[MEGA] God

[Enlitx]

Nope, not at all. My beliefs, which have empirical backing, are that humans have evolved to want to believe in a god of somesort. That doesen't make it any more true or plausible. Frankly, I think some of these responses about a universal collection of energy and love are just a bunch of burnt out hippie mottos, but I am a very practical biochemist, so...%)

 

[stonerfromohio]

empirical backing..........

 

[spaceyourbass]

The fact we're here and not nothingness is testament enough to the existence of a universal consciousness. The whole is greater then the sum of its parts like a car.

I'm not so convinced of this universal consciousness. To me, it seems like whether we like it or not, we are all the centers of our own universes. There is never a stimulus that an animal experiences in which the animal is not the absolute center of its own world. The whole is greater than the sum of the parts, because a group of people (and many other animals for that matter) can do things that one single being could never do. For example- build a house, run a company, procreate. But to suggest that the universe is in some way aware of itself, or that the universe itself has conscious thoughts that are seperate from that of any other consciousness...well I can't fully understand how that is plausible. Could you explain?


To answer the OP, I do not believe in a conscious God or deity. I do think that God exists and is very real within peoples' minds. God can do amazing things for people, things that they wouldn't be able to do without God. But calling God a "he" os "she", unless for the sake of simplicity, seems strange to me.

 

[MyDoorsAreOpen]

^ What you've hit upon is the great paradox of sentient existence. Your sentient experience of the world is an interface between an inner world and an outer world, which are both part of the same great whole. You're at the center of one, and far to the periphery of the other. This is one of the things that the Yin Yang symbolizes.

To me, universal consciousness is realized when sentient beings get together and realize that their inner worlds, which seem so separate and alienating, are actually all interconnected, and that our perception of ourselves as 'islands' can't possibly be real or lasting.

Your consciousness IS the universe's consciousness. So is mine. So is everyone's, including those yet to come into existence.

'God' is a word I tend to use very sparingly, and only in context, when I'm discussing metaphysics and spirituality, because it's a word loaded with the cultural baggage of 'an external agent reaching into and manipulating the universe', which is not what my experiences have led me to believe in. What I've read about the Dao or Isvara, seem much more on the mark, philosophically. But note that Taoists and Hindu philosophers are quick to point out that these concepts are extremely slippery to put into words, and are best approached indirectly, by way of art and metaphor.

 

[Psychedelic Gleam]

I can go into more detail about my experiences if you guys want, let me know. It's just like I said, I don't like being mocked or doubted, and I am careful who I share certain parts of my life with because some people aren't very open minded.

I, an unabashed skeptic, would love to hear about your experiences and swear I wouldn't mock/criticize/question them, always fascinated by subjective "mystical" or metaphysical experiences.

 

[spaceyourbass]

^ What you've hit upon is the great paradox of sentient existence. Your sentient experience of the world is an interface between an inner world and an outer world, which are both part of the same great whole. You're at the center of one, and far to the periphery of the other. This is one of the things that the Yin Yang symbolizes.

To me, universal consciousness is realized when sentient beings get together and realize that their inner worlds, which seem so separate and alienating, are actually all interconnected, and that our perception of ourselves as 'islands' can't possibly be real or lasting.

Your consciousness IS the universe's consciousness. So is mine. So is everyone's, including those yet to come into existence.

Ah that is very interesting, thanks for the reply.

 

[Psychedelic Gleam]

how did you manage to become an "unbiased skeptic"? Wouldnt you have a bias toward skepticism? Arent there some unconscious biases that are seeping in there somewhere? How about your environment you grew up in, your parents, friends.... none of those biases influence you?

unbiased? I said unabashed....

definition: unabashed ( ) adj. Not disconcerted or embarrassed; poised. Not concealed or disguised; obvious: unabashed disgust.

 

[MynameisnotDeja]

Frankly, I think some of these responses about a universal collection of energy and love are just a bunch of burnt out hippie mottos, but I am a very practical biochemist, so...

Well, I accept your viewpoint. Stuff like this used to anger me, but then I realized that your experience is your own, and I can't really look down on you or get angry at you for not having experienced what I have in life. I mean, if you'd have some of my experiences you wouldn't feel the way you feel, but if I'd never had any of MY experiences I might feel the way you feel as well.

