Sexual Preferences vs "Transphobia"

[tubgirl.jpg]

Because I am not attracted to men.

Neither am I.

My interpretation of people who are attracted to women not wanting to fuck any trans women in existence seems like it boils down to some combination of:
1) Seeing trans women, even those who are indistinguishable in appearance from cisgender women, as being fundamentally men in some way (and vice versa for trans men)

Yes, because they are trans-women. Men who transitioned.

2) Insecurity about one’s own sexuality and gender, and then projecting these insecurities onto transgender people.

Yeah, that's not the issue.

No, because you have previously engaged in vile behaviour towards specific transgender users in past years on here from what I can recall.

My problem has always been the semantics. I don't care what other adults do to themselves, or other consenting adults.
I may have expressed my opinion in a rather crude manner.

It is transphobic. It’s also your right as an adult human to have that preference, even if it is a bigoted one.

Cheers to that.

Having penetrative sex with someone who now has a vagina and used to have a penis does not.

This is another disagree about language - neovaginas and vaginas are not the same. They are different, and that's okay.
But language does matter.

 

[phantom_alyce]

Neither am I.

Yes, because they are trans-women. Men who transitioned.

Yeah, that's not the issue.


My problem has always been the semantics. I don't care what other adults do to themselves, or other consenting adults.
I may have expressed my opinion in a rather crude manner.


Cheers to that.


This is another disagree about language - neovaginas and vaginas are not the same. They are different, and that's okay.
But language does matter.

Trans women are women from before birth, we know this thanks to science and evidence. "Trans" means "on the other side of", meaning their gender is "on the other side of" or "opposite" their sex. This is why reading books on human biology is important.

 

[tubgirl.jpg]

Trans women are women from before birth, we know this thanks to science and evidence. "Trans" means "on the other side of", meaning their gender is "on the other side of" or "opposite" their sex. This is why reading books on human biology is important.

Do you mean biological sex or gender identity? Or the brain structural phenotypes?

Unfortunately that does little to change my mind.

 

[phantom_alyce]

Do you mean biological sex or gender identity? Or the brain structural phenotypes?

Unfortunately that does little to change my mind.

"Women" is a gender term. So if facts can't change your mind, then the moon might as well be made out of cheese. ALL women have the same brain structure. ALL women think the same, respond to fear, love, shame, stress, etc. the same. ALL women view sexual intercourse and relationships the same. These are well known facts and have been for roughly 100 years now. Sex is between the legs and does not dictate who a person is, the brain does. So if you want to view people as simply what is between their legs, than you have a disturbing view of people, and that's on you, not anyone else, and not on innocent people simply born differently than you.

 

[tubgirl.jpg]

ALL women have the same brain structure. ALL women think the same, respond to fear, love, shame, stress, etc. the same. ALL women view sexual intercourse and relationships the same. These are well known facts and have been for roughly 100 years now.

All women do not respond the same to fear, love, shame and stress. All women do not view sexual intercourse and relationships the same. Neither do all men.
That is a preposterous statement.

Sex is between the legs and does not dictate who a person is, the brain does. So if you want to view people as simply what is between their legs, than you have a disturbing view of people, and that's on you, not anyone else, and not on innocent people simply born differently than you.

Then I guess I want the brain of a woman placed in the body of a woman from the start. What's between their legs is a big deal to me. I stated earlier that women aren't all tits and cavities, but I certainly am attracted to those. It's not all there is, but it certainly plays a major part.

 

[mal3volent]

ALL women have the same brain structure. ALL women think the same, respond to fear, love, shame, stress, etc. the same. ALL women view sexual intercourse and relationships the same. These are well known facts and have been for roughly 100 years now.

lol, wtf are you talking about? This is unironically the most bigoted statement in this entire thread.

 

[streaM Freak]

I think she was being sarcastic about the "ALL" parts?

I agree with the last sentence though

So if you want to view people as simply what is between their legs, than you have a disturbing view of people, and that's on you, not anyone else, and not on innocent people simply born differently than you.

