It probably could be taken orally, I'm not sure of the effect. I'm 98% percent sure they are legit, I know it sounds crazy but I've been doing a lot of research. A regeant test won't hurt though just in case, so I'm working on getting one! The guy I got it from has basically collected a whole antique pharmacy ...including morphine, old apomorphine, full bottles of opium used for children, cannabis syrups, lsd, etc.. some that were never even opened. Very rare stuff and great items for history and display anyhow.
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OD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic
Heroin Antique FULL Heroin Tablets Bottle from 1906....What do you think?
- Thread starter Tipton444
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Limpet_Chicken
Bluelighter
Avoid apomorphine like the plague btw. Perhaps in small doses it could be alright, like pramipexole and piribedil are. Effect is a dopamine agonist, and a strong one, it is, or rather it was, in some pharmacy treasures of my own-two huge leatherbound tomes on medicine, named 'the household physician' vols. 1 and 2, and they noted its produced by boiling morphia in a sealed tube with conc. HCl for some time. The result, apomorphine is noted as being not an opioid but a potent, powerful and certain, most rapid emetic.
These books are from the 1700s, and it doesn't mean to say the treatments they advise should be used. This is from the days when HNO3 was used as a wash for piles, babies were given a paste of metallic mercury and chalk to help teething, and people were dosed with antimonial wine, plus the likes of goulard's lotion (lead compound, lead acetate IIRC) and Fowler's solution, an arsenical were available from any pharmacy you might choose to visit. How I long for those days. Would make my days spent hunting for the supplies my lab guzzles like a fish drinks so much easier. I mean sure I can just place an order if I wanted say, some white phosphorus, but to be able to take a short walk to the pharmacy and come back with bottles of willy peter for a few copper coins would be fantastic
Suggestion to test those pills is to first sniff for vinegary odor, this would indicate hydrolysis of some of the ester (heroin, diacetylmorphine) back to morphine. Not 100% reliable since it relies on some degradation back to morphia. Worst case, is if the pills are genuine there is partial hydrolysis and you got a bunch of morphine tablets. I'd extract with dry EtOH or MeOH, iPA if needs be, then let dry out, micron filter and shoot. But to test, you could just use a syringe with no needle, bust a fudge first and then stuff it in solution up the chocolate starfish.
These books are from the 1700s, and it doesn't mean to say the treatments they advise should be used. This is from the days when HNO3 was used as a wash for piles, babies were given a paste of metallic mercury and chalk to help teething, and people were dosed with antimonial wine, plus the likes of goulard's lotion (lead compound, lead acetate IIRC) and Fowler's solution, an arsenical were available from any pharmacy you might choose to visit. How I long for those days. Would make my days spent hunting for the supplies my lab guzzles like a fish drinks so much easier. I mean sure I can just place an order if I wanted say, some white phosphorus, but to be able to take a short walk to the pharmacy and come back with bottles of willy peter for a few copper coins would be fantastic
Suggestion to test those pills is to first sniff for vinegary odor, this would indicate hydrolysis of some of the ester (heroin, diacetylmorphine) back to morphine. Not 100% reliable since it relies on some degradation back to morphia. Worst case, is if the pills are genuine there is partial hydrolysis and you got a bunch of morphine tablets. I'd extract with dry EtOH or MeOH, iPA if needs be, then let dry out, micron filter and shoot. But to test, you could just use a syringe with no needle, bust a fudge first and then stuff it in solution up the chocolate starfish.
Limpet_Chicken
Bluelighter
Reagent-wise, it'll turn a dark red-purply color with marquis reagent.
I'd try marquis first, then if a reaction, Froehde's reagent, which is more specific for opioids. Basically molybdic acid or sodium molybdate in hot, conc.H2SO4. Don't get it on you, especially Froehde's. It will react rapidly and violently with tissues and char flesh to black ash if enough were spilled. You only need a drop or so on a clean plate, and do wait a little to see if colors develop and change. Wiki has a large table of responses of different drugs to at least Marquis.
Froehde's should be used second, after a presumptive marquis test (use two samples, the reagents are destructive, especially Froehde's reagent. The latter will distinguish much more accurately between heroin, codeine and morphia.