My only problem with sharing is when people try and convince me that the things that I've gone through were somehow imaginary or something like that. I don't like that at all. It usually leads to an argument. (not saying you would do this, just saying that people with your viewpoint tend to be the people who do)

 

[Enlitx]

Well, I accept your viewpoint. Stuff like this used to anger me, but then I realized that your experience is your own, and I can't really look down on you or get angry at you for not having experienced what I have in life. I mean, if you'd have some of my experiences you wouldn't feel the way you feel, but if I'd never had any of MY experiences I might feel the way you feel as well.

My only problem with sharing is when people try and convince me that the things that I've gone through were somehow imaginary or something like that. I don't like that at all. It usually leads to an argument. (not saying you would do this, just saying that people with your viewpoint tend to be the people who do)

Well, aren't you trying to convince me that I am wrong by saying that if I would have had your experiences I would think like you? I could just as easily say that if you had a degree in biochemistry you would think like me .

I am not here to judge you for your opinions, I guess I would like you to expound upon what you mean. To me, human emotions are just an evolutionary byproduct that facilitate certain behaviors. Love isn't a form of energy unless you are referring to the electrical potentials in the neurons that represent the feelings of love. Just saying "loving energy" is so vague it borders on useless as a term.

 

[TheParty]

I don't believe there is a conscious god, or conscious spirits.
I think when the feeling of a loving god is present (which i thought i had felt before), thats its just emotions making you think that.
There may be an overall peaceful spirituality to the universe and nature, but nothing conscious out there. And definitely nothing worth worshipping.
:D

 

[MynameisnotDeja]

Well, aren't you trying to convince me that I am wrong by saying that if I would have had your experiences I would think like you? I could just as easily say that if you had a degree in biochemistry you would think like me .

Uhhh did you read the second half of what I wrote? :

if I'd never had any of MY experiences I might feel the way you feel as well.

But to be fair, a degree in biochemistry wouldn't change my views at all. Having a degree wouldn't change my psychic abilities or experiences...

To me, human emotions are just an evolutionary byproduct that facilitate certain behaviors.

I respect your opinion but I can't imagine viewing life that way. It seems so cold and void of meaning.

 

[MynameisnotDeja]

I think when the feeling of a loving god is present (which i thought i had felt before), thats its just emotions making you think that.

Yeah.. I feel like a lot of people think that way and that's why I'm not going to share much of my story.

 

[daysonatrain]

Interesting thread, thanks for posting OP.

"Your consciousness IS the universe's consciousness. " Mydoorsareopen summed it up beautifully.

I dont believe in a seperate God, what i think of as the common christian term for God (which i know not all christians are into ), something that looks down on us and judges.

To me, God IS consciousness. Beneath all the thoughts and sensations there is something deeper, the actual consciousness-- the very fact that we are observing/feeling something.

This goes for all living things. Trees and plants have the same consciousness as humans, just interpreted differently because of the myriad of needs that a plant has that a human (for example) doesnt.

It is awareness.

A plant is aware of where the sun is and grows towards it, where water resides and grows roots towards it, curls its leaves up during the dry season to conserve water, and on and on. This is the same as humans (though humans tend to be much more complex because we possess a strong ego sense). We get hungry, so we find food, we get horny so we find a mate... and on and on. But beneath all the superficial overlays is this awareness, to be AWARE of being hungry, or cold, or being tickled, or tricked, or loud..........and on and on

To me, this is God.

 

[MynameisnotDeja]

it is awareness.

A plant is aware of where the sun is and grows towards it, where water resides and grows roots towards it, curls its leaves up during the dry season to conserve water, and on and on. This is the same as humans (though humans tend to be much more complex because we possess a strong ego sense). We get hungry, so we find food, we get horny so we find a mate... And on and on. But beneath all the superficial overlays is this awareness, to be aware of being hungry, or cold, or being tickled, or tricked, or loud..........and on and on

to me, this is god.

