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Fentanyl is garbage, and it ruined heroin.

G_Chem said:
I’ve often wondered if different fentanyl analogs might actually be more stimulating and euphoric than pharmaceutical fentanyl.

BTH is absolute garbage though no matter how you slice it. I think there might of been a very brief period in the beginning where some BTH could be 60-70% pure but most of it is probably 5-10%. I’ve heard especially since fent it’s purity has dropped even more. I could never imagine using that shit to be honest, in any ROA.

I knew a guy that used very pure “ECP” (really it’s upper midwest and northeast coast) for over a decade no problem. Moved out west and lost all his veins in a matter of months and died not but a year later.

-GC
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What do you expect from injecting black tar? Its literally called blacktar
heroin and is a black tar.totally unsuitable for injection without purification.heroin is a white powder
how could anyone think sticking a thick black goo in there veins won't lead to at the least fukd up veins and at worst death from injecting tar.
 
I found Black tar to be enjoyable. It injected fine for me and dissolved with little to no heating needed. No permanent vein damage and quite the legs and high.

I kind of enjoyed Tar because I felt it was less susceptible to being cut with fentanyl.

Any East Coast Powder sourced in New England is fentanyl. or 97% of it is. And unless you know someone with serious drug connections your heroin isn't heroin, its fentanyl.

Unless you have a European source, I've found The Netherlands, France and the UK to still have #3 and #4 heroin that is mostly real heroin. I'm unsure if the EU will get hit like the USA did with Fent and its crap because Middle East is such an easier smuggle route than China or Mexico.
 
But I agree 100%. Fentanyl is the sole reason I've been narcan'd 5 or 6 times. I can't reach the euphoria I desire without dying. The line is so thin between a good nod high and death on fentanyl it's literally like walking a tight rope over the Grand Canyon.

Worst drug to ever be synthesized. It has destroyed street heroin, which is actually an amazing drug when pure.
 
I never had much trouble getting what I assume was real heroin rocks (colors ranged from brown, to tan, to grey to even blue & green) in the Chicago / Midwest area. The first time I was given fent, I knew it right away. I was cautious enough that since this was white powder, I proceeded with a smaller bump to test it. Just this little bump had me nodding so hard I actually reached for my naloxone for the first time ever. There was barely any euphoria or happy warmth whatsoever. It was bullshit. I agree with all the sentiments OP has.

I really wish they would legalize heroin. It's beyond time for it to be done. Addicts need access to clean diacetylmorphine.
 
FuckinAcidMan said:
I just wanna buy DHC and Oxy at CVS and Walgreens OTC plz.

I thought America was into free markets.

Buncha dicks.

Nobody needs to die.

Legalize poppy cultivation and opium extraction.

Education not incarceration.

Opiate prohibition is retarded.
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I agree. Most "Opioid overdoses" are actually mutiple drug induced respiratory failure labeled as an "opioid overdose", excluding those cases where these nasty non-euphoric high potency opioids have been used (fentanyl, etc..)

In the long term, opiates do not damage the brain or body in any manner even close to what alcohol, tobacco and many other legal / socially acceptable drugs do.

I really hope I live long enough to see the end of the prohibition of heroin & opiates. These drugs are great for more than just pain and are much safer (when used alone or with the right education) than the mainstream media and governments want people to know.
 
G_Chem said:
I’ve often wondered if different fentanyl analogs might actually be more stimulating and euphoric than pharmaceutical fentanyl.

BTH is absolute garbage though no matter how you slice it. I think there might of been a very brief period in the beginning where some BTH could be 60-70% pure but most of it is probably 5-10%. I’ve heard especially since fent it’s purity has dropped even more. I could never imagine using that shit to be honest, in any ROA.

I knew a guy that used very pure “ECP” (really it’s upper midwest and northeast coast) for over a decade no problem. Moved out west and lost all his veins in a matter of months and died not but a year later.

-GC
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nothing like pharma grade morphine and diamorphine, you can shoot up those indefinitely for years on end multiple times a day and it doesn't damage your veins at all. The euphoria and analgesia are consistent aswell. Beautiful substances.
 
DeathIndustrial88 said:
I agree. Most "Opioid overdoses" are actually mutiple drug induced respiratory failure labeled as an "opioid overdose", excluding those cases where these nasty non-euphoric high potency opioids have been used (fentanyl, etc..)