I'd try marquis first, then if a reaction, Froehde's reagent, which is more specific for opioids. Basically molybdic acid or sodium molybdate in hot, conc.H2SO4. Don't get it on you, especially Froehde's. It will react rapidly and violently with tissues and char flesh to black ash if enough were spilled. You only need a drop or so on a clean plate, and do wait a little to see if colors develop and change. Wiki has a large table of responses of different drugs to at least Marquis.
Froehde's should be used second, after a presumptive marquis test (use two samples, the reagents are destructive, especially Froehde's reagent. The latter will distinguish much more accurately between heroin, codeine and morphia.
Thank you so very much Limpet, that really, really helps. Definitely appreciate the warning on the apomorphine, almost thought about asking him for it. Can you explain extracting with dry ethyl alcohol and letting it dry out a little more? Do you think that would be necessary? I'm definitely far from a chemist, but I'm sure I can figure it out. And can anyone help me with a link to purchase a marquis reagent test? I just want to buy the right one as I've never used one. I'm going to smell it in a few hours... say there was partial hydrolysis and they turned to morphine, is there a huge difference in shooting it? What is the difference with the rush? I've only taken one morphine tablet a while back and felt it didn't do anything so I dont know much.
Limpet_Chicken
Bluelighter
Heroin, morphine, dipropionylmorphine, dibenzoylmorphine, all those have a SHITE bioavailability. I only know it off the top of my head for morphine and its about 30% bioavailability per os, IF you are lucky. So poor is the bioavailability that there is little point in even taking these drugs orally IMO. Granted I've got a beastly obnoxious shitbag of a tolerance (used to be about a gram and a half IV morphine sulfate, tops, now I can do close to the same if not the same with dipropionylmorphine (its about 3.5x-4x the potency of H)
Buggers never did give me enough pain meds to begin with (higher dose morphine, lower dose oxycodone), so its all got to get esterified. But plugging DOES work, not the most pleasant thing but it works. No rush but far better bioavailability. Don't waste these by mouth, its fucking worthless and a massive waste. DON'T go near the apomorphine, it is a powerful, powerful emetic. Although used as a DA agonist in very small doses for parkinsons. For a DA agonist (very pleasant if one gets the right one, with opioids IV) I'd go with pramipexole first or if not, piribedil.
Reagent test kits are available via pill test kits. Look specifically for marquis and Froehde's, you might have to search for the latter separately I don't know, because I don't buy kits I make my own reagents up as and when needed. I can picture the Froehde's reagent not being part of standard kits only through logical deduction since its unlikely H would turn up in Es, which are what most of the kits are aimed towards screening. If needs be, 95-98% sulfuric acid is cheap, although a nuisance to ship large quantities since its so heavy. Do NOT let it get on you. First, wearing some cheap goggles is a must, will save your eyes if you get hit. Add acid to cold water, slowly, because the dissolution of sulfuric acid in concentrated form is highly exothermic, doing it the other way it will hiss and spit and spatter, and you don't want that shit on you. Pour a bit onto some sugar in a disposable vessel like a tin can and watch what happens. The molybdic acid or sodium/potassium molybdate, just don't eat it, it won't jump out and rip your face off or anything, its a solid, you may be better off making up the sulfuric cold, then heating it, stir with a glass rod. A little bit of molybdic acid/sodium molybdate, will go a long way.
Seriously though, wear gloves and goggles handling the acid. I once spilled some 98% sulfuric on the floor, and rushing to dispose of something nasty overheating with same as a primary ingredient, spilled it. Charred a hole in the floor like a fucking blowtorch would. And on sugar, its such a powerful dehydrating agent when concentrated to that level that it removes the -OH groups from the sugar, and burns it to inorganic carbon, a wee bit of sugar starts to slowly swell, and smoke and stink a fair bit, and it expands before your very eyes until theres a sizeable bit of (still acid-soaked, so watch it) foamy solid carbon left behind.
Since your only using one or two drops of prepared reagent per test, a single liter of conc. sulfuric will last you a long, long time, as will a fairly small amount of molybdic acid or sodium molybdate.
Look up the reagents on wikipedia for more info, also chances are, if there IS any vinegary smell the pills are either real, or if fake, aspirin. I'd personally fuck the testing right off for these, since it isn't as if they are going to turn up PMA or the like, not party pills if you see what I mean and just plug an amount according to your opioid tolerance. If they were faked with aspirin its not going to kill you, it'd just be taking a couple of aspirin, only, up the arsehole instead of swallowing the things haha.
