for those of you who dont like alcohol...

[PGTips]

Alcohol destroys a person. Physically, mentally, physiologically, socially, emotionally...definitely way more than a bowl a day or hell even a hit of acid once or twice a year. Alcohol does not belong in the body. But, in order to intoxicate someone alcohol must sit in the liver and wait to be metabolized...while its sitting there it is eating away at the tissue...destroying your liver... yes even in one night. Drunk = intoxicated = filled with toxins

Technically, isn't any chemical that your body naturally attempts to remove from itself a toxin? That covers every type of drug and other chemicals that wouldn't be "drugs" but can still be taken into the bloodstream somehow.
Many of them "sit" in your bloodstream while your liver/kidneys/[body part] try to remove them over time.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a huge fan of alcohol but I do drink now and again but not to stupid excess. I just don't think that line of reasoning is particularly valid.

I personally have now got to the point where the roughness in the morning and the "Oh god, why did I do that" or "WTF went on last night, I can't remember" out weigh the enjoyment of the night. Others haven't reached that point, and I don't have too much of a problem with that as long as they don't pick a fight with people or mindlessly vanalise things.

 

[kbee]

Also:

How many people do you hear about going to Detox Clinics, Rehab, Drug Abuse Meetings, Anger Management Courses because of marijuana?

I was actually went to rehab for smoking marijuana. Sad, but true. And I know many people who have been to rehab for the same reason. It's bullshit and it makes me sick to my stomach, but yes, it is happening.

Another thing that really engraged me the other day was something I saw about the 'dangers of marijuana'. This thing said that marijuana is dangerous, and is proven by the fact that (so and so number) of people go to rehab each year because of marijuana destroying their lives. Talk abiot bullshit! Yeah, make a drug illegal and force people to go to 'self help' programs with the threat of jail if they don't. Then publish this statistic to reinforce the danger of it!! I wish there was just one guy out there who said, "oh shit! look who fucking stupid this is! ...this law is removed immediately." That is the day I die.

-kb

 

[MattPD]

"Technically, isn't any chemical that your body naturally attempts to remove from itself a toxin? That covers every type of drug and other chemicals that wouldn't be "drugs" but can still be taken into the bloodstream somehow.
Many of them "sit" in your bloodstream while your liver/kidneys/[body part] try to remove them over time."

So, totally on target. In fact, delta-nine-THC is metabolized in the liver, just like EtOH (booze), well, it doesn't cause the nasty scarring bit like EtOH, but, same kinda route of excretion.

EtOH is just a tool like any other drug. I've seen people acting quite retarded (ok, I was one of them) on a dose of MDxx, and on EtOH, it's the person, not the substance.

M

 

[Strawberry_lovemuffin]

I really, really hate when anti-alcohol types use this ridiculous line of thinking.

You directly compare the huge amounts of alcohol required to destroy a person with "a bowl a day or hell even a hit of acid once or twice a year".

Do you not see how one-sided and incorrect that is?

Compare a bowl a day to a glass of wine a day and you're being reasonable. Last time I looked, there is NO long-term negative impact from a small amount of alcohol taken each day.

As for toxins, marijuana has quite a stack of them.

Thanks, Petersko. A voice of reason.

I've read this thread shaking my head in disbelief. Can't you see you are treating drinkers in the same way you hate to be stereotyped as smokers?

I don't smoke mj, but have in the past and have no problem at all with people who do. I do object, however, to being in a relationship with a person who would prefer to get stoned and stare at a Playstation game all night rather than communicating with me. I much prefer my boyfriend when he's had a few drinks - he's chatty, energetic, sociable, cuddly, humourous. After a few cones he's sullen, silent, unmotivated and frankly, a bore.

My personal opinion is that both drugs are fine in moderation. As people have said, it's those who use them (or abuse them, more specificially) who are the problem. And problems can arise with just as much frequency with both.

 

[monkyfunky]

I really, really hate when anti-alcohol types use this ridiculous line of thinking.

You directly compare the huge amounts of alcohol required to destroy a person with "a bowl a day or hell even a hit of acid once or twice a year".

Do you not see how one-sided and incorrect that is?

Compare a bowl a day to a glass of wine a day and you're being reasonable. Last time I looked, there is NO long-term negative impact from a small amount of alcohol taken each day.

As for toxins, marijuana has quite a stack of them.

This is basically exactly what I wanted to say, and being the lazy sod I am, I'm just gonna quote it. Plus I couldn't have written it as well

 

[ussmak]

I have been to so many parties where I'm offered a beer and I'm like "nah, I'm a stoner". Then people get all indignant on me and act as if I've broken some unspoken college rule: "If thou goest to a festival in which many hot chicks are in attendance, then alcohol must be consumed". I will drink wine sometimes but I hate beer and spirits are nasty tasting (except for grapefuit juice/vodka). But I'm sure we're all preaching to the choir.

 

[vegtable]

But I'm sure we're all preaching to the choir.

Speak for yourself. I love alcohol in all it's forms: wine, beer, or hard. And personally, I'm not a very big fan of weed. By nature, I'm a withdrawn, introverted person. Alcohol, in healthy quantities allows me to open up and be more social with people. In comparison, weed does nothing but make me lazy, slow, and yet more introverted. I'd choose alcohol over weed pretty much any time.

 

[Prinsesse]

Alcohol, in healthy quantities allows me to open up and be more social with people. In comparison, weed does nothing but make me lazy, slow, and yet more introverted. I

I agree w/ that part of what you said. But I always seem to come to the point where alcohol just isn't 'doing it' for me. Sure, it gets me to open up, but most of the times I just ended up saying a lot of things I would have never said. I think it really changes my personality, and I'm not sure if it's for the better. I have seen it bring out the absolute worst in people, but also makes others more approchable and fun.

