Skydancer -- A Democratic Bluelight *see first post for link to Skydancer's response*

[starlightgemini]

I don't know if you've access or not, but going to someones profile and clicking "User Options" at the bottom takes me to a page with various information about the poster including the last time they posted and last time they were "active" (ie logged on). Its been over 4 days since Catch logged in, so either he's unaware, or he's relying on others to send him copies of this and the other threads in question.

I don't know which is worse, not being aware after 4 days or being aware but can't be bothered to come online to check? Of course he could be coming online logged out, but why would he do that? All it does is give the impression he's not coming online, which is a bad thing.

Good point.

 

[Finder]

I want to say that I'm glad Bluelight means a lot to many people as much as it does to me.

 

[gloggawogga]

An email was sent out with large list (about 25) of forum emails in the CC list. SO was not on it. Perhaps SO was left out because the mods here would already know.

Anyways I would have never known there were problems here until I became a mod of PD. First there was another person who was congratulated with me, and then his modship was declined because of post quotas about two weeks after everybody had been congratulating him. And then, after reading the staff forum and observing what goes on in there, I realized there was a serious amount of political tension going on. And at that point my gut instinct kicked in and I just decided I'd lay low. And doing so there's been more than enough room for Atlas and I to mod PD so I haven't worried about it. And in fact as a mod I've hardly kept up with the staff forum, because there's hardly anything useful there, just another closed thread with somebody's repressed idea.

I've never had any dealings with Skydancer or Catch-22, nor have I seen much of their involvement here so I can't personally say anything about them specifically.

Oh...the drama. I sure do hope all this works out with a peaceful solution, so that this community can continue to thrive.

 

[Web]

on second thought...

I lost any respect for the admins during the creation of Second Opinion, that replaced the Life forum - not in regards to whether it was the right thing to do but more the attitude - the way it was handled.

There was no discussion with the current mods, well none that I was privy to - it was basically, this is going to happen and no we won't listen to any opinions you might have. You have a choice to stay on in the new forum or leave. In my mind that was utter bullshit.

Coupled with the sackings of mods and the all new quota system that mods had to achieve, quashed any desire I had to mod there and then. There was some wanky discussion in the mods forum regarding this quota system which I thought was a waste of time, cause like anything, despite any other opinion, Catch would just go ahead and do what he pleases. I subsequently dropped all three mod positions I had.

I'm not sure what the perfect system is.... but its certainly not one run by people on some sort of power trip and with little to no regard to the well being of this board and the people that use it.

My 0.2c on how I saw things.

You know, I was going to keep up the "I don't give a fuck" attitude... but the side of me that still cares is 100% in accord with what my fellow former mod says here (except the part about changing "Life" to "Second Opinion", since what it turned into was what I always wanted the Life Forum to be... but it DID piss me off that the management acted like they were doing us a favor and that this "change" was their idea... not to mention the ultimatum we were given... help with the change, or you are fired).
While I did step down from my position due to personal issues, stress and lack of time on-line,... a HUGE part of the stress was what I had to put up with by being a member of the staff around here. when the micromanagement started, I noticed it right away. The defiant side of me (is there any other side?) immediately lashed out. Didn't help much. I tried to argue my points with logic after that... didn't even make a dent. Soon I was completely frustrated, and I felt like watching over my forum wasn't fun anymore... and then it became a burden. I didn't want to give up, I wanted to stay on and help... but when I quickly realized that my input wasn't wanted, even when it was asked for, I walked away before getting angry and doing something stupid. No regrets, and I'm glad I have no responsabilities around here... but the best part was not having to listen to the bullshit of the "management" around here.

Personally, I'd rather have no bluelight at all than have the current incarnation.

 

[Strawberry_lovemuffin]

At first, I thought all this verbosity was pointless, How can people be so worked up about an internet forum? When I read more and more about the people here, I realise why. It's not actually an internet forum at all, but a system of support and information for thousands of people

Posters share knowledge, expertise, sympathy, distraction, a reason to carry on, or a reason to laugh, they meet up and have relationships outside their computers. This isn't unique to Bluelight.nu, but people here save real lives, in a much more effective way than any government-run drug support/prevention scheme could.

