• Psychedelic Drugs Welcome Guest
    View threads about
    Posting RulesBluelight Rules
    PD's Best Threads Index
    Social ThreadSupport Bluelight
    Psychedelic Beginner's FAQ
  • PD Moderators: Esperighanto | JackARoe | Cheshire_Kat

The Big & Dandy DMT Thread - The Fifth Symphony

Status
Not open for further replies.
That's pretty much what I was getting at a few posts above. Unless you separate your DMT from all the other stuff, which isn't practical or economical to do for most people, you're not going to have pure DMT from plants, just purified alkaloids.

But what I was saying is that hypothetically speaking, if a person were to purify plant-sourced DMT to where it was as pure as possible, and were to compare it to synthetic DMT, there shouldn't be a substantial difference in how it behaves neurochemically, because it would be the same chemical. DMT is non-chiral, meaning it doesn't exist in different isomers, so any DMT from a plant would be the same as the DMT from a lab.

Yuremamine is suspected to be a possible culprit for the oral activity of mimosa hostilis. I don't know a lot about the chemistry of it, but it is an indole alkaloid, so it could very well wind up in a batch of extracted spice. This would definitely contribute to the experience.
 
Nibiru said:
But what I was saying is that hypothetically speaking, if a person were to purify plant-sourced DMT to where it was as pure as possible, and were to compare it to synthetic DMT, there shouldn't be a substantial difference in how it behaves neurochemically, because it would be the same chemical. DMT is non-chiral, meaning it doesn't exist in different isomers, so any DMT from a plant would be the same as the DMT from a lab.
Click to expand...

100% correct.
 
i'll have to read through the rest of this later. just wanted to ask, has anyone ever done a pressurized gravity bong hit of DMT? IMO its the best way to make sure you get a full dose/experience. the first time i did (smoked anyways) i was so fucked that i'll never do it any other way. also was so terrified by how quick i came up that i didnt do the other hit until two days later.
 
badass morbiddoctor, welcom to bl btw!

people say that naptha extracts just the dmt and xylene will pull the other shit, but for sure naptha pulls that other shit, just alot less than the other solvents. everything is sssslllliiiiggghhhtttlly soluble in no matter what you put it in. fuck, dmt is soluble in water, just not enough to use it to extract (and it wouldnt make sense for separation, but im only talking about its solvent proporties).

oh and with the organic giving you diferent expereinces, i think that only happens with regular dmt, cuz if i smoke d with junglespice or just a strait xylene extraction (with no previous naptha extraction done) i get a very consistant trip, i can even point out the times that the certain changes occur like clockwork.

btw a strait xylene extraction comes out smellin strait up fruity-deliscious sometimes. theres pleanty of rxns going on that we are not aware of!!!

and i say fuckyeah to that! other alks ftw, organic all teh wayy
 
^yeah I've read teks that discuss how to get pure jungle spice. first you have to extract with xylene, and that will pull out just about everything. then another extraction (or rather, wash) is done with naptha, and it leaves relatively pure jungle spice.

IGNVS, tell us more about smokin the dark spice.
 
invert said:
Do you have any plausible theoretical explanation as to why two physically identical chemicals would have different subjective effects in the brain? (Other than differences in expectations, which is what most immediately springs to mind for me.)
Click to expand...

r u sirius? the nature of the question poses so many confounds, and as the common fifthgrader will tell you when dealing with quantum phenomena empirical replication of objective perception, much less subjective experience is impossible. there are no 2 physically identical batches of anything, much less DMT, a postquantumholographichaoticoomplex technology. expectations: i expect synthetic product to be about as wise as the wisest reaction vessel in the particular Chinese lab...on another note, if you start 50/50 spice/caapi, than add huge amounts of more dmt and caapi, do ya get 60/60? #%^)
 
Ok I have a Big and Dandy question. I have not yet used psychedelics, but have always had a strong interest in their potential.

