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Poppy Seed Tea Withdrawal Is Hell

Day 3 in WD ( 4 since last use): Made it through another night but it was hell. Legs would not stay still and kept chilling and sweating. Had to get up and change the sheets at one point. Felt like my skin was crawling all night as well--very odd feeling-not really and itch or burning sensation, something in between I think like ants crawling all over you. Tried getting in a hot shower for a while but that didn't seem to do much. Seems like the third night was the worst last time I went through this so maybe things will start improving. Took another Trazodone last night but it didn't seem to do much other than give me a dry mouth and another pounding headache. I've read studies where they are giving Trazodone during opiate withdrawal to lessen the symptoms but I'm not getting any relief as far as I can tell. Maybe they are dosing at higher levels or more often. Very nauseous this morning as well. Feel like I should eat or drink something but nothing sounds good. I'm still taking the loop and it has stopped the diarrhea for the most part so I'm not losing fluids as much as last time but know I need to stay hydrated. Everything aches but lower back is really hurting for some reason--don't recall that last time. It started bothering me later in recovery but nothing like this. OTC pain meds don't seem to have much effect either. Not sure what my heart rate is since I forgot to charge the monitor but it seems to be fairly high. And then there is the infinite sadness/depression...having some really dark thoughts. Normally an upbeat, positive personality so it's hard to deal with. It snowed last night and saw a robin out in it which made me cry. I don't know why--seems like a sign of Spring would cheer me up given the events of the last year. Keep telling myself this will pass if can keep things together.

Update: Just went back and read through my notes from the last kick and it looks like my back was killing me then as well. It just completely blows my mind that many of the details of that misery are mostly erased.
 
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Hey Gollum, I’m keeping up with your journey. Hang in there. It’s all temporary. It gets much better. Clonidine helped me with fast heart and some with BP but gave me a bad headache, but it did help the first two weeks. If I had to DO something, I doubled dosed Imodium.
Personally im still taking trazadone. (50mg), melatonin for sleep.
Are you able to get any diversion? Anything to take your mind off being sick? I feel for you! Try to keep,some positive going. Depression can really get you. If nothing else, write it all out on here. We will listen. It’s ok.
 
@Debbie: Thanks for the support--glad to hear you are still staying strong in recovery--excellent job! Very proud of you because I know the willpower it takes.

Kind of thinking the Trazadone is what is making me so depressed but not sure. I have some other stronger sleep meds but was kind of saving them for when the insomnia becomes unbearable which I know will happen soon. May try not taking it tonight and seeing how I feel in the morning--it sure as hell isn't helping me sleep so it is probably pointless to keep taking it. I did hope since it is used as an anti-depressant that it would make me feel better but that doesn't seem to be happening. Resting HR is down to 80 which is better and BP is 127/77 which is pretty good so I think I am OK so far and not feeling like I am going to have a coronary like the last CT.

Took the dog out earlier and she saw a rabbit and took off after it across the neighborhood. Last thing I felt like doing was chasing her but I went and got dressed and did it anyway. It is cold here today and I am having trouble keeping warm anyway so that was a shock but it actually felt kind of good to be out and moving even though I didn't think I had the energy for it. I am about 37 pounds lighter and in much better shape than my last kick so that is probably helping. Last time every step felt like a marathon and wore me out and I am not noticing that as much this time even though my legs are achy. Small victories, I guess.
 
@CJ: Thanks--completely agree at this point. The Trazadone may even be making things worse. Going to avoid it tonight.
 
Good luck man- you’ve done it before, you can do it again.

someone yesterday told me cheese and salt are good for rattling. salt to help with your legs, and cheese cos ceasin breaks down into a very weak opiate in your system. if you can get anything down, might be worth a go. now i think about it i've heard both mentioned before but never remembered to try either when i was rattling.

have you had any therapy or got any outside support to try and help you address the issues that caused the addiction?
 
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@chinup: Haven't heard of that remedy--not sure about the salt as I'm afraid it might jack up my heart rate. And cheese just doesn't sound good at all (but nothing else does either).