The principles of harm reduction seem pretty clear to me, and I think you all do a cracking job, from the lowly n00b asking an intelligent question, the fuckup who makes mistakes so you don't have to, to the chemists and counsellors, philosophers, the comedians, the flirts, and devil's advocates, the mods who wipe the skid marks off each forum, to the admins who try to keep a handle on this gargantuan torrent of ascii.

Some people stop taking drugs as they get older, some people take more. The pills are shitter, the skunk smells funny, your coke gets soaked in wd40. Like raves are never like they used to be, bluelight.ru will never be the same again.

Change is inevitable, for better for worse- The question is how commited are we to the people who need this site the most? Whether they need distracting, a virtual hug, or bio-molecular bumfluff...

Beautiful sentiments andy So true

My thoughts:

I think we are somewhat lucky and sheltered in Sex, Love and Relationships. No-one in Senior Administration has ever tried to dictate anything to us about how we run our forum - we are allowed to choose our own mods and are given respect and autonomy in virtually every way. So basically: I have never had any personal problems with any individual of this current staff.

It makes me sad that this is not the case for many of my friends and collegues.

And as a Senior Moderator it's not enough anymore to stand back and say 'this doesn't affect me in my little corner of utopia', because clearly it does. I have a stake in much more now.

I care very, very much about this site and have poured my heart and soul into it... I don't like feeling scared to speak up (which I have at times) in support of someone, or against an action, for fear of having my beautiful little forum taken away from me. Up until now I haven't said much for that very reason.

I would like to see more respect shown for people who contribute their time here; more consultation, more transparency. Whether that involves a shake-up of the current administation or not I don't know: what I do know is that I would like people to at least acknowlege and be accountable for mistakes of judgement because that's what a real leader does.

I don't think anyone expects someone who has the massive responsibility of running this site to be perfect. In fact, it's kind of comforting if they're not: if they can say from time to time "Hey guys, I fucked up - let's put some actions in place to make sure this doesn't happen again."

Most of all I want to say how much this site means to me and I'm completely serious.... the real lives we touch every day are extraordinary, and I hope that fact doesn't get lost amongst all of this.

Love, SLM

 

[Mystic Styles]

There was a mass email sent out. As to whether it actually went to all the mods or not, I'm not sure. It called attention to this thread asking for input and comments to it.



I've been a part of bluelight for over 5 years. i started lurking in early 2000 and joined in late 2000. I rarely venture out of music and djs anymore though.


Most of the things i would have said here have already been said (and probably better said than i could have), so I'll just say that i agree bluelight doesn't seem the same as it was 5 years ago when there were just, what, three forums? I just have to agree that the post quota is wholly ridiculous in my opinion, and, if that was the reason Kyk was removed as a Music and DJs mod (i wasn't one at that time), then that is just a shame. He was (and still is) one of the most informative contributors to the Music Forum.



SLM brings a good point above though. For my time as Music and DJs mod, we haven't been interfered with by anyone, and we were asked our input before the Non-Electronic Music Discussion Forum was created, which i think was a terrific idea.

Best not to disclose e-mail addresses that are sent the moderators.

 

[j22]

I think at the very least, the "post quota" nonsense has got to be done away with, as it is just that - nonsense.

The Nazi's wouldn't enforce such retarded rules.

Sorry this wasn't constructive, but I felt like being my usual sarcastic self.

 

[killarava2day]

What is the 'post quota' anyway?

 

[KemicalBurn]

From what ive read of this, it would appear that SD is the only with the ability and the (possible?) inclination to do so.

but im not exactly sure as to what the path of least resistance is...ive seen some general ideas, but what would happen if C22 was sacked?

How would one put put forth a series of guidelines or failsafes to prevent such a rise to power? (ps: the problem isnt only C22)

I think Pleo was on the money, you need more than one or two ruling Admins...perhaps a veto system would be ideal?

 

[KemicalBurn]

What is the 'post quota' anyway?

mods get sacked if they dont make a required number of posts in a forum.

Like CMB.