As for the extraction, powder pills up, suspend in hot methanol (cheapest) you won't need much, the morphine type alkaloids are usually very soluble in methanol, let it stand for a while, decant with measuring syringe, separate that portion out, and then do a few more such washes, doing the same, and finally, in a separate container so you can tell how well they perform, a coffee filter, since you sound like you won't have the likes of fritted filter funnels available, if its free of crap and active when plugged (no alcohol for that, you A-don't want to plug alcohols it will burn your arse if concentrated, plus methanol is not to be ingested, it is toxic, and can either blind or kill. Let it evaporate off. The plugging testing bit you just dissolve a few pills in ordinary water, ground up and plug the lot.
With the alcohol bit if you do so, combine the decanted portion and evaporate as well as in a separate container evapping the stuff passed through the coffee filter to obtain the goods, the stuff left behind will be mostly binders, although you could let it dry off and then suspend in H2O and plug it too when you do some more of the gear. Lucky fucking fucker
Buggers never did give me enough pain meds to begin with (higher dose morphine, lower dose oxycodone), so its all got to get esterified. But plugging DOES work, not the most pleasant thing but it works. No rush but far better bioavailability. Don't waste these by mouth, its fucking worthless and a massive waste. DON'T go near the apomorphine, it is a powerful, powerful emetic. Although used as a DA agonist in very small doses for parkinsons. For a DA agonist (very pleasant if one gets the right one, with opioids IV) I'd go with pramipexole first or if not, piribedil.
Reagent test kits are available via pill test kits. Look specifically for marquis and Froehde's, you might have to search for the latter separately I don't know, because I don't buy kits I make my own reagents up as and when needed. I can picture the Froehde's reagent not being part of standard kits only through logical deduction since its unlikely H would turn up in Es, which are what most of the kits are aimed towards screening. If needs be, 95-98% sulfuric acid is cheap, although a nuisance to ship large quantities since its so heavy. Do NOT let it get on you. First, wearing some cheap goggles is a must, will save your eyes if you get hit. Add acid to cold water, slowly, because the dissolution of sulfuric acid in concentrated form is highly exothermic, doing it the other way it will hiss and spit and spatter, and you don't want that shit on you. Pour a bit onto some sugar in a disposable vessel like a tin can and watch what happens. The molybdic acid or sodium/potassium molybdate, just don't eat it, it won't jump out and rip your face off or anything, its a solid, you may be better off making up the sulfuric cold, then heating it, stir with a glass rod. A little bit of molybdic acid/sodium molybdate, will go a long way.
Seriously though, wear gloves and goggles handling the acid. I once spilled some 98% sulfuric on the floor, and rushing to dispose of something nasty overheating with same as a primary ingredient, spilled it. Charred a hole in the floor like a fucking blowtorch would. And on sugar, its such a powerful dehydrating agent when concentrated to that level that it removes the -OH groups from the sugar, and burns it to inorganic carbon, a wee bit of sugar starts to slowly swell, and smoke and stink a fair bit, and it expands before your very eyes until theres a sizeable bit of (still acid-soaked, so watch it) foamy solid carbon left behind.
Since your only using one or two drops of prepared reagent per test, a single liter of conc. sulfuric will last you a long, long time, as will a fairly small amount of molybdic acid or sodium molybdate.
Look up the reagents on wikipedia for more info, also chances are, if there IS any vinegary smell the pills are either real, or if fake, aspirin. I'd personally fuck the testing right off for these, since it isn't as if they are going to turn up PMA or the like, not party pills if you see what I mean and just plug an amount according to your opioid tolerance. If they were faked with aspirin its not going to kill you, it'd just be taking a couple of aspirin, only, up the arsehole instead of swallowing the things haha.
As for the extraction, powder pills up, suspend in hot methanol (cheapest) you won't need much, the morphine type alkaloids are usually very soluble in methanol, let it stand for a while, decant with measuring syringe, separate that portion out, and then do a few more such washes, doing the same, and finally, in a separate container so you can tell how well they perform, a coffee filter, since you sound like you won't have the likes of fritted filter funnels available, if its free of crap and active when plugged (no alcohol for that, you A-don't want to plug alcohols it will burn your arse if concentrated, plus methanol is not to be ingested, it is toxic, and can either blind or kill. Let it evaporate off. The plugging testing bit you just dissolve a few pills in ordinary water, ground up and plug the lot.