I have never talked to anyone about my problem. Always took the macho attitude that I didn't need no stinkin' therapy, but...that has changed. As I continue to struggle with cold turkey again after already going through the misery less than a year ago it is pretty obvious I need some outside help. I've given a lot of thought to first telling my wife and then figuring it out together, but maybe that is selfish on my part. Is there really any reason to hurt her just so I can feel better about lying to her all these years? The more I think about it the less sense that makes to me. I think we convince ourselves that we are being brave and honest but really all we are doing is further hurting those we love. Don't get me wrong--I am not condoning lying and cheating. It's just that my wife is not a drug counselor so telling her will only add more stress to a marriage that has probably had enough of it lately. We have made a lot of progress spending more time together even tough I was using again and I hate to fuck that up. I think a better plan is to talk to someone who knows what they are talking about and if they think I need to come clean with her, then maybe I will cross that bridge.
 
iamgollum said:
Jesus, why did I start using again??? I worked so hard to get my life back on track and now I am basically starting over. So stupid.
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Don't think that way, your brain isn't itself. Don't make any hard decisions while you're detoxing dude - INCLUDING telling your WIFE - because you know that's only going to make things worse! That's my opinion though and i'm not part of your marriage-nor do i know either of you. But dude, you've kept your drug use a secret for all this time, if it were to come out now how long you have been using right under her nose, she'd freak (at least I would if my Mr told me the same thing). Telling her isn't going to help her or your marriage at all- the reason you want to do it is guilt and your mind is off because of the withdrawals. I really don't see how breaking her world in two and telling her would help HER in any way, let alone YOU in the long run. Again, my opinion, but I think you're better off going to a counselor that you can talk shit through with, who will keep your secrets and be able to help you, instead of telling your wife who later when you detox completely you'll probably think "Why the fuck did i do that?".

NO big decisions while you're going through it - reevaluate in a few months once you've come out of the woods. Pretend your sick or are depressed and then tell her you're getting help (and actually do it). At least, that's what I said when I was in your shoes and now am happy I made that decision.

Good luck!

- Honeybadger Don't Care
 
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@ZB: Thanks--good advice. Decided against talking to the wife until I talk with a counselor or therapist. Also, managed to get myself off my ass, take a shower, shave and somehow managed to go out to dinner with my wife and daughter (and I remembered my towel!). Didn't really feel like it but gave it all I had. I let my wife drive which just shows how bad I feel because I hardly ever let anyone else drive anywhere. Told them it had to be a Cracker Barrel so I could order EXTRA bland with my dinner. Nothing sounded good but did manage to eat a little. Hopefully it stays put. Don't seem to be having as much stomach issues as last time and have only vomited once which I am thankful for. I've been taking the loop regularly so that is keeping the other end under control. Congestion seems like it my be clearing a little tonight which is a good sign I think. But, I absolutely ache all over and still feel really, really down/depressed--hope that feeling passes soon.
 
Day 5 Late Afternoon of my CT do-over. Another sleepless night--may have gotten an hour or so but no more. Restless legs were not as severe and seemed more twitchy that anything and did not notice much of the crawling skin sensation. Mostly just a lot of tossing/turning and staring at the ceiling. Did not take any Trazadone last night and don't really notice any difference mentally/emotionally one way or the other. Congestion is almost go today and only sneezing occasionally 4 or 5 times. I definitely think the physical symptoms are fading quicker than last time but the anxiety/depression seems much worse. Legs and lower back still ache but it seems like Tylenol and Advil are now helping more than they were earlier in the week. I cut the loop from 4 every 8 hours to 2 so we will see what happens there--last time it was not very pretty but I think I need to get my intestinal systems moving regularly again. Managed to get dressed and drive over to the local market and buy some bread and Gatorade and seem to feel like moving more today. Also managed to eat a scrambled egg and some toast--don;t have much appetite yet but felt I needed some protein/carbs. Think there is light at the end of the tunnel at this point if I can just get my head screwed back on straight. The sleep deprivation is probably not helping that so maybe I should try a stronger sleep med since I have them this time.

My wife wanted me to go to a friend's daughter's wedding with her today (who gets married in March?) but I just did not feel up to making vacuous small talk to a bunch of people I don't know while fighting CT withdrawal. I have willpower, but not that much...
 
Day 7 (part b) of CT withdrawal. Almost have made it a full week with no tea. Actually made it into work today which was a slog since I am still not sleeping worth a crap. I tried taking a Lunesta last night which had a weird effect. I kept feeling like my arms were restless and kept moving them but I don't know if that was really happening or if I was dreaming it. I do think I managed a couple of fitful hours though but still very tired and spacey. Legs and back are still very achy and seem to be sneezing a lot today for some reason. It is colder than hell here and I feel like I am freezing all the time. Stomach issues seem to have passed and I actually feel like I could eat something decent. Sadness/depression seems to be lifting which gives me great relief--God what a dark oppressive feeling that was. Still not back to my usual upbeat self but I see light on the horizon today.
 
