Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine FAQ & Megathread v2; 2010

[PillPoppingAnimal]

i mean an opiate that isnt going to be in my system for 3,1/2 years. like vicodin, perks, or small pieces of roxis.

im thinking about it, and i dont think i would have to cut roxis into 80 little pieces to get off of them. so its rediculous that im going to have to with suboxone. am i wrong? would it also be necesary to chop up a roxi into 80 pieces to wean off of them?

u are wrong

pain patients get RXd .2mg of bupe

not nearly enough for a opiate addict, thats why we get 20x the amount

thats why u need to chop it up...and no, ur just an addict and want an excuse to pop more oxycodone

 

[jamesBrown]

boys boys settle. . . time period and shit, he still got more posts than you........

what does it matter how many posts someone has? also, what does it matter how long someone has been a member of BL? Its not like poeple cant lurk around on BL for years, and learn, and have there own personal experiences to give advice about.
I just dont understand these people always trying to imply that posting too quickly is "wrong" in some way, as if i just trying to increase my # of posts....do you people really think it matters how many posts someone has? Or that people who have been members for longer than other members somehow "know more". I just dont get it.

What is wrong with me trying to help as many people as I can? So what if I post alot in a short period of time. In my opinion, that simply means im trying hard to help other people. Why interpret it as something negative?
Also...it doesnt matter how many posts you have, what matters is the quality of your posts and your intentions.

These people need to stop clogging our threads trying to bitch about people who are simply trying to help others. It sounds kind of like jealousy or something, as if the number of posts someone has matters. I could care less. If they cleared all of my posts off out from under my name, I woudnt give a shit....because I would still be just as capable of giving advice as I was before I had all those posts "racked up".

 

[jamesBrown]

even if u do go into precip WDs, just ride it out, but u prob wont consideing only .1 H a day...

precips onl last 30 mins- 2 hours depending on how much dosing of a full ag uhad in ur system.

you are making the right dessision, i mean u dont want to be on opiates for the rest of ur life now do u?

The PW's also differ in legth depending on how much suboxone you took. Even if you were full of full agonists.....a dose of 0.5-1mg of suboxone will cause a much shorter, and much less intense withdrawal period than if you took a higher dose.

Ive persnally experienced PW's that only lasted 5 minutes, maybe less. It depends on alot of factors.

 

[donnie080208]

To @jamesbrown Less is better with subutex comment


Read your posts and respect your opinion but surely the way to go for the vast majority of users who want to get off Heroin alltogether is high dose subutex. I not sure if you understand (you prob do but.. ) the massive difference the 16MG blocking effect has on stopping users from relapsing , they would have to wait min of 3 to 4 days to clear the sub block ime by that time most get fed up and pop another sub instead.
If you are on a say 0.5mg dose it virtually blocks nothing and the euphoria is so slight for most, that on its own its not enough to stop someone craving H , etc..imho The 16MG is a "lock without a key" 8 to 16mg is best for long term (over say 3months) maintainance (rather than a short detox or rec.)

 

[jamesBrown]

To @jamesbrown Less is better with subutex comment


Read your posts and respect your opinion but surely the way to go for the vast majority of users who want to get off Heroin alltogether is high dose subutex. I not sure if you understand (you prob do but.. ) the massive difference the 16MG blocking effect has on stopping users from relapsing , they would have to wait min of 3 to 4 days to clear the sub block ime by that time most get fed up and pop another sub instead.
If you are on a say 0.5mg dose it virtually blocks nothing and the euphoria is so slight for most, that on its own its not enough to stop someone craving H , etc..imho The 16MG is a "lock without a key" 8 to 16mg is best for long term (over say 3months) maintainance (rather than a short detox or rec.)

I guess itj ust depends on the individual. When I have taken high dose suboxone it doesnt give me any euphoria/energy/ anti-depressant/etc....and therefore, it causes me to think more about using heroin/oxy again. If im not getting SOME sort of satisfaction, its much easier to find excuses t relapse.