With the alcohol bit if you do so, combine the decanted portion and evaporate as well as in a separate container evapping the stuff passed through the coffee filter to obtain the goods, the stuff left behind will be mostly binders, although you could let it dry off and then suspend in H2O and plug it too when you do some more of the gear. Lucky fucking fucker
Limpet_Chicken
Bluelighter
Oh and there is no rush with oral, only IV.
And the difference between morphine and H is...variable, depending upon the state of the user. H and morphine also target different splice variants of Mu opioid receptors (MORs, MOR1 being the primary type responsible for euphoria etc). And in a user tolerant to/dependent upon morphine, apparently heroin undergoes a switch from being primarily a MOR agonist to activating DOR (delta opioid receptor, there are four main ones, Mu, aka MOR, kappa, or KOR, delta, DOR and ORL1/nociceptin) there seem to be others, such as a putative epsilon receptor, iota ( for I, for instestinal,controlling peristalsis) something known as the lambda binding site that I know fuck all about, and lastly the zeta opioid receptor which has bog all in common with the other opioid receptors, and seems to be something along the lines of a tissue growth factor.
And the difference between morphine and H is...variable, depending upon the state of the user. H and morphine also target different splice variants of Mu opioid receptors (MORs, MOR1 being the primary type responsible for euphoria etc). And in a user tolerant to/dependent upon morphine, apparently heroin undergoes a switch from being primarily a MOR agonist to activating DOR (delta opioid receptor, there are four main ones, Mu, aka MOR, kappa, or KOR, delta, DOR and ORL1/nociceptin) there seem to be others, such as a putative epsilon receptor, iota ( for I, for instestinal,controlling peristalsis) something known as the lambda binding site that I know fuck all about, and lastly the zeta opioid receptor which has bog all in common with the other opioid receptors, and seems to be something along the lines of a tissue growth factor.
Limpet and Taco, you guys have been great. Lot of great info, thanks. I've got a reagent test on the way now, so that should help determine if it's heroin or morpine now. So here's an update...
I opened the cork, and there is the very slightest smell of vinegar, but the tablets look great. They are very light brown, so I decided to crush one up into powder to see what it looked like, and try dissolving one to see what it looked like. I tasted it and it actually tastes just like heroin...you know that crazy taste! The dissolved tablet looks just like the street powder I used to get around here, dark brown with a very little bit of swirling dark material. Here are some pictures:
I don't plan on doing this one, so I just used the can for now.
So...I snorted half of 1 tablet (2.5mg) and I actually felt it. I noticed my breathing was a little deeper, I was spacier and slightly losing focus here and there on the computer and tv....I can't say that it actually felt good, felt slightly euphoric and slightly drowsy. now, over an hour into it I feel a little more energized, normal, and comfortable. I was a little paranoid at first so I probably paid attention to every little change it had on me. I do have a slight tolerance to methadone right now so I'm actually surprised. With the dissolved liquid and powder looking the way it is, I think I'm almost confident enough to try a little via IV....because after all, I only wanted the rush, don't care too much for a long high. The whole bacteria thing definitely made me scour the internet again though, but it's not like there's mold growing on the pills so that comment helped Taco lol.
What you guys think? Sound and look good so far?
I opened the cork, and there is the very slightest smell of vinegar, but the tablets look great. They are very light brown, so I decided to crush one up into powder to see what it looked like, and try dissolving one to see what it looked like. I tasted it and it actually tastes just like heroin...you know that crazy taste! The dissolved tablet looks just like the street powder I used to get around here, dark brown with a very little bit of swirling dark material. Here are some pictures:
I don't plan on doing this one, so I just used the can for now.
