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☮ Social ☮ PD Social Talk Thread: If 2020 Was the Dumpster, Can 2021 Be the Fire?

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I went to some of Alex Gray's parties when he had that space in NYC. It was pretentious as fuck but some of the events were fun and I met a few chill people there including one who I discovered was a Bluelighter. People were very indiscrete there though. The EMTs were dragging people out of there pretty regularly. Every now and then you'd get some guy losing his shit or some chick taking her clothes off. People minded the former much more naturally. The vibe overall was very cultish. Alex was a dick. His wife was even worse.

They wore out their welcome in the city and moved up to some Waco-style cult compound in Westchester County. Good riddance. I never went up nor did anyone I know. My impression is that only the cult people actually followed him there because he stopped throwing fun rave type situations and just started doing weird New Age shit. Not that he wasn't doing that to begin with, but it's easier to ignore and write off at a big drug fueled party where it's only creepy when you think about it. Otherwise it's just creepy. Fuck the Gray's.

I never really liked the art that much, either. Technically proficient? Very. Evocative of psychedelia? Yes, to a degree—although I think more so in people who've seen the paintings before they ever tripped and thus "primed the pump." But overall the art is basically one gimmick executed well but executed again and again ad nauseum.
 
Had to look him up tbh.
You went to his parties? Cool! What was generally the music of choice? I'm curious
 
I like Alex Grey's art pretty well but he's never been in my top echelon of psychedelic artists.

(whatever did happen to Samadhi Smiles btw?)

He and Delsyd and I hang out on the regular, he's one of my best friends. He and his girlfriend had a kid, he's 2 and a half, he's crazy smart and cute. He (SS) is one of the happiest people I know, he's slaying life, to be honest. Running his own business, recently built his house mostly by himself, starting to transition to being primarily a house builder. He's really figured it out. He still trips from time to time. I'm a little bit in awe of him, to be honest.

He still talks about sex a lot, though, lol.
 
Had to look him up tbh.
You went to his parties? Cool! What was generally the music of choice? I'm curious
Psytrance, I guess? Definitely not Good Old Grateful Dead. I'm not all that discerning when it comes to electronica.
glad to hear buzz happy easter.

The more i get to know this girl the more im worried about how this acid trip could go ima have one of her friends around for emotional support. Though its only 100 ug people carry alot of secrets in the dark corners of their mind.

Was hanging with her till 3 am watched a couple movies but it seems to be where are just really good friends and its hard to bury feelings for her. Love is such a calming force. But why is it the women i always get along with best we just end up best friends. Why can i never find a girlfriend like them.
Tripping with this woman is an unbelievably bad idea. I know you probably assume me to be a veritable font of negativity towards everything in that world, and to an extent that's true, but I can think of few things I'd be less inclined to want to experience tripping than dealing with the "Uncertain Smile" (to shoehorn in another reference to a Matt Johnson track) of the "friend zone" and trying to "bury feelings for her." Think of the poor girl, too, getting uncomfortable signals from you when she's trying to enjoy her first trip. I'm not suggesting that this is indeed the case but the whole thing has the potential to create a kind of trap where things start to feel forced, even predatory while you feel rejected and isolated. Fuckssake pull out before you both have a bad time if those feelings are flying around. If you do dose do it at a show or something (whoops COVID guess not) not just sitting around. That's practically begging for someone to get all Jungian and introspective and nobody wants that.

I say all this because I've been where you are now in at least some kind of way and adding serious drugs to the mix never helped anything so I believe it's a harm reduction practice (no, an HR obligation) to plant the seed of the fact that you're gonna have a bad time so deep that you decide to skip. If I've misinterpreted the situation tell me to go fuck myself but if the dynamic is indeed interpersonally fraught in that manner, abandon ship. Heck, abandon hope. That whole thing is bad news when you stir in a little acid. Especially if it's her first time and you expect her to be even a little emotionally liable. Forget you having a bad time in that case—it's not fair to her!

Please put neither yourself nor her through this ordeal.

Its fucking expensive to overspend going to eat out aswell quite a few times aswell. Then muchines cost hella loads of money for snacks in NZ. But you gotta keep women well fed.

though i should take it as a good sign if she wants to hang out til 3 am fall asleep in my arm. So maybe one day things will work out.
In terms of women generally you've got the chill out and dial it back a bit with the buying stuff and being at her beck and call and expecting things to work out down the line somewhere. Women can smell desperation and avoid it like the plague but sometimes either find it hard to disengage from a guy who is doing that kind of stuff or even like the attention. Since the term entered public consciousness sometime last year people have said a lot of dumb stuff about "simps," but I thought this was a good article (written by women for women but seems to me to break things down pretty well.)
 
