Can't you just overdose and have an overdose experience? Or does a big enough overdose automatically cause an ego-death?
If you drink alcohol until you have no sense of self are you having an ego-death?
LSD dosage to achieve ego death
- Thread starter louisvillemusicman
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Can't you just overdose and have an overdose experience? Or does a big enough overdose automatically cause an ego-death?
If you drink alcohol until you have no sense of self are you having an ego-death?
ParappaTheRapper
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My opinion of ego death with LSD, is assuming 1 hit is 125 mcg, then 1 hit adds trippy effects to your normal thoughts and surroundings, while 2 hits brings you to a new place. Since the new place is the same place but you don't think it is, you have achieved ego loss, by feeling its different. Higher doses increase the effect in measurable intensity.
I always think its interesting to watch someone watch someone tripping, on say salvia, and interpret it as the physical actions and verbalization of a drug. but someone who has tripped knows the person is in the same place but not recognising it.
I view what most people describe as ego death, as the effects of dissocatives, where you seperate from your body. it also seems like a lot of people view ego death, in a literal way, such as disintegrating. I tend to view it in freuds terms though. Ego being what you do everyday at work, and superego (your trip view) as the real you, your morals, and life experiences.
I always think its interesting to watch someone watch someone tripping, on say salvia, and interpret it as the physical actions and verbalization of a drug. but someone who has tripped knows the person is in the same place but not recognising it.
I view what most people describe as ego death, as the effects of dissocatives, where you seperate from your body. it also seems like a lot of people view ego death, in a literal way, such as disintegrating. I tend to view it in freuds terms though. Ego being what you do everyday at work, and superego (your trip view) as the real you, your morals, and life experiences.
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Livinginthealps
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Depends what you consider an overdose. I mean yes a big enough dose will automatically cause ego death. Often when ingesting a large enough dose the effects are pretty instantaneous. When we ingest large dosages, it can sometimes be accompanied with violent exorcist like vomiting. Once it comes up, you are pretty much pushed into ego dissolution. My lady often vomits once in extreme high dosages. I do as well. I do have friends who can hold down the energy a little better.But, i look at it positive as I am purging my self before I enter an egoless state. You litterally feel your sense of "I" slip away from your grasp until it is no more.
No , when you drink alcohol you don't experience ego death. When you drink alcohol you are most definitely still in possession of an ego. (drunks generally have inflated egos at the time) You may be slurring your words, in black out mode. But, you still have a sense of self and you can still make the distinction between mind and body.
'medicine cabinet'
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sounds terrifying if youre not ready for it.
Livinginthealps
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Ego-death has been around to describe a psychedelic phenomenon for a long time. Since the early 60's with the publication of a few books. If you are denying ego death then you haven't experienced a truly beautiful thing. Let alone experience what psychedelics have to offer....
Absolutely is a TERRIFYING experience for one that is unaware and can't let go. You have to submit to the experience or it will break you. After all this is one big reason why psychedelic therapy can work. As often the ego gets in the way of the patient solving their issues. Well psychedelics are a great tool to break down the ego.
I have been witness to a few unexpected trippers who were very unsure how to handle it. In that situation, if we weren't there to talk them down (which is easy if you experienced what they are going through) they certainly could get arrested/hurt. It is just a lot of uncertainty, for the unexpected tripper, when going through the push into full ego dissolution. But, once one is ready there it is the most beautiful experience.
Ya ok bro now you really tripping. I already posted 25 times on here I have had this experience hundreds of times. We just never got caught up in catchy slogans and hey man lets go for ego DEATH tonight lol. Sounds a bit over dramatic to me but do you. Timothy Leary would be proud of my experiments I'll leave you to fly to mars now teeheeee.
Livinginthealps
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Thats cool. I am sorry for the accusation. The way you said it made me think you thought it was a new term. I don't think anyone goes lets go get ego deathed lmao
hah
But, it is the term commonly used to describe the phenomenon and has been used for a long time in books, research and discussions. . As these experiences can be very hard to get to words sometimes. No, I don't think ego death is a over dramatic phrase to explain it. As that is definitely the best way to describe it! How else would you describe the phenomenon of complete ego dissolution resulting in the user to often feel like "they" died and eventually reborn. That's been the term since dr's started studying it publicly.
