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Harm Reduction New! - Cold Water Extraction Mega Thread & FAQ

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I'm paranoid about Cold Water Extraction!! Help! I already did it.

Today I did a CWE. I put the stuff in a cup and put the cup in a freezer with water. AFter the stuff had crystalized ever so slightly, i put all the shit in a tightly woven cloth and squeezed, then i put the the stuff through a coffee filter.

The solution was clear with a bit of white in it.

I extracted 100 tylenol 1's. Thats PARceutamal shit, codeine, and caffeine. Seriously a fucking waste, didnt even get high...

Now I am thinking, fuck I hope I didn't accidently fuck up the process and eat too much paraceutamal. Please offer some reassurance that I did the process right! Thanks. :\

I am freaked out. but like i said before about the color of the solution, is that really telling?
 
Well, if you used cold water (not warm), then your fine. However, the caffeine was not extracted. To extracted caffeine, you need to do the charcoal extraction method.
 
How much water did you use? For a set amount of water, only so much paracetamol can dissolve. (Laws of science. Can't break them. Well, maybe, but not in a kitchen filtering codeine. ;)) Assuming you filtered it, you're only going to get a rather small amount of paracetamol passing through the filter into the final product. The rest will be in the goop in the filter.

I can't remember the exact solubility, but it somewhere in the neighborhood of less than one gram of paracetamol will dissolving in 100mL water. So if you used a reasonable amount of water, you had a limit to how much paracetamol could have dissolved in it (while most/all of the codeine would have dissolved, as codeine is very soluble in water).
 
If you ever try it again it's worth using pills that contain Acetylsalicylic acid such as AC&C (if they are available in your area) as ASA is less soluble in water than paracetamol. According to Erowids info.

Codeine Type Solubility (31C water) Solubility (21C water)
Aspirin 1g / 100 ml 1g / 300ml
Acetaminophen 1g / 70 ml 1g / 150 ml
Codeine 1g / 2.3 ml 1g / 0.7 ml

IMO this solution tastes not quite as awful. You should be fine ;)
 
johanneschimpo said:
I can't remember the exact solubility, but it somewhere in the neighborhood of less than one gram of paracetamol will dissolving in 100mL water.
Click to expand...

That's right, well at 22 degree Celsius it is anyway. :)

As long as you didn't use too much water, you will be fine, and even if you did use too much it's unlikely you used enough to cause much damage. Lets say 8 grams would make us seriously worried; that's 800ml of water give or take.

Merging Draigan's question into the CWE mega thread.
 
Extracting codeine from OTC Tylenol 1/222?

Hey folks. I'm new here, and I hope someone out there can help me with this one. I recently attempted this with 222s (containing 8mg codeine phosphate per tablet), following the extraction method found on Erowid ( http://www.erowid.org/pharms/codeine/codeine_faq.shtml#extraction ), however the directions are piss-poor. (Even going so far as to mention refrigeration in a bracketed note, yet no where else in the directions.)
Could anyone point me in the direction of clearer, more detailed directions? Relative terms such as "warm" and "cold" are used. How warm and cold? Exactly what temperatures? I'm a technical guy, and this is something I want to get right, obviously. Descriptions of what the solution should look like each step of the way would be helpful. Pictures would be great :P.
Even a definition of "solubility" (I must have missed that science class), and an explanation of the concept behind the technique would be helpful.

Precisely what happened to me was the following:
First, the directions caution the reader about the presence of extra ingredients in the pills, which 222s possess, a lot of. Though, I'd found another set of directions, specifically for 222s, using a slightly different cold water extraction technique, so I assumed it was alright. I crushed the tablets (20) into powder first, transferred the powder into a small glass, and added 40 ml warm water (31 degrees celsius, as per the second set of directions, which seemed "warm"/borderline hot) - the water instantaneously dropped in temperature to 15 C, a process the directions describe as taking half an hour. I tossed the solution then and there, given things had seemed to go wrong. I'm assuming the water cooled due to the glass being room temperature. The directions say nothing about warming the glass, however.
Anyone?
 
Hey.

I've extracted codeine from some tablets myself twice, and my expierience was that when the water was supposed to be "hot", it would be near boiling point.

I heated the amount of water I needed in a microwave, and when I took it out, the water was so hot you wouldn't stick your finger in it, but it wasn't boiling.

After this, I poured the water over the crushed tablets and stirred.
Then I put the whole mixture in the freezer for about.. 20 minutes, stirring about every 5 minute or so. I just waited till the mixture was so cold that I could stick my finger in it and think "this water is cold", or something like that.

At last, I filtered the mixture in a wet coffe-filter strapped over a large glass, letting the codeine-mix pour down.

Then it was just to mix with whatever juice I wanted, drink, and wait. :)


Since I did this right before I got to bed, I woke up in the middle of the night finding myself in quite an euphoric state of mind, which was quite pleasing.

Hope this helps you. :)
 
I just Get the water super cold,Dump in the pills,let dissolve,filter through into another glass,Lab grade filters are the best apparently but two or 3 wet coffee filters on top of eachother seemto work alright.Then after it is filtered,Filter it a couple more times if you want, and Drink...No hot water Needed, So to Recap what I use,2 Glasses,Ice Cold Water,codeine Pills,Coffee Filters.

