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Opioids Kratom Mega Thread v. 5

LOL To reiterate:

Got a Beginner's Pack from a place. Red Vein Meng Da, Green Vein Malay, and White Vein Bali. Looked like a deal to me. (Been researching.) This will be my first time, so I plan on taking it slow and seeing how my body handles it. Any suggestions from other Kratom users? Should I be concerned about potential interactions with hydrochlorathizide, spironolactine, furosomide, omeprazole, and Advair Diskus Inahaler? Also, hearing a lot about potential liver toxicity, I'm taking Milk Thistle, as I'm on an aspirin regimen for my osteoarthritis. 175mg of Milk Thistle three times a day. (Self administered, that last one.)

I plan on using a low dose in the morning for productivity, and an opiate dose at night. I'm a big guy, about 460 with mild hypertension. (Ergo the hydrochlorathizide.) Other than that, only problems I've had is light atherosclerosis. I do have gastric reflux (ergo the omeprazole) and I smoke about two packs a day, though I am switching to vape and hopefully staying on it this time. I do not drink (very little, anyways) As in I used to drink about once a year or so, and would drink heavily at one time. I don't drink now, as my meds dinnae like the alcohol, LOL I was administered mobic for osteoarthritis pain. but have discontinued (self) after seeing some reactions I didn't like.

Also, as I am on the meds for fluid retention specifically, should I be worried about the main toxicology post-mortem issue with many of these so-called Kratom deaths, which is "pulmonary congestion and edema and a distended bladder, both of which are consistent with, though not diagnostic of, opiate use."--https://www.researchgate.net/publication/232526745_A_Drug_Fatality_Involving_Kratom

I know Kratom's effect largely vary by individual, but I don't want to do anything stupid (moreso than smoking and eating the wrong things) and end up as one of the rare statistics of fatality in cases which involved (along with a shitton of other drugs usually) Kratom. I won't take it if I think there's a serious risk here. :/

PS: The DEA withdrawing the September ban was actually a positive step in the right direction. Plus 45 members of the House intervened, petitioning the DEA to stop the Kratom ban. That's, frankly, unprecedented. I feel confident about the December 1st due date. And if I'm wrong, well I'll just move on. :/
 
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LOL To reiterate:



PS: The DEA withdrawing the September ban was actually a positive step in the right direction. Plus 45 members of the House intervened to petitioned the DEA to stop the Kratom ban. That's, frankly, unprecedented. I feel confident about the December 1st due date. And if I'm wrong, well I'll just move on. :/


You feel confident that Kratom will stay legal or will become illegal on December 1st??

I'm hoping that it stays legal.

Yes it was VERY unprecedented and a step in the right direction, but I hope it doesn't just stop there and stays legal.

It's my favorite drug ever other than maybe shrooms and I want to continue to have access to it.

But I really don't know the answers to your questions here man, and I'm not sure if anyone here can claim to for sure.

I very much doubt it would have negative reactions with a steroid inhaler, Asprin, Milk Thistle or omeprazole and I wouldn't hesitate to mix it with them, but I don't have much familiarity with the other substances you are talking about.

As mentioned, I don't think Kratom is toxic to most people's livers.

I really don't know much about the issue of fluid retention, I'm not a doctor.

One thing about your night time dosage, FOR ME and many others Kratom keeps them up at night, but some others sleep on it just fine.

I personally could not sleep a wink unless the Kratom had WORN OFF about 6 hours prior to bedtime, but this may not be an issue for you.

I recommend trying to keep your dosage low and not using more than about 3 days a week so you don't get addicted, but even if you do I didn't find the withdrawals to be very bad but I was VERY strict about NEVER using it more than 4 days a week.

As for strains, they tend to differ based on vendor and are not always the same across the board so I'm not sure how much name always matters, but red strains are usually more sedating, white more stimulating and green in the middle.

Green Malay is my favorite strain followed by Red Bali.

If you want to toss and wash thats how I do it, just put a VERY small amount in my bottom lip like if it were chewing tobacco (I suggest NOT putting more than a teaspoon in your mouth at one time) and wash it down with water...but beware it doesn't taste good and many people HATE it more than I do and do NOT put too much in your mouth at once or you could choke on it on the way down as it is very gritty like a ground herb would be.

There are other ways to take it but toss n' wash is the only I've used.

It takes about 45 mins to kick in and lasts about 4 hours.

I would personally not eat a LOT before you take it and during the first two hours of the experience as that can dull it, but I don't starve myself to get high off it like others do either.

