any more healthy or possibly more enjoyable than suboxone in IV instances like your's would you think?

 

[Captain.Heroin]

I know buprenorphine has a higher affinity for the receptors than nalaxone does, but could switching to subutex, which doesn't have the nalaxone preparation be any more healthy or possibly more enjoyable than suboxone in IV instances like your's would you think?

In terms of "healthy" what's bad for you is magnesium stearate, or corn starch, which is in both. Not having the coloring/flavoring might be an added benefit, but besides for that, there essentially would be no difference.

ultra-low dosing of opiate antagonists have shown to help keep tolerance down to some extent; I don't know if this carries over into Suboxone, but I have a feeling it does.

I can't see why there would be any real advantage to be honest with you. Good theoretical question though.

 

[Cloud_9]

....Good theoretical question though.[/COLOR]

I know that its pretty impossible for a drug to occupy every single opioid receptor in your body, especially as a partial-agonist like buprenorphine; and as such I can imagine only that when IVed that some of those leftover receptors would be occupied by the nalaxone in the solution unlike subutex.

We need a side by side comparison..... any takers?

 

[pixplzthx]

Here's a tapering question (eventually).

I have no desire of getting hooked/addicted/physically dependent on another opiate. I want off as soon as comfortably possible. My doctor thinks I should start at 16 mg and taper after six months.

I am so not doing that.

I was about 60 hours into withdrawal when I took my first 4 mg of bupe. About two hours later I took another 4 mg. In an effort to get an initial craving (That's the wrong word. I had to answer a question) out of the way, I took 16 mg about six hours later.

Nothing. No improvement. No good vibes. No negatives. Nothing.

I felt really good about that "nothing." It will help me know that there isn't a high for me to chase.

Back to the doctor-man's point of view: He is used to treating people who became opiate dependent and has decided to get off of opiates altogether. He has told me that I am a unique patient. I am trying to figure out what my pain level really is. I was warned that bupe is NOT used to treat pain (in the US, anyway). It could be that I am setting myself up to hurt for a few days while I await the bupe to get out of my system! But I have a feeling I'll be okay.

Anyway back onto tapering:

I want to immediately begin tapering from an 8 mg dose. I plan to dose once a day so that when I get to the little doses, I won't be trying to cut those in half, nor will I be setting myself up for a twice a day routine. As an aside, I used to take 140 mg of oxycodone (4 * 15 IR and 2 * 40 ER) over 6 doses/day. I want to reduce by 2 mg every four days to 2mg and then reduce by 1/2 ever four days. I haven't quite worked out a 100% sanitary way to get to the 1 mg and the 1/2 mg doses. I'm thinking of taking an 8 mg tab and dissolving it into 8 cc of bottled water (or water that had been boiling). Then taking 1/2 mL doses of the solution would equal 1/2 mg doses of bupe.

I am guessing I should be able to jump from 1/2 mg after four days. Then, I’m done. That means that I will have been "on" bupe for 24 days or 576 hrs (that number will help later). Based on the the 1/2 life of bupe 20 to 70 hours… I'll use 36 hours for easy math, that means that I will have 1 mg in my system (last .5 mg dose plus .5 worth of leftovers) at discontinuation. I might be off on that by about a quarter mg.

Essentially, that's the plan. Any thoughts?

 

[Oxymorphone]

I hate having my recovery in the hands of an idiot with a prescription pad

Ugh, another day, another dickhead retarded bupe doctor.

So today after seeing my psychiatrist who was prescribing me suboxone at 24mg a day along with 2mg klonopin (which i was also on for 3 months prior to seeing him and 5 doctors haven't had any issue with the combo) I was telling him about what led to my relapse and my plans for staying clean.

If you read my story on the first page the major reason that led to my relapse was having a bupe doctor who pulled the plug on me while I was in the ER/hospital and refused to prescribe me bupe unless I went to a 30 day+ rehab. So I was pretty pissed off and thought I might not find a new doc in time plus I lost all my trust and little respect left I had for psychiatrists and specifically those who specialize in addiction. So I started to taper on my own while starting to see this new psychiatrist who was providing me bupe. He said some idiotic stuff like that I could ween of 2mg klonopin that I've been on for 2 years in 2 days, seriously wtf? That made me not trust him more along with other things he said or did that showed he is completely incompetent, but I need a doctor to get my meds... I was afraid he would pull the plug on my suboxone at any time like the last asshole (because I got drunk one night and ended up in the hospital because I tried staying warm in a college building at 3am and security called an ambo).