I guess I'm still very undecided on this topic and it has been something I have been giving a lot of thought to. Interesting and informative replys.....from all different angles.

Edit- Spelling error

 

[bbbccc]

Most drugs cause some kind of ego-loss. Alcohol and speed (for some) make peoples ego's tripple in size. Give me a drug-fucked-hippy over an abusive-drunk-asshole anyday.
Beer's the worst drink of them all.

 

[nephil]

i wouldn't say the thought is rediculous...i guess you just haven't seen or experienced the negative sides of alcohol enough to know.

i should have known better than to expect people to understand what im saying here. 8)

 

[randycaver]

I have long thought alcohol to be the worst drug, the worst in effects for me personally, and the way it makes people act, etc.
But this thread is absolutely atrocious in the way it is generalizing people. I know plenty of people who drink because they like the taste with dinner, or just in general.

if my drink is too strong, i do not go 'oo what a good drink' i go 'Yuck, this is nasty' and pass it to someone who can handle it better than I.

It really seems as though you're turning your negative experiences with your roommates and others who you've seen act this way into facts, in your mind, about all drinkers.

I agree with whoever said that it sounds like generalization of pot smokers, and drug users in general, when you categorize and label as such.

 

[fadetobliss]

Yeah... a lot of this bickering seems quite close-minded ( kind of ironic on an ecstasy forum is it not? ). I personally enjoy drugs and alcohol about equally, that is to say if it is a good drink. I DO find pleasure out of certain tastes of alcohol moreso than others. I get quite the satisfaction from a cold New Belgium brew and a bowl of dank. Not everyone drinks shit alcohol to drown their reality completly. Sorry BUDDY!

P.S. I agree that a lot of drunks are annoying.. but I like to find humour in their stupidity. And drunk girls are always wanting to take off their shirt so that is all good, lol.

 

[Strawberry_lovemuffin]

i should have known better than to expect people to understand what im saying here. 8)

Nephil, that's really condescending and patronising. Most of us here have given intelligent, well thought-out replies to your original post. Just because our ideas differ from yours (and you invited them, starting such a polarised post in the first place) doesn't mean they're wrong.

If you can invalidate everyone with a sweeping statement like that, it really makes me wonder why you posted your thoughts here in the first place.

 

[randycaver]

^^ i agree, it came across as a really bitter statement, just because our opinions aren't what you want doesn't make them worthless

 

[nephil]

I dont mean to come across that way...its just as this thread progresses it seems that my initial point was totally taken in the wrong context...exactly how i thought would happen.

I am having a hard time expressing the actual point because of ...the fact that this is the internet...also because each post is taking it further and further from what i was getting at to begin with.

 

[randycaver]

that is, unfortunately, a common flaw on BL

 

[Strawberry_lovemuffin]

I dont mean to come across that way...its just as this thread progresses it seems that my initial point was totally taken in the wrong context...exactly how i thought would happen.

I am having a hard time expressing the actual point because of ...the fact that this is the internet...also because each post is taking it further and further from what i was getting at to begin with.

Ok thanks for clarifying, nephil. I hope I didn't come across too defensive. I just like to think that posters who make an effort to respond are read, appreciated and understood, no matter what their view.

Why don't you re-direct the discussion if you can find the right words to do so?

 

[nephil]

well SM, i considered posting about my experiences with alcohol, my experiences with alcoholics, witnessing pure alcohol addiction, and my experience with people who have become physically and mentally ill because of it...but i figured someone would just once again say i am generalizing.

I definitley respect every point of view...im not saying that anyone hear has no right to say what they are saying...I know we are all stating opinion so thats why it can be often taken way out of proportion.

I don't mean to generalize but i have experienced such negativity come from this and my main problem is that it is legal to go out and get wasted. People get drunk all the time...it is perfectly ok to say..."damn, I did that? Oh well I was wasted thats why" To society its ok to blame our wrongs on being drunk. It is also very easy to blame our problems on alcohol. Even being an alcoholic is becoming very acceptable. I can't tell you how many times Ive heard peers say "alcohoholism runs in my family...thats why i drink all the time" or "I am an alcoholic" while they down their third shot. Yet to do anything else, for instance smoke pot, is not considered ok and can have very severe (legal) consequences if you are caught.

but again...those are my interactions...not everyone else's. I think tho that it may take something severe to happen concerning alcohol for many people to understand it...

 

[fadetobliss]

I actually know where you are coming from there.. I got arrested for marijuana possession and para. around three months ago (luckily the charges got dropped :D). And the reason the cops came to the house was due to a couple of my friends who were drinking exclusively and being excessively loud around 3-4am. The cops poured out their beer bottles and told them to drive home (mind you, they were quite intoxicated) while the people caught with marijuana(3-4 friends) were held in custody for 2 hours. Fuck the judicial system and conservative America.

 

[Petersko]

I've been around people who drink alcohol my whole life.

I spent two years hanging with ravers who were also drug people.

I saw far more people who had problems with coke, crack, meth, heroin, ecstasy and (to a much lesser extent) psychedelics in those two years than I ever saw alcoholics. I also know more marijuana addicts (yes, unable to quit) than I do alcoholics.

I have no numbers to back it up, but my perception is that the percentage of users who run into trouble is much higher on the drug side.

Not that I've never met alcoholics - I've met my share.