Many people think you HAVE to take it on an empty stomach to get high and I've found that to be false in my case BUT you will almost certainly get higher the longer you go without food before taking it.

You might perhaps find you don't get as high as some people if you've eaten a lot prior to it as you said you are a big guy, and I wouldn't want to ruin the experience, so I'd just suggest not eating for 2 hours prior and then not again till it's worn off.

You say you have stomach issues and Kratom gives SOME people stomach aches so I might suggest taking some Pepto Bismol or something like that if it bothers you as that has helped with me, but usually my stomach tolerates it fine.

As you've probably heard, many compare it to a low dose of Vicodin with some stimulant effects as well.

Just a really nice mood boost and puts me in a great mood.
 
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Yeah, I'm not even worried about the QT thing anymore, but these thigh pains are kinda scaring me. I'm a hypchondriac though, so get scared easily. I just don't know what else would be causing them, both of my inner thighs are hurting. Of course my mind thinks of all kinds of issues this could be from...

Yeah dude, I have no idea about your thigh pains, never experienced that.

Maybe you strained them in some way while on Kratom without noticing since Kratom is a mild pain killer, and then noticed them when it wore off??

That's all I could imagine.

I wouldn't worry about it much.
 
The effects of Kratom for me* are 110% linked to stomach contents and acidity. Empty stomach = Good times. Empty stomach and NOT taking antacid medication = BEST times. ANY amount of food = Almost ZERO effect for me.
 
The effects of Kratom for me* are 110% linked to stomach contents and acidity. Empty stomach = Good times. Empty stomach and NOT taking antacid medication = BEST times. ANY amount of food = Almost ZERO effect for me.

Yeah, it's that way for some people, just not me.

I mean in those situations where that happened did you just keeping take more to see if EVENTUALLY you'd get a good effect and if so did it STILL not work??

I'd assume a higher dosage would work if you had a full stomach, at least for me it did, but maybe not for you.
 
Yeah dude, I have no idea about your thigh pains, never experienced that.

Maybe you strained them in some way while on Kratom without noticing since Kratom is a mild pain killer, and then noticed them when it wore off??

That's all I could imagine.

I wouldn't worry about it much.

Yeah man, I'm actually so high I'm I don't feel it right now lol.

I'm on 7.6G, my highest dose yet. Is that considered a pretty high dose? It's of some Green Malay.

I'm gonna try the Maeng Da or Red Borneo I get tomorrow, and then gonna take a 3-4 day break.
 
Possibly, but I just don't like the idea of putting more than 10g of that stuff, in one sitting. Double digits is already too much imo. Especially when you would think you have to take it 2-4 times a day. Which is a lot. I've noticed so far since taking it, I am urinating a LOT more than normally. I don't think it's quite affected me like a fiber in that department yet lol.
 
You feel confident that Kratom will stay legal or will become illegal on December 1st??

I'm hoping that it stays legal.

Yes it was VERY unprecedented and a step in the right direction, but I hope it doesn't just stop there and stays legal.

It's my favorite drug ever other than maybe shrooms and I want to continue to have access to it.

But I really don't know the answers to your questions here man, and I'm not sure if anyone here can claim to for sure.

I very much doubt it would have negative reactions with a steroid inhaler, Asprin, Milk Thistle or omeprazole and I wouldn't hesitate to mix it with them, but I don't have much familiarity with the other substances you are talking about.

As mentioned, I don't think Kratom is toxic to most people's livers.

I really don't know much about the issue of fluid retention, I'm not a doctor.

One thing about your night time dosage, FOR ME and many others Kratom keeps them up at night, but some others sleep on it just fine.

I personally could not sleep a wink unless the Kratom had WORN OFF about 6 hours prior to bedtime, but this may not be an issue for you.

I recommend trying to keep your dosage low and not using more than about 3 days a week so you don't get addicted, but even if you do I didn't find the withdrawals to be very bad but I was VERY strict about NEVER using it more than 4 days a week.

As for strains, they tend to differ based on vendor and are not always the same across the board so I'm not sure how much name always matters, but red strains are usually more sedating, white more stimulating and green in the middle.

Green Malay is my favorite strain followed by Red Bali.

If you want to toss and wash thats how I do it, just put a VERY small amount in my bottom lip like if it were chewing tobacco (I suggest NOT putting more than a teaspoon in your mouth at one time) and wash it down with water...but beware it doesn't taste good and many people HATE it more than I do and do NOT put too much in your mouth at once or you could choke on it on the way down as it is very gritty like a ground herb would be.

There are other ways to take it but toss n' wash is the only I've used.

