How Young is too Young?

[Russ]

Fuck, I go out to lunch, and I find this when I come back.
I think the following quote sums up what I feel exactly!!!

Originally posted by Mr. Horse:
What a crock of shit, get off your high horses.
It amazes me how self righteous so many people on this board are!
From "A good age to start", I mean I wouldn't like to see anyone younger then this takeing drugs. I don't mean, "OK, your 17 now, here's a pill"
My lil' bro has wanted to come with me to raves for ages, but I have not let him.
I think the age of 17 is acceptable because itis the age where you have developed enough physically and mentally to handle a pill. You are treated in nearly all areas as an adult. You can drive a car, get a job and live by yourself.
My lil' bro is a devious little shit, and he would be getting into this himself. So, my older brother and myself have given him guidence.
He got a pill tester for his B'day, knows to test all pills, about how much water to drink, about overdoing it.
I now have to go to a meeting. So, I will reply again if needed when I return.
But, I am glad that I have encouraged some good discussion.

 

[sydkiwi]

When I did my first pill at 20 it was like I had my school cert, hsc and uni a head of me like someone who was say 14 or 15. Ive seen 14 year old chicks at one of the utopias in the loos. their friend is smacking out big time. they standing around arguing on wot to do with her. She on the other hand still standing there looks likes shes about to go on them. the thing that gets me at this age is:
1. how the fuck do they get those drugs
2. who is looking after them?
3. Do they no wot to do in an emergency. standing around arguing on wot to do with your smacking out mate isnt going to solve a thing.
I mean they teach at schools how bad drugs are etc But really they still kids, and most of the time have not really much of an idea of wot to do with a mate whos not handling it. I mean like ive said Ive seen kids out with their friends and not with anyone who looks like they could be an older brother or sister infact they just out with their mates. they come out with this "look at me, Im soo cool. Im at a rave and Im on ECSTASY!!!". attitude.

 

[Russ]

^^^That is exactly what I meant when I started this thread.
Young KIDS, smashed out of their heads. Who don't know what to do when their friend is to hammered to walk.

 

[SKADAVER]

I truelly believe that when they say " take drugs safe" that age is one thing that has to be considered. Not at all your PYsICAL age but your mental one. We all know that drugs open up other parts of your brain and make you think in ways that you never did before. I have friends that i would not recommend ever taking drugs because they would never be able to appreciate the experience. That alone, there is also being able to handle yourself and " what if" something went wrong. A person must be at a mental age to be able to responibley handle drugs, because there may never be a psyical age at which they will be able to do that. I once saw a picture of some guy pilling with his kids, one was only 12 years old, also pilling. after i saw it it made me psyical ill and i cried at seeing such innocence distroyed and then supported by a father. This 43 year old man who was giving his kid pills i would say is not at a mental age to be handling drugs. 43. giving his 12 year old pills. That is not responsible drug taking.
One other thing that i have to say that when i go out i do find a lot of younger kids: ie; under the age of 18, that it is there older bro/sis that offers pills to them. Im going to be judgmental here but any brother or sister that GIVES their younger siblings drugs sickens me. support your own habbit, dont create others.
[ 25 September 2002: Message edited by: SKADAVER ]
[ 25 September 2002: Message edited by: SKADAVER ]

 

[Russ]

Originally posted by SKADAVER:
One other thing that i have to say that when i go out i do find a lot of younger kids: ie; under the age of 18, that it is there older bro/sis that offers pills to them. Im going to be judgmental here but any brother or sister that GIVES their younger siblings drugs sickens me. support your own habbit, dont create others.
What the alternative then? Them going behind your back and doing it anyway.
This site is about Harm Minimisation. This means educating people about the safest possible method of takeing drugs.
I have physically stopped my little brother from takeing pills. Taken them off him.
But now I have educated him and he is aware of the risks.
I think it is "sickening" that you would turn a sibling away if they came asking for guidence.