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I like Alex Grey's art pretty well but he's never been in my top echelon of psychedelic artists.



He and Delsyd and I hang out on the regular. He and his girlfriend had a kid, he's 2 and a half, he's crazy smart and cute. He (SS) is one of the happiest people I know, he's slaying life, to be honest. Running his own business, recently built his house mostly by himself, starting to transition to being primarily a house builder. He's one of my best friends and has really figured it out. He still trips from time to time. I'm a little bit in awe of him, to be honest.

He still talks about sex a lot, though, lol.
No shit. I'm really happy to know all this. Send him my regards! I was scared of hearing a bad outcome. Glad to know that someone is doing good, and, you know, alive for once!
 
In terms of women generally you've got the chill out and dial it back a bit with the buying stuff and being at her beck and call and expecting things to work out down the line somewhere. Women can smell desperation and avoid it like the plague but sometimes either find it hard to disengage from a guy who is doing that kind of stuff or even like the attention. Since the term entered public consciousness sometime last year people have said a lot of dumb stuff about "simps," but I thought this was a good article (written by women for women but seems to me to break things down pretty well.)

Yeah for sure. The way to attract women is to be comfortable and confident, but like actually confident, not "look at me, I'm so confident"... be yourself. Just interact with women like you're not even interested, but don't play games, either. Try to forget you're interested and just interact normally. Women can smell desperation/trying too hard a mile away and it's a turn-off. If she's into you, it will become obvious if you aren't trying to force it, and then you can make a move if she's giving you an opening, or let her make a move on you. I don't mean just this girl, I mean women in general. Just do you, and at some point, someone will be attracted to that, and then it will happen naturally.

If she's not into you, you should move on. I mean if you've made friends with her, be her friend. But if she's putting you in the friend zone, I think it's not a good sign for romance.

And I agree with SKL, tripping with her right now in these circumstances sounds like a recipe for a difficult/awkward trip, if not an outright disaster.
 
No shit. I'm really happy to know all this. Send him my regards! I was scared of hearing a bad outcome. Glad to know that someone is doing good, and, you know, alive for once!

It's nice, right? So many bad outcomes.
 
Never bought her anything but if people come to my house I always have a large range of free food snacks everything people can need/want while stonned or drunk. So I treat all my guests like family. Hell we go out to eat alot aswell and never once I have paid for her meal. I think the situation will be okay I will have her close friend with her aswell sober. But I have been through so much hardcore acid trips that I should be okay I usually let go of everything and just soak in the bliss escapism and jam music.

Inside will be best I have scouted the outside areas around and evetynight I go out in encounter the most fucked in the head situations and people which is not good If walking around on acid. I just gotta play it careful with my track selection. Though to outsiders when I on acid they usually are surprised when my mates were walking with me for the peak of a heavy trip they thought I was sober for 8 km.
 
It's nice, right? So many bad outcomes.
Thinking of that era I have to wonder about @Youkai though. I was actually reading some very old posts recently and saw some of his as well as s_s and others. Does make you wonder. As far as Youkai goes there are only so many possibilities given how hard he was going though. Maybe he just got locked up though. Who knows.

And @bluedolphin I wonder a lot about. We used to be very close. I hung out with his now ex-girlfriend a while back and there wasn't really any news of him but pretty sure he was alive at that point at least. He was definitely going through some profound turmoils the last anyone knew though.

There's a very good reason, many very good reasons, why I'm extremely jaded about this stuff and make a point of projecting that. Having said, good outcomes are also, and this is equally in evidence, possible. Only thing is they are pretty rare. And even the people who are doing really well now, if they were deep into being about that life, have almost by definition been through some real difficulties though. It's something I'm not sure what to do when faced with younger or more seemingly naïve people. I have my own little ways, I suppose. I hope people don't think of me as some kind of black hole of cynicism, though. That's my role I guess—a sort of advocatus diaboli—but there's more than that to it and I try to come from a place that cares.
 
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Never bought her anything but if people come to my house I always have a large range of free food snacks everything people can need/want while stonned or drunk. So I treat all my guests like family. Hell we go out to eat alot aswell and never once I have paid for her meal. I think the situation will be okay I will have her close friend with her aswell sober. But I have been through so much hardcore acid trips that I should be okay I usually let go of everything and just soak in the bliss escapism and jam music.

