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for those of you who dont like alcohol...

...its just as this thread progresses it seems that my initial point was totally taken in the wrong context
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Okay, Nephil - in your initial point you made the following generalization:

When I look at alcohol drinkers, and alcoholics i see lazy, stupid, agressive, mean, liars, lack of control...etc, etc.
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In what context should we take it?
 
I read a few replies but all I got was whinge whinge whinge blah blah blah cry cry cry.

I think this rag on people who use alcohol thing is so pathetic.

It's like a personal justification for using drugs, "hey at least I'm not a <insert stereotype here> drinker"

Weak.


People use a set of stereotypes about drinkers to try and dispell the same stereotypes pot heads have! Makes no sense.

I love smoking pot, I love drinking.

I don't have to find another social subset to vilanise just to justify my drug use.
 
After reading through, Petersko, alisdar, slm, word's of wisdom a usual!

Bottoms up I'll drink one for you guys.
 
nephil said:
I don't mean to generalize but i have experienced such negativity come from this and my main problem is that it is legal to go out and get wasted. People get drunk all the time...it is perfectly ok to say..."damn, I did that? Oh well I was wasted thats why" To society its ok to blame our wrongs on being drunk. It is also very easy to blame our problems on alcohol. Even being an alcoholic is becoming very acceptable. I can't tell you how many times Ive heard peers say "alcohoholism runs in my family...thats why i drink all the time" or "I am an alcoholic" while they down their third shot. Yet to do anything else, for instance smoke pot, is not considered ok and can have very severe (legal) consequences if you are caught.
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The issue you are trying to raise then isn't really with alcohol, its a social problem. Society has failed to educate itself properly about the dangers of alcohol abuse and has caused all of the problems that you mention.

Many of the arguments for prohibition of drugs are the same as your arguments against alcohol, yet people are slowly starting to realise that drug abuse is caused by social problems and not by the drugs themselves.

Many people argue that better drugs education, better availability of good information about drugs would lead to more responsible drug users. This is equally valid for alcohol. Rather than talking of prohibiting alcohol use, the energy would be better spent on educating users about responsible alcohol use.
 
^^^Well said.

I drink. I am a pot person too nephil, but I like my drink at the end of the day just like I like my men... good and stiff. ;)

I have made an absolute buffoon out of myself while drinking. I have been pretty good since coming to CA, with one exception, but when I lived in FL and was drinking heavily every day, all day (except for work) I had some rough nights.

Yet I have still gotten more out of alcohol than it has gotten out of me.

The good time I had the night I fell down the stairs and skinned the shit out of my knee was worth it. (I took a cab that night.)

The night I had a breakthrough and told someone to fuck off who had it coming for years after 3/4 a bottle of Absolut Vanilia and soda was worth it.

Hangovers are evil. Alcohol does have calories, but I tend to stick to liquor and diet or club soda. I drink good liquor and I don't usually get hangovers. Most importantly, I'd rather crash on your couch than get in a car and try to drive.

If you can't use in moderation, don't use. That applies to any drug.

I am having Caesar salad and a nice bottle of Pinot Grigio tonight.

Try some good wine with a good bowl one night, nephil, with people who don't act like idiots when they drink. I guarantee you'll enjoy yourself. :D
 
If you notice back in history, stupid un-educatedpeople generally got drunk. Upper-class and educated drank ladanaum, did heroin, cocaine, etc. They make you feel good, but you can still think and think positive. Alcohol just gets people into a stupor, not caring about anything or being able to do things very well. Given 19th century laws and politics, who the hell would actually drink when 240 mg. of Morphine per ounce of 60% alcohol could be bought, imagine a shot of rea laudanaum!
 
Far for alcohol being bad for society, I would counter that without alcohol western socity as it is would not exists today.

Alcohol has been used for thousands of years as an antiseptic for both healing wonds and sterilizing warter.

A few hundred years ago warter was about the one of the most dangerous thing you could drink, in the west people drunk beer diluted with warter as a way to safley drink warter. Becuase the alch killed bacteria.

