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Does anyone really know "how" to take LSD anymore?

LSD and select few other psychedelics are quite strictly not meant for 'getting high and having fun.'
with respect, i think i'm a much better judge of what drugs mean to me than you are.

your comments - and those of certain others in the thread - are drug snobbery of the worst kind and, paradoxically, suggest arrogance rather than enlightenment...

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alasdair
 
I want to her someone tell me, "I made myself a open, accepting vessel for a deeply life-changing experience that made me so high and full of love and potential that it irrevocably changed my life for the better", but it hasn't happened in 15 years.

OP I think you are just talking to the wrong people. Especially when I read the part about spineless indie rock. Place a personal ad for a deeply life-changed love-filled vessel.

If you are referring to this forum, this is where people come to find out if things they want to do are safe so you have to expect many are less experienced (but hopefully more personally responsible than most drug users).

I love the idea of people prattling on about "LSD this" and "LSD that" -- it sounds kind of charming.
 
And they have to be a horse :)

Well if you do further reading people will tell you that you actually have to be Mr Ed with a masters in k-holeology or Pharlap.

Well, they are never as revolutionary as they seem while you are tripping. But that's the point. To be able to examine ideas about yourself and your role on this planet with new eyes. Right?

I agree with this in particular, perhaps it's not very constructive to be setting too firm expectations(tunnel vision) on the effects of a substance that has a universal effect on all users for removing preconceived notions and pattern filters.

Sure you still do background research to personally determine if the possible benefits outweigh the possible risks but reflection on the experience can only happen afterwards as Cloudy outlined.

Also bad trips(or uncomfortable moments) are often the best for stimulating reflection on ones self, I normally trip alone and recently tripped with other people in a unique setting during which I had to go off to be alone for a large part of the experience(it felt like sensory overload and I was having trouble communicating). I'm still drawing from this experience when I sketch out my plans to improve on those relations when I get a chance to hang out with my friends again.
 
As if all the people in the 60's when it first widespread were using it for "greater" purposes... Have you seen the videos hahaha? While LSD can impart so much to one, at the same time the fact that it can also instill such simple happiness and laughter at the same time is just as beautiful.
 
I haven't read this entire thread, just your post. But who's to say you don't really know how to take LSD? There's no manual with psychedelics - or any drug.

I guess it's just that, in having taken LSD many times and discovering the manual long after my first few trips, I felt that it was extremely helpful for me in that it provided me with a way to view the experience in a very logical and western-friendly way. Now some people may not question anything about their trip, and that point i have honestly overlooked. The way i word things is quite arrogant, I do see that after rereading my posts, and am reconsidering my approach and attitude quite seriously.

I do really feel that in reading the manual completely, the theories and methods outlined are very hard to deny. It wasn't just written by Leary, but by a team of Ph.D's, and is basically a translation of Bardo Thodol, or The Tibetan Book of the Dead, which is book about what to do in the period between death and rebirth. (This intermediary period was likened to the LSD experience by Leary and his colleagues.)

Hear me out - This may sound like a load of shit at face value, but I believe the process of death and rebirth is a metaphor for archetypical human experiences that happen to our egos perpetually on many scales at once. As we mature and make discoveries about ourselves, we often struggle through the periods of change. This struggle can be observed during the discomfort one may experience during the 'come up' phase. I find LSD to put my mind in a state that leaves me particularly vulnerable to psychological 'rebirth'.

For example, consider a child swearing for the first time. His mother disciplines him for doing so, and thus the process of death and rebirth can be observed. A part of the child's innocent psyche dies, and is reborn through the process of punishment, as a more 'mature' child, since he now knows the cause and effect of swearing in front of his parents and therefore (hopefully) would not do it again. In the process of learning from experience, part of the ego is transformed and becomes seemingly more aware, and ancient authors of Bardo Thodol as well as Leary saw this process as a 'rebirth.'

Leary and his colleagues evidently saw this process occurring to people under the influence of LSD to a much greater extent/higher rate than under normal everyday circumstances, and therefore felt it important to translate this manual for people like us to better understand how to comfortably accept the intense changes and lessons that are induced by a strong psychedelic experience while they are happening. His goal was to prevent negative or frightening experiences for everyone that took the drug, and that I quite admire about him.

Please don't fall victim to believing this, before it ends up happening to you.

Though, I may be more aware than you might think. I did use opiates and moved into shooting heroin and smoking crack, along with a heavy side use of phenazepam, mdpv, and ketamine on the regular, for about a quarter of my life. I was able to detox cold turkey after eventually losing everything. I read the manual for the first time and took LSD during my acute withdrawal, as a form of self therapy. I used negative imagery associated with (mainly) heroin, and feel that I was able to reform the way I viewed heroin. I feel the experiment was a success, as I now view opiates in a negative light, which for me has been healthy.