But when I am on low dose subs, it actually DOES give me euphoria(not like heroin but enough to satisfy me nonetheless) and when this happens, I feel no need to try to get high in other ways. Like I have said before, for most people, in order to taper down to a tiny sub dose in the correct way for them to experience euphoria in the end, they must do it over an extended period of time, and its in this time period that you are given time to re-evaluate your life while using hard drugs and understand with a clearer head that the way you were living/behaving was detrimental to your overall health.....this helps you adjust to living life without having to use hard drugs all the time. So, when you finally do get down to that "euphoria" dose, it is all you need to keep you from relapsing. But, of course it doesnt work this way for everyone. As we all know, everyones different. But I believe what I just explained would work great for many people. And I also think its worth giving a try.

 

[DeLee]

Anyone on Suboxone that shifted too Subutex here?
If yes, why did you shift over and did it work better?

 

[jamesBrown]

Anyone on Suboxone that shifted too Subutex here?
If yes, why did you shift over and did it work better?

Some people find that the nalaxone in the suboxone gives them headaches and sometimes ther side effects(but mainly headaches) so they switch to subutex and sometimes it helps and soemtiems it doesnt. But I think there are two main reasons people switch to subutex...

1.)they are having side effects that they attribute to the nalaxone
or
2.)they want to abuse(inject) there bupernorphine without having to worry about injecting nalaxone into there veins. Even though its probably not that much safer than injecting suboxone.

Of course some people might switch for other reasons, but Ive heard ALOT of people talk about switching from one to the other and thsoe are the only two reasons I have heard so far.

I am perfectly happy on suboxone so I havent made that switch, so I am not a direct source for information on what its like to switch over. Allthough Ive heard mixed things.....some people say that they like subutex better, some dont, some dont notice a difference, its all over the place. Justs supports the idea that everyone is different and one must try something for oneself before passing full judgement.

 

[DeLee]

Some people find that the nalaxone in the suboxone gives them headaches and sometimes ther side effects(but mainly headaches) so they switch to subutex and sometimes it helps and soemtiems it doesnt. But I think there are two main reasons people switch to subutex...

1.)they are having side effects that they attribute to the nalaxone
or
2.)they want to abuse(inject) there bupernorphine without having to worry about injecting nalaxone into there veins. Even though its probably not that much safer than injecting suboxone.

Of course some people might switch for other reasons, but Ive heard ALOT of people talk about switching from one to the other and thsoe are the only two reasons I have heard so far.

I am perfectly happy on suboxone so I havent made that switch, so I am not a direct source for information on what its like to switch over. Allthough Ive heard mixed things.....some people say that they like subutex better, some dont, some dont notice a difference, its all over the place. Justs supports the idea that everyone is different and one must try something for oneself before passing full judgement.

Thanks for your answer!
Like you Im on Suboxone as well but me and the people at my clinic have touched the subject of letting me try Subutex.
Ive used a lot of Subutex on the street for coming off Heroin, Suboxone I never did that much.

Anyway, I hope I can try Subutex (They are very restricted with Subutex) and see how I do on that medication.
My main reason is side-effects. I would never ever sell of my medication, this is all I got right now.. without it I would practically kill myself with opioids like Heroin because of my surgery on my heart.

 

[jamesBrown]

what side effects are you experiencing with the suboxone?

 

[SkagKush]

i dont get any side effects from the naloxone as of yet... i dont see how i could, maybe in the future..

 

[Jabberwocky]

u are wrong

pain patients get RXd .2mg of bupe

not nearly enough for a opiate addict, thats why we get 20x the amount

thats why u need to chop it up...and no, ur just an addict and want an excuse to pop more oxycodone

hey dick face, im trying to get off opiates all together. dont answer any more of my questions. you dont know shit about me.

 

[pixplzthx]

Wow it just got hot in here. Did I just feel a Buuuuurnnn?


(HA!)