Inside will be best I have scouted the outside areas around and evetynight I go out in encounter the most fucked in the head situations and people which is not good If walking around on acid. I just gotta play it careful with my track selection. Though to outsiders when I on acid they usually are surprised when my mates were walking with me for the peak of a heavy trip they thought I was sober for 8 km.
You do you I suppose. You're not doing right by the chick though. Think of her first here. You do seem to get that you're responsible for her, which you are. If shit gets weird and she feels uncomfortable that's very likely on you and the fact that it will impact your relations with her going forward will probably be the least of your worries. I've turned people on who had a bad time before. It's a horrible feeling and I didn't remain (or become, if we weren't already) friends with any of them. Let alone anything romantic.

Now, I'm not accusing you, but if you are even vaguely hoping for that to develop from the LSD, even a little bit in the back of your head (examine yourself!) then you're a downright bad person and no different from someone trying to do it dropping flunitrazepam in her cocktail. If you aren't going for this it still seems like there is a huge chance for shit to get awkward. Now, I don't like awkward. Nobody does. I'm sure she doesn't. I'm assuming she's neither dumb nor emotionally obtuse so she can probably pick up what you're vibing...and the potential for awkwardness is huge.

I've never had a bad trip as such, which fact I've written about here recently, but every time I came close it was due to social awkwardness. More often than not I think due to a woman.
 
I hope people don't think of me as some kind of black hole of cynicism, though.
Not at all, you're good.

As for guiding a trip, it's indeed very hard and likely to not be beneficial to the relationship. I am out immediately if I have first time trippers in the area, I hate the responsibility and I'm beyond terrible at it.
 
I am out immediately if I have first time trippers in the area, I hate the responsibility and I'm beyond terrible at it.
So true. To—as the lovely Jenn Psaki would put it—"circle back" a but, I once made the mistake of puddling a kid I didn't know who asked for it, at an Alex Gray event. He wound up restrained and hauled out by EMTs and NYPD. He asked for the puddling and I thought he was responsible. He wasn't.

Apparently he was going through some things in life with—get this—well, cherchez la femme! He couldn't handle thinking about it on L, lost control, had a bad time, and more importantly, became very conspicuous. But I, unenthused with the potential of risking incarceration and equally loath to throw around the "grip of drugs" I was carrying around—had to lay low and then bump completely. Before which his friends had even approached me to ask what to do. Well? Fuck off.

After that I never turned on anybody except confirmed heads at Greatful Dead related shows and very close friends. And I always kept at least a vial each of Thorazine and Ativan both for injection. Was never gonna be in the situation of someone losing it in front of me again—much less that happening in my apartment, camp area, or other location that needed to remain secure.
 
First timers have always been good with myself over my life. I use to trip with a girl a while ago while she was always sober but sat through many of my trips and out of all the women in my life she was my closest one but now we live apart on diff countries though my feelings never leaked out on acid.

In fact half the time I trip I wonder if I even like women always questioning my sexuality but never found a solid answer. I think I just like having close friends after alot of isolation through covid and maybe misinterpreted my own feelings.

By having her own friends there it will def balance out the trip. If anything I might lower the dose to 50 ug but 100 ug will be a experince.
 
He wound up restrained and hauled out by EMTs and NYPD. He asked for the puddling and I thought he was responsible.
See I don't get this, is psychosis on psychedelics that common?
I went psychotic once, but it's after I had barely been sleeping and an intense manic period, I feel like there's nothing I could do or was due to fear or something.
 
By having her own friends there it will def balance out the trip. If anything I might lower the dose to 50 ug but 100 ug will be a experince.
Well, if nothing else, while I still think it's a bad idea and to go on past experiences is questionable here, giving a threshold dose is the responsible thing to do. The above story is about a puddling which is anything but. Another time I dosed someone he wound up very manic, but this was on a large dose too. Both cases involved putatively experienced people asking for a dose that was more than they could handle. That time it wasn't a puddling but was a certain number of hits to a person who was probably used to a lesser quality of hit in terms of dosage (which is also a big problem when people talk about doses represented as a certain micage, as I've discussed here many times.) @Buzz Lightbeer this also plays in to why psychosis/mania happened. A "puddling," for anyone unfamiliar with the term, involves liquid and is exactly what it sounds like. We're talking a saturation dose. In excess of a milligram. Don't do this, lol. I learned from hard experience.