It takes about 45 mins to kick in and lasts about 4 hours.

I would personally not eat a LOT before you take it and during the first two hours of the experience as that can dull it, but I don't starve myself to get high off it like others do either.

Many people think you HAVE to take it on an empty stomach to get high and I've found that to be false in my case BUT you will almost certainly get higher the longer you go without food before taking it.

You might perhaps find you don't get as high as some people if you've eaten a lot prior to it as you said you are a big guy, and I wouldn't want to ruin the experience, so I'd just suggest not eating for 2 hours prior and then not again till it's worn off.

You say you have stomach issues and Kratom gives SOME people stomach aches so I might suggest taking some Pepto Bismol or something like that if it bothers you as that has helped with me, but usually my stomach tolerates it fine.

As you've probably heard, many compare it to a low dose of Vicodin with some stimulant effects as well.

Just a really nice mood boost and puts me in a great mood.

I REALLY miss it and hope it stays legal after December 1st so I can feel confident in ordering it again, but I don't see the point in buying more and reminding myself how much I love it before I run out and can't get more...

Thanks for your reply! It's very informative, and I agree with you on how people react individually to it. I also appreciate that you didn't try to provide an answer for those medications you weren't familiar with. Some people try to defend Kratom to the point of addressing all concerns with the statement "it's completely harmless." I'm glad you are sensitive enough to admit a lack of understanding where you deem necessary. Honest dialogues like this are what will keep Kratom legal, should it remain so. And even many prestigious and formally educated people are admitting the DEA overstepped its bounds with its arbitrary attempt at Prohibition II, LOL I think that helps also, as many people are under the influence (no pun intended, LOL) that those defending Kratom so vehemently are just junkies and faux meth addicts, and shit like that. Boards like Bluelight and posters like you help to show people that's not the case. So again, thank you! :)
 
^ The answer is strain dependent. But if you get a strain that is high in mitragynine (the opiate metabolite), I would say you're going to want to dose at least 4 or 5 grams. The onset of action takes about 15-45 minutes, so I'd wait 45 minutes to redose if necessary. Red vein has more of an opiate like effect, white vein has more stimulant properties and green vein is a mix of both. Although both effects can be felt with all strains.. generally lower doses procure the stimulant effects, while high doses generate the opiate like effects.
 
ive been dosing more and more kratom lately.

Same here :/ I know the feeling.

When I first tried kratom 2 years ago, I was clean from all opiates for 2 years at the time. (I was addicted years ago, then went on suboxone for 1.5 years, tapered off and remained clean for 2).

So I was finally free of the monkey for two full years and I started taking kratom. All I needed was 1 or 2 gram doses and I was happy. I kept it under control and didn't use often enough to get hooked. I loved it.

Then I got cocky and tried Tianeptine. Thought I could use it occasionally in small doses like I had been doing with kratom. Wrong, so utterly fucking wrong.. My Tianeptine doses instantly spiralled out of control, I was constantly redosing and I found myself very quickly dependent. I've been using it nonstop now for the last 1.5 years or so.

I'm tapering off Tianeptine now and plan on switching to kratom for the final taper stretch. I need to get lower on Tianeptine first. I was at 3g of sodium salt per day at the worst. Currently I'm down to 1g of free acid spread throughout the day. I've made good progress but have a lot more tapering to do.

It sucks though. I really enjoy kratom and I miss what it used to be for me. Lately I have been experimenting to discover where my kratom tolerance is at. In the beginning 1 or 2 grams was a pleasant 3 or 4 hour experience. But lately Ive been trying bigger and bigger doses and not getting much out of it.

Yesterday I tried my largest kratom dose to date: 12 grams and felt a short mild buzz for only 45 minutes followed by absence of any Tianeptine withdrawals for only another 3 hours. I might try 16g next, but I don't want to waste anymore of my kratom. I should keep what I have for the final stretch instead of wasting it on increasing bigger doses that aren't doing much... Though the 12g dose was promising though mild...
 
Try splitting your normal dose for the day into two doses spread out by 5-6 hours, less is really more with the self-limiting kratom. If you take too much too often, it will produce a higher side effect:desirable effect ratio than by taking reasonable amount (4-8g a day) split into smaller doses.

Also, keep in mind that tianeptine is a hardcore opioid relative to the μ-opioid receptor agonist alkaloids found in kratom. If you're looking to chase some sort of super-powerful opioid effect out of kratom, it's just not going to happen.
 