It's been about a year and half and so far haven't shown any sings of addictive behavior, but I do however still use various drugs roughly once a week. Never opiates or crack, though.. my interest in taking these substances has completely diminished, astonishingly. To me, the twelve step method made no sense at all. I studied Learys '8 circuit model of consciousness' and the 'Psychedelic Experience' manual, and that alone helped me to understand my addictive behaviors far more than any counselor or therapist ever could.

It was this that lead me to have such a fondness for Tim Leary as a person in general, and I didn't really realize he was a controversial topic. I vaguely know of his legacy and basically formed my opinion of him based solely on those two pieces of literature.

In my opinion, the 'incorrect use' of psychedelics as i had defined earlier lead me to a very confused and depressed state of mind, and ultimately lead me to escapist drugs. I like to believe that, had i read the manual prior to experimenting with psychedelics, I may never have underestimated the power of LSD and/or took the experience for granted (which so many people seem to do). It is my hope that people can understand that I am only trying to help, and although coming off like a total prick (which i agree with and am sorry about), my intentions are from the heart, to provide another way to look at LSD and other entheogens that may possibly benefit and possibly save somebody from the trauma that psychedelics can very well induce.

I hope this sort of puts me on better terms, this is all just my experience and my opinion and I happened to find that my ideas about LSD are similar to Leary's ideas. I don't really know what type of person he really was, but the readings make a lot of sense to me and I thought that they would to others.
 
Well it seems people have opinions on this topic.

To the libertarians, I'm not trying to "repress" anyone. Of course everyone is free to take drugs however they want, but I liken the experience of taking LSD without a proper understanding of it like using a $150k Porsche for its stereo and air conditioner. One could extend the metaphor even further and say that sitting in a running car just to listen to the radio could even be extremely harmful. (carbon monoxide poisoning... its a stretch :))

I do vehemently disagree with any comparison of LSD and other entheogens with amphetamines or other drugs, however. When considering the history, literature, body of research and vast number of personal anecdotes indicating the potential of an LSD trip, it would be asinine to do otherwise. If "drug snobbery" is saying that major psychedelics like LSD are "more valuable" or "more useful" than other drugs, then I AM ABSOLUTELY a drug snob. Most hard drugs are a useless, oftentimes destructive distraction from life, maturity, personal understanding and/or spiritual development. Do I do them occasionally? Of course, because they're fun. But I have never considered them in the same category or world as LSD, DMT, Psiolcybin, etc. etc. Is that not a absolute given to anyone on a "Psychedelic Drug" forum? I'm shocked if its not.

To be clear, I'm not an evangelist. I'm certainly not advocating that anyone else take LSD. I've had enough strange/difficult times on the drug to never dream of doing so. Of course I believe that if there were more people who were inclined to self-understanding and compassion, feelings which a properly integrated psychedelic experience can certainly promote, the world would be a much better place. I think that goes without saying, though.

In regards to the "nonsense" statements, or the posts refuting that there may be something in psychedelics drugs that holds real value, I would point to Stanislav Grof's classic "LSD Psychotherapy". After presiding over 10,000 clinical LSD sessions, Grof has produced by far the most complete map of the psychedelic realm. Leary and Alpert never came close to achieving its rigor and thoroughness. Personal note, I do have misgivings about Tim Leary, but admire his dedication and willingness to sacrifice a distinguished career at Harvard for his convictions. Whether you love him or hate him, he was the guy who brought LSD to the world.

Interesting to hear everyone's opinions though.

jazz88
 
Of course though, there are many roads to many places and it would be churlish to promote one complete truth. In recent years I have preferred phenethylamines to LSD, Psylocybin, etc. They lack the deep meaning of LSD and are life affirming rather than life changing. Is this better? No but it's not worse either. The emotional balance they have brought me has been significant. Life is long and we have different needs at different points.

All drugs have their uses and their dangers. LSD is unusually rich in both.
 
It's a frustration common to enthusiasts (or snobs ;)) of all kinds. You can elicit the very same frustration from a wine enthusiast by getting pissed on his favourite vintage and then vomiting it up, for example. I do get frustrated when people use psychedelics irresponsibly, like your friends disregarding set and setting, but as to using them properly I disagree. The life-changing and spiritual aspects of these drugs are deeply personal. There's no proper way to use LSD and as far as educating people in the use psychedelic I think it should be limited to HR.
People probably don't appreciate the value of them as much as they should but, as oscar wilde said, nowadays people know the price of everything and the value of nothing.
 
People probably don't appreciate the value of them as much as they should but, as oscar wilde said, nowadays people know the price of everything and the value of nothing.

I do get pissed off though with the mythical status that LSD is developing among a new generation. The result is that when they take the drug, it doesn't match up to the perfect experience they have been led to expect. So they assume they have been ripped off with a substitute. There's plenty if threads on bluelight about this so maybe I shouldn't be mentioning this here. It's good to vent though.