I've had this done to me too when I didn't expect it to be so haedcore in the form of someone giving me a vial wash spontaneously at a show. It was rather too high a dose to enjoy myself, luckily I was able to get to my tent and lie down! Might very well have been bad if I'd been in rougher surroundings (like, say, the Alex Gray gallery.)
questioning my sexuality
And with this floating around in your mind in addition to everything else you want to take hardcore psychedelics? "Damn, son."
By having her own friends there it will balance out the trip
This is good. Don't be weird (or feel bad) if she'd rather spend time with them than you though.
 
thats the whole reason i will have them around so if she does want her own space then she has some female friends who can stay with her plus thats one of the things in the old 1950s textbooks of having female and male guide to balance the energy of the setting out. I have waited a while and held off giving her acid though she wanted to take it the first night i met her while i was shit faced drunk and told her to wait and i will find a right time but she still wanted to do the next week when i barely knew her.

But now we pretty much go out for dinner alot of nights of the week with our two friends. Hang out til 1-3 am smoke weed a few times a week drink sometimes. Which im glad i did wait because as you get to know a person more warning signs can develop.

My main concern is tripping with people who still believe in satan, demonic forces etc and was into that stuff in the past because even if has no basis in reality its still within their mind and the dark corners of the mind of those concepts can flow out on trips. Plus i still don't know much about she grew up so you never know if people have a traumatic past.

But im playing it quite safe with the doses i know these tabs and these dudes who i introduced to LSD in feb said their first trip was amazing but they took two tabs each next time for their second trip a couple weeks ago so 200 ug in total and were not prepared for the extreme increase in intensity. But now they got humbled and said yeah we should of listened to you it was a huge jump for them 100 ug to 200 ug. These dudes where doing nangs smoking weed on their first trip and handled it fine.

This LSD i have is top quality stuff so i do believe in it alot even on 200 ug they did not flip out or anything.

I have been weighing out all the things for weeks now and just making sure i truly weigh things up with outside perspective aswell. AND i will really make sure she 100% wants to take LSD i have told her the worst of what can happen aswell and the risks etc and she still wants to do. Infact i did not even suggest LSD to her she just randomly asked if i had done it when i met her and that she wants to try it. Im glad i was to shit faced drunk that i refused to give her acid then though. Now that we are really good friends and she always feels comfortable around me then that makes it better for guiding a trip.

I have been punched in the face on LSD before by my best friend and i did not even react negatively at all i just accepted it got home and spent time riding through the peak then we laughed it off on the comedown smoked another joint and tripped heavy under the stars.

LSD is the drug i know my way around i am the one always nominated to talk to sober people if it is required on the peak.

but again its fucking LSD anything fucking thing can happen. I am just making sure the setting and set is good and if i still have doubts i will either delay taking the LSD or just not all.

So far i made sure all the tracks i pick have no confusing lyrics or meanings. I.E avoiding anything that even remotely hints at emotional relationships, love etc. So far i am probably just going to play peaceful music and whatever she wants on the come up. But while peaking i will most likely just play super peaceful music that has no lyrics and not mind melting.

I have been on many trips with others where i just let them do whatever they wanted if it was not good for my trip just make there trip good. It doesn't faze me I will always put others first before myself.

I will never ever give anybody more than 100 ug for their first trip. And thats a rule my group of friends have always followed we either you one tab that we know the strength of or half of it.

After that i will probably turn my other friend onto LSD he is really level headed but prob only give him 50 ug as he has some worries about first time experiences.

I also have a bunch of people that want me to take them shroom hunting for their first times and guide their trips. Everybody i ever gave mushrooms i only give like 1-1.4 g dried had amazing times that they liked more than LSD.

Its just risky introducing so many people over the time so far i have screened people quite well i reckon.
 
My main concern is tripping with people who still believe in satan, demonic forces etc and was into that stuff in the past because even if has no basis in reality its still within their mind and the dark corners of the mind of those concepts can flow out on trips.
Malignant preternatural entities 100% objectively exist. Period. (So does their boss but that's more something to take on faith.) Not only have pretty much all societies and faiths believed this in addition to my own but I've encountered them in a clinical setting—though I have seen what you might call "possession" very rarely, a small, small number (count on one hand) in thousands of patients, plain old psychiatric illness is usually the situation—as well as in the drug world, and heard enough corroboration from other people in both settings (people don't like to talk about experiences with them in either, but get someone drunk enough...) They like to hang around people and areas where horrible stuff has happened. Most of all they like it when they are in various ways invited in. Sometimes drug use falls under this category. Ayahuasca ceremonies certainly might.

Another interesting Bible word is φαρμακεία, which shows up in the letter to the Galatians but twice in the Apocalypse, always in a very negative context. The traditional translation is "witchcraft, sorcery." If you can read the Greek alphabet you already can guess that our word "pharmacy" derives therefrom. Some of the less serious modern translations put in references to drug use. This is far too cute, but it may mean something like, idiomatically, "divination by potions." (Sounds like doing ayahuasca, doesn't it? Sometime ask me to tell you the cursed Peruvian amulet story.) It seems fairly clear it had a more general application, though, but it's interesting that drugs and sorcery had an intimate association back then.

