WARNING.......BOOK-LENGTH POST AHEAD.....
Delta 9, please dont take that post so personal. I was not sayin somethin bad about you yo. There aint nothin wrong with bein educated about rights and all that, but I am just sayin that your attitude is kind of "know it all" and it wouldnt hold up in a police encounter. Its important to know about things "book smart" , but you also got to be famialir with the street smarts, or , experience.
Toast, the reason bein in the hood matters is becuz if you aint been in that situation, you have no idea how shit works. You can talk about it all say, but until you been in the position of people in this thread who are talkin a bout gettni stopped in certain areas with drugs or while tryin to cop drugs, you got no clue yo.
Your advice might not be "Bad", but it definately is misinformed. Its like reading about sex all day long but bein a virgin--some shit is different in practice than in theory, and until you do it, you dont know those differences.
I aint sayin this with disrespect to you. Its totally normal to think, "hey, thats fucked up, tellin people that they aint got no rights and not to try to exercise their rights." But the thing is, if you want to survive your interaction with the police out here, its a bad, bad idea to do any of the things you or delta is suggesting.
If you read all my posts you would see that Ive suggested much more than hiding your dope better. There is alot of shit you can do to ease the situation, and I mentioned a couple of them in my posts. They are long so I understand if you didnt read the whole thing, but the thing is dont criticize me for not sayin something that I did say, but you just didnt bother to read thru.
Coppin in the hood and dealin with the police in the hood, aint somethin you can learn by readin about it, and you DEFINATELY cant apply the regular rules of the law to police interactions in this situation. Doin that will end u up in alot of shit. Its a totally different world, with different rules, different understanding of the rules, and it aint nothing like the world that you are familiar with. You have to learn it by doing, you got to experience it. Becuz before I got pulled over the first time with dope, before I been in that spot, I believed the same shit. That I had certain rights, that I was allowed to drive wherever I want, that I cant get stopped just for bein in the hood, this and that. Once I actually got stopped and dealt with the cops tho, I realized it was muuuuch less simple than that.
So I dont blame u for havin the views that u do. You aint "Ignorant" in a way that is meant to insult or offend you. I dont say it as a put-down. But you are just .....misinformed, or naieve, about how shit works--and its totally understandable that u think that way, becuz u aint had the experience to show you otherwise.
But you should understand that the people who ARE speakin from experience, are the ones who know how it is thru those experiences, and they are better qualified to offer advice than somebody who is just applying their theories to situations that they dont fit with. If you notice, almost everybody who is sayin the "Its my right to be wherever i want, etc..." theory, is somebody who aint familiar with the situations of this thread, and most of the people who disagree with you guys, are ones who been thru it many times and are familiar with the system. We both got valid points. I am aware of the laws, I know wat they are, but I also recognize that unfortunatly....they dont apply in the same ways with city cops, and that shit is very different there than it is in non urban areas without open air drug dealing. So, i got to modify my behavior, to fit with those new rules, you feel me?
In this situation, you really have to experience it to know wat you talking about. It has EVERYTHING to do with whether you can make a informed suggestion for somebody.
QUOTE=PGHSTEELERBOI;8313347]that Harvard smooth talking whiteboy richkid shit dont work either....don't matter what your body language or how smooth you talk or where you came from, they don't discriminate, they will pull all whiteboys and whitegirls over alike. at least here in pittsburgh they will. cant speak for other areas.
ACTUALLY, cops around here HATE those preppy lookin white boys that come down to the hood to cop mainly because these kids/men have had MANY opportunities to do something right with their lives and have fucked them all up and squandered them with drugs whereas someone who was raised in the hood had a much slimmer chance of going to Harvard then someone who was raised in a "Beverly Hills" type neighborhood or of the same, who does dope isn't frowned upon AS much.[/QUOTE]
Thank you....I dont know how it is for people in other places, but I know jersey aint the only place that the cops is some shady ass dicks.
Carl Landrover, Let me tell you this from personal experience.....I have been riding in a nice, clean late model car....Dressed like a normal chick, not a preppy broad but just a regular-ass chick in jeans, a zip up hoodie but not a sweatshirt, one of them tight ones thats made out of like sweater material, u know, lookin all clean and well kept (That is one thing, when I was a junkie at least when i was out in public, I never let my self go, I always stayed commmited to taking care of myself, so i never looked skeezy or dirty or w/ever) and I didnt even have no dope, I was like 3 months clean and I got pulled over by the Staties not even in the hood and I got GRILLED by this dude, he was all over my shit, lookin around in my car with his flashlight as much as he could without searching, he asked me AT LEAST 4 times if i had any drugs and if i was "Sure" , and then made a couple comments about how "I should understand why he is suspicious becuz you know how hard it is to get the truth out of "People like you" " and shit like "Well, you know, I got a right to doubt you since junkies like you lie all the time" and shit like that. He was a total cocksucker to me, and I was bein seriously polite, on some yes no officer shit, playin my nice girl role which is a very real role now that I am clean I am mad respecful and shit.
