I Like to Draw Pictures of Random Molecules

[Nagelfar]

You can't phosphine. You just can't phosphine. It's not allowed. You will never -- there is never -- you can't put a phosphine in a drug. Full stop. Instant covalently-bonding-to-enzymes territory, right there. Phosphonic acids, maybe. Phosphoric monoamide esters and N-phosphorylimines, sure.

Also, both of those aminals are unstable.

My above quoted one from two above, or the last one after I quoted the other one in two different capacities? I would think the former one should be stable.

 

[Nagelfar]

Question; might a stable structure be formed that basic (heptatic, for example) human metabolism turns into an 'energetic' substance in vivo? This isn't atomic, but molecular, so I couldn't see free radicals or radiation resulting, what would the effect be in such an instance?

 

[sekio]

It depends.

"Energetic molecules" are generally only really "energetic" when you put a lot of them together (milligrams e.g.); when you have a biological system that functions at high dilutions you might be able to produce energetic compounds, but they would be reasonably expected to either react with cellular components or decompose catalytically rather than going kerboom.

There are mycotoxins that effectively act as prodrugs for hydrazine compounds, arguably those are energetic molecules being made (exothermic decomposition to N2 gas etc) but I think the main effect of the produced hydrazine is not decomposition but instead reactions with proteins.

In the normally reducing environment* of a mammalian cell I would not expect anything with a nitro group to survive, or some of the other "oxidising" moieties.

* gross oversimplification

 

[Nagelfar]

It depends.

"Energetic molecules" are generally only really "energetic" when you put a lot of them together (milligrams e.g.); when you have a biological system that functions at high dilutions you might be able to produce energetic compounds, but they would be reasonably expected to either react with cellular components or decompose catalytically rather than going kerboom.

There are mycotoxins that effectively act as prodrugs for hydrazine compounds, arguably those are energetic molecules being made (exothermic decomposition to N2 gas etc) but I think the main effect of the produced hydrazine is not decomposition but instead reactions with proteins.

In the normally reducing environment* of a mammalian cell I would not expect anything with a nitro group to survive, or some of the other "oxidising" moieties.

* gross oversimplification

Interesting. I was thinking of a specific way to target and kill off cells, like oxidopamine is used for, but in a more universal sort of application for whichever ligand. Bind and blow. ;-p ;j

 

[Dresden]

1-cyclopentyl-2-phenyl-ethane.
1-(1,3-benzodioxole-5-yl)-2-cyclopentyl-ethane.
1-(3,4,5-trimethoxyphenyl)-2-cyclopentyl-ethane.

Possibly some great research chemicals there.

 

[Nexus_Tripper]

https://i.imgur.com/STw7jsU.png

The N-cyano and N-fluro groups would be metabolized off, leaving large amounts of cyanide and fluorine. The 3-(2-bromomethyl) group would alkylize DNA, making this a strong mutagen, and the 4-iodo group would likely add massive serotogenic neurotoxicity.

 

[pharmakos]

so what you're saying is we'll see that on the RC market in a month or two

 

[SteamboatBillJr]

^Only in the places with absolute prohibition. When decriminalization in California is successfull perhaps we could get some additional change.

 

[roi]

 

[Dresden]

5-MeO-JWH-018.
4-OH-JWH-018.

Unless it's me taking it, then I'd rather use JWH-073 or 250 as the base.

 

[roi]

2-Fluoropentyl and 6-Fluorohexyl seem be possible as well.

 

[pharmakos]

5-MeO-JWH-018.
4-OH-JWH-018.

lol

the tryptamine connection inspired me to draw this:

its like LSD, but opened up and with a pentyl added to the nitrogen on the indole and an added JWH-style oxygen secondary to the indole on the other side.

might not need that added oxygen, but its funny that this is likely active as a cannabinoid. you can put a lot of strange junk where JWH-018's napthyl group was and still retain some activity.

 

[crmt28]

lol

the tryptamine connection inspired me to draw this:

its like LSD, but opened up and with a pentyl added to the nitrogen on the indole and an added JWH-style oxygen secondary to the indole on the other side.

might not need that added oxygen, but its funny that this is likely active as a cannabinoid. you can pot a lot of strange junk where JWH-018's napthyl group was and still retain some activity.

Interesting! We could probably see 1-Pentionyl-LSD one day. It would probably end up very similar to 1P-LSD.

No idea if it could actually end up hitting CB receptors, though. Maybe with a few tweaks on the molecule.

 

[Dresden]

1-pentyl-LSD would be closer to the original JWHs.

 

[blueberries]

Almost definitely been thought of before but can't find much on it (in fact I think Shulgin referred to it in the Psilocin bit, but it could have been the methoxy). Can anyone give me some insight? Good/bad, strong/weak, visuals/non?

4-MeOH-DMT (Heh! M-ee-O)

 

[blueberries]

lol

the tryptamine connection inspired me to draw this:

its like LSD, but opened up and with a pentyl added to the nitrogen on the indole and an added JWH-style oxygen secondary to the indole on the other side.

might not need that added oxygen, but its funny that this is likely active as a cannabinoid. you can put a lot of strange junk where JWH-018's napthyl group was and still retain some activity.

This....just may work. Taking away the N1 and 4-keto groups to alleviate it's cannabinoid effects, it seems like a phenmetrazine style tryptamine analogue with the trimmings of LSD. I think you had it right without the extras, it could even be as potent as DMT or stronger, certainly easier crossing the BBB. Who knows, maybe even without the 1-keto-methylamine. It seems like it'd just be an extra bit to reduce potency.

So something like this:

EDIT: I'm an idiot. I knew I'd seen it before. This is N-Me-pip-T. Well, at least the hydroxy should be active!

EDIT2: It does, however, give insight into the workings of LSD and analogues to come, so perhaps beneficial in the long run.

EDIT3: How about this though?

Same number of atoms away from the previous amine as LSD and that ketone moves back a bit and joins the hydrogen (perhaps at a downward angle, like LSD?).

 

[roi]

Might work. And one more for Nagelfar:

 

[blueberries]

Or even:

I very much doubt any activity but it's nice to dream!

 

[roi]

β-Hydroxythio-3,5-dimethyl-4-fluorofuranylfentanyl

 

[crmt28]

Crazy 2C-B analogue, inspired by Glaucine, which basically looks like two DMPEAs glued together.

Not sure about the extra bromine or the N-methyl, but this compound could have some interesting psychedelic activity.

If not, maybe if we changed changed the methoxy groups around, like the TMA series.

EDIT:

From what I've read on Wikipedia on similar compounds, it might not be psychedelic at all, since Glaucine isn't even active at the 5-HT2a receptors from what I've read. But it still could have interesting therapeutic potential as a non-addictive anxiolytic/analgesic like Tetrahydropalmatine.