Miscellaneous Trip stoppers. Are they bullshit?

[SaintJude]

Speaking of Ketamine specifically, the clinics will tell you to not take your morning dose of benzos or amphetamines, but buprenorphine and SSRIs are fine.

I asked whether they interfere with the efficacy of Ketamine itself or just don't want to risk drug interactions. I was surprised to have been given different answers by different doctors.

Some said that benzos would lessen the efficacy and experience, others said it was for respiratory depression risks. I was told amphetamine avoidance was to keep your heart rate steady. Multiple Drs said bupe was fine, but one said he did see that patients using bupe and trying to treat Depression had to come back much more frequently than those who did not.

Does anyone have any experience and/or knowledge on this topic?

 

[vita17]

Speaking of Ketamine specifically, the clinics will tell you to not take your morning dose of benzos or amphetamines, but buprenorphine and SSRIs are fine.

I asked whether they interfere with the efficacy of Ketamine itself or just don't want to risk drug interactions. I was surprised to have been given different answers by different doctors.

Some said that benzos would lessen the efficacy and experience, others said it was for respiratory depression risks. I was told amphetamine avoidance was to keep your heart rate steady. Multiple Drs said bupe was fine, but one said he did see that patients using bupe and trying to treat Depression had to come back much more frequently than those who did not.

Does anyone have any experience and/or knowledge on this topic?

I have a prescription for ADHD meds in the amphetamine class and am wondering what the interaction is like between taking occasional small dose of ketamine with these meds? What's your take? I usually smoke a little weed every so often while on ADHD meds to handle the intensity and keep focused or relax a bit as I go for lengthy 12-16 hour on-and-off work sessions. Curious for your experience.

 

[Camomill]

'bad trip' in itself seems to be quite the spectrum. Minor complications for example could more often than not stem from overreaction/general anxiety.
An effective tool can be to remember to control and influence one's breathing.

Very good practice.
But I know there could be more dramatic situations, or the case of actual physical complications, an overdose for example.
In which case it also really depends on what kind of 'trip' you are on, and what dose etc... A general trip stopper seems pharmacologically naive to me but it could work some times...

 

[SaintJude]

I have a prescription for ADHD meds in the amphetamine class and am wondering what the interaction is like between taking occasional small dose of ketamine with these meds? What's your take? I usually smoke a little weed every so often while on ADHD meds to handle the intensity and keep focused or relax a bit as I go for lengthy 12-16 hour on-and-off work sessions. Curious for your experience.

A little weed with ADHD stims is fine. I do it the same as you and also if I occasionally take more stims than usual it can help with the comedown irritability. I don't know what other meds you are on or your experience with KET, but I have never had an issue with small amounts of the three together. That said, I typically take KET on it's own though as I specifically use it for treatment resistant depression and feel it works better for that when not combined with anything else. YMMV, best of luck.

 

[M!$TER-ED]

I can speak not as one who intentionally tried to stop a trip, but one who has not tripped because of medication.

 

[Jung and Stoopid]

Xanax or Valium definitely work to stop most bad LSD trips.

Any benzo will work. Zopiclone works even better and will stop a trip in about 20 mins if taken on a empty stomach

In my humble opinion benzos do not stop trips, they only make them more easily managed.

Saying zopiclone kills trips is dangerous advice imo

Some of my best, most intense trips involved hefty benzo doses... but I take truly heroic amounts.

Antipsychotics KILL trips... benzos dull them. Z drugs might do anything.

 

[paranoid android]

In my humble opinion benzos do not stop trips, they only make them more easily managed.

Saying zopiclone kills trips is dangerous advice imo

Some of my best, most intense trips involved hefty benzo doses... but I take truly heroic amounts.

Antipsychotics KILL trips... benzos dull them. Z drugs might do anything.

Benzos and z drugs kill my trips better then zyprexa does. I cant even take zopiclone the night before tripping or it wont work. Same wth high dose klonopin

 

[lexxbell]

like others have said, a good benzo will definitely chill out a bad trip, if not kill it entirely. seroquel on the other hand WILL kill the trip entirely, you will be done tripping and falling asleep. i like to keep a couple benzos or seroquel on hand, for trips as well as just my panic-riddled noggin

 

[Camomill]

like others have said, a good benzo will definitely chill out a bad trip, if not kill it entirely. seroquel on the other hand WILL kill the trip entirely, you will be done tripping and falling asleep. i like to keep a couple benzos or seroquel on hand, for trips as well as just my panic-riddled noggin

Now, I have a question regarding this.
I have taken Seroquel because an old friend of mine had to take them after a psychotic episode of some kind.
I wanted to just see what he tried to take there, since he also was diagnosed with schizophrenia, and I just maybe wanted to empathize better with him. I kind of lost that friend since the psychotic episode, or lets say I couldn't understand him any longer, but in the first few years I really tried keeping up with him and one day said to him, he should give me one dose of Seroquel so I can relate to how he felt then.
So I kind of do know what it is about.