Plus i still don't know much about she grew up so you never know if people have a traumatic past.
This is in my experience rather less relevant to having a good time in the psychedelic experience than people think, as long as people are protected from becoming overly introspective. If that is presented as the point of the experience though, boy howdy you'd better have some benzodiazepines on hand (which you haven't said if you do or don't, if you don't already you're irresponsible) or be some kind of professional therapist.

But im playing it quite safe with the doses i know these tabs and these dudes who i introduced to LSD in feb said their first trip was amazing but they took two tabs each next time for their second trip a couple weeks ago so 200 ug in total and were not prepared for the extreme increase in intensity. But now they got humbled and said yeah we should of listened to you it was a huge jump for them 100 ug to 200 ug. These dudes where doing nangs smoking weed on their first trip and handled it fine.

This LSD i have is top quality stuff so i do believe in it alot even on 200 ug they did not flip out or anything.
You should be very careful throwing around these numbers. I know I have said this before and you said you shit was tested but was it really tested enough times to be so blithe about throwing around these numbers. This is especially problematic when someone might be transitioning from or to a different batch with an advertised microgram strength. It's easy for people to make assumptions when doing this and they can wind up in real trouble. This could have even be the case in the situation you were referring to in addition to the fact that doubling the low dose is a big jump.

I have been weighing out all the things for weeks now and just making sure i truly weigh things up with outside perspective aswell [...] So far i made sure all the tracks i pick have no confusing lyrics or meanings. I.E avoiding anything that even remotely hints at emotional relationships, love etc. So far i am probably just going to play peaceful music and whatever she wants on the come up. But while peaking i will most likely just play super peaceful music that has no lyrics and not mind melting.
You are overpreparing for this which speaks to unresolved anxiety on your part. Think that over.

I have been punched in the face on LSD before by my best friend and i did not even react negatively at all i just accepted it got home and spent time riding through the peak then we laughed it off on the comedown smoked another joint and tripped heavy under the stars.
Don't expect it will work out this way for others. Especially smoking joints after having a bad time. You need to give people benzos. In fact instead of halving the dose from "100mcg" to "50mcg" (dude just say the number of hits and whether they are strong, it's close enough for government work, doesn't have the same potential for problems that I mentioned above, and seems less like boasting) maybe consider giving a full hit (n.b. "full hit" not "full dose") and preloading with a longer acting BZD. A dose that is too low but not a microdose can have its own problems with anxiety.

Its just risky introducing so many people over the time so far i have screened people quite well i reckon.
It's eventually going to happen especially as you've convinced yourself you know how to do it. I've said it three times so I've said it a hundred: benzos.
 
Unrelated, I'm watching Final Space on HBO Max right now and I have to say it is sort of awesome (if you like getting high and watching cartoons as I do.)
I would describe it like Rick n Morty crossed with Space Dandy crossed with Gaurdians of the Galaxy crossed with Bravest Warriors (if I had to...)
Worth a watch.

I've never met anyone who has seen Bravest Warriors. I haven't seen Final Space, but I can say, WATCH BRAVEST WARRIORS.
 
Yeah, having her close friend also around is the better idea. Having benzos at hand is also the sound thing to do with a first timer. I've never had to use them to calm myself, but i ALWAYS have benzos with me when I trip with people I haven't tripped with before, or suspect they haven't dosed as high before. Twice I had to use them, once with a close friend that on the comedown of a 4-AcO-DMT trip decided to smoke some weed just before leaving my house, and got stuck in a BAD loop. Apparently he forgot how to speak? That's what he reported was happening, on my end I just saw him lose his train of thought any time he tried to say something. I noticed he was becoming disfunctional and gave him 1 mg clotiazepam, worked like a charm. 15 minutes latter he was back on earth and an hour later he was ready to go.

The second time was with my girlfriend, back when we were still in the process of knowing each other. She had tripped before many times, but never taken a high dose of any psychedelic. We had been dating a couple of months and then spent a new years eve camping in a particularly breathtaking place lost in the Andes. We took 150 ug of ETH-LAD there, and it was too much for her. She had what I can only call a panic attack. If it wasn't for the benzos it would have ended badly. It still was a pretty tough experience for her, though. So now I know benzos are a must, even if I don't plan to use them, having them around just seem like good harm reduction practice.
 
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