 

[SubutexMan]

Anyone on Suboxone that shifted too Subutex here?
If yes, why did you shift over and did it work better?

Hello, So I am new to these forums so please forgive me if Im repeating things already said. But to you DeLee I really suggest that you try switching to Subutex as soon as you can. I have been buprenorphine for about a year now. when I first got on it I took it as prescribed (sublingual.)But since I got my new job which drug tests I stopped taking it sublingually, and started using it IV.

Ever since getting on Suboxone I noticed that I stoped feeling dope sick and It curbed my obsession of trying to find heroin 24/7. But I always felt sick like nausea and headache, I would vomit pretty often. So after going to my primary care doctor and getting blood tests done, I was shown that My bilirubin levels were far higher then they should be. I have Gilbert's syndrome so they are always elevated but they were tripple the normal level instead of double.

So after learning this I switched to Subutex Right away. About 2-3 days after the switch to subutex I noticed my life changed for the better this was 4 months into my maintenance program. I noticed I stopped throwing up and no more head ache, and The best thing was I was motavatied to live again and get out doing things. I started to really enjoy life again.

So now I am one 1 mg Ived twice daily and Things could not be better I dont think about heroin anymore. even though I am still an Iv drug user I think it is a far better life then the one I was living chaseing money and drugs to b high.This subutex stuff enables you to have a life again and live it the way u want to.. and break the cycle.

So sorry for leaving such a long post but its my first one and I want you guys to get a good feel for who I am and my battle thus far with Heroin. Before getting on suboxone I was a 2 1/2 year long opiate Junkie. with one or two spin drys in rehabs during the summer of 2 years ago.

So PROS to SUBUTEX over SUBOXONE are..

-Subutex lasts 24-36 hours before I feel the need to dose again.
-Subutex doesn't make me sick at all, my liver levels are back to the normal double the regular level for most people.
-It tastes way better the suboxone.
-you will continue to be able to get pills and not have to do the film bullshit.
-The cost is far less then suboxone.
-you dont have to have Naloxone touch your body ever again, naloxone is what made me such a sick person and caused me to feel unlike myself. I'm not sure how this is the case because I know it can't pull buprenorphine out of the opiate receptors. But like that DKblaze1 said at the start of this thread I think Naloxone still is active in some way.

Subutex CONS

-If you did well on Suboxone you will most likly have no issues with subutex.
-pretty much no CONS to subutex if suboxone worked for you only one that
could be a CON is there is alot higher want to Use it IV.
-IF your not prescribed subutex and you are buying both suboxone and subutex. switching from the subutex to suboxone will make you feel reall gross. my freind has this issue because our dealer sells both subs and texs but the texs cost way more... so hes always ends up getting shitty feelings when gettitng back to suboxone...

I Suggest Everyone to get on Subutex now before you get stuck with the films..
Hope that this was a helpful post for people and that it wasn't a waste of peoples time to read. again sorry if I repeated things already said I just wanted to let people know the deal and what I know, and who i am. good day everyone

 

[Covert]

what does it matter how many posts someone has? also, what does it matter how long someone has been a member of BL? Its not like poeple cant lurk around on BL for years, and learn, and have there own personal experiences to give advice about.
I just dont understand these people always trying to imply that posting too quickly is "wrong" in some way, as if i just trying to increase my # of posts....do you people really think it matters how many posts someone has? Or that people who have been members for longer than other members somehow "know more". I just dont get it.

What is wrong with me trying to help as many people as I can? So what if I post alot in a short period of time. In my opinion, that simply means im trying hard to help other people. Why interpret it as something negative?
Also...it doesnt matter how many posts you have, what matters is the quality of your posts and your intentions.

These people need to stop clogging our threads trying to bitch about people who are simply trying to help others. It sounds kind of like jealousy or something, as if the number of posts someone has matters. I could care less. If they cleared all of my posts off out from under my name, I woudnt give a shit....because I would still be just as capable of giving advice as I was before I had all those posts "racked up".