Very Primitive CWE,But it works.
 
cold water or bottled water
heat it to as hot as you can stand stick a finger in it (don't burn:X)
pour in empty jar
add powdered pills
tight lid & shake for 3 minutes
can add a little ice and shake,
place in freezer, lid off, until the top of solution wants to form a thin layer of ice
lid on tight n shake

if filtering through a coffee filter you may want to let it filter alternately in the freezer/fridge(which is a pain, or add some ice chips and gently stir as it filters ) - otherwise it filters so slow that the temp starts to rise

usually end up having losing patience and squeezing the coffee filter after about 75% of the solution has been slow filtered and the tylenol crap is slowing the filtration
 
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^the only thing about that is

that u dont let it just "filter"

put it in the filter and SQUEEZE the solution thru the filter

if u dont then ull be sitting there for 20 minutes waiting, while the temperature rises, and as the temp rises, less and less opiates are getting thru (as the longer u wait) since the temp is going up. and ur getting more APAP
 
Thanks for the responses guys. Don't interpret this as knocking your methods... I'll likely be using one or part of the described methods. However, it seems that the cautions listed on Erowid, and Herion Helper, are being thrown to the wind. For example, Erowid warns against using water in excess of 40C, surely a temperature being well exceeded if using water near boiling-point. I've actually read that this will destroy the codeine. Maybe I'm being anal about this? Also, a precise amount of water is usually recommended, from what I've read... something to do with the solubilities of the different chemical compounds. I'm just overall confused as shit about this, hah. If solubility depends on the temperature of the solvent, why does the amount of solvent (water) used matter? And if it depends on temperature, why do some methods use cold water exclusively?
I'm lacking a core understanding of the process : /.

PillPoppingAnimal:
Why exactly do less opiates get through as the temperature rises?
 
You don't need to use warm water, the codeine will dissolve fine in room temperature or refrigerated water, in fact the warmer the water the more paracetamol will be getting through. I use 100ml of refrigerated water for 48 tabs, if you crush them beforehand they will dissolve in a minute or two, then filter and you're good to go. I use boardshorts for a filter as you can squeeze them as tight as you like and they won't break like coffee/lab filters. Also the weave stays nice and tight unlike a tshirt for example - not much paracetamol is getting through at all. If you want a comparison dissolve a couple of tabs in the same amount of water and you'll see that it's far whiter than the filtered water. Obviously some of this is filler/binder but most is paracetamol.

Crushing tabs - 5 mins
Dissolve in refrigerated water - 2 mins
Carefully filter - 3 mins
Should be done in 10 mins. None of this using warm water then waiting around for the water to get cold, it's a waste of time. Also using very warm to hot water may destroy some of the codeine. Another reason to just use cold water from the start.

If you really want to understand why this works and why this is an effective CWE method, yeah check out the CWE mega thread or the Codeine extraction thread over in Aus DD.

EDIT:

Also, a precise amount of water is usually recommended, from what I've read... something to do with the solubilities of the different chemical compounds. I'm just overall confused as shit about this, hah. If solubility depends on the temperature of the solvent, why does the amount of solvent (water) used matter?
Click to expand...

Because the more water you use the more paracetamol will get through. Paracetamol doesn't dissolve very well at all in water but codeine does. The idea of using a small amount of water is that you're using enough to dissolve the codeine but not enough to get anything more than a recommended dose of paracetamol (if that).

And if it depends on temperature, why do some methods use cold water exclusively?
Click to expand...

Well, three reasons like I said above:
1. Very warm/hot water will destroy codeine.
2. The codeine will dissolve in the cold water very easily, you don't need to get it hot to dissolve the codeine.
3. The colder the water the less paracetamol is dissolved, which is what you want.
 
Acetaminophen is relatively insoluble in cold water, but Codeine/Hydrocodone is. The reason you don't want to use hot water is because the APAP is slightly more soluble in hot water, as well as, IIRC, the Codeine can begin to degrade from the heat.

Seriously, try searching the Cold Water Extraction Mega Thread. You will find everything you are looking for there.
 
Before the Wake said:
PillPoppingAnimal:
Why exactly do less opiates get through as the temperature rises?
Click to expand...

Answer...in bold

morphonorconic said:
Acetaminophen is relatively insoluble in cold water, but Codeine/Hydrocodone is. The reason you don't want to use hot water is because the APAP is slightly more soluble in hot water

Seriously, try searching the Cold Water Extraction Mega Thread. You will find everything you are looking for there.
Click to expand...
 
can't seem to find these OTC Tylenol 1/222s... where exactly are ... all I see are 0/325 and 0/500s... and a 0/625
 
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monstanoodle: Seeing as the methods I've encountered insofar have all been hot water methods, they weren't referred to by the authors as "Cold Water Extraction". So no, that's not a viable "clue".

PillPoppingAnimal: That's not an answer. I'm getting more N-acetyl-p-aminophenol. That doesn't necessarily mean I'm getting less codeine. But thanks for the response.

Aside that, thanks for the ideal technique, and clarity with which it was described, blau1005. I still have a couple of lingering questions, but I'll read the CWE "mega thread" first. Only reason I haven't yet, is that I imagine there's a lot there to digest/sort through. Hell, I didn't want to take Chemistry 101 to get this done :P. *heads over to the thread now*

Edit:

BASEjumper: They're OTC (over the counter) at just about any pharmacy in North America. I believe. This might vary from state to state.. I'm not sure. I'm in Canada, where they're no problem to obtain whatsoever. Expensive fuckers though.
 
^No worries. One thing I forgot to mention is to wet your filter before filtering, this way none of your codeine water will get absorbed into the filter.
 
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