Now basically I ended up relapsing since I tapered on my own to under 2mg before i was ready and had huge cravings and I eventually relapsed at that point.

Now I am explaining this all to him as to why I tried tapering then subsequently went back and forth between bupe and dope trying to get some help. His immediate reaction was "I'm not going to provide you with Suboxone anymore, I won't be responsible for your death." I was shocked. what he just said and tried to do is the exact thing that led me to relapse and I made it clear I wanted to stay on maintenance so nothing like that ever happens again.

I calmly asked why and reminded him that being denied bupe is what got me into trouble, and he says it's because I was mixing benzos with bupe and that is a deadly combination. I reminded him I have taken more benzos before with other doctors who all approved and said it was fine and not dangerous in my case. I reminded him HE PRESCRIBED THEM BOTH TO ME AT THE SAME TIME, why the hell is he bringing this up now and using it as rationale for not treating me?

I got into a length debate about how it isn't dangerous and his response was to prove it to me by pulling out the Suboxone brand pamphlet where it says benzos combined with bupe can cause death in a tiny bullet point/caution section. I again asked why he prescribed them both to me in the first place since he knew that from the beginning, and then went on to explain why it was not a problem for me and how absurd his rationale was. I was getting confrontational challenging him on his knowledge of pharmacology and how wrong he was abut the whole thing. I asked why he was trusting a pamphlet from a drug manufacturer that created suboxone as a complete gimmick to fool the FDA and medical community as being safer with naloxone, which he still believes makes it abuse proof. I wish I had a syringe on me so I could shoot it right in front of his face..

He continued to refuse to matter how much I explained which obviously made him feel uncomfortable that a patient knows more about drugs than him. I got furious since this is exactly why I went off bupe on my own since I can't trust doctors who will pull the plug on your meds at any time for RETARDED reasons. I needed more suboxone to stay clean and not go into the same cycle that made me relapse.

I was so furious by then that nothing I said and called him out on was sticking into his head claiming I am not a doctor and therefore don't know what I'm talking about when he gets his most trusted info from a little pamphlet. 8) I got up and started cursing him off shouting he was an irresponsible idiotic fucking old hack who will stops prescribing drugs due to his incompetence with no regard to his patients safety and well being. I was loud enough his waiting patients could hear the scene and was walking out the door when he told me to calm down and sit for a minute. I sat waiting to hear what he had to say and he eventually wrote me a scrip for 5 fucking days worth which I don't even need to fill since I have enough to hold me over until I find a new doctor.

It is pretty fucked up these poor excuses for doctors will put someone on suboxone maintenance then immediately stop providing treatment if anything goes wrong. I hate having my recovery in the hands of these idiots, I wish this shit was OTC so I don't have to waste money paying these fucktards who will eventually try to screw up my life.

So the lesson here is: Act like you know nothing about drugs and psychiatry in front of them because once you hurt their ego and make them look like the idiots they are then they will try to control you the only way they can which is with a prescription pad.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Back to the doctor-man's point of view: He is used to treating people who became opiate dependent and has decided to get off of opiates altogether. He has told me that I am a unique patient. I am trying to figure out what my pain level really is. I was warned that bupe is NOT used to treat pain (in the US, anyway). It could be that I am setting myself up to hurt for a few days while I await the bupe to get out of my system! But I have a feeling I'll be okay.

Suboxone isn't used for pain (at least not officially) but buprenorphine is, in the form of Buprenex.

I haven't quite worked out a 100% sanitary way to get to the 1 mg and the 1/2 mg doses. I'm thinking of taking an 8 mg tab and dissolving it into 8 cc of bottled water (or water that had been boiling). Then taking 1/2 mL doses of the solution would equal 1/2 mg doses of bupe.

I am guessing I should be able to jump from 1/2 mg after four days. Then, I’m done. That means that I will have been "on" bupe for 24 days or 576 hrs (that number will help later). Based on the the 1/2 life of bupe 20 to 70 hours… I'll use 36 hours for easy math, that means that I will have 1 mg in my system (last .5 mg dose plus .5 worth of leftovers) at discontinuation. I might be off on that by about a quarter mg.

Sounds good. Water measuring is the easiest way to taper below 2mg IMO.

Essentially, that's the plan. Any thoughts?

If you're taking it sublingually you should be fine. If you are trying to assist the tapering process, you can use ethanol to help the bioavailability, sublingually speaking, mixed in with the water when you take it.

Either way it will work fine.