Now, I also been in situations in the HOOD where I got pulled over (Didnt do ANYTHING AT ALL WRONG) becuz I was on a certain street in Paterson. At that time I didnt have nowhere to live at and I was riding with my boy, it was like 11 at night and we was passing thru to go somewhere else.
I got stopped by the TNT boys in the Emergency Response truck and they ran over and started fuckin with us immediately. In that case again, dressed clean and normal, my boy wasnt evne speakin unless they spoke to him, my car was clean, it was a older model but it was well kept, no dents or rust or hubcaps missing, pretty much like those old grandma cars that are in great condition even tho they are 15 yrs old.
Anyways, these cops started talkin shit, they was like wheres the drugs, wheres the drugs, wheres the drugs, we know why you here, where the dope where the coke, and said that they "saw my boy do a hand to hand transaction" (complete lie.) "You know where you goin tonight? The fuckin county jail.....Oh yes you are....Youll love it there, you little piece of shit junkie fucks..." And so on....
They told us that if they find any drugs in the car they will smash our heads against the sidewalk and stomp the shit out of my boy. I kept telling them there wasnt shit, politely and in a complete non asshole way, i didnt get mad, i didnt get uppity, I wasnt givin no attitude, and they just kept goin on.
At one point They stood outside my driver side window and was talkin shit about wat they think they should do with us and says Ima ask you again, where is the drugs....When I told them we absolutely did not have shit, he leaned down to the ground, by the side of my door kind of halfway under my car, and he goes "Hey.....That looks like a bag of weed to me!"
His partner said somethin to him real quick and then after a minute they came back and said "Hey, you guys are lucky. We decided to be nice . You are really catchin a break here so you better appreciate it and we better not never see you here again or well take you right in no questions asked. You lucky that we are such nice guys and are gonna let you get away with this shit tonight......"
and then they gave me a ticket for Careless Driving....
SO, if that is the experience that a normally dressed person who is bein polite and respectful, in a normal car, can have, when they DONT even have drugs, I think it is safe to say that it might even be worse when you do.
I am tellin you this.
And this aint specific to nobody here, it aint directed at nobody here, Its just somethin in general that I noticed many times.
I am sick of the cop apologizers who swear that the only reason you will have any trouble with cops is if you dont act right. Fuck that, it aint true. You aint gotta look shady to get fucked with. You aint gotta be havin a attitude with them. You aint gotta have a old messy car, you aint gotta be dressed in a non "normal" way, you aint gotta do SHIT EXCEPT BREATHE and sometimes they WILL FUCK WITH YOU.....
Carl, I absolutely know wat you sayin about the people who think they are being totally respectful, but they manage to say the most inappropriate shit. I feel u on that 100%, there is defiantely some ppl like that, and they feel like they ar bein the definition of a gentleman and meanwhile everything that comes out their mouth you are like oh god, we are so fucked.
But I can assure u that in both these situations that I told u, there was nothin but the "right way to act" comin from me and my passenger. Also, I been stopped with my BF many many times too, and got the same kind of treatment.
You can be white as hell, little Mr Abercrombie American Eagle and they will fuck with you! My boy used to dress up in like dress pants and a tie and white shirt and put like...folders and shit on his seat, and pretend to be goin to a job interview, when he went to go cop, and evne dressed like a young professional type of kid (And he looked like a total yuppie, straight edge type kid) he got fucked with and arrested, etc.
I am tellin you this, you just might be worse off if you try to play that innocent whiteboy college student prep kid type of shit--Why, becuz this is how it gonna happen--They either gonna look at you and think, hey, he is a student, he is out of place, good kid, ok let me help him find his way out of this neighborhood....Or, they will clearly see that your whole personality and style is a attempt to throw them off and then they will be immediately suspicious, cuz why would u do that.
I used to specifically dress like the nicest little bitch when I would go to pick up drugs. I mean I had a shirt I had got as a hand me down from some abercrombie type of store, and I saved it and had it put aside as part of my "nice girl costume." I would blowout my hair, straighten it and wear it down, with the nice little popular-girl cheerleader shirt with the little sea gull on it, and some totally plain, boring jeans with some of those generic kind of shoes that the preppy bitches around here wears, usually girl-ified, pink and white super clean skate shoes, or phat farm shell toes with the colored laces, u know real put together and matchy....And I would rock that shit...I would even put on one of those delicate little bracelets that looked super girly, and wear cheerleader girl kind of makeup.....I had a full DISGUISE goin yall....