I don't really care what anyone else says, Godfather, but I think you are doing a GREAT job. Just on the off chance that you think it is somehow something of a "thankless" job, I for one would like to say. . . Thank You. Thanks for your time, thanks for your effort, thanks for your attempts to explain the same things over & over & over again, just hoping that people will "get" it. . . Seriously: thanks.

That being said, anyone -- and I mean ANYONE, myself included -- who takes what JB says & just assumes it is right without thinking about it, without looking back at older posts, without checking his resources or looking for your OWN resources to convince yourself -- anyone who does this is basically a moron. I've been "lurking" on this site for 3 weeks now, have read all nine of the bupe megathreads, not to mention all of the other posts on here, & I know that JB "knows of what he speaks" as they say. But you should ALL be checking up on him. We should ALL be checking up on each other. The minute anybody finds any information that contradicts anything said on here, by all means BRING IT UP. It's not about the quickness or number of posts, it's not about someone having to be right -- it's about ALL OF US helping EACH OTHER. . .

That, JB (or Godfather, as i like to say, as in "Godfather of Soul"), is why i'd like to say "Thank You" -- because anyone with a single functional brain cell can CLEARLY see that your SOLE MOTIVATION is to help people.

And yer helpin' em, by God -- free of charge & on yer own free time.

Thanks, dude.

 

[jamesBrown]

I really have no idea what you meant by that post......thank you?

if it was sarcasm then im sry you have some problem with me and hope that you can eventually get over whatever your issue is in the future. i also hope you dont respond to this with yet even more sarcasm.

 

[5StarSquatHotel]

You most likely will not need more than 4-8mg of Subutex at once to relieve w/d symptoms, but if you can tell us how much exactly is a "bag of gear" where you are it will help determine that. Is that .1g, .5g, 1g? It will be much easier to answer the question of how much Subutex to take if you can tell us that. Also, make sure you are in w/d for a little while before you dose with the Subutex so you can avoid precipitated w/d. If you take your Subutex sublingually as directed, it should relieve your symptoms within 15 minutes, 30 minutes max. If after 30-45 minutes, you don't feel 100%, dose with 2mg more and repeat this process until you do feel 100%

The temazepam should help, but I have hear that Clonidine is very helpful with w/d and in the U.S. it very easy to obtain from a doc, so that may be the same case in the UK. Immodium A/D is also very helpful with the physical w/d symptoms. It's an OTC antidiarrhea med that contains Loperamide, which from what I've been told is an opiate that doesn't cross the BBB, so it won't get you high, but will lessen w/d.

Good luck on getting off methadone/heroin and maintaining on Subutex and check out http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=524458 it's the Suboxone/Subutex megathread and FAQ, so there's a ton of useful info that may help you along the way.

Thanks for taking the time to post. I say a bag but it's prob more like 0.4 to be honest maybe as much as 0.6 on some days. I'll check that thread out and bear in mind the points you have made

 

[5StarSquatHotel]

Im not sure what you mean by clucking? Could you explain that too me in more detail please so I can give you better advice.

Also....in my opinion.....I would start with a 1-2mg dose....and give it about 20 minutes to kick in. If you arent completely satisified after that, I would dose in only 1 mg incriminents every 20 minutes after that until you feel 100%. I have learned during my experience with suboxone(or subutex) that the less you take the better. Alot of doctors prescribe around 12-32 mg's/day and I think that is just too much. You can choose to do what your doctor says to do but I would atleast try the method I mentioned above and see how it works. I mean, it cant hurt, all you have to do is take more subutex if your not feelin good. But I still always reccommend you follow your doctors instructions but it seems that most doctors arent very experienced with subutex/suboxone and therefore dont prescribe it correctly most of the time.
Also, the lower the dose you take, the less side effects you will have, and the easier it will be to get off of subs in the end.
Also, if you read the suboxone megathread like ATLL suggested above(and the previous versions of suboxone megathreads) I think you will learn alot of about your options concerning how to take your medication. you will more than likely come across posts, many of them mine, that suggest taking doses of under 1 mg after you become adjusted to the subs. I reccommend this because I believe you get euphoria and energy boosts from these small doses......any higher doses simply take away your withdrawals and can even give you headaches in higher doses.