 

[xtcxtc]

That is what Catch and Skydancer would no doubt prefer. What xtcxtc wants on the other hand is to make this a community decision, not yet another despotic move. He wants to gauge support and feedback before entering into any final discussions.

I think the outpouring of support for xtc's plan has surprised them, they may well be planning some kind of response in private. G.

a very accurate assessment GL except that i do not expect "any final discussions" will be between SD & I so much as SD and the current admins ( maybe with me in the background ).

re "outpouring of support" it has certainly surprised me. i would have expected more arguments for both sides.

again the money i provide was very little last month so when i had some discussions with the 2 senior admins just over 6 mths ago my proposals for a more democratic BL were brushed aside. SD effectively said Jase and he had always exercised autocratic control ( a big surprise to me ).

the argument over who owns BL ( certainly not me ) is pretty much irrelevent without the support of all the staff and members.

i believe SD has made a big mistake by not responding to this sooner,

either BL will convert to something "democratic" or what he will end up "owning" will be worthless.

 

[michael]

re kemicalburn:

without getting into any specifics, that's not entirely true.

on either count.

 

[alasdairm]

i agree with a lot of what's been said here. i wrote the following in the staff forum a while ago and i think it's appropriate to reproduce it here:

i remember when i opened my bank account in college when i was 18. if i had a problem, my bank manager knew who i was - if i had a problem, he and his staff made a decision based on both qualitative as well as quantitative criteria. i was a person in the bank's eyes.

now, i don't know my bank manager and he/she doesn't know me. i had some problems recently and, after a long period of being an excellent (i.e. dotcom) customer, i needed to turn to my bank for help. the automaton on the other end of the phone (they wouldn't even help me at the branch) punched my details into a computer and said "no". in my bank's eyes these days, i'm just a number.

i'm an active and, i feel, pretty good mod in the forum i moderate. i'm not worried about my position there because i'll continue to actively participate.

i just feel that i'm beginning to look more like a number than a name at BL and, if that's the case, i can't help feeling that we've all lost a little piece of what makes BL special.

in light of BL's mission, the content community benefits from a full, frak and courteous exchange of views. i feel, at very least, that approach should extend to the way the board operates.

i was told by catch-22 sometime ago that i had a "potential credibility problem". despite numerous private messages and email messages, i have never had the courtesy of an explanation. to me, that's a good example of how BL should not operate.

finally, aside (and on a slight tangent), i don't feel that "moderators have post quotas therefore administrators should have post quotas" makes much sense. it fails to take into account the difference in the roles.

that said, i feel a formal post quota system is not necessary at bluelight.

namaste

alasdair

[added later: in the interests of accuracy i checked the details of my post. more accurately, i was informed that either i had a "potential credibility problem" or complaint(s) had been made against me. to this day i have received no explanation despite asking for same a number of times.]

 

[xtcxtc]

i will say that i think spencer has made the best post so far in this thread.

you might have noticed i also commended spencer on his post.

i would be grateful if you could offer further insights into same.

 

[64tf]

i was told by catch-22 sometime ago that i had a "potential credibility problem". despite numerous private messages and email messages, i have never had the courtesy of an explanation.

That's wild, I wonder what was being implied. That kind of communication is a very poor practice.

 

[Spencer]

My understanding is that C22 doesn't listen to people, so much as he listens to numbers. Accordingly, I believe another 34,673 people will need to speak up in this thread for it towarrent his attention.

 

[KemicalBurn]

re kemicalburn:

without getting into any specifics, that's not entirely true.

on either count.

I did mean to say "forum contributions"...and i dont mean to specul;ate regarding any of the circumstances of any mods that have been demoted.

 

[michael]

i did in fact notice.

i really don't have much more to add to it, though. i see the problem largely is as a result of walt's semi-mia status. i'll expand on this a little more via PM.

 

[dbighead2]

who originally created bluelight?

maybe one of you old guys can pull up a rocking chair and give us youngin's a history lesson:D

 

[Spencer]

who originally created bluelight?

maybe one of you old guys can pull up a rocking chair and give us youngin's a history lesson:D

Jase is the Founder of bluelight.ru. Skydancer currently leads the Admin team, and I do not believe Jase is involved, though I am not certain of this.