And let me tell u that not once did anybody ever treat me different in a police encounter than when I wore my normal, regular clothes , my timberlands and baby phat and shit like that with some big ol hoop earrings and braids in....Its like the police is SO trained to recognize and pick out the addicts and junkies that they dont even see your clothes, word bond I really feel that way.
So this is how it is here. Thats life, that is the reality that we live with. And i correct ppl who suggests to act certain ways, becuz out here, if you act that way, you are fuckin toast. (Na, I dont mean you havin sex with Toast who just posted before me.
)
In Jersey, esp. the highways and roads outside our major hoods of Paterson, Newark, and all the smaller cities u can cop in surrounding those cities, the cops are stupid bastards. The state police officers in the marked cars are big, dumb, piggish goons who can barely add 1 + 1 and all they will believe is that you are a drug addict coppin drugs. You can tell them the most logical, true story about ur reason that u just pulled off the Madison Ave exit and you are heading back on 80 West and you are from Mount Olive New Jersey, but they will be assured no matter wat u tell them that u are coppin dope.
The state police DETECTIVES, in the undercover cars, are a little smarter, and they can either be worse, or better to deal with depending on the cop...There is one mutha fucka with a long hair cut, his hair is liek down to his shoulders and wavy light brown and he got blue eyes and looks a little like a contractor type dude, he will walk down the street with a baseball cap on sometimes pretending to be a regular dude and watch u, or he will watch from his nissan altima....He is OK. I got stop by him once cuz he had been watchin me and my man sit for like 20 min waitin for the dopeman and he was like where the drugs, etc, I was like yo listen. We been waitin here for a minute. We here for piff. Why here , why come to the block to get it? I know, i know, but Ill be honest with u officer---They got better weed here. And its cheaper, and I aint got a whole lot of money, so you know...I gotta budget my weed (Laugh) (cop kind of laughed too)
"So...let me show u somethin officer....(reach into my bra) See this? (Cop says, how much is that, 40 bucks?) it was actually 30, but i didnt correct him...."Now...If i am a dopehead junkie....Ima spend all my money on dope, right? Do you think you would find me here, sittin in this car, with 40 dollars on me after I already copped? Come on man....I aint gonna bullshit u--I WAS here to buy drugs...But I was actually just tryna get some bud so I can smoke a nice blunt later--forget that diesel shit, I got clean and I just smoke weed now, its better for you....
"...So officer....You aint a dumb guy, i mean you found us here...So tell me...Do you honestly believe that we got drugs on us when we still got our money? And give us some credit too--would we just park on a paterson block close to a dope spot for 30 minutes if we had dope on us? That would be retarded."
The cop smiled and looked over at his partner and they was like....OK.....I dont know wats goin on here...But it looks like we got to u before ur dealer did...So do me this favor--GET THE FUCK OUTTA HERE. And i dont mean go buy a soda and hit up your dealer around the corner where we cant see you and then get out. I mean turn down 11th ave, get on east 33rd and pull onto route 20 at the light and GET OUT and DONT EVER COME BACK......Have a nice day."
The truth in that situation was that i DID have dope on me. I had copped earlier and then we decided to go back cuz the dope wasnt that good , and buy some piff to smoke with it. our boy had kept us waitin and later he told us "sorry yo, i totally forgot yall was waitin there" 8) anyways tho, if we had played that innocent shit like "Nooo...We just like to randomly come sit on the side of the street in paterson 3 blocks from the dope spot....we aint doin shit!" we woulda ended up with a female called in to search me, and just a lot of bullshit.
By usin quick thinking, and appealin to the cops logic, while still bein totally respectful, and admitting that I was wrong but not totally wrong since I didnt cop yet, I was able to get the cops guard down and ease his suspicions a little--why would I be tellin him straight up that I was tryna cop drugs, if i had drugs. Why would i admit that I am a drug user that was here with the intent to buy drugs, and put my self out on front street like that, If i actually had drugs.
As soon as i showed him the money, he was like instantly chill , and just had that kinda knowing, "ha ha, got ya" attitude that a dad would have if he caught his son gettin head instead of like...shootin heroin. It made a big difference.