So...I snorted half of 1 tablet (2.5mg) and I actually felt it. I noticed my breathing was a little deeper, I was spacier and slightly losing focus here and there on the computer and tv....I can't say that it actually felt good, felt slightly euphoric and slightly drowsy. now, over an hour into it I feel a little more energized, normal, and comfortable. I was a little paranoid at first so I probably paid attention to every little change it had on me. I do have a slight tolerance to methadone right now so I'm actually surprised. With the dissolved liquid and powder looking the way it is, I think I'm almost confident enough to try a little via IV....because after all, I only wanted the rush, don't care too much for a long high. The whole bacteria thing definitely made me scour the internet again though, but it's not like there's mold growing on the pills so that comment helped Taco lol.
What you guys think? Sound and look good so far?
Treefa
Bluelighter
Holy shit that's pretty fucking cool....to think in 1906 someone, anyone, could walk into a drugstore, any drugstore, anywhere, and instead of being bombarded by fake endorsements for Naproxen, you could just go and get a 500ct. bottle of 1/12th grain tablets of diacetylmorphine and go about your day.
No waiting 30 days back then, no prescriptin monitoring. Ahhhhh, the good ol' days.
Needless to say I'd wager 5 to 1 odds that whatever tablets ARE left in there most likely contain anything BUT heroin...I mean 110 years is a long time for some junkie not to turn over every rock in the blessed U.S.of A. Could be a fancy bottle with nothing but sweet tarts in it!
So prepare yourself for that.....or freakin jujubes or whatever the hell kinda candy some 1920's dope fiend might use to replace dope with.
I believe taking Heroin orally is just essentially quicker-acting morphine. Heroin is a pro-drug of sorts for morphine anyways, so their not that different.
Morphine is probably not as good orally as Heroin, but I like Morphine orally therefore I should like oral Heroin a little better or at least the same.
No waiting 30 days back then, no prescriptin monitoring. Ahhhhh, the good ol' days.
Needless to say I'd wager 5 to 1 odds that whatever tablets ARE left in there most likely contain anything BUT heroin...I mean 110 years is a long time for some junkie not to turn over every rock in the blessed U.S.of A. Could be a fancy bottle with nothing but sweet tarts in it!
So prepare yourself for that.....or freakin jujubes or whatever the hell kinda candy some 1920's dope fiend might use to replace dope with.
I believe taking Heroin orally is just essentially quicker-acting morphine. Heroin is a pro-drug of sorts for morphine anyways, so their not that different.
Morphine is probably not as good orally as Heroin, but I like Morphine orally therefore I should like oral Heroin a little better or at least the same.
JBrandon
Greenlighter
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- Oct 8, 2009
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- 1,021
Dose and ROA?
))) No jujubees here! Definitely the real deal. IVed 1 tablet, good solid rush, very, very fast acting...like before I even got halfway down. Felt good for a bit but it faded fast, so did 2 tablets an hour and a half later....crazy rush, truly incredible. So the 2 tablets would equal about 11mg. I'm not nodding out or anything, but I'm sure I could be if I did more. No headache or any concerns thankfully. I truly wouldn't be able to tell the difference on whether it morphed into morphine over time just because I've never shot morphine, but the rush was great, just faded a bit after but we will see after more is done.
Limpet_Chicken
Bluelighter
There are differences between H and morphine alright. Morphine causes a lot more histamine release than heroin. Plus, heroin and morphine are differentially selective between some alternately spliced isoforms of MOR1 (Mu-1 subtype of the Mu opioid receptor, the one we know and love most) which is in a large part responsible for the euphorigenic effects (histamine release is IIRC the result of a heterodimeric MOR-galanin receptor hybrid), these alternately spliced isoforms of MOR1 confer an incomplete crosstolerance between morphine and heroin. Also in tolerant morphine users/addicts heroin undergoes a switch in receptor selectivity from being mostly MOR agonist to a state where its causing much much more DOR1 agonistic effects (in fact it might even be selective, can't remember for sure. But diacetylmorphine does indeed undergo such a switch in receptor binding, whilst 6-monoacetylmorphine is a selective ligand (excluding any residual MOR agonistic effects) for DOR2 (DOR-delta opioid receptor)
Agoraphobiaphile
Bluelighter
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- Feb 15, 2016
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Dreams do come true. This thread was like a suspense novel with a happy ending.
theMerovingian
Bluelighter
Please I'd be more than willing to test their potency. Hope you have a ball on them. I envy your situation. I'd happily give an arm and leg
. Hope you have a ball on them. I envy your situation. I'd happily give an arm and leg- Status