Day 8. Decided to try a Restoril last night for sleep--its a benzo. Only took 15mg but I was able to sleep for about 4 or 5 hours and head feels more clear this morning. Only side effect I get from it is I usually wake up freezing and sweating profusely at the same time which happened last night as well. That's really not listed as a known side effect but that's how my body reacts to it for some reason. The infinite sadness seems to be lifting quickly--but I suppose the benzo may be helping with that as well. Lower back feels less achy today but still having a lot of pain/weakness in my legs which makes it hard to get going. Think I am going to attempt a workout before going back into work which would be the first one in a week. I've also started taking Magnesium which I read is supposed to help with muscle aches. I'd love to go for a long walk but its like 6 fucking degrees here with 20 below windchill. Appetite seems to be back for the most part and no gastro issues to speak of at this point.

I think I am on the other side of the the cold turkey hell at this point but not back to 100% by any stretch of the imagination. I don't want to say it was not as bad as last time, but it is different. I also think there was some comfort in knowing that it would eventually pass--even though everyone kept telling me that last time, I had never been through violent CT before and it was just so relentless. This time I knew it would pass if I could just keep my shit together. Seemed to be less physical pain and more mental/psychological issues this time around. I've had to deal with a shit-load of emotional pain in the past few months so maybe that had something to do with it. Still feel like an idiot for using again and having to start over with recovery but know I just ned to let that go and move forward. As I said before, I think recovery is more about winning battles. And, just like any war, sometimes the enemy wins a battle and sometimes you win one, the key is to just keep fighting.
 
Day 9 of the wash & repeat CT. Long night last night--did not sleep a bit--felt both restless/tired, cold/hot all night. My arms and legs seemed to feel really cold, but it drives me crazy for them to touch each other. I start sweating immediately when they do--I remember that little symptom from the last CT as well. I have a couple of meetings this morning I need to be lucid for and just didn't want to risk taking any sleep meds. Honestly, I don't know how people take those things on a regular basis. Yes, you do usually sleep but it takes hours for your brain to boot back up--at least it does for me anyway. Regardless, I decided I would rather be exhausted than catatonic. I did make some coffee which I don't drink very often anymore--but I think I need a cup or two today. Ironically, I actually feel pretty good this morning aside from a dull headache. Maybe it's just the caffeine giving me a light dopamine rush but my legs are less achy. I did switch from Ibuprophen to Aleve (naproxen) yesterday since my stomach seemed to have settled and I think that may be helping the aches/pains too. The uber-dark depression is mostly gone but I still have an anxious feeling--again could be the caffeine and/or lack of decent sleep. Can't say I have my regular sunny disposition back yet, but I am actually looking forward to getting the day started. Stomach/intestinal issues are gone and appetite is returning more each day--maybe too much. I definitely need to start hitting the workouts a bit harder or the pounds are going to start packing back on. Still sneezing a lot--like 5 or 6 times in a row but it seems like that took about 3 months to clear up last time, around the same time the insomnia started to improve. Wonder if there is a connection?

I'd like to get outside and start walking again but it's still colder than hell here (fucking groundhog is useless...). Think my grandmother used to say that if March comes in like a lion it will go out like a lamb--I hope that's right. It has been a long cold bitter Winter in all kind of ways for me and my family. There's something about Spring that says life goes on.
 
cj said:
Man honestly i am kind of in awe of you being able to just quit like this. Your a strong willed person
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Same. I honestly don't think I could do it. Withdrawal that prolonged, knowing the whole time how easy it would be to make the pain go away. I just don't think I'm the type that can do that. I might make it a while, but after several days solid of my mind finding any and every justification to give in...

Yeah, major respect to anyone who can do it, cause I don't think I could. Not by choice.
 
@CJ/JessFR--Thanks, appreciate the support. I don't think I have anymore strength or willpower than any other person--it really just comes down to a real desire to be done with it and a focus on that I think. Yes, I feel shitty and yes, I would love to mix up a batch of PST and make it all stop, but I know the misery would just start again. It is definitely relentless, but what I have discovered in withdrawal is that there is a point of critical mass where you don't want the pain to start again. For me it has been around the 3 or 4 day mark. Up until that point I REALLY craved more of the drug, but after that my brain begins return to rational thought and tell me "Do you really want to start this misery again" or "Is the high really worth all the BS you go through". And usually the answer is no--but there is sometimes still a lot of debate...
 
