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LSD dosage to achieve ego death

I dunno if I'm that singular. One of the standard definitions of a psychedelic drug is that you're aware you've taken a drug. If you arn't they usually call that a deleriant instead. Have you really lost all sense of your self to the extent that a tramp could walk in, pull your trousers down and have sex with you and you wouldn't notice?

Seeing as everyones idea of what "ego-death" means is different I think many people just confuse "ego-death" with "being high on a psychedelic drug".
 
Ismene said:
Have you really lost all sense of your self to the extent that a tramp could walk in, pull your trousers down and have sex with you and you wouldn't notice?
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No, in the same way that someone who is meditating is likely not to let someone repeatedly stab them. Don't be ridiculous.



trying to put a definition on a trip is laughable as well, each one is varying. On DMT the last thing I was thinking was "I'm on a drug right now!"
 
For me, LSD is not a drug that I take to achieve ego death. 5 grams of mushrooms laying down on a couch in a dimly lit room will get you "there" no problem. I took 5 hits of some seriously strong white on white last summer and found myself wandering around Chicago confused as fuck. Not pleasant, although I definitely had no idea who I was. I just think L last a bit too strong to take such a high dose.

To answer your question, though, I'd say 500ug of some quality LSD is what you're looking for. Do a thumbprint and get back to us.
 
Ismene said:
I dunno if I'm that singular. One of the standard definitions of a psychedelic drug is that you're aware you've taken a drug. If you arn't they usually call that a deleriant instead. Have you really lost all sense of your self to the extent that a tramp could walk in, pull your trousers down and have sex with you and you wouldn't notice?

Seeing as everyones idea of what "ego-death" means is different I think many people just confuse "ego-death" with "being high on a psychedelic drug".
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What is this guy talking about?
 
Oh, and as far as the original question goes, I've had full on immersion from as little as 50ug of LSD. 40mg of ketamine is what really kicked it in, but this was much more than a K hole... the world dissolving around me into fractals until there was nothing but an abyss and pure existence, no thought other than just being there.. in that moment. Priceless.
 
Folley said:
No, in the same way that someone who is meditating is likely not to let someone repeatedly stab them. Don't be ridiculous.
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Then by definition you havn't "lost all sense of self". Think about it.

On DMT the last thing I was thinking was "I'm on a drug right now!"

But the point is you would have realised you were on a drug - again this is proof positive you havn't lost "all sense of self".

chitown rollin said:
For me, LSD is not a drug that I take to achieve ego death. 5 grams of mushrooms laying down on a couch in a dimly lit room will get you "there" no problem.
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Nah, you're talking out the back of your arse there chitown. I've taken 3 times that dose of mushrooms and never had an "ego death". Can you define what you mean by "having an ego death"? Or is it just the feeling you get when you can't handle your high on a big dose?
 
Ismene said:
Then by definition you havn't "lost all sense of self". Think about it.

On DMT the last thing I was thinking was "I'm on a drug right now!"

But the point is you would have realised you were on a drug - again this is proof positive you havn't lost "all sense of self".



Nah, you're talking out the back of your arse there chitown. I've taken 3 times that dose of mushrooms and never had an "ego death". Can you define what you mean by "having an ego death"? Or is it just the feeling you get when you can't handle your high on a big dose?
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I guess Terrence McKenna is "talking out of his arse", as well then?
 
Oh man people are still trippin afterall. When I was in high school to college 1990-1999 they are saying that generation took the most lsd over any other thus far. Even more than the 60s and 70s. Most of these numbers are because the population in now 10 times bigger but for some reason my generation went in deep on the lsd. Deeper than any other and I can testify to that. My worst trip was when I took 4 hits, waited 2 hours and it felt soo weak so of corse I took 4 more. Then 2 more hours go by and now I buggin hardbody. My shirt is like made out of water and everything looking weird. I just entered a diff dimention for 16 hours lol. The best trip I had was on liquid lsd and I over squeaze the dropper on purpose and got 8 times what I paid for. That was a great experience and very long lasting. I decided to end it there on a good trip, my best. Shrooms were ok but usually made me sick. I can't even put a number or the amount of times I tripped but remember alot of crazy nights. Have fun and be careful.
 