 

[Enlitx]

Uhhh did you read the second half of what I wrote? :



But to be fair, a degree in biochemistry wouldn't change my views at all. Having a degree wouldn't change my psychic abilities or experiences...

To be fair, having your experiences wouldn't change my views at all. And are you actually saying you have psychic abilities? That might change my view about this whole issue.

I respect your opinion but I can't imagine viewing life that way. It seems so cold and void of meaning.

You can't imagine it because humans have evolved to find patterns and significance where there isn't any. My life is not cold and void of meaning though, I am perfectly happy. I just choose to believe in what is actually real.

 

[Enlitx]

Interesting thread, thanks for posting OP.

"Your consciousness IS the universe's consciousness. " Mydoorsareopen summed it up beautifully.

I dont believe in a seperate God, what i think of as the common christian term for God (which i know not all christians are into ), something that looks down on us and judges.

To me, God IS consciousness. Beneath all the thoughts and sensations there is something deeper, the actual consciousness-- the very fact that we are observing/feeling something.

This goes for all living things. Trees and plants have the same consciousness as humans, just interpreted differently because of the myriad of needs that a plant has that a human (for example) doesnt.

It is awareness.

A plant is aware of where the sun is and grows towards it, where water resides and grows roots towards it, curls its leaves up during the dry season to conserve water, and on and on. This is the same as humans (though humans tend to be much more complex because we possess a strong ego sense). We get hungry, so we find food, we get horny so we find a mate... and on and on. But beneath all the superficial overlays is this awareness, to be AWARE of being hungry, or cold, or being tickled, or tricked, or loud..........and on and on

To me, this is God.

Why not just call it awareness? Or response to stimuli? Or in the case of humans, sentinence? I did some research on plant response to environmental stimuli, so why not call it ACHe mediated calcium ion influx mediated by extracellular H20 concentrations? %)

 

[5tra1t tr1ppn]

not a beliver. there has been scientific proof to prove that evoltion is real. i don't really know how anyone can deny it but it makes sence to me. i could go on for days about gods and beliefs but the truth is that if someone belives hard and long enough that something is real then it will become a reality to them, no matter how far fetched. also if someone is feeding u this shit from birth and u really don't have any knowlege on other beliefs and facts about existance around the world then that's what i call brainwashing. prime example would b catholicism. what a fucked up religion. what kinda of fucked up jesus seeker preech to people about not commiting sins and such the go fuck a little boy in the ass. i mean there is people all over the world that start "cults" and get looked down apon for it and chewed out. not saying they shouldn't b, i totally agree with shutting that shit down, but is religion not a cult in it's self. just because something has been around for hundreds, even thousands of years for some religions, this doesn't make them any more rite or real. i can c people back in history beliving in gods and such, but they didn't have the knowlege and know how that we do in this day and age. they wanted and answer so they created one. the truth is no one will ever know the real truth behind how everything started and how we were created and all that stuff. honestly i could care less. i'm here now and that is what i know for fact and what i can c for fact. i am not dedicating what is probly the only existance i will ever have to a book of fucking lies. i won't. enjoy the now, cherish it, love it. that is what matters because that's what we know. before i start to go off on a rant, lol, i just want to say to all u who belive in what ever figure u call god, think about things. do some research, get your facts then base your desision on that. don't just fall into the trap of religion because ur parents said it was what is rite. if in the end of all that u still feel that this is what u want to think, i really don''t care. just know what else is out there and don't limit your self to a fairy tail that was written before they could c the whole picture.

 

[Fishface]

I just choose to believe in what is actually real.

Which is?

8)

 

[Enlitx]

Which is?

8)

How about those things we have evidence for? Evolution, biochemistry, physics, etc... Certainly not psychic abilities, gods, or "universal love energy", whatever the fuck that is.

 

[Fishface]

None of those things are 'real'. They are mere constructs with which to attempt to decribe the 'material reality' we experience.

I am unaware of the experiences mynameisnotDeja has had, but I know that if I recounted some of the experiences I have had during my near 54 years, you would not believe them, yet I know them to be 'real'.

This *waves hands around to indicate 'reality'* is nothing but an illusion or, as Albert Einstein said, 'Reality is an illusion, albeit a persistent one'.