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  • AADD Moderators: swilow | Vagabond696

Strong Sleeping tablets.

Tryptanol and Doxepin (T'cylic AD) have helped me before for insomnia mixed with an SSRI (been on many but at the time it was Paroxitine.
 
I'm lucky that at the moment all I need is a couple of restavit to get to sleep and even though I feel a bit groggy the next day the quality of sleep is alot better than with the benzos or z-drugs.

with any luck I will be able to sleep again without the use of sleep aides soon.
 
Seroquel is by far the most potent drug avail here for this use, WITHOUT the risk of addiction or abuse.

HOWEVER dont let that lull you into a sense of security with it. I recently have gone clean of this insidious substance after nightly use for 2 years.... While it is amazing at letting one sleep unabated keep in mind it has the propensity to turn you into a piece of cardboard even during waking hours, It seems to stay active in ones system for approx 3-5 days.

Generally speaking 25mg is plenty for a new-comer to sleep soundly for 8-12 hours.... If you get some, Dont be a toughguy and take more. 25mg is plenty and make sure your in bed as its highly likely you will blackout and harm yourself from the fall.
 
I still vote seroquel.

25mg is the minimum dose, My prescription box states 1-3 tablets a night as needed.

Last night I had 50mg valium and 2mg xanax, so all i needed was 25mg seroquel.

It's definitely not addictive, yes I can say I've crushed and snorted it... If you want to fight the sleep on it you just become dumb, literally... for a while.
 
Just about the anti-depressants for sleep issue. Adverse effects of tricyclic anti-depressant include somnolence (ie sleepy). They work good at 25mgs for Endep (Amitriptyline) and have the added bonus of reduced nocturia!! Mitrazapine has different pharmaco-dynamics to tricyclic-antidepressants but also works, for me at least to chill and relax after a big night. They do the job even if they use different modes of action on our various receptor sites in order to get it done.
 
88brenno said:
It just boggles my mind why a doctor would prescribe something meant for depression/anxiety that has a sleepy side effect as opposed to just a benzo, shes not depressed I see her often and she is always merry, happy,cheerful even without the wine, she just has issues sleeping as of late, not to mention the weight gain possibility when that very same doctor said she needed to loose weight. She might be due for a visit to doctor brenno I think lol.

"Unique AD" or not, that still doesn't change what it is an AD. I dont know alot about this specific one but I know enough to stay far away from any form of AD. I have read of people having to taper off the shit with brain zaps, god i hate those.



Effects of sudden cessation of treatment with mirtazapine may include depression, anxiety, panic attacks, vertigo, restlessness, irritability, decreased appetite, insomnia, diarrhea, nausea, vomiting, flu-like symptoms such as allergies and pruritus, headaches, and sometimes hypomania or mania.[49][50][53][54][55]
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I agree that tapering off an AD is not pleasant at all... Your mentioned effects are all very real and fucked up. Mirtazapine will take the usual month or so before the AD effect kicks in

but the hypnotic effect is felt straight away with the lower the dose such as 15mg more effective in inducing sleep than typical doses 30, 45+mg. Personally I FUCKING HATED

MIRTAZAPINE as I do the rest of the AD's Ive been prescribed, and that's a fair few of them, but I can understand why it would be prescribed before any benzo. as the world of

benzo use imo is a lot worse and are highly addictive and have worse effects from sudden cessation and side effect profile in general. Saying that, I also agree that Mirtazapine shouldn't be used as a sleeping aid.
 
I developed tolerance to Mirtaz quite quickly, shitty AD, only ever took it for sleep really. What do you do when you become too tolerant to Seroquel?
 
I can't sleep without Seroquel, but my doctor says because it is giving me such good sleep and how sleep is so important it's worth keeping up on with it. I wonder as well what i'll do without it. Its not ideal but so beneficial to my sleeping patterns atm. Not looking foward to ceasing it..
 
Azron said:
I can't sleep without Seroquel, but my doctor says because it is giving me such good sleep and how sleep is so important it's worth keeping up on with it. I wonder as well what i'll do without it. Its not ideal but so beneficial to my sleeping patterns atm. Not looking foward to ceasing it..
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Was in the exact same boat as you Azron, To the point where i feared what might happen without that sleep control. Taking 100-500mg a night for 2 years.

I used surmontil for 2 weeks to wean off serquel, and now have gone about 3 months with no sleep-aid :)

Its possible buddy and the sooner you do it the better!
 
Cheers - I'm on 400mg - For mood disorder as well, but mainly for sleep been on it for about 18 months. I remember when 25mg would induce a nice lunchtime snooze, and now finding even 400mg + is not the same as it used to be...
 