Ismene said:
I dunno if I'm that singular. One of the standard definitions of a psychedelic drug is that you're aware you've taken a drug. If you arn't they usually call that a deleriant instead. Have you really lost all sense of your self to the extent that a tramp could walk in, pull your trousers down and have sex with you and you wouldn't notice?

Seeing as everyones idea of what "ego-death" means is different I think many people just confuse "ego-death" with "being high on a psychedelic drug".
Click to expand...
Ego death really means one thing. Dissolution of the users ego, aka loosing all sense of self. Separation of the mind from body in the simplest description.

Yes, on high doses of psychedelics I have zero sense of self (once you reach the point of no return generally starting around the peak) . You don't know you are on drugs if your experiencing ego death. You don't know who "you" are. You are everything and nothing at the same time. Complete ego dissolution.
On high enough dosages there really is no fighting it. Doing so generally, will lead to a very difficult experience. Although, at some point in the experience you have NO choice but, to "let go" and float down the river so to say.

If a new psychedelic user doesn't know what the sensation of ego death is, it can become very very scary experience. Especially, due to the fact the user generally feels as if they are dying. This sensation of death is VERY real. There is no shrugging it off when you reach that time. You need to make peace and give in. Experiencing a so called near death experience often shatters egotistical values.

There are a lot of sensations that you feel when you are approaching this "level" and by truly understanding them can make the experience life changing. The book the psychedelic experience based on the book of the dead, and makes much sense of these sensations. These sensations are present even at low dosages. Once you are aware of these feelings you can let go and experience full dissolution at lower dosages.

The first time you are forced into ego death, It is then when you completely let go your ego will shatter. Ego death is a very appropriate term for the phenomenon we are discussing. Especially, since the experience generally leads the user to feel as if they died and were re-born. The re-born part generally has to do with the user, "re-learning" who they are. As your ego starts coming back, you start grasping certain identifiers that your still alive. Such as hearing your breath, feel your body, know your name etc. It is truly the most magical experience and I can say with certainty, I would not be who I am today with out experiencing this phenomenon. This is truly a life changing experience and is what helps terminal patients make peace with death. Often, after the experience on realizes death is not the end.
 
Livinginthealps said:
Yes, on high doses of psychedelics I have zero sense of self (once you reach the point of no return generally starting around the peak) . You don't know you are on drugs if your experiencing ego death. You don't know who "you" are. You are everything and nothing at the same time. Complete ego dissolution.
On high enough dosages there really is no fighting it.
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I dunno - I've taken incredibly high doses and always realised I was tripping. That's the beauty of psychedelics for me. I can't see any enjoyment in being totally bewildered as to what's happening to you and not understanding you're on a drug. If I wanted an experience like that I'd take a heavy dose of datura, not a psychedelic.
 
^ there are no words to describe the beauty of this experience. You may love psychedelic because you are under "control" and are fully aware of what is going on around you. But, there is SO much more to the vast universe of psychedelics.
What are your so called "incredibly high dosages">? If your dosages were that high chances are you were fighting ego death the entire time. But, it it easier typed then done lol. There really is no fighting it once the dose is high enough.
It is bound to happen and at the right dose there is NOTHING you can do but "float down the river." It's not like your going to take 100 ug and be thrown into complete ego dissolution.

As for the experience, it is these ego death experiences that aid people really find meaning to their existence. The experience, is certainly not for everyone. I mean being presented with ego death with that attitude would be sure to slap you around a bit. I have a close friend who took 4 years+ off of all psychedelics due to being forced into ego dissolution without being prepared. He thought he could handle a large dose (1mg) due to previous experiences with somewhat high dosages. Well it was in a setting where 100's of psychedelic experiences went down so that was not the issue. It happened to be filmed for a little bit due to a reason I won't get into right now. He wouldn't watch the video for years. He though he was a child stuck in a horrible loop the entire experience. He believed nothing he did or said was making any sense. He fought it with all his might. But, LSD is always stronger. It really slapped him around. A 8 hour loop is no fun especially, when your convinced your dying.
The biggest issue is/was the sensations that come right before ego death. There aren't really any effective words to describe these sensations. But, to a user who doesn't understand what is going on in that moment right before everything dissolves into nothing, it can truly be a very terrifying experience. That is why I suggest anyone interested in experiencing this should read the psychedelic experience by , metzner, alpert, leary. It really makes sense of everything. Especially, the sensations you feel.