No drug is perfect and although LSD might be up there in terms of 'cosmic' and 'awesome' it's also in my experience the most likely to lead to difficult experiences. It's also the most likely to drift you away from the commonly perceived understanding of reality with long term use.
 
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People should do what they want with drugs and with everything else. If you think you "know" how of how not to use a drug then you are as wrong as you think they are. If soembody wants to dance to it or bike to it because it gives them energy that's fine. If somebody wants to fuck to it because it arouses them it is ok. you see where i'm going with this. If you want to go to the middle of the dessert and eat cacti that's also fine. hell, i would join you. But i'd also fuck in that dessert, you know?
 
I personally don't think people dose high enough these days, I mean sure there are always a few dedicated old timers but a huge percentage of the younger generation seem to be just taking piddly doses of around 80 to 100 mics and using it like sparkly speed to dance and party with, I suspect the percentage of people taking 500+ mics and treating it like a therapy/spiritual investigation session is quite low.
 
The merry pranksters, brotherhood of eternal love, etc believed that once this number reaches a critical mass, there will be no more war and hatred.

What positive social example did any of the people you mention set? The brotherhood moved into selling cannabis, Tim Leary ratted on his friends after being hounded by the CIA, Jerry Rubin turned into a hardcore free-marketeer, Hendrix choked to death on his own vomit.

What "subjective" change did LSD bring to anyone?
 
with respect, i think i'm a much better judge of what drugs mean to me than you are.

your comments - and those of certain others in the thread - are drug snobbery of the worst kind and, paradoxically, suggest arrogance rather than enlightenment...

:\

alasdair

You know, in the past, I would have taken this position. But now, I lean more toward the OP, in that there really is a right way and a wrong way to use psychedelics.

Look at it this way. We ALL use psychedelics recreationally. The purpose of all human behavior is to preserve the species, and the primary biological signal that instructs our behavior is called "pleasure". You go to work every day for the pleasure of money. You go to the doctor for the pleasure of good health. Etc.

However, there are varying degrees of fun you can have with psychedelics, and there are more and less effective ways to accomplish this goal. Attempting to use psychedelic drugs with the intention of deliberately eliciting euphoria, is a great way to clearly illustrate a general principle of life - happiness is not achieved by searching for it. The greatest pleasures in life occur incidentally, as we are successful in other, more concrete endeavors. In other words, to find TRUE pleasure, you can't just take a chemical - you have to accomplish some greater goal, such as learning a skill, acquiring knowledge, bettering yourself, making a meaningful impact in your community, etc.

These are the sorts of goals that psychedelics should be applied toward. To attempt use drugs to directly induce pleasure is simply ineffective - like trying to carry water with a leaky bucket. Therefore it deserves criticism.
 
Let me drop a little knowledge into this thread. Before I stayed using psychedelics I was a practioner of dzochen buddhism, I read learys manual, multiple works by stanislov grof, a great number of Vedic texts, and the Tibetan book of the dead. I idolized Leary for a brief perioid of my life.
And you know what, all of that food for 'enlightenment' and meditation ended leading me to impractical and impossible expectations. The concept of bardo actually led me to a period of SERIOUS psychosis, because I was dosing so heavy on multiple compounds along with medical grade marijuana.

Psychs are better to use without intention, that way you are open to anything that happens durin your trips and you don't have a preconceived notion of what false instrinsic value you believe is held within the psychedelic agent, LSD in this case. All in all, I think following Leary and the ram dass path led med to loose my mind and it severely crippled my adolescent development. I'm sorry I'm being so contradictory, but I honestly believe that the ideas expressed in this thread are dangerous and even idiotic at points.

Please forgive me for be a jaded, pompous ass. I feel entitled to my opinion and I'd rather not have an impressionable poster read this thread and go down the wrong path.
 
I don't know entheo, don't you think that people are going to have preconceived notions about LSD no matter what? It really isn't possible to go in it empty minded, unless you are a monk or master-meditator. I took the majority of my trips before looking into the works of Leary, and that ironically lead me into psychosis and eventually down the road of opiate addiction. It wasn't until the end of this period that i read the 'manual' and was able to induce what i perceived to be a much healthier and coherent experience. That's just what happened for me, though. Ideally, you want to go into a trip without a single thought but for me personally, that is never possible. I'd rather go in with at least a series of metaphors to recognize, rather than expecting colors, trails, and a fun time, which is what many people seem to go in expecting. I believe the experience is more than that and if one is expecting a fun house, it can potentially be horrifying.

It's is mind boggling how the drug can give two minds such drastically different opinions on this, but there must be some point at which we agree that certain preliminary steps should create a more enjoyable experience, rather than just popping lsd without thinking about it.

Even thinking that you aren't going into it with any preconceived notions, is a preconceived notion. And that in itself has bit me in the ass before too.
 
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