It really does makes sense to me as I have been thru some outter body experiences. We never had online or much research before dosing but it would have answered a few questions. Most of my ego death was unplanned so when it catches you off guard, woweee talk about loss of the I an I. Back then you really had no idea what you were taking and obscene doses was standard practice. That was part of the fun and horrors of it. Now it seems like you guys have more control of how much your taking and info on it so thats good.
Livinginthealps
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^ yup big doses were normal so 1-2 hits and your out there! That is also what helped drive a negative attention to LSD. As many people that used it probably, should of been taking much smaller dosages. But, yes I agree the lack of internet meant most people would have no idea what "ego death" is unless they were involved with Alpert, metzner, leary etc.
So that means lot's of people had this unexplainable experience where their ego's dissolved and often times scary/ Especially, if you don't know what is happening/about to happen.
So that means lot's of people had this unexplainable experience where their ego's dissolved and often times scary/ Especially, if you don't know what is happening/about to happen.
Its funny how the 90s saw the most usage ever with limited knowledge or care about the effects. Just take it! In the 70s people had no clue but it was a smaller population using compared to the 90s. People party hardy back then. 1-2 hits was like a weds night lol. Part of the problem people were taking it 4-5 days a week so it started to not work. You really need to space it out by weeks to get maximum effect without taking 15 hits. Still the liquid was the ultimate. Give me that now and you probably see me on the news freakin out lol. If I was on an island somewhere I would do it again. Buggin in the city is no fun anymore for me.
The term ego-death does seem to be a source of great misunderstanding, IMO. Specifically, I get the feeling that some equate the term with the feeling of "one-ness", or connectedness of all things. Possibly because you really do tend to feel like you don't have an "ego" when you experience it, since you don't feel so much like an individual, but more like a mere part of a greater whole.
I always wondered if "the death of self" would be a better term.
I always wondered if "the death of self" would be a better term.
Livinginthealps
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Yup, I feel you buggin' in the city get's old haa. Been there, done that. I basically only eat LSD on my mountain property which is the way to do it. Go for a wander in vast acreage of nature. Better yet, it's my own. What city do you refer too?
I have to say I agree with you sayig you need to space out trips in order not to need massive amounts of paper. Though I will say, two days is enough in terms of tolerance but weeks is much better idea. I actually can eat LSD multiple days in a row with more or less of the same effects these days. I am not sure why. But, when I started eating lots of LSD I could not eat lets say 2 tabs monday then 2 tabs tuesday. I would have near zero effect tuesday. I would need to double it ideally, depending on the original dose. In this example, I could of probably got away with 3 tabs tuesday with near similar effects as the monday.
These days (past 4 or so years) I can often eat LSD two days in a row, same dosage and still be very high. Though, these days it is rare I eat LSD two days in a row ....My friends on the other hand... 8) I'm not sure how they eat so much L. Though, if I am at a wonderful festival I am more or less high 3/4 of the time. Every year that goes by, I am less able to pull that off. I think through years of decreasing my drug intake my body is just relaying the message to take it easy. After my surgeries it tends to really effect my body. Though, not directly related to the drug more what I do while on the drugs.
It is a very known phenomenon and there is LOT's of information out there so I am not sure misunderstanding is the right word. Maybe, for some people who haven't experienced it first hand.
I don't think your really getting the full point of ego death. It is complete loss of your ego. As in you have no idea what "I" is.
Complete separation from the mind and body.
There is no differentiating between things, everything is one.
One consciousness completely separated from your senses.
You loose everything material. It is not that you feel as if you don't have an ego... That wouldn't be ego death since you still have a conscious idea of yourself. That's half way to ego death but, not there yet. Ego death is an unmistakable experience. The first time it happens is often one of the most life shattering experiences ever. Completely washes away everything you think you know. That is why for an unsuspecting user it can be VERY terrifying and lead to being scared away from psychedelics. When that happens often the user needs some time (weeks, months, years) to process what happened as it really leaves an impact.
"Death of self" does not make sense really... well I guess that means ego death in a way but, without really describing what is dying. "death of self" sounds like your actually dying. Ego death means exactly what is written. Your ego is dead, gone, no more.
I think the biggest misunderstanding is sometimes users think they experienced ego death when in reality they have a sense of self. Lower doses of psychedelics can make you ignore your ego somewhat and that is one reason why psychedelics are great. But, that is not ego death because often the user will know exactly who they are and the people around them. Ego death is inevitable at some dosage.