I don't know if this will help anyone either, who caps their Kratom, like myself. I was using the '0' sized pills at first, but quickly switched to the '000' size, based on another users recommend. It has made a decent difference for me. Less of the "gelatin" in your stomach to get through, and more "space" for the Kratom to fill. If I pack them tight, I can basically get 3g in two pills. Taking less of them, gives me greater effect and cuts down on the time it takes to come on. I'm trying so hard to not go above 10g, hell I don't even like being that high to begin with, and I honestly didn't think my tolerance was that high. 12mcg of Fent is like 30 oxy oral. So, recommending 4-5g for the guy who is on 40-50mg of Methadone, just might be an understatement. Just saying from my own experience, but then again, my stomach pH and stuff are waaay wacked out, so it could be different.
 
I don't know if this will help anyone either, who caps their Kratom, like myself. I was using the '0' sized pills at first, but quickly switched to the '000' size, based on another users recommend. It has made a decent difference for me. Less of the "gelatin" in your stomach to get through, and more "space" for the Kratom to fill. If I pack them tight, I can basically get 3g in two pills. Taking less of them, gives me greater effect and cuts down on the time it takes to come on. I'm trying so hard to not go above 10g, hell I don't even like being that high to begin with, and I honestly didn't think my tolerance was that high. 12mcg of Fent is like 30 oxy oral. So, recommending 4-5g for the guy who is on 40-50mg of Methadone, just might be an understatement. Just saying from my own experience, but then again, my stomach pH and stuff are waaay wacked out, so it could be different.

I never used the gelatin caps, isn't it like pig skin or something? Whatever it is, it can't be good for your system. There are vegetable capsules that are much safer for your digestive system.
 
The effects of Kratom for me* are 110% linked to stomach contents and acidity. Empty stomach = Good times. Empty stomach and NOT taking antacid medication = BEST times. ANY amount of food = Almost ZERO effect for me.

This is true. Eating before taking Kratom pretty much killed any effect for me too when I used to take it. You have to take it on an empty stomach to get full benefits. I did notice that after a while, I would get the munchies and eating on it made the Kratom feel even better. I used to really be into it years ago. I can't even remember the last time I took it. It used to help with anxiety and put me in a good mood. It stopped working for me long ago and I only felt side effects.

I'm really glad it's still available (for now), simply for the fact it's a miracle for anyone going through withdrawals.

This part isn't directed at you Pixies, just saying in general: As someone mentioned earlier, this is not a good time to get hooked on Kratom. Who knows when the DEA will finally have their way. If you're not looking to get a "high" and you're only battling withdrawals, take advantage of it now while it's still around and try to get off whatever opiate you need to.
 
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This is true. Eating before taking Kratom pretty much killed any effect for me too when I used to take it. You have to take it on an empty stomach to get full benefits. I did notice that after a while, I would get the munchies and eating on it made the Kratom feel even better. I used to really be into it years ago. I can't even remember the last time I took it. It used to help with anxiety and put me in a good mood. It stopped working for me long ago and I only felt side effects.

I'm glad to read this because I thought I was the only weird person! I dose on an empty stomach, usually, but then get the munchies an hour or two later. Once I eat, I feel the Kratom even more. It's like it pushes it through my system, lol
 
I take neixum every AM, but, I've noticed that grapefruit juice really kicks in relief for me, I got a pound of citric-acid for $6- I added a pinch to water and it's tastier - I'm gonna try drinking it with Kratom.
I was in horrible WD today and took ~15 grams and it really saved me.
I feel like even the acid in coke, if I drink it with kratom, helps a lil with the relief.
 
Okay, I know what people say about Kratom and Calcium, esp. Milk. (That is, they taper the effects of the Kratom.) What about cocoa packets? (Not that cocoa, LMAO) They have hardly enough amounts of either to qualify, right? I'm pretty sure Kratom on a completely empty stomach will make me sick, as I have GERD.

Anyways, to the main point of my post. Still researching Kratom before I make the jump and came across a listing in Google which said "DEA intelligence brief"--half quoting there, LOL I dun remember the full title--and it seems a step in the right direction if true. (And as it leads to nim.nih, I'm sure it is.)

http://https://toxnet.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/sis/search/a?dbs+hsdb:@term+@DOCNO+7901 Food for thought, anyways. 8D
 
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Hey guys,

I've used Kratom on and off for the past 2 weeks, and lately have had some bad leg and arms cramps. The leg cramps go all the way up into my thighs.

I've never really had these before, and think they are somehow Kratom related? If I cut my usage back to 2 days a week, I'm sure it would be fine. Should I be worried? Could this be a sign of bad circulation while on Kratom?
 
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