Does anyone really know "how" to take LSD anymore?

[Ismene]

I dunno crashed, I've never thought monks or master-baters had any more insight into the psychedelic experience than anyone else. Wasn't that whole "You take acid but I can like get permanently high by studying Hinduism with the maharishi dude" just a late 60's urban myth?

 

[Crashing]

No, it didn't have anything to do monks or perverts understanding drugs, i was saying that people who practice meditation daily may have a higher likelihood of 'clearing their minds' than the average person. And yeah, that last bit depends on what they meant by 'high' i guess.

I'm not Crashed by the way, that's another user

 

[jazz88]

Quick 2 cents,

A lot of comments on this page I agree with, especially the notion that it would churlish to prescribe certain drugs. I certainly don't intend to be fascistic.

Though I do believe that there are correct and better ways to use psychedelics, as there are for any tool, I also agree with many of the people here in thinking that approaching LSD with the expectation that it will "fix" or "cure" you in any way, putting to much emphasis on your own psychological "problems", or even just intellect in general, is also extremely problematic. I fell into that hole for many years, refusing to accept some aspects of the LSD experience, and and ultimately denied myself the internal freedom that I knew the substance could provide. That was definitely a confusing period of time.

It definitely seems true that nowadays people are taking small doses. My first time was 500mics and have almost never taken anything smaller. Grof has lot to say about small vs. big doses, and I guess I'm just a big dose guy.

jazz88

 

[Thanatos]

^ a little tip: you most likely have no idea how many micrograms you took. In fact I would put money on the fact that you have no idea what your initial dose was. Its dangerous to make such bold statements, Jazz. Unless you laid the blotter yourself you have no idea. In the interest of HR, i would refrain from using exact dosage when speaking about such potent chemicals. Someone may get a little too much bravado and mega-dose with horrible effects.

 

[jazz88]

Entheo,

It was liquid in a vial from a trusted source. I should have specified and said "about 500mics". I arrived at this number based on my 15 years of experience taking LSD, and am quite confident the trip was in the 400-600 microgram range, and took the mean.

Hopefully anyone who would be inspired to take a "mega-dose" (like the time I took 15 hits to get myself out of "rut" .. yeeks!) would heed the topic of the thread, which clearly states my opinion that there are responsible parameters and guidelines for LSD usage. It seems unlikely that in course of flipping through just two pages of messages, this original intent could get lost on anyone.

I will gently remind the newbie reader: don't fuck around with LSD and respect the psychedelic experience.

there.
jazz88

 

[webbykevin]

Look at it this way. We ALL use psychedelics recreationally.

I wouldn't describe my high dose mushroom journeys as recreational in any way.

 

[webbykevin]

It really isn't possible to go in it empty minded, unless you are a monk or master-meditator.

Some of the most frustrated, fucked up, psychotic people i have ever met have been monks who have been banging their metaphysical heads against a wall for years and getting nowhere, the path of the seeker is full of pot holes for the ego.

However, as McKenna pointed out, once you discover psychedelics you are no longer seeking, you have found it.

The problem then becomes, what are you going to do with it.

 

[Crashing]

Some of the most frustrated, fucked up, psychotic people i have ever met have been monks who have been banging their metaphysical heads against a wall for years and getting nowhere, the path of the seeker is full of pot holes for the ego.

However, as McKenna pointed out, once you discover psychedelics you are no longer seeking, you have found it.

The problem then becomes, what are you going to do with it.

Look man the point is nobody can go into a trip without preconceived notions. Using monks was just an example, i don't know any personally so perhaps I shouldn't have said it.

All i was ever seeking was a good time, and psychedelics seem to have showed me that and then some. I don't know, seems like a common occurrence wouldn't you say?

 

[webbykevin]

All i was ever seeking was a good time, and psychedelics seem to have showed me that and then some. I don't know, seems like a common occurrence wouldn't you say?

Absolutely, I have found in my 30 years experience with taking psychedelics and being part of the psychedelic community that unless people already had some psychological issues before they took it then the majority have described the experience as overwhelmingly positive, eye opening, refreshing and beautiful, many times spiritual in the truest sense of the word.

The people who have had bad trips seem to fall into a few basic categories, either they had mental issues before they started and just were not in the right stable emotional state to cope with the experience, or... They had been overdoing it, or upped the dosage to some insane amount and got an ass kicking (this is especially true of psilocybin) or got caught in some kind of thought loop and didn't have any mindfullness techniques to be able to navigate through it or.... they just had what they thought was a bad trip but what actually happened was they didn't get what they wanted they got what the needed (as the rolling stones said) and got more out of 1 bad trip than they did out of 100 good ones.