 

[mal3volent]

I don't think anyone is defining people based on their genitals, simply that they factor into sexual attraction pretty significantly.

If you don't want to have sex with a 500lb woman, I don't think that'd make you fatphobic, would it? It wouldn't be you reducing her to her weight. It's just that isn't what you like sexually.

 

[phantom_alyce]

All women do not respond the same to fear, love, shame and stress. All women do not view sexual intercourse and relationships the same. Neither do all men.
That is a preposterous statement.

Then I guess I want the brain of a woman placed in the body of a woman from the start. What's between their legs is a big deal to me. I stated earlier that women aren't all tits and cavities, but I certainly am attracted to those. It's not all there is, but it certainly plays a major part.

I'm not talking about nuances, obviously everyone is different, I'm referring to the way the brain itself responds.

Well, no one is perfect, sadly. Hence why we have hospitals, medications, research clinics, and so on. So, you simply have a genital preference.

 

[phantom_alyce]

lol, wtf are you talking about? This is unironically the most bigoted statement in this entire thread.

Because I've noticed a few bigots on here, and when I say "women", that includes all women. Some people don't understand this, so I made sure to emphasize on that point in this specific reply. And that brain structures play a huge role in our everyday lives and countless brain scans have proven cis and trans women have extreme similar structures and wiring. Not sure how any of that is bigoted, but okay.

 

[mal3volent]

ALL women have the same brain structure. ALL women think the same, respond to fear, love, shame, stress, etc. the same. ALL women view sexual intercourse and relationships the same. These are well known facts and have been for roughly 100 years now

"ALL women have the same brain structure. ALL women think the same, respond to fear, love, shame, stress, etc. the same. ALL women view sexual intercourse and relationships the same. These are well known facts and have been for roughly 100 years now"

"I'm referring to the way the brain itself responds."

Can you provide a few sources to back up your claim that ALL women/trans women have the same brain structure and respond the same way to all the things you listed? You said it has been a well known fact for a century, so it shouldn't be too hard.

 

[mal3volent]

I'd be very interested to read a source from 1926 on the subject!

 

[phantom_alyce]

"ALL women have the same brain structure. ALL women think the same, respond to fear, love, shame, stress, etc. the same. ALL women view sexual intercourse and relationships the same. These are well known facts and have been for roughly 100 years now"

"I'm referring to the way the brain itself responds."

Can you provide a few sources to back up your claim that ALL women/trans women have the same brain structure and respond the same way to all the things you listed? You said it has been a well known fact for a century, so it shouldn't be too hard.

Since you're unable to use a search engine yourself, sure, the Hirschfeld research which started in the early 1900's in Germany, which has now been collected (that which survived the nazi regime that followed) into one archive can be found here: https://transreads.org/wp-content/u...e7b7907afd3_the-hirschfeld-archives.pdf1_.pdf

This was the start of much research, that has been reproven, corrected, and expanded on since then (roughly 100 years), by more modern science and research. I'm not going to do anymore homework for you though, I'm sure you're smart enough to figure out how to work a search engine.

Oh, and we didn't have brain scans back then, just oberservational studies, so the hard evidence is more recent, just an FYI.

 

[phantom_alyce]

I'll be logging off for the weekend, this debate is beyond silly and has gone way further and way more off topic, more than it ever needed to.

 

[mal3volent]

Since you're unable to use a search engine yourself, sure, the Hirschfeld research which started in the early 1900's in Germany, which has now been collected (that which survived the nazi regime that followed) into one archive can be found here: https://transreads.org/wp-content/u...e7b7907afd3_the-hirschfeld-archives.pdf1_.pdf

This was the start of much research, that has been reproven, corrected, and expanded on since then (roughly 100 years), by more modern science and research. I'm not going to do anymore homework for you though, I'm sure you're smart enough to figure out how to work a search engine.

Oh, and we didn't have brain scans back then, just oberservational studies, so the hard evidence is more recent, just an FYI.