Would it be unwise to have an experience with something like DMT for the first time using a psychedelic?
 
no matter which one you pick its gonna get weird. The good thing about DMT, especially smoked, is its extremely short duration. Granted it may not seem very short while you're on it, but its only a matter of minutes. I'd say DMT would be a good choice... kind of like learning some latin before going on to spanish, french & italian... My first true psych was shrooms, which contain 4-hydroxylated and 4-phosphorlated DMT, and it was a blast... Just make sure you're well prepared and know (sort of) what to expect.
 
nanobrain said:
r u sirius? the nature of the question poses so many confounds, and as the common fifthgrader will tell you when dealing with quantum phenomena empirical replication of objective perception, much less subjective experience is impossible. there are no 2 physically identical batches of anything, much less DMT, a postquantumholographichaoticoomplex technology. expectations: i expect synthetic product to be about as wise as the wisest reaction vessel in the particular Chinese lab...on another note, if you start 50/50 spice/caapi, than add huge amounts of more dmt and caapi, do ya get 60/60? #%^)
Click to expand...

HAHA awesome
 
MilliVanilli said:
Ok I have a Big and Dandy question. I have not yet used psychedelics, but have always had a strong interest in their potential.

Would it be unwise to have an experience with something like DMT for the first time using a psychedelic?
Click to expand...

No I think vapourised DMT would be fine as a first time psychedelic - check to see if there are any possible interactions with medication you may be taking first tho.
Oral DMT (ayahuasca) is slightly more tricky inasmuch that it persists longer but of more importance is the function of MAOi in ayahuasca. This can give rise to complications ( potentially fatal in worst case scenario) if taken with certain classes of drugs or medications & also certain foodstuffs - always read up thoroughly before you ingest a substance. :)
 
junctionalfunkie wrote:

It is simply a different experience, and one advantage synth has over organic, at least in my opinion, is its consistency in what it delivers. I find I can take synthetic DMT and get pretty much what I expect each time, while with organic, you never know quite where it's gonna take you.
Click to expand...

That's a pretty major difference in my opinion... and that's a big variable which I don't think we can easily just rack up to minor amounts of "other" alkaloids.

invert wrote

Do you have any plausible theoretical explanation as to why two physically identical chemicals would have different subjective effects in the brain? (Other than differences in expectations, which is what most immediately springs to mind for me.)
Click to expand...

Well, you and I, from the perspective of a higher order of being, say, are physically identical lifeforms, for the most part, we have two eyes, one nose, a mouth and two legs and so on...

But that doesn't make us THE SAME.

There's no way that anyone can prove that two DMT molecules are the same... we just have this label... I suspect, DMT is SO VARIABLE, that there may even be different types of DMT that we do not presently have labels for or cannot yet understand these differences.

That the melting point and boiling point of DMT is so variable indicates acute differences between different batches of DMT molecules.

In Australia, we have many different batches of DMT, from lots of different trees... the core of the experience is DMT, DMT is by far the predominant alkaloid - yet the experiences from these different trees are completely different from each other. We are talking about an entirely different world here. It doesn't make sense to say it is the trace alkaloids which are causing this difference, as it is in the core of the experience, that these differences are experienced!

Nobody here who has experience of different batches of DMT from different trees, actually believes that, as far as I am aware, because its just such a stark experience - how different this predominant molecule is from different Acacia trees! :-)


Julian.
 
^ Well, organic is extracted from plant material, and from there can be clean-up, refined, recrystallized, or have other alkaloids removed as the user prefers.

Synthetic is created from raw base materials in a lab, I would assume. Theoretically, synthetic DMT should be N,N-DMT alone, while organic is bound to include other alkaloids like 5-MeO-DMT, Jungle Spice, in addition to beta-carbolines, weak MAOIs, and god knows what else. :)

At least this is my understanding. I am a simple country person and most of this chemistry stuff is way over my head. It's a lot of fun to extract though, and vary the proportions and techniques to get a nicer end product. I'm pretty new to this, but DMT has rapidly become my favorite drug and it is quite a fun hobby.