 

[webbykevin]

On a side note - no one has mentioned diet and pre preperation techniques, or the inclusion of natural or synthetic mao inhibitors.

200 mics can be bardo territory (as entheo put it) if you have been controlling your diet for a week or more before the experience and is a factor that is hugely overlooked or not even considered.

 

[Crashing]

On a side note - no one has mentioned diet and pre preperation techniques, or the inclusion of natural or synthetic mao inhibitors.

200 mics can be bardo territory (as entheo put it) if you have been controlling your diet for a week or more before the experience and is a factor that is hugely overlooked or not even considered.

This is disheartening to hear and actually a little crazy, because don't you think the manual i've been advocating all-too-much mentions preparation to a very well thought out extent?! I mean, what more could be added to that description of proper set and setting?

Also the point about not having techniques to settle a bad trip, they're in the reading too. I could just translate the translation of the translation i guess, but i figured a link would have worked better. I really got bashed for advocating it, though.

I feel like nobody has read it, is that the case?

 

[jazz88]

webbykevin,

Thanks for trying to get things back on track. I agree that diet and preparation is very often neglected, even in my own tripping. Recently though I've started to do some light yoga and review the Yoga Sutras of Pantanjali. I think both things will have an affect on how I approach my next psychedelic experience (whenever that may be), mainly as a means to help me stay accepting and present.

What seems evident in this thread is that there are distinct camps, those who advocate an academic/ceremonial approach to entheogens, and those who seem rebellious toward any such thinking whatsoever. While I do believe that a "goal oriented" approach is certainly not correct, my nerdy tendencies do naturally push me to construct some sort of definition or framework to put the experience in. I think something like that could especially useful when people confront difficult situations or material.

This all being said, I'm starting to so so godamn professorial about this I'm making myself nauseous. Psychedelics are also totally about getting high and feeling good-- lest I forget.

jazz88

 

[webbykevin]

This is disheartening to hear and actually a little crazy, because don't you think the manual i've been advocating all-too-much mentions preparation to a very well thought out extent?! I mean, what more could be added to that description of proper set and setting?

Also the point about not having techniques to settle a bad trip, they're in the reading too. I could just translate the translation of the translation i guess, but i figured a link would have worked better. I really got bashed for advocating it, though.

I feel like nobody has read it, is that the case?

Hey man, I'm not bashing you in any way, I agree with your fundamental point, was just sharing my own experience and perspective on the matter, but i am enjoying the debate and your voice in it is very valid bro.

 

[Crashing]

Alright forget the manual shit. But seriously, all questions raised have been looked at very thoroughly in it. but fuck it lol. I guess i just feel like no one has actually read it, since nobody has actually said "hey i've read it and disagree". Anyway, haha...

I like to liken the colors of my food to the Hindi Chakral system. Each color of food represents a different part of the psyche and to me represents nourishment of that area. For a few days prior to the trip, i generally like to cut out all processed foods and eat strictly whole foods of as many colors as possible to maintain a healthy physical and mental balance. I drink only tea and water because it sounds like the enlightened thing to do, to me. I like to stay away from heavy flavors and spices, just because i like to feel very plain and neutral before a trip, so that whatever comes through the trip will feel more 'pure' for lack of better word. I feel if I eat fresh vegetables, fruit, and fish, just because of what i know about diet in our society, i feel more healthy which leads to a better experience.

I also like to practice meditation every morning and night, regardless, but especially before a trip. Getting a mantra ready to ground myself at any time is extremely useful, and this technique took me a long time to discover. Using techniques like fetal position (extreme cases like with deleriants), deep breathing and low drone mantras can completely eliminate a bad trip for me.

When i come up on the LSD or whatever it may be, i like it to be silent and i like to close my eyes and just imagine i were floating. The deeper i meditate during the comeup, the better the whole trip is, i have found.

Everyone's techniques may differ and i would love to hear them!!!!! Maybe i'll try someone elses approach for fun. I don't use this preparation every single time, but ideally i should because it results in a better ride.

Edit - Yoga is great for preparing for a trip, and during a trip as well. I can decide to have a novel trip, but there are also seemingly some very profound things that can be done during a trip that just seem cosmic, and can be induced by proper breathing techniques but i suppose it's sort of user specific.

 

[Crashing]

Webby do you have any rituals for prep?

 

[webbykevin]

Webby do you have any rituals for prep?

Well... I'm 46 this year and so my methods and ideas have changed radically over the years. In my 20's I was a part of the rave scene in Europe, travelling around with the likes of spiral tribe all over the world and we took massive amounts of acid and mdma, there was no ritual involved then at all lol, we just binged on it continually, a regular dose back then for most of the people I was hanging with was 700 mics and a couple of good quality E's thrown in with coke and hash chillums added to give it a kick.