Well, your central claim was all about the brain and brain function, so I searched the 230 page document and found just one single result.

"They agree with other findings that suggest that Wilde died from menin-goencephalitis, an infection of the brain"

so I'm afraid this doesn't quite prove what you suggested.

Btw-- there's no need for the attitude re: "Since you're unable to use a search engine yourself". That's not very productive or mature. if you make a claim you should be able to back it up yourself rather than relying on others to do it for you.

 

[mal3volent]

I'll be logging off for the weekend, this debate is beyond silly and has gone way further and way more off topic, more than it ever needed to.

I agree, it was extremely silly for you to say that all women "have the same brain structure, think the same, respond to fear, love, shame, stress, etc. the same...view sexual intercourse and relationships the same." I've never in my life heard anyone make such an obviously untrue statement with such confidence.


-----------------



I also think it's beyond silly for anyone to suggest a black woman who is exclusively sexually attracted to black men is somehow bigoted or racist.

Population and Evolutionary Genetics 2012, Human Genes and Genomes
Leon E. Rosenberg, Diane Drobnis Rosenberg

Assortative Mating​

When one chooses a mate based on some particular trait possessed by that person, mating is assortative. It is estimated that 80% of people the world over marry individuals born within 10 miles of each other. Because we tend to choose mates similar to ourselves in one or more of several ways (skin color, intelligence, native language, artistic talent, athletic ability), such assortative mating is often positive, its overall genetic effect being to increase the frequency of homozygotes at the expense of heterozygotes. But in certain clinical settings, the effects may be negative. For example, if two people with blindness resulting from homozygosity for the same mutant allele mate, all of their children will be blind. Another example: if two individuals with achondroplasia (an autosomal dominant form of dwarfism) mate, their offspring homozygous for the mutation have a lethal form of dwarfism not observed otherwise. This kind of assortative mating may have little effect on the entire population, but its effects on a specific family may be large.

​

https://www.britannica.com/science/sexual-selection

 

[streaM Freak]

The whole world isn't going to up-to-speed with new social standards as soon as the bar is raised. It takes time, and picking on people who have preferences because of how they grew up and experienced the world is not fair.

Bigoted and prejudice imply intentional wrongdoing. Narrow-minded and preferential is more accurate but again - I think it's unfair to try to force people to have new opinions and then point your finger at them when they don't.

 

[tubgirl.jpg]

So if you want to view people as simply what is between their legs, than you have a disturbing view of people, and that's on you, not anyone else, and not on innocent people simply born differently than you.

And I've never argued that's all there is. I've never said they're not innocent either.
But I can't really control who I'm attracted to. No intellectual parkour is going to get me there.

I'm not talking about nuances, obviously everyone is different, I'm referring to the way the brain itself responds.

But the brain responds differently in each individual?

Well, no one is perfect, sadly.

No, and I am certainly no exception just because I was born into the "correct" flesh vessel.

Hence why we have hospitals, medications, research clinics, and so on.

Yes, and that is amazing.

So, you simply have a genital preference.

Yeah, I have no phobia or hostile feelings against transpeople.

And that brain structures play a huge role in our everyday lives

Yes, but behavior is not homogenous.

and countless brain scans have proven cis and trans women have extreme similar structures and wiring.

You were right about the importance of reading relevant litterature.
And it seems since around 2021, studies, papers and articles say tha the dimorphic brain is a myth, and that humans brains are monomorphic with such slight nuances that there are not two distinct types.

Remembering the null hypothesis when searching for brain sex differences - PMC

Human brain sex differences have fascinated scholars for centuries and become a key focus of neuroscientists since the dawn of MRI. We recently published a major review in Neuroscience and Biobehavioral Reviews showing that most male–female brain ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

So both men and women have extremely similar structures.

Not sure how any of that is bigoted, but okay.

A general assumption about the behavior of an entire group of people?
I think thats the textbook definition, from one bigot to another.