 

[Sowle]

I am only 15 so expect some bias
There is no general age when someone just wakes up in the morning with the ability to handle drugs and alcohol. Everyone just develops at their own time, some a lot younger than others some a lot older. I have met so many 13 and 14 year olds that have done pills, speed, heroin and coke and been more informed and prepared than their 20 year old counterparts.
Russ's older brother did the exact right thing coz if his little bro wanted to do them he would certainly find a way.
Kids are starting to do stuff(sex, drugs, parties) a lot younger and though it can cause damage if you are still growing, if you know what you are doing you can greatly minimize(sp?) the chances of any negative things happening.
My group of friends and I started young(weed-11, speed-13, pills-14) but we made sure to learn what we needed to know. Some of you may say that is too young but we are all healthy and having fun.

 

[Sllip]

One of the good things about when you turn 18 is that you can go to license places, buy alcohol and ciggarettes, go to strip clubs, buy porn, and other other joys of life.
I personally don't think anyone under the age of 18 should be regularily using drugs, legal or otherwise, since there are certain things you just have to wait for, whether you like it or not.

 

[pill_popping_babe]

Hmmm, VERY interesting topic, and one which i often think about. I'm 17, as many of you no doubt know, and I had my first pill about 3-4 years ago... Looking back, I was too young, an I know alot of people would look atme NOW and think I'm still too young to be going out like I do. However, I can honestly say that I'm a lot more mature and safe reagrding the way i go about it all, and to say that there's an age when it all suddenly becomes "acceptable" is just ridiculous - I've seen 30 year olds swallowing 4 pills "just because the first one didn't work"! On the other hand, there does have to be some sort of limit, although in my opinion, this limit has to be set individually for each person by those close to them.
My sister, who's 13, knows that i take drugs. She hangs around with "the bad crowd" at school, and many of that group of kids are already into the drug scene.
By telling my sister about what I do, it not only gives her someone to talk to about the issue without feeling embarassed or unsure, but it gives her an alley to turn down when the day comes that she wants to try something as well. I'd much rather her decide to try a pill and come to me about it, than get it through a friend. What would i prefer her to try, a tested pill which i can in controlled ammounts, or a dodgy random pill thats come from god knows where, in completely random ammounts? I think the answer is obvious.
I would never condone drug use, but this rule applies to 10, 30, and 50 year olds. However, if anyone, no matter what their age, asked me for advice, or wanted someone to be around for their first pill, I would always gladly help out, even if some would see this as the wrong thing to do...

 

[pac.man*]

I think it’s important to be a reasonably educated person before indulging in such substances so as to properly understand exactly what’s going on. And that said, I’m not suggesting that a thirty year old is better educated in a way that will help harm minimisation than a twelve year old or a twenty year old. But obviously there is some discrimination between the amount a child knows and the amount an “adult” knows about illicit drugs and how to use them as safely as possible.
wrong. most "adults" don't know the first thing about illicit drugs, their effects, or the difference between USE and ABUSE. this is not to say that younger people do either. but restricting their use does not help. think of a main reason that the "war on drugs" is failing miserably: the lack of ability for society to guide and aid users. shutting them out, particularly family and friends, is not the answer.
i have problems with younger uneducated people taking drugs, but this being said, i have problems with uneducated people of all ages taking drugs. but we have to embrace these people and help them to USE drugs, rather than ABUSING them. simply taking a hardline approach is not the answer. look at underage drinking: an age limit does not solve anything. it will always be a problem until people learn to accept that it is happening and help to promote the safest possible use of illicit drugs.

 

[funki]

Anything below 18 is too young in my opinon.
Call me a hypocrite.... i started early at 16, went quite hard that year, then hardly did much at all my HSC final school year.
each to their own, its their body
-funk-

 

[Riot Grrrl]

Ehhh, it's weird, i was thinking about this question over, only a week ago. Well, before utopia 2002, i would have said 15+ age.
Though when i was at Utopia i saw this 16yr old chick OFF HER FACE with that cityrail junkie look. With her, ALSO 15-17 yr old friends arguing over whether to take her to first aid or not. It really made me sick to see that, just from how young she looked. It felt wrong.