Anyways, I can barely remember how it felt but I still know that it hit quite hard, so I understand that while tripping it will probably 'make you fall asleep and stop tripping' as stated, I guess.
I mean a trip isn't the biggest thing in this world and I do understand one can quite overestimate its effect.
But for me this 'taking that drug so it kills the trip' sounds almost even more mysterious than the effect of lets say an LSD trip itself.

I mean how does that work. It is probably less dangerous than a serious bad trip and its possible implications. (worst case scenarios a la Don't jump out the window etc) Here I can definitely see how it is a valid and sensible option.
But what are the side effects of this?
I mean taking stuff like Seroquel once is I guess not as impactful as having to take it consistently.
But taking it once to kill a heavy trip, will you feel most likely groggy or even confused the following days?
Has someone actually done this, and what were the side effects?
I guess probably minor things in comparison to having wrong set and settings and actually falling victim to its potential bad situation in regard to a too strong of a dose??
I hope you can somehow elaborate, I always wondered how that feels, but my english is also not the finest, I know, sorry for that!

 

[lexxbell]

I mean how does that work. It is probably less dangerous than a serious bad trip and its possible implications. (worst case scenarios a la Don't jump out the window etc) Here I can definitely see how it is a valid and sensible option.
But what are the side effects of this?
I mean taking stuff like Seroquel once is I guess not as impactful as having to take it consistently.
But taking it once to kill a heavy trip, will you feel most likely groggy or even confused the following days?
Has someone actually done this, and what were the side effects?
I guess probably minor things in comparison to having wrong set and settings and actually falling victim to its potential bad situation in regard to a too strong of a dose??
I hope you can somehow elaborate, I always wondered how that feels, but my english is also not the finest, I know, sorry for that!

honestly i’m not super versed on the pharmacology of seroquel specifically, but with it being an anti-psychotic it ends or heavily dampens the effects of psychedelics. having been on other antipsychotics in the past, namely Abilify, while on it the effects of tripping were heavily reduced. next to no visuals and less of a mental change.

both abilify and seroquel act as strong serotonin receptor antagonists- specifically of the 5ht2a receptors. LSD when taken binds to those receptors and acts as an agonist. if you’re not familiar with these terms- a receptor agonist binds to said neurological receptors and effectively turns it on, activating it at the site. antagonists are the opposite, blocking the receptors and having no effect, effectively turning the receptors off/preventing them from being activated. now, how LSD binding to these receptors causes the major effects it doesn’t isn’t fully understood, but it’s well known that psychedelics cause parts of your brain to communicate that normally don’t- likely a major cause of the hallucinatory and mental state changes.

so when certain antipsychotics are taken they begin to take the place of LSD, blocking the effects. the antagonists reverse the effects once taken, turning off the receptors and negating the effects of psychedelics. the sedating and dampening effects as well play a major role, especially with LSD which has minor effects on the dopamine system too. it’s similar to how certain antidepressants prevent/dampen the effects of psyches. most antidepressants are SSRIs, which prevent the reuptake of the serotonin molecules from the receptors, keeping the receptors occupied for longer with serotonin (ideally) to get more from its effects and duration. so when you take LSD or mushrooms on SSRIs, the drug can’t bind to your serotonin receptors the same way, thus less effects are usually experienced.

the next day effects are kinda variable. i mention seroquel specifically because it’s an antipsychotic that doesn’t need as much time to build up in one’s system. it can act acutely pretty quickly. i’ve taken it on the tail end of an acid trip before- not due to a bad trip, just to get some sleep. i was definitely out of it the next day, only a little more than i would be normally. my ex had taken seroquel to kill trips a couple times too, and it never seemed to have a major impact on them. i never noticed any side effects from it beyond being sleepier the next day. wouldn’t really be any major risk of side effects any more than either of the two drugs alone.

hopefully this helps clear some of it up. this is just the cursory knowledge i know off the top of my head, so apologies it’s not the most in depth. i’m no expert on antipsychotics and there’s a lot of science out on how psychedelics work the way they do. but it basically just blocks and reverses the effects from the psyches in your brain. antipsychotics are definitely a bitch, a necessary one in some cases. being on them at points really has a major dampening and sedating effect on the noggin most of the time. so even that alone will slow down the chaotic racing thoughts of psychedelics. i’m glad that i don’t need to take them long term, love my mood stabilizers tho. the ones im on don’t negatively impact my ability to trip/roll.