It's so nice to have your mind blown by something you made yourself. :)
 
folias said:
There's no way that anyone can prove that two DMT molecules are the same... we just have this label... I suspect, DMT is SO VARIABLE, that there may even be different types of DMT that we do not presently have labels for or cannot yet understand these differences.
Click to expand...

What is this, a denouncement of scientific thought? Anyone can prove that two DMT molecules are the same. They have the same atomic mass, the same atoms in the same arrangement, the same molecular formula, the same NMR and GC results. What the hell do you think could be different about them?

DMT is organic molecules, not a living creature.

There is only one kind of DMT, there aren't even any optical isomers.
 
Coolio wrote

What is this, a denouncement of scientific thought?
Click to expand...

No, see Edward O. Wilson's book "Consilience" on the understanding that reductionism and scientific thought can only reduce phenomena to understand it... but that the phenomena itself is not reduced! It is merely our perspective and way of understanding it.

Anyone can prove that two DMT molecules are the same. They have the same atomic mass, the same atoms in the same arrangement, the same molecular formula, the same NMR and GC results. What the hell do you think could be different about them?
Click to expand...

Well, we're just measuring the physical realm then aren't we?

Say, we take my example further about human beings... and we have two identical twins born at the same time, with exactly the same features.

This does not mean they are the same! Because THEIR EXPERIENCE AND POSITION WITHIN TIME AND SPACE HAS BEEN DIFFERENT.

This is called "environment" within the regular parlance, as the genetics in this case, are the same.

We just don't know what quantum interiors a molecule provides... but when we ingest it... we are experiencing something akin to those quantum interiors...

DMT is organic molecules, not a living creature.
Click to expand...

yes, but they often come from a living creature... a plant.

I did iboga again recently... its just a full connection to a living creature, a plant spirit.

We do group with certain plants, people generally concur about the nature and shape of what the plants are teaching them.

Understanding this is the key to understanding how plants work... in the amazon, this is what they are primarily about, learning from the plants... many may consider that supersticious or fantastic, but they consider us (the white people) rather ignorant on these matters.


Julian.
 
Shakti said:
IGNVS, tell us more about smokin the dark spice.
Click to expand...

ive tried the xylene extract and pure junglespice. the xylene extract is the best, most potent, longest lasting experience.

pure junglespice feels like a slowed down sped up version of dmt (some aspects are slower and some are faster), with a much more chilled out feel to it, almost borderline sedating. a very, "i dont want to move right now" feel that lasts long after the trip. the visuals are actually dim, dark. lots of blacks dark neon blues, greys, etc... heavy earth tones also. oevs are alot more whispy with a sucking windy feel to them. the body high is incredible. it definatly has that my body isnt here aspect regular dmt does. you can go in and out of it.

xylene extracted spice gives a real cool expereince, the darkness of the jungle spice adds cool shadows in the fourth dimension. the headspace is diferent. a mirror quality almost. it comes on slower, alot stronger too. fish eye vision at 1 minute transitioning into extreme warping and color distortion. closed eye visuals change from intense swirling pixilated flames of translucent etherial sunshine to a black matrix of colorchanging dots (that change colors so fast its like neon brown) exploding from the center of the vision at right around 4 mins (consistantly between trips). around ten minutes oevs are still extremely intense, leaving you wondering when youll come down. but then you do.

extremely wonderful trips on the xylene stuff, just make sure you get it all out by scraping your extract as its still slightly wet, scraping it back up and smearing it, continuing to do this until a waxy consistancy and clear yellowish color is obtained. it will also be alot harder to scrape. youll know when its all gone.

i want to mix the xylene spice with bufotenine and harmala alkaloids.. i feel like this will be a winning combo
 
Folias, you've either read a lot of batshit crazy things and bought into them, or you're completely misinterpreting some less than crazy things. The comparison between two identical molecules of DMT and two twins (complex living organisms with free will that may interact with their separate environments in separate contexts in any way they desire) is just inane.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top