 

[SKADAVER]

Originally posted by Russ:

What the alternative then? Them going behind your back and doing it anyway.
This site is about Harm Minimisation. This means educating people about the safest possible method of takeing drugs.
I have physically stopped my little brother from takeing pills. Taken them off him.
But now I have educated him and he is aware of the risks.
I think it is "sickening" that you would turn a sibling away if they came asking for guidence.
well excuse me.
i never said that i would turn them away. thats a different matter all together. i would ALWAYS give advice regardless of age or wheather they were a stranger or my flesh and blood.
What sickens me is when older siblings give their bro/sis pills without them asking for them . i believe that us older ones should not be in that position to INTRODUCE them to drugs. they should DISCOVER them for themselves rather than them being pushed in their faces.
and no they should not do it behind our backs. if my 18 yr old bro came to me and said he was going to try it i would take him out and attach him to my hip all night.
im talking about not creating something that may never be.

 

[sweetaskhandi]

I'm young. I took my first pill at just 16. My sister was with me. I asked her for it. I'd thought about it lots and decided that I was ready for it and I could handle it....which I have well. No offence to anyone, but it really annoys me when I'm out and people tell me that I'm too young. It's a personal choice, in the nicest way possible you can't really tell anyone that they are old enough or too young to do it.

 

[babu]

I first tried mdma when i was 17.
The pill was bought from a rather trustworthy source, as opposed to some random at an event, and each pill individually tested.
I read quite a bit before my first pill experience. I wanted to know what to expect, how to be prepared, what to do in case of problems, signs of overdose, risks involved etc.
I'm very glad that I did my homework beforehand, i'm pretty sure the sudden sweating, increase in body temperature and eye wiggles, for example, probably would have freaked me out if I hadn't been expecting them.
I don't think that there is really an acceptable age and I also don't believe that anybody can ever give a rightful opinion on what the right age to experiment with drugs is.
Drugs are illegal. Becase of this, we have no right to decide when it's o.k. for somebody to try a substance.
All I would say though, is that when a person is 'mature' enough to realise the risks involved, and have enough sensibility to be aware of what they are doing and how to do it, then that's the acceptable time.
Props to Russ for bringing this up
[ 25 September 2002: Message edited by: babu ]

 

[sydkiwi]

At a rave at the beining of the year I met a 17yr old chick who was going to have her first bikkie experience. I chatted to her and her mates for awhile and one of their friends came back saying they found someone. she was about to give I wont state the price to a complete stranger. I go I no someone here with pills want me to go get them. I see them at just about everything. anyway so she gets a pill off my guy and for cheaper than wot the stranger was going to sell her. she takes half.
45 mins later...
"sydkiwi I cant feel it yet" So wot do i do?? well for one try to get her up and moving. She wont. I found my mate who had wiz on him we gave her that still nothing. my mate suggested giving her the other half. its like "and wot say the first half kicks in straight after shes swallowed it". it could end up causing more problems than its worth. so that left me one thing. I wen looked for the guy. practically yelled the place down at him. anyway we went back and it had finally kicked in.
My point? If your little brother/sister wants to try something go with them look after them and get their shit for them. that way if something happends to them you no who to go and kill.

 

[deeCee]

Well judging from my first all-ages party last year, I would have say 18yo!.. thats it IMFHO..
Cause all it was, was a bunch of 14-15-16yo peakers just running around like mad people, and the scary thing was most of these mad people where selling too... and it just disgusted me, having random talk's and most of them saying.. ohh skool on monday is going to be soooo bad.. I'm going to be soo scat.. blah blah farkN blah..
And that really put me off going to on other all age's party again, but hence I went to another one, and well this changed my impression *again* .. I would have some quiet stimulating convo's with a random, and to find out later they where in fact around the ages of 16-17yo.. and this happened quiet often!!..
So in conculsion, age is nothing... it's whats up hear *taps on head* that count's .. Maturity
ReZsPecTaHh

 

[anna!]