 

[Camomill]

honestly i’m not super versed on the pharmacology of seroquel specifically, but with it being an anti-psychotic it ends or heavily dampens the effects of psychedelics. having been on other antipsychotics in the past, namely Abilify, while on it the effects of tripping were heavily reduced. next to no visuals and less of a mental change.

both abilify and seroquel act as strong serotonin receptor antagonists- specifically of the 5ht2a receptors. LSD when taken binds to those receptors and acts as an agonist. if you’re not familiar with these terms- a receptor agonist binds to said neurological receptors and effectively turns it on, activating it at the site. antagonists are the opposite, blocking the receptors and having no effect, effectively turning the receptors off/preventing them from being activated. now, how LSD binding to these receptors causes the major effects it doesn’t isn’t fully understood, but it’s well known that psychedelics cause parts of your brain to communicate that normally don’t- likely a major cause of the hallucinatory and mental state changes.

so when certain antipsychotics are taken they begin to take the place of LSD, blocking the effects. the antagonists reverse the effects once taken, turning off the receptors and negating the effects of psychedelics. the sedating and dampening effects as well play a major role, especially with LSD which has minor effects on the dopamine system too. it’s similar to how certain antidepressants prevent/dampen the effects of psyches. most antidepressants are SSRIs, which prevent the reuptake of the serotonin molecules from the receptors, keeping the receptors occupied for longer with serotonin (ideally) to get more from its effects and duration. so when you take LSD or mushrooms on SSRIs, the drug can’t bind to your serotonin receptors the same way, thus less effects are usually experienced.

the next day effects are kinda variable. i mention seroquel specifically because it’s an antipsychotic that doesn’t need as much time to build up in one’s system. it can act acutely pretty quickly. i’ve taken it on the tail end of an acid trip before- not due to a bad trip, just to get some sleep. i was definitely out of it the next day, only a little more than i would be normally. my ex had taken seroquel to kill trips a couple times too, and it never seemed to have a major impact on them. i never noticed any side effects from it beyond being sleepier the next day. wouldn’t really be any major risk of side effects any more than either of the two drugs alone.

hopefully this helps clear some of it up. this is just the cursory knowledge i know off the top of my head, so apologies it’s not the most in depth. i’m no expert on antipsychotics and there’s a lot of science out on how psychedelics work the way they do. but it basically just blocks and reverses the effects from the psyches in your brain. antipsychotics are definitely a bitch, a necessary one in some cases. being on them at points really has a major dampening and sedating effect on the noggin most of the time. so even that alone will slow down the chaotic racing thoughts of psychedelics. i’m glad that i don’t need to take them long term, love my mood stabilizers tho. the ones im on don’t negatively impact my ability to trip/roll.

that's a really elaborate thoughtful answer to my question. this probably took some minutes/time to write down.
Thanks! and yes I think that shined some light on the topic at least for me.

I think it's again an experience which is always hard (maybe even impossible if one wants to be that nitpicky) to explain if you haven't gone through it.
Maybe one day I will see for myself.

Well yes, I think some mild mood stabilizers do sound very reasonable to take if you already know that you are someone who profits from such a thing.
Most important thing is to feel safe/okay or maybe even good (simple but also very complex word sometimes)

If these things were available OTC where I live maybe I would actually be more versed in their usage, but I have to admit Seroquel wouldn't be my first choice then, maybe a kind of last resort.

Benzodiazepines might be a good idea to have for a person like me. But I don't like the almost alcohol like loss of inhibition they kind of spark in me. Haven't rouched them in years...
But gut instinct tells me they might be a good option if I misjudge a trip and end up somewhere I didn't intend to land.

What I do take use of are even milder things (which are available here) like certain herbs to brew tea from. But I have to admit, when a really harsh trip has happened, which for me is already quite some time ago (but still goes to show I am just as vulnerable as anyone else I guess) a little baldrian or maybe green hops would surely help a little bit, but definately wouldnt cut the mustard for stopping that impending doom feeling that had arisen once already.

I am very careful nowadays where/when and with whom I take something.
But even then I can still misjudge a little I have already noticed.
Experience I think helps though.
Especially first few trips might have been the most impactful and riskiest, at least for me.

I guess it's handy to have, even when not taken, just to feel safer. But I also think they should be regarded with similar caution and respect