In the long term, opiates do not damage the brain or body in any manner even close to what alcohol, tobacco and many other legal / socially acceptable drugs do.

I really hope I live long enough to see the end of the prohibition of heroin & opiates. These drugs are great for more than just pain and are much safer (when used alone or with the right education) than the mainstream media and governments want people to know.
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I wanna live the end of my days banging pure morphine or heroin daily.
 
ickray said:
Don't get me wrong, fent is great for what it is meant to be used for, end of life pain, and surgery. But recreationally, I find it to be garbage.
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You're forgetting for addicts, relief is more important than experience.

It's much cheaper, can be done in smaller amounts and provide quick and easy relief to withdrawals like heroin was never able to provide. Dealers make more money, addicts have to do less crazy stuff to finance their addiction, everyone is happy.
 
Deru said:
You're forgetting for addicts, relief is more important than experience.

It's much cheaper, can be done in smaller amounts and provide quick and easy relief to withdrawals like heroin was never able to provide. Dealers make more money, addicts have to do less crazy stuff to finance their addiction, everyone is happy.
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With heroin if it's good you only need to dose 2-3 times a day. With fentanyl you need to do at least 2x that amount of shots AND with the shit you're always gambling with death.
 
nznity said:
With heroin if it's good you only need to dose 2-3 times a day. With fentanyl you need to do at least 2x that amount of shots AND with the shit you're always gambling with death.
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Still worth it for the relief from withdrawals - initially. Eventually it becomes incredibly boring - almost like MMT or BMT. You're gambling with your life with heroin too.
 
DeathIndustrial88 said:
Street heroin maybe. But pure diacetylmorphine is no where near as dangerous as fentanyl.
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I mean...I don't like fentanyl at all and I don't want to seem like I'm defending it.

But if you dose phamaceutal fentanyl correctly, and dose pharmaceutical diacetylmorphine correctly, the risks aren't much different.

It's not much fair to change the debate to now the heroin is medical grade and the fentanyl is street grade.

As a matter of fact, the opposite argument could be made to your response: fentanyl is used daily in medical settings with no problems, where diacetylmorphine is not - until recently where I believe some countries are allowing it for specific reasons.

Maybe the argument should be people do not understand how to dose fentanyl correctly, and that creates the bigger risk, because they don't realize how extremely small a proper fentanyl dose is. In markets where fentanyl dominates over heroin nowadays, the issue of selling batches of fentanyl with deadly amounts is becoming less and less.

I did street fentanyl for almost three years with no issue- not because I wanted to, but because heroin was no longer available.

Once the supply issues were figured out and everyone started learning how to dose properly, the overdose spikes were completely eliminated.
 
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Deru said:
I mean...I don't like fentanyl at all and I don't want to seem like I'm defending it.

But if you dose phamaceutal fentanyl correctly, and dose pharmaceutical diacetylmorphine correctly, the risks aren't much different.

It's not much fair to change the debate to now the heroin is medical grade and the fentanyl is street grade.
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The risks are highly different as we're talking about a semi-synthetic opiate that's basically a pro-drug to morphine and a fully synthetic highly potent opioid.

I'm not talking about "dosing correctly", we're talking about addicts and drug abusers here.

Sorry but I fail to see how heroin is as dangerous as fentanyl. People with a tolerance can still easily overdose on fentanyl but overdose isn't as likely with regular diacetylmorphine. I did heroin for 12 years and have never once overdosed and the first time I was ever given fentanyl had me reaching for the naloxone, big difference.

No one 'changed the debate to now heroin is medical grade and fentanyl is street grade". Fentanyl is one of the main reasons that makes street heroin dangerous in the first place. Even in a setting where both heroin & fentanyl are pharm grade, the fentanyl carries more risk as it is more potent and subject to lots of redosing, where as good heroin will keep you well for up to 6-8 hours.
 
DeathIndustrial88 said:
I did heroin for 12 years and have never once overdosed and the first time I was ever given fentanyl had me reaching for the naloxone, big difference
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Interesting. I was an opioid addict for 11 years and all my overdoses were with heroin. Never once on fentanyl for the three years I used it.

It is all about dose.
 
If you overdose, it's because you literally "over" dosed.
 
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