Its actually a perfect study of the 2 approaches, becuz my BF was doing the "polite respectful I know my rights officer" speech to the one cop. He was tryin, and totally failing. "Officer, I gotta respectfully say that all you caught us doing was sitting in the car. I understand that its suspicious to u guys, but we aint committing a crime. " "Well why are you here in paterson on so and so street , thats a coincidence that its by a dope spot" "That may be true, but it aint a crime to drive on certain streets neither. I know you are just doin your job and I respect that. But its not illegal for us to be here. You didnt see us coppin drugs or do anything except sit. We are moving soon, and we aint got alot of money. We noticed alot of for sale signs when we pulled onto east 33rd by the dunkin donuts, so we came down the street more to see wat else was for rent."
And so on.....never admitting nothing....And the cop was gettin real irritated, shit was irkin him. He was like how botu we call the dogs, search the car, all that ish.
Meanwhile I was doin the total opposite with the other cop, and I aint tryna take all the credit but seriously if i had not been there and did that he woulda ended up fucked.
I know all my Jersey heads feel me 100%...If you aint from here, u GOT to understand...THE cops here is SELFISH, ASSHOLES, DONT CARE ABOUT THE LAW, DONT CARE ABOUT YOUR RIGHTS, WILL WRONGLY PULL YOU OVER, SEARCH YOU, BEAT YOUR ASS, LIE ABOUT WAT YOU DID, LIE UNDER OATH IN COURT, WRONGLY ACCUSE YOU, PLANT DRUGS ON YOU, VERBALLY ABUSE YOU, INSTIGATE A FIGHT WITH YOU AND ATTACK YOU SO YOU WILL HIT THEM BACK AND THEY CAN ARREST YOU FOR ASSAULTING A COP, And so much more.....
They.. Dont. Care. Thats how shit is here, at least with city cops. The excuses and pretending to be little Miss or Mr. Perfect Innocent Kid aint gonna fly. They see sooooo many junkies, constantly, everyday, that they can pick them out pretty easy. Its like they got a 6th sense for junkie detecting. And i HATE to give that much credit to cops, becuz most of our boys in blue out here is pretty fuckin dumb, but they somehow still got a good junkie detector.
Sure, u will find the occasional dumb ass ignorant old cop who will have NOOOO idea that you are a drug addict, and be like have a nice day young man...and lock your doors, this is a bad neighborhood, follow me to the exit!
But most of them will know when you are lyin, will know when you are coppin, will know u are a junkie. and if you try to insult their intelligence for even a second by tryin to play it off like they got the wrong guy, that you aint no drug user, etc, they will get mad as hell and you will feel the consequences.
Because this site is about harm reduction, I feel like as a moderator here i got a duty to put out the information that will help people,
And while it is true that cops need probable cause to search you,
that they are wrong for stopping you for not doin nothin wrong just cuz u in a certain neighborhood,
that you should act polite and respectful, but assert your rights,
that you have certain rights and the right to exercise them,
that you have the right to refuse a search,
that you should not incriminate yourself to a cop....
In junkie-police world in the ghettos of new jersey (and lots of other corrupt places) , all those rules is like...upside down. Following them, will get you in more trouble. ASserting your rights will get your ass beat, drugs planted on you, worse charges, anything could happen. Refusing a search when you have shit on you, 99% of the time wont get the cop to say, well, fuck it, i cant get a warrant so Ill just let you go. It will end with the k9 coming and sniffin your shit out , or some kind of abuse of power and lying to get the right to search. or maybe they will just say that you gave consent, and testify in court. and out here, "cops dont lie." you will end up screwed.
You should act polite and respectful, and if you listen to these posters tellin you all this about "rights", you will tell the officer that you got a right to be here, you got a right to drive wherever you want, that he is violating your rights by stoppin you, that you got a right to refuse search, and all that.
But the thing is, no matter how nice you say it, that is seen by cops as bein disrespectful and rude. Dont matter if you sing it to him in a nice song, or whisper it, or say "With all due respect officer, and i am not being rude, i want you to know that i am specifically telling you that I am sayin this in a polite and completely friendly way, I refuse the search becuz that is my constitutional right, respectfully." they will still think you are bein a wise ass, that you gettin smart with them, and you will end up in more trouble.
I am sayin this, becuz this is shit you need to know if you cop drugs out here. These things I am sayin is necessary for your survival, real talk.
I aint sayin it to discredit nobody who says otherwise. I aint tellin nobody else that they are liars, or stupid. I am just sayin, this is how it is, and even though in theory, technically on paper, all the things about exercising rights are true....IN reality, and the way shit really works, its a very different story, and not realizing that could end you up in a whole lot of trouble.