Then I got married, moved to Australia and raised 3 kids, so through all of my 30's I just had a total break from the whole scene, I didn't have acid for over 10 years and only smoked weed occasionally.

Through that period I spent a lot of time developing meditation and mindfulness techniques and believe me mate 20 years of married life and 3 children is a fucking trip in itself, but I never forgot how LSD had woken me up to a deeper reality and what a gift it was to have had those experiences in my 20's.

Now, in my 40's over the last 5 years I have come back to psychedelics with a totally new appreciation and respect for them and have been able to integrate my life's experience into the mix.

I initially tried acid again but found it strangely empty and unsatisfying, I mean it was still crazy shit and lots of fun but I didn't make any deep new discoveries on it and was almost at the point of giving up on the whole idea of psychedelics again, THEN I DISCOVERED PSILOCYBIN and my whole world was turned fucking upside down lol.

For me the depth of the mushroom experience is so much more profound and challenging than anything LSD ever threw at me, I have had my ass whooped a few times by shrooms but view each of those experiences as the most important of my life, the doorway to the great unknown has been flung wide open by them and now mushrooms are the only psychedelic I am working with.

The way I take them is rarely (maybe 3 or 4 times a year) and in high doses, always over 5 dry grams usually between 6 and 8 and this year i have been experimenting with banisteriopsis caapi vine and syrian rue as an MAOI addition to the journeys, I always approach the trips with knees knocking and deep respect, I watch my diet for a few days before hand, I drink lots of plain water, eat fruit, avoid salt and dairy and meats, on the day I am going to dose I will fast for at least 8 hours and make sure i have an empty house, the phone is unplugged and I take them in silent darkness and ride it out no matter what happens.

I sit with them in my hands for a few minutes before I eat them and I say to the mushroom "please don't burn me, I put myself totally in your hands and i am holding nothing back"

I don't smoke pot while I'm on them, I maybe have a couple of cigs and I have a huge jug of icewater, no candles, no music, no other people.

What happens during the trip is usually so un-englishable that it's impossible to share, I still have no real clue as to what it is I'm actually dealing with or encountering but it has me convinced that it's definatly some kind of "other" some autonomous intelligence or mind that has its own ontology, but in what dimension or how it functions or what makes it tick I really don't know, i feel i am still scratching the surface of all that.

I talk to it, I rave at it, it raves at me, it's like having an eccentric teacher in hyperspace or something.

I tried half a dose (350mics) of acid and 5 grams of shrooms once and the hallucinations were mind blowing and went on for hours and hours.

But LSD on its own doesn't really float my boat anymore, if i was ever going to take just acid on its own i wouldn't really do any rituals or prep, I would just take a huge dose and have fun, but I wouldn't expect it to be anything profound or spiritual.

EDIT.. I have tried DMT a few times both NN and 5meo and i take my hat off to those who can deal with that lol, also i find that on a high dose of shrooms it's very similar to the DMT space but in a much more manageable and non invasive way.

Never done salvia.

 

[johannes kreisler]

nice, nice. ^
I suggest you try smoking nn-DMT with a MAOi in your bloodstream (either smoked or eaten). most profound yet most clear mindstate ever. duration and depth of the experience can be controlled quite accurately as you can always smoke more DMT as you like, with individual peaks lasting 15-20min. be careful as DMT is much more potent in that fashion. it is very likely that 15mg give you "the fear" ("this time I overdid it, y do I do this to myself, I can't handle this..." XD ) on the comeup cause it feels so goddamn mighty...
going through 150mg+ of DMT in that fashion over a few hours was so deeply satisfying that I didn't touch DMT for 2 years afterwards...


sorry for OT...

 

[coolcucumber]

Jazz88, thanks for opening this up for discussion, but I have a few comments on your first post.

If somebody just wants to take a drug just for the visuals or whatever then that's their gig. Who am I to judge that? It's not like there's a law in the universe saying that everyone *should* want to seek out deep mind-expanding experiences.

Also, if they're missing out on something that they're not aware of—something that you're saying will improve their lives—then the judgmental and condescending tone of your post doesn't really make sense, as they would just be victims of ignorance.

For me to judge you, however, would be hypocritical, as I don't believe anyone *chooses* to have irrational beliefs.

 

[Anon0631]

I decided to stop contributing to this thread when it started to get heated.

I think it's significant though that we are having this conversation about LSD and not 2c-b, DOM or Mescaline. Why is that?

 

[webbykevin]

I think it's significant though that we are having this conversation about LSD and not 2c-b, DOM or Mescaline. Why is that?

I think the clue is in the thread title