This is partly why westerners can handle their drink better then thoses from the east where alcohol wasn't used as much.
It's becuase westeners with genes to produce enzymes that break down alcohol where favourble to thoses who did not as they where more likely to servive desease.

Altough I love weed I would say alcohol has far more use medicaly then weed ever has. At best weed is a relaxent and a mild pain killer.

Don't get me wrong not dissin' weed, anyone who knows me knows I love my weed but we need some reasoning.
 
BTW: SOCIAL drinkers are not a problem, BINGE drinkers are, and therefore the object of discussion. I love being drunk as much as anyone, but it feels nasty to me. Unlike opiates and stimulants, with alcohol you're poisoning your body by drinking too much in order to enjoy the side effects of alcohol. Being drunk is in on a lower level than being high in my opinion, it's not even a clean buzz if you call being impaired for fun a buzz. It's too physical and not mental enough, imo. Look how much a person has to drink to get drunk (not first time ever drinkers, but your normal 6-12 pack drinker), it's measured in ounces while other drugs are in grams or milligrams. Dont get me wrong, I love to drink expensive liquor mixed with water on the rocks, but not 10 of them in a row. I hate people who say drinking ONE bottle robitussin is stupid, yet drink several 12 ounce beers in order to get a worse buzz.
 
I honestly don't see any point in that, its simply drug snobbery. You don't enjoy alcohol, that's fine, but why the need to slam the users. The problem users of alcohol are the same as the problem users of any drug, they are the ignorant ones.
 
JTMarlin, you realise the alcohol content in beer is measure in mg not fluid ounces???

You are drinking dilluted alcohol? And they say drinking makes you stupid. lol


Also for most it dosn't take a 12 pack to get drunk, 3 beers and most are well on their way.

Which isn't a huge amount of alch.

Like tooky said it's simple drug snobery, and put forth in a maner which makes you guys seem a little slow on the uptake.
 
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JTMarlin said:
BTW: SOCIAL drinkers are not a problem, BINGE drinkers are, and therefore the object of discussion.
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nephil said:
^^^thanks...you see my point
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nephil also said:
When I look at alcohol drinkers, and alcoholics i see lazy, stupid, agressive, mean, liars, lack of control...etc, etc. ... people drink alcohol simply to get fucked up. how many times do you hear people say...thats a good drink! they arent referring to flavor there...they are refferring to it's strength.
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What are you, President of the United States? Your point, well established from the start, pertained to ALL alcohol drinkers.

Be a man and stop revising history.
 
Petersko said:



Be a man and stop revising history.
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i cant be a man...nor would i want to

you see i lack the proper plumbing for that...besides what does being a man have to do with anything...and who's reviving history? You all are changing the context of my post with each new reply!

how well did you do at reading comprehension when you were a kid?
 
Also for most it dosn't take a 12 pack to get drunk, 3 beers and most are well on their way
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Well, other than the fact that I said binge drinkers, or drinking like 2 drinks per hour or more, I have to disagree totally. Three beers? Are you kidding me? Go to a restaurant, many people drink three beers with a meal, and they're not even getting drunk. I know many people, including myself on sporadic occasions, who drink 1/2-1 pint (16 ounces) or more of 40%+ alcohol. Doing the math, that's between 3-8 ounces of pure alcohol, if not more depending on the spirit. Of course, any unit of measurement can be converted to another, it's called the metric system. It's not drug snobbery, but a fact. Amphetamines, cocaine, THC, or whatever you want to say, make your brain "click" with very very small smounts. Alcohol's buzz, or being drunk, isn't a buzz, but more on the level of huffing gas to get a buzz (hey, to some people cutting off oxygen to their brain feels good). When you get too drunk you throw up, it's considered normal, when you drink way to much you die. The OD symptoms of other drugs are basically the buzz alcohol gives you.
 
people. some worthwhile discussion here. let's not spoil it by heading down the road of petty insults?

play the ball and not the player.

alasdair
 
Yeah, you're right, we seems to self-destruct every topic with semantics.
 
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