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GreenMachine
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some say you can get ego death off of even low dose trips, its all set and setting. i can kind of buy into the idea that through the right kind of preparation and guidance through the trip you could get there without eating whole tenstrips.
i think the "ego-death" is a super loaded term, the ego doesnt die, it dissolves. anyways the only time my ego became completely dissolved, as in "I" didnt exist anymore for a prolonged amount of time, i didnt need huge amounts of LSD. if i wrote up an erowid report i would list it as LSD--repeated. from what i remember i dosed up about four hits of decent WoW, then someone apparently dosed me with another of liquid, then i believe i had about two more over the course of the night. however what kicked me over the edge was a good MDMA/MDA roll and a fat line of ketamine.
"I" didnt come back for hours, and when i did, only enough of me was there to vaguely remember my name and that i am a human. hell of a fucking trip, i got owned. woke up the next morning feeling great though, but not necessarily a very fun experience
but my advice is that if you REALLY feel like you want to obliterate your ego in a serious way just eat a whole strip. make sure you have sitter and all the normal set and setting stuff are straightened out of course.
EDIT: you may want to try something like a breakthrough DMT trip or a K-hole level ketamine experience to know what exactly you are getting yourself into with the whole "ego death" thing
i think the "ego-death" is a super loaded term, the ego doesnt die, it dissolves. anyways the only time my ego became completely dissolved, as in "I" didnt exist anymore for a prolonged amount of time, i didnt need huge amounts of LSD. if i wrote up an erowid report i would list it as LSD--repeated. from what i remember i dosed up about four hits of decent WoW, then someone apparently dosed me with another of liquid, then i believe i had about two more over the course of the night. however what kicked me over the edge was a good MDMA/MDA roll and a fat line of ketamine.
"I" didnt come back for hours, and when i did, only enough of me was there to vaguely remember my name and that i am a human. hell of a fucking trip, i got owned. woke up the next morning feeling great though, but not necessarily a very fun experience
but my advice is that if you REALLY feel like you want to obliterate your ego in a serious way just eat a whole strip. make sure you have sitter and all the normal set and setting stuff are straightened out of course.
EDIT: you may want to try something like a breakthrough DMT trip or a K-hole level ketamine experience to know what exactly you are getting yourself into with the whole "ego death" thing
Livinginthealps
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^ yes you can absolutely achieve full ego dissolution from low doses. Though, probably not unless you experienced ego death many times. I achieve it through meditation during a low dose trip and can with many other psychedelics too. Meditation is a great tool as well.
ParappaTheRapper
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^This.
The more stubborn you are the harder it is to break down your ego. It would make sense to experience an ego death as a a rebirth or disintegration to a stubborn person in my opinion. If you experience a trip as an intentional opening up, its more impossible.
I think its important to not let the ego become too soft or malleable though. This makes it harder to be proactive in life. It also makes you less sensitive or responsive to most things. An lsd trip in effect lists can be compared to self psychological abuse such as gaslighting in many ways.
The more stubborn you are the harder it is to break down your ego. It would make sense to experience an ego death as a a rebirth or disintegration to a stubborn person in my opinion. If you experience a trip as an intentional opening up, its more impossible.
I think its important to not let the ego become too soft or malleable though. This makes it harder to be proactive in life. It also makes you less sensitive or responsive to most things. An lsd trip in effect lists can be compared to self psychological abuse such as gaslighting in many ways.
dan k
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i have forgotten who i was, where i was, what i was, that i had taken a drug for some period of time only twice on lsd, the first time at 2mgs, and then recently around 250ug. the latter was only for less than 5 mins or so but i was running around screaming at people that they where all dying(so i was told).
it is much easier and safer to reach ego death on dmt or ketamine, and if youre seriously trying its hard not to...
it is much easier and safer to reach ego death on dmt or ketamine, and if youre seriously trying its hard not to...
The problem with the term ego-death is that the term "ego" itself is loaded with several meanings. The original meaning is pretty much equivalent to "self", however, we also say that someone has a big ego, or that your ego is getting in the way of you achieving humility, etc...
I can see how someone would then mistake the experience of cosmic unity, that you can have on psychedelics, for ego-death, because you really do feel like all the emotional baggage of being "you" (i.e. your "ego") simply vanishes at that moment.
"Death of self" is a lot less susceptible to misinterpretation. Death of self happens if you have no concept of "I". It's not a pleasant experience - it feels like you are about to die, because most of us, I feel, are not familiar with any concept for "ceasing to exist" other than death.