You should choose to do what YOU want to do. Its your body and your life. I just highly reccommend you do some research on this drug on Bluelight before makin any major decisions. Bupernorphine(subutex) is a very unique and interesting drug and it takes more thought and experience to use it in the most eficient and effective way for you as an individual.

Like ATLL said, make sure you are in withdrawal before you take it, this should ensure that you dont get PW's. But, since you have been taking methadone recently(even though you have switched to using "gear" recently to make the transition easier) I think you should tough it out and make sure you are in somewhat serious and intense withdrawal before taking it. Im sure you know from exerience that PW's are far more "uncomfortable" than regular withdrawals.

good luck, and feel free to ask any questions you may have.

*Also....if your not against it, I woudl also reccomend snorting the subs...it has a higher BA and kicks in faster, and in my experience, feels better. But if you shoose to stick with sublingual, then that is perfectly fine too. I IV my suboxone and get nice euphoric rushes from my low doses IV'ed. Im not necessarily condoning this activity, but if you happen to allready be an IV user, and you know how to properly and safely inject a solution made from a pill(i.e. micron filter, sterile syringe, etc....), then you might want to give that a try. the BA(bioavailablity) of IV is 100% as compared to sublingual which is only like 35% if I remember correctly.

When I say clucking I mean W/D's. How long after my last dose of gear do you think I will need to wait before taking Subutex mate? I'm thinking 24 hours if possible but if that does get a bit much would I be ok doing it after 12?

 

[5StarSquatHotel]

even if u do go into precip WDs, just ride it out, but u prob wont consideing only .1 H a day...

precips onl last 30 mins- 2 hours depending on how much dosing of a full ag uhad in ur system.

you are making the right dessision, i mean u dont want to be on opiates for the rest of ur life now do u?

No I dont, definetely not mate!

 

[jamesBrown]

When I say clucking I mean W/D's. How long after my last dose of gear do you think I will need to wait before taking Subutex mate? I'm thinking 24 hours if possible but if that does get a bit much would I be ok doing it after 12?

Ahhh....clucking means "WD's"....never heard of that. Is that a European term or something?..

Anyway....you can take the subutex as long as you dont have opiates on your receptors. As long as you are in withdrawal you should be fine to take it. But make sure your atleast in moderate withdrawal, preferrably severe withdrawal, before taking your first subutex dose. This should guarantee that you wont have PW's.

Its also a good idea to only take 1mg at a time when your first starting to take the subutex. Take 1 mg, wait 15 min. If you still feel bad, take another mg, then wait 15 minutes....and so on. I think you will be suprised at how small of a dose you need to get rid of the Withdrawals. I had a gigantic IV heroin habit for several years and I was able to switch over to only 2mg's of suboxone and felt great. Also, its a good idea to take small doses in incriments like that because just in case you ARE taking the subutex too early and are going to have PW's, the smaller subutex dose you took, the less severe the PW's will be, and the shorter they will be as well.

I also reccommend lowering your dose to under 1-2mg's very quickly after you get adjusted to your subutex(2-4 days). I personally believe that in smaller doses you get euphoria and energy boosts due to bupernorphines "full agonist" metabolite norbupernorphine which can only bind to your brains receptors when you take subutex in tiny doses. I take 0.5mg doses everyday and feel euphoria everytime. Allthough you can choose to take your subutex however you like, I was just giving my advice.

Good luck with the Subutex!

 

[SkagKush]

just took a single 8mg pill and cut in into half, and then again, one half into half...... finally cut a 2mg piece...... from 4mg down to 2mg tomo, for euphoria and extra fast stockpiling.......