Well, the experience shook him up and left him visably distraught for a long time. Eventually, I got down to the bottom of it with him. He later read the book I left him and he made sense of everything. It allowed him to acknowledge the sensations he was feeling and help explain them to him.
He now uses psychedelics again and now FULLY respects them. The point of the story is to kind of explain what happens when you fight a certain ego death.
Ego death was something that just happened to me, I didn't know what was going on the first time. I never read about it before I experienced it the first time. I was convinced I was dying, but still was able to acknowledge the more I fought this certain death, the harder these sensations fought back. I had nothing left to do by close my eyes and float down the river. Well what happened next was the most magical thing ever. Complete and utter peace, unity , I was everything but, yet I was nothing.
You will never have such an experience on datura.
 
Ismene said:
I dunno - I've taken incredibly high doses and always realised I was tripping. That's the beauty of psychedelics for me. I can't see any enjoyment in being totally bewildered as to what's happening to you and not understanding you're on a drug. If I wanted an experience like that I'd take a heavy dose of datura, not a psychedelic.
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Usually the higher doses keep you from getting to those kind of states. There is too much going on in the outside world for you to focus on what's inside. That's what differentiates a ++++ or "ego death" from just "tripping balls", just as "making love" can be different from "having sex"
 
I def achieved ego dissolution soo many times I can't count. Thats the whole point of taking it right? Back then we just called it peaking and hopefully a nice hippie chick was there to calm you down. I've seen some epic meltdowns and blackouts that were scary. Dog ate ounce of shrooms once. One time I was in the hospital getting stitches late night after huge skateboard crash. We saw this little chick get wheeled in strapped down screaming in tongues. She was like having an outter body excorcist moment lol. The whole hospital bed she strapped to was lifting off the ground. She was going buck and probably 95 lbs 5' 2" chick. The cops were terrified, she probably beat them up before getting her on the bed and strapped. People are unpredictable when they hit that peak, specially if mixing which they usually are.
 
Folley said:
Usually the higher doses keep you from getting to those kind of states.
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This is the problem Folley - you're saying high doses stop you having an "ego death" whilst Livinginthealps is saying if you take a high dose you're fighting ego death the whole time. How can you be talking about the same thing when you're so far apart?
 
We are most likely discussing different dosages and experiences. Yes, I can relate to Folley when they say sometimes high doses can make it harder to reach those states. But, there becomes a time when ego dissolution is inevitable.
 
^ Yeah, at around 500ug I find it almost harder to concentrate to anything meaningful, yet near the 1mg mark and there's really not much you can possibly do but sit back and watch the universe unfold around you. Yet even then, when I've seen angels appear before my eyes... I didn't feel as if it was "ego death", just an EXTREMELY intense experience. I was still watching thing happen in this world, it's not really until your third eye opens and the world around you slips away that you truly enter these states.


Of course, this is always going to be personal. Trips vary for even the same person, so obviously there will be enormous differences between different people. IMO though a good way to look at ego death is how ketamine effects people. I believe that same kind of disconnect of mind from body can be achieved with psychedelics, but it is much more fragile and harder to find.
 
I got ego deathed on 5 hits on the weekend.. they were ridiculously strong hits though.. probably around 200 mics each at least cause it was stronger than even taking 10 liquid that i did a couple years back
 
Its impossible to measure lsd effects over a general spectrum. What floors one person only buzz another just like anything else. From my experience you can usually tell before dosing who is going to have a great time and who is heading for the buggout zone. I not sure if many people want to push the limits of lsd and the ego death you reffer to. Taking such high doses in a long committment. People have taken 100 hits and trip for a month- delltron 3000 for example. If I really wanted to scare the crap out if myself would find peyote or dmt. Dmt is the one thing I never tried but heard its way more intense but short acting.
 
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