Originally posted by pac.man*:

wrong. most "adults" don't know the first thing about illicit drugs, their effects, or the difference between USE and ABUSE. this is not to say that younger people do either. but restricting their use does not help. think of a main reason that the "war on drugs" is failing miserably: the lack of ability for society to guide and aid users. shutting them out, particularly family and friends, is not the answer.
If you'd actually read what I said ...

Originally posted by anna!:
And that said, I’m not suggesting that a thirty year old is better educated in a way that will help harm minimisation than a twelve year old or a twenty year old. But obviously there is some discrimination between the amount a child knows and the amount an “adult” knows about illicit drugs and how to use them as safely as possible.
I'm talking about the distinction between a six year old and a twenty-five year old. Life experience. I explicitly stated that I wasn't suggesting that a thirty year old would know more about harm minimisation than someone ten or twenty years younger.
If my brother came to me and asked me for a pill, I would tell him to get to get fucked. And after I did that, I would sit him down and explain to him exactly why he shouldn’t be doing it at this point in his life, from personal experience and family history. If he still wanted to do it, I’d send him to bluelight and erowid and make him read everything there was to read on the topic, then buy him a pill from a reliable source and ask him what he should do with it to make sure he knew what he was doing. I’d hate it, but I’d hang around when he took it and make sure he was safe.
I’m not sure what my stance would be if he wanted to do it again. I can’t hold his hand forever, and I really don’t want to sit around and watch my family doing drugs after the experiences I had with them.
Perhaps it’s more simple than all this. You’re too young to take a pill if you still type in acronyms and abbreviations like rofl and 2 and replace s’s with z’s.

 

[AlexxRed]

Very interesting topic guys. I just cant help but feel that we are forgetting something rather important here. Life does not fit into neat little boxes! Its all very well to talk about what age your able to start handling drug use at depending on your life experiance etc etc but shouldn't we be looking at the reasons why people take drugs. To me that seems a much better method with which to gauge whether someone is handling it without massive damaging impact on their life.
I would say that many of the really young people who are doing it are trying to grow up to fast. Who can blame them, we expect kids to be responsible and make mature informed decisions (for example schools, accelerated learning etc) but then turn around and pretty much treat them like they dont know anything. I say let kids be fucking kids, let them play let them day dream help them to have a childhood.
Sorry if I am getting way off track here but to me drug taking has a serious effect and bearing on a persons emotional well being and development. But do you think young people are going to listen to anyone telling them not to do it? Its made even worse when people try to be liberal and say just wait until your older and more mature. Like thats going to work.

 

[plazma]

I think something that people are forgetting is that you can't really enforce any age limit on illicit drugs. Young kids will continue to take drugs if they are available, and they always are. But the point is, that what you need to do is educate them so that if they choose to take them, even though some might argue that they're far too young to handle them, and others might argue the other way, at least they'll KNOW what they're doing so they won't be in as much danger.
I've got a 15 year old brother who knows full well what I do. He's even registered on bluelight, he has access to the information, and he's decided that he's not even going to think about taking a pill or any associated illicit substance until he's 17 or 18. I think that's an awesome thing, because I haven't told him that, he's decided of his own accord because he has access to the information required to make an informed decision.
So I think its all about the fact that you need to educate everyone, so they, no matter what their age, can make a hopefully better informed decision about what they're going to do with their bodies.
-plaz out-

 

[punch e punch]

Firstly, I agree that u can't tell teenagers that they should wait til they're older before trying things. I remember when I was 17 and was hell-bent on trying acid. If anyone told me I shouldn't do it, I resented them, as well as their advice.
But from my personal experience, ecstacy had a profound effect on my life because I didn't try it til I was almost 21, and by that stage the novelty of drug-taking had worn off.
I'll never forget the fact that ecstacy turned my life around, whereas I think if I started younger, I'd be taking it for granted by now and it wouldn't have had such a long-lasting effect on my attitude.
Also, the ecstacy honeymoon only lasts like 18 months if ur lucky, so u wanna be old enough to make the most of it.