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  • EADD Moderators: Pissed_and_messed | Shinji Ikari

Jobseeker's Allowance Megathread ver. The Jeremy Kyle Fan Club

Ismene said:
No, every word of that is complete bollocks. The problem hasn't been around for decades - 5 years ago unemployment was lower than it had been for decades. The reason? There was quite a few jobs. The reason people are on benefits now is...drum roll.....

.......................

There's no fucking JOBS!!

These things come a little clearer when you talk them through.
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You totally miss my point. Yes, more people are on benefits now because there are fewer jobs (because of the recession - economics 101 here eh). I never disputed that and I was not talking about unemployment in general, although thanks for the revelation that fewer jobs = more unemployment 8)

I was saying that there has always been a minority who have no intention of working, even if there was a decent job for everyone in the country, and there always will be under the current system. However tackling this problem effectively without punishing the large majority of unemployed people who genuinely would love nothing more than to find a job; that's the difficult issue I was referring to.
 
how long should we let people stay on the dole for before putting them in forced labor camps or used in involuntary lab experiments? surely 1 year is enough time to get a job.
 
o make sure the unemployed get treated with some sort of common decency and respect
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Go you, you're such a great guy. The unemployed deserve to be treated with contempt and despised at all times.

we should have a swap around of the system. Sack all the DSS staff and employ all the unemployed in their place. then we'll have lots of unemployed people who have recent work history, a good CV, references and a will to work and they should be pretty good at getting jobs since their profession was dishing them out.

the job center will still be run by cretins and all the vacancies will be filled up and nobody out of work, which means we can sack all the DSS staff again and they can go back to drinking special brew and smoking crack.
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Winner! :D
 
tranceaddict84 said:
I was saying that there has always been a minority who have no intention of working, even if there was a decent job for everyone in the country, and there always will be under the current system.
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Nah, I'm calling bollocks on that. When there were plenty of jobs unemployment was so minor it had no effect on the economy. The idea that there's millions of people desperate to live in £60 a week is nonsense.

And remember mass unemployment is fantastic news of any right-wing government - it lets you drive down wages, drive down working conditions and destroy unions. That's why the first task of Thatcher was to create enormous unemployment. That was the key to introducing "free market" economics.
 
Ismene said:
Nah, I'm calling bollocks on that. When there were plenty of jobs unemployment was so minor it had no effect on the economy. The idea that there's millions of people desperate to live in £60 a week, rent paid, child benefits is nonsense.
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With all the extra's included there are some people who couldn't afford to work and others who just don't want to.

I've known a few scroungers like that, milk the benefit system for all it's worth when there's fuck all wrong, bar some whiney bullshit that with a kick up the arsis soon would be sorted, with them Have never done a days work in their life and they think they're owed it all.

They're better of then I am. (pissed off cos I just paid a big tax bill...)

Average Joe loses his job , they got problems 'milking' the 60quid out of them.
 
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Arnold said:
I've known a few scroungers like that, milk the benefit system for all it's worth when there's fuck all wrong, bar some whiney bullshit that with a kick up the arsis soon would be sorted, with them Have never done a days work in their life and they think they're owed it all.
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So on the off chance of catching one of these alledged "scoungers" we make every one who claims JSA go and pick up dogshit 40 hours a week? Or do menial work that we could employ someone and pay them a living wage to do?

What use is that to anyone but the rich employer who gets free labour while the state pays his £60 a week wage bill for him?
 
Ismene said:
So on the off chance of catching one of these alledged "scoungers" we make every one who claims JSA go and pick up dogshit 40 hours a week? Or do menial work that we could employ someone and pay them a living wage to do?

What use is that to anyone but the rich employer who gets free labour while the state pays his £60 a week wage bill for him?
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Your view is very simplistic -- forcing people to pick up dog shit 40 for hours a week -- but it is actually the basis of a decent theory.

If the jobcentre assessed people based on their strengths and requirements they could then assign them to an appropriate part-time, unpaid position with a local authority, council or similar public sector employer. Sort of like the work experience placement most of us will have done through school when we were about 14-15.

I don't think any genuine jobseeker would have any problem with doing something like this for maybe six hours twice a week in order to claim their JSA (12 hours work for your £65 is not unreasonable). They could then gain valuable experience relevant to the line of work they were looking for as well as getting an employer reference to back up their job applications.

I'm not saying this approach would solve everything but anything that genuinely helps people and at the same time takes away the option of getting money for doing literally fuck all has to be a good start.
 
They'd probably object to doing some piece of shit job they're not at all interested in and isn't actually relevant to them, which let's face it is what they'd end up doing given the job centre's love of trying to palm off call centre jobs on fucking graduates.

It's probably more hassle to train and accommodate these people for the council, they couldn't do any meaningful work without getting a CRB check no doubt.
 
wibble said:
They'd probably object to doing some piece of shit job they're not at all interested in and isn't actually relevant to them, which let's face it is what they'd end up doing given the job centre's love of trying to palm off call centre jobs on fucking graduates.
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You object you lose your benefit, simple as that. Granted it would need a big shift in attitude from the job centres (that's a different issue entirely) but I'm sure given the right disposition they / the country as a whole could find something useful, suitable and ultimately mutually beneficial for many of the people currently claiming JSA to do. Some people will only ever have the aptitude to pick up dog shit or clean up graffiti, that's life, but I don't think obligating people to do so for a few hours a week in exchange for their benefits would be unreasonable.
 
tranceaddict84 said:
... but anything that genuinely helps people...
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I think that may be the sticking point in your plan.

Jobcentre isn't really about helping people. Sure, they provide a handy job listing service, but their primary function has always been to keep unemployment statistics artificially low - even in the good years.

They'll have no interest in giving people a helping and useful hand in the bad years. It will be about forcing people into any old shite to deflate the figures - an approach paradoxically advocated in your follow-up post.
 
tambourine-man said:
Jobcentre isn't really about helping people. Sure, they provide a handy job listing service, but their primary function has always been to keep unemployment statistics artificially low - even in the good years.

They'll have no interest in giving people a helping and useful hand in the bad years. It will be about forcing people into any old shite to deflate the figures - an approach paradoxically advocated in your follow-up post.
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As I already conceded, in order to work it would require a massive change in approach from the jobcentre who are, as you say, currently mainly concerned with lowering statistics and meeting targets.

And I'm not advocating forcing people into whatever shit unsuitable job possible just to get them off the dole -- they'd still be on the dole -- but get them either doing something to increase their employability or in the case of the minority who really are beyond hope, just doing something vaguely useful to society so they're not getting money for doing nothing.
 
I'll tell you now that I would refuse to work 12hrs a week for £65 JSA.

And in the past I've done unpaid voluntary work whilst I've been unemployed and whilst employed so it's not like I'm against giving my time unless I'm being paid well. But there's no way I'm going to be forced into some shitty job just to be able to claim my JSA which I already am entitled to due to paying taxes.

YOU CAN FUCK RIGHT OFF!
 
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