Day 10--double digits. Seems like a milestone (again...). Yesterday started pretty good but the zero sleep really made me hit a wall around 3:00 and I felt really shitty both mentally and physically in the evening. I tried another Restoril and went to bed around 9:00. Actually slept about 6.5 hours in 2 or 3 hour sessions. Kept waking up feeling cold but wringing wet with sweat. Nonetheless, the sleep helped and I feel more mental clarity this morning. Maybe it is the benzo helping but I do not have as much nervous anxiety/restlessness today--that feeling of a need to do something, but don't feel like doing anything. Since I'm not really taking it on a regular schedule I doubt it is having that effect and may just be a placebo effect or just the result of getting some sleep. Depression seems to be about gone at this point--God that was horrible this time. Still sneezing and legs are less tired/achy since switching to Aleve. It kind of upsets my stomach and reduces my appetite, though. Fair trade-off, I think.

We are supposed to get 5 inches of snow tonight, which sucks. Jesus, where is global warming when you need it? I'd love to get outside more but still having trouble keeping warm and it just feels shocking to be out in the cold. Even though I felt crappy, I somehow managed to make it out to dinner with my wife and son last night and by the time we got home, I was literally shivering all over--had to soak in a hot bath to get warm again. I think that next week we are supposed to be in the 50's so I am looking forward to that.
 
iamgollum said:
Day 10--double digits. Seems like a milestone (again...). Yesterday started pretty good but the zero sleep really made me hit a wall around 3:00 and I felt really shitty both mentally and physically in the evening. I tried another Restoril and went to bed around 9:00. Actually slept about 6.5 hours in 2 or 3 hour sessions. Kept waking up feeling cold but wringing wet with sweat. Nonetheless, the sleep helped and I feel more mental clarity this morning. Maybe it is the benzo helping but I do not have as much nervous anxiety/restlessness today--that feeling of a need to do something, but don't feel like doing anything. Since I'm not really taking it on a regular schedule I doubt it is having that effect and may just be a placebo effect or just the result of getting some sleep. Depression seems to be about gone at this point--God that was horrible this time. Still sneezing and legs are less tired/achy since switching to Aleve. It kind of upsets my stomach and reduces my appetite, though. Fair trade-off, I think.

We are supposed to get 5 inches of snow tonight, which sucks. Jesus, where is global warming when you need it? I'd love to get outside more but still having trouble keeping warm and it just feels shocking to be out in the cold. Even though I felt crappy, I somehow managed to make it out to dinner with my wife and son last night and by the time we got home, I was literally shivering all over--had to soak in a hot bath to get warm again. I think that next week we are supposed to be in the 50's so I am looking forward to that.
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I've read the whole thread, and as applaudable as your will power has been, I am not entirely your approach is 100% sound (particularly in respect to your first time around). If it is at all possible, it is generally best to avoid acute withdrawal as to prevent that neural "memory" from forming. It seems like one reverts back to that state more easily once it has already occurred. It seems like future withdrawal events which would seem mild to others based on dose and duration, are more severe in individuals who have experienced severe withdrawal symptoms at some point. If possible (and it almost always is) it is best to avoid acute withdrawal.

Perhaps you might have better luck switching to a shorter acting compound like kratom and do a taper. Kratom seems to dose much more predictably than PST, and the withdrawal isn't nearly as severe as it is with oral raw poppy alkaloids (i've been through poppy pod tea withdrawal, along with methadone, heroin, tianeptine and a host of other withdrawal syndrome). You could potentially even consider Kratom maintenance therapy for a while until your ready to quit, which will immensely increase your odds for abstaining.

That said, you're this far, so stick with it. If you're having trouble with anxiety, you might consider ashwagandha KSM extract as an alternative to benzos. If you're having too much trouble now however, you won't be setting the clock back that far if you do a 30 day kratom taper to ensure that you're comfortable. Watch out for the benzos -- the withdrawal is in many ways more severe and debilitating than opioid withdrawal.
 
@negrogesic: Thanks for the feedback and advice. Unfortunately I live in one of the six states where Kratom is listed as a Schedule 1 narcotic (right up there with heroine and cocaine) and while I am sure it can be obtained somewhere, I have no desire to get arrested. My whole reasoning behind using the poppy seed tea was it was basically a legal high--I may like getting stoned, but I am not going to risk getting busted to do it. I could literally buy hundreds of pounds of the seeds and as long as I didn't reduce it down to pure opium and try to sell it, there's not a damn thing anyone can do about it. Nothing to be proud of BTW...

Also, I am a definite Type A, impatient personality so I am more of a rip the band-aid off, damn the torpedoes, kind of guy. I tried tapering for about a month and just got so damn tired of messing with it. Don't get me wrong--violent cold turkey is the absolute worst experience I have ever dealt with and like to think that with the right support and diversions, I can achieve abstinence. At this point I am just about past the acute phase, I think, so not reason to risk trading addictions anyway--just need to lean into it. And, agree totally on the benzos--plan to use them sparingly for insomnia as needed.
 
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