Azron said:
Cheers - I'm on 400mg - For mood disorder as well, but mainly for sleep been on it for about 18 months. I remember when 25mg would induce a nice lunchtime snooze, and now finding even 400mg + is not the same as it used to be...
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Have you had any weight gain from the squirrels?
 
yup... im 6 foot 1 and in in my ice ages i was a sunken 58 - 65kg and when I stopped using ice I hovered arpund the 75 to 80kg.. I'm now 98kg
 
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Azron said:
yup... im 6 foot 1 and in in my ice ages i was a sunken 58 - 65kg and when I stopped using ice I hovered arpund the 75 to 80kg.. I'm now 98kg
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That sounds about right. I know of people that have hit 120kg that are your size. Are you worried about getting Diabetes or have you discussed that with your Doc? I was reading about the Diabetes risk with Squirrels and Zyprexa.
 
Tell u the truth I never thought of the Diabetes angle... will discuss with doc next wednesday... Im smashing weights, excersising and eating healthy now that I relised none of my jeans fit me anymore. It crept up pretty quick! Zyprexa is worse for weight gain to, squirrels supposed to be one of the better neuroleptics for less weight gain, but Ive been told the thinner you are, the more likely you will gain weight fast...
 
Azron said:
Tell u the truth I never thought of the Diabetes angle... will discuss with doc next wednesday... Im smashing weights, excersising and eating healthy now that I relised none of my jeans fit me anymore. It crept up pretty quick! Zyprexa is worse for weight gain to, squirrels supposed to be one of the better neuroleptics for less weight gain, but Ive been told the thinner you are, the more likely you will gain weight fast...
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Cool. I didn't know that about Serequel compared with Zyprexa.

One of my mates passed out in the gym from Zyprexa as it made him very dizzy every time he exercised. The sticker on the box indicated that was a side effect. He was trying to eat right and exercise but couldn't due to the drug. It did what it was supposed to do though which was the important thing.
 
Zyprexa along with quetiapine are considered blockbuster drugs. (The amount of sales in the 100's of millions. A low dose of Zyprexa such as 5mg will have a mood stabalizing effect as well as a mood 'flatening" if you like (cant think of the right word but an dopamine antagonist), where as seroquel is a dopamine antagonist but is only a mood stabilizer in high doses... above 800mg I believe. Zyprexa is a great drug in it can be used as mono treatment to manic mood phases and plataeu rapid cycling,(along with a certain anti-depressant for the low moods), where as seraqel is normally used in conjunction with something like sodium valporate or lithium and an anti depressant.
 
Azron said:
Zyprexa along with quetiapine are considered blockbuster drugs. (The amount of sales in the 100's of millions. A low dose of Zyprexa such as 5mg will have a mood stabalizing effect as well as a mood 'flatening" if you like (cant think of the right word but an dopamine antagonist), where as seroquel is a dopamine antagonist but is only a mood stabilizer in high doses... above 800mg I believe. Zyprexa is a great drug in it can be used as mono treatment to manic mood phases and plataeu rapid cycling,(along with a certain anti-depressant for the low moods), where as seraqel is normally used in conjunction with something like sodium valporate or lithium and an anti depressant.
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Interesting. Thanks Azron.

I was wondering what the difference was between Zyprexa and Serequel for Bipolar. I didn't know that Zyprexa had mood stabilising qualities as well. I always wondered where the mood stabilizer came from for people on Zyprexa.
 
Aggh!

My insomnia is back in full swing again. I am needing 3 tablets of zopliclone just to sleep. Last night I would have got about 3-4 hours sleep and I am exhausted. These days it seems that it is just making me feel tired the entire day. Honestly, I feel completely out of it and tired until I get home from work, then I get a second wind. I'm still tired but can't sleep.

I am considering going to the doctor and asking what are some alternative medications. Everyone here seems to be championing seroquel. but the potential side effect of tardive dyskinesia (rare I know) and weight gain do worry me a bit. I really need to get this sorted within the next month. Next year work is going to be getting intense and i really need to be operating at my best. How does seroquel affect your cognitive performance?

I don't know if it is a side effect from needing to take large amounts of zopliclone but my memory is shot. I have difficulty remembering conversations I had the previous day and I am finding my ability to think on my feet is suffering.
 
psytaco said:
Aggh!

My insomnia is back in full swing again. I am needing 3 tablets of zopliclone just to sleep. Last night I would have got about 3-4 hours sleep and I am exhausted. These days it seems that it is just making me feel tired the entire day. Honestly, I feel completely out of it and tired until I get home from work, then I get a second wind. I'm still tired but can't sleep.

I am considering going to the doctor and asking what are some alternative medications. Everyone here seems to be championing seroquel. but the potential side effect of tardive dyskinesia (rare I know) and weight gain do worry me a bit. I really need to get this sorted within the next month. Next year work is going to be getting intense and i really need to be operating at my best. How does seroquel affect your cognitive performance?

I don't know if it is a side effect from needing to take large amounts of zopliclone but my memory is shot. I have difficulty remembering conversations I had the previous day and I am finding my ability to think on my feet is suffering.
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A lot of people are on low dose Squirrels now for everything from depression to anxiety to OCD. The low dose is having good results and not increasing weight in the patients I have seen.

They are selling for a fortune in Gaol as well at the moment.
 
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