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Alcoholism Thread v. A sober life is a good life <3

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Eight days and counting.

Ive been feeling good despite the head cold and cough I picked up this week. Was at a social gathering the other night and I managed to stay sober, which is quite the change for me. Seeing people drinking gave me some cravings at times but Im glad I didnt give in to them. I'm very pleased with myself right now, as is my family. It's great not having to wake up feeling hungover. Or explain the things I had done in my alcohol induced stupor.
 
bignbrown said:
Im really worried about myself, im 18 and im just coming off benzos, have serious anxiety issues and drink heavily, ive been a heavy drinker for a few months, never even considered myself to be at an alcoholics level or anything, but this weekend i have drank every day and alot, and it got to the point where i stole some money for drink, considered stealing wine from the local 247 at 9ish in the morning, and even got drunk around 9:30 this morning, sobered up now sitting here at 2:30 am and ive had 2 beers and about a glass and a half of wine (and yes not my alcohol, my dads), i feel terrible, my drug usage has got out of control and now drinking is becoming a big factor and i dont know what to do, ill probably be able to get a few hours sleep after these drinks but will wake up shaking, i even had stomach pains this morning that the drink tonight got rid off.

Any advice or anything, i just dont know what the fuck to do with myself anymore, i even lost a good mate this weekend by telling his parents he did heroin with me whilst drunk, and i feel like a scumbag completely and deserve any criticism, but im just looking for advice really.

I have some pregablin coming soon which im hoping in low doses will help with any wds and cravings but still im lost completely.

thank you to anyone that can give me any advice.
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L-theanine(Suntheanine) really helps me for the anxiety. about 400mgs does it for me.
And valerian to calm your brain down. 0.8 Valernic acids(standardized).
 
Thanks man <3
Feeling better now, although hungover. I've been really really bad with drinking the last 2 weeks. It just escalates so steathily that I don't even realise I'm drinking that much until it's completely out of control. I have to not drink tonight but I can't trust myself that it will actually happen :|
 
One thing again about alcoholism versus sober life. I get anger once a while. I've seen way enough people about my age who lacks education or done education lousy way. There's nothing else than fucking social figures with alcohol, and occasional dopes those people. It's that some people are SO damn hyppocrite and stupid, from one single happening is AGAIN whole analyses done.

Repeating some fucking phrase as 13 year old, and/or pretending being deep, deep philosophic mind character. The only problem is that why loose nerves with any. Those/these people have nothing else than, as example, first it's dope condemnation. Then trying themselves and getting another complication which is try fuck others mind to feel at least little bit themselves.

There is non-single reason to think, it's serious if (most people really don't care a shit of any fucking things) only if some authorities, cops, social workers (if need) or any other position/office has wrong profile, or too detailed profile.

That mid-drop / drop-out people as me should see with what kind of people to hang out. Really it's called snobbism including severely ignorant profile what to suffer and most themselves have mental characterisation, also from psychiatric disgnoses lacking, that severe that, they lack normal thinking patterns of normal life, pretending being SOO authentic.

I say it to all who know same, it's wrong people again, ehh? Try be and behave as adult if nearby people are idiots. Hey, i have a point! Don't care a shit and after being talked with some super-characterised decider-me-fool goto pizza. I stay away all possible shitpans, i should have educated myself and stay away from the-soo-much-freedom-spirit personas.

This thing: :!, for any reason, especially in winter, why should? No reasons. Even more clear explanation, don't drink if bitter feeling, try to get out of it some better way as avoiding completely. It's different aspect if something meaningfull or important, not some autistic sukker try play mind games. To get a damn sober clean mind, try figure realistic values of society, social life and what the fuck is something to avoid.
 
Drink has fucked me up like no other drug has, I've done, said things that i wouldn't dream of saying/doing when sober. I also get aggressive sometimes after drinking, I was on Antabuse which i stopped taking because i wanted to drink. It's a love/hate r/ship i have with booze but It has got me through some hard times and as we speak I'm drinking Cider.
 
To be honest, I'm not even sure what to think anymore. I always end up drinking way passed the party has ended, and to be honest, I love drinking. At age 16 this shouldn't be the case, and I realize that, but during the summer everything seems to fall into place. I do MDMA every 3 months or so, have only done it once this summer (it's my DOC) but I've done shrooms 3 times this summer and have smoked and drank every day this summer. I got drunk as fuck today. I still don't think I'm an alcoholic, but I find myself doing Irish Carbombs every once and while *just* to keep a buzz going. I'm not sure really what's forcing me to do this, but I hope it stops as soon as school starts.
 
^ Look after yurself mate, you're so young! I'm 25 now and used to do MDMA way to much when I was younger. Prolly last did e around 3 years ago. I'm always the one that keeps drinking and drinking "after the party is over" too :/

Right now i'm drinking again due to bad benzo cravings, arrgg, can't stand it.
 
n3ophy7e said:
Thanks man <3
Feeling better now, although hungover. I've been really really bad with drinking the last 2 weeks. It just escalates so steathily that I don't even realise I'm drinking that much until it's completely out of control. I have to not drink tonight but I can't trust myself that it will actually happen :|
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you can stop! seriously n3o.

i've quit about seven weeks right now. lots of anxiety and life just drones on much of the time; other times its overwhelming with umm----good stuff :p
 
I have strongly decided not to ruin myself with alcohol. My personal disorder comes too strong from binge drinking. Even i decided to quit, i now after 1800mg DXM trip needed, totally needed to pick 12 beer-pack. My old pain problem became noticeable. I only took 1 beer and now i'm gonna drink the rest anyway. But not any more then. It's just that i unsure how long lifespan i have and want to at least, try to live fun and good still i can.

My problems are deep and i'm usually with wrong people. This is cool place. I got relieved bacause eaten well, but i had to buy beer. Now there was a few line that sounded as drinking boasting but i was completely confused then. That to say to voxmystic and enki too. Some-one probably would want to be at least a week without and see how much clearer everything feels when can think straigh without all being delirious and thoughts twisted.
 
I'm not an alcoholic, but I have seen people struggle with alcoholism, and it took me a very long while to recover from heroin addiction.

My #1 protip to everyone here is; don't beat yourself up if you slip up here and there. Life isn't easy, and no one is perfect. I noticed the more I would get down on myself, the more I would feel like the only thing I could do to relieve the stress/shame is to use again.

Everyone here is a fighter, and you all deserve a round of applause, especially N3o for being one of the best Smods EVER!

Secondly, it takes a lot of guts and will power to say "I'm not going to do this because I know I am strong enough, and this is what I want for myself". Even if right after you do this, and you slip up again (I know I did countless times trying to quit cold turkey...and miserably failing within days of trying... :(), just pick yourself right back up and try again because you ARE worth it!

I think the feeling of worthlessness had definitely set in for me with my addiction, and that kept me in a downward spiral for a while.

I don't mean to relate my experiences to everyone here like they will inevitably have to go through the same things I did, I just hope that my experiences can help someone in the here and now, or if not, someone later on who visits and reads this post.

Stay strong guys!
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^^^

The whole blanket experience being so often so similar, minus our individual nuances and subjective tweaks, always was fascinating to myself.

I'd like to add

Protip #2: Don't replace your vices. After a few strong years of opioid use, primarily the harder ones, getting off of them was made simpler by taking up an ethanol and benzodiazapine. Now, having worked through the both classes, it was substituting what for me was a minor inconvenience to something that almost caused brain damage to quit.

A few days back in, feels good to be able to read fiction again without having to restart every paragraph.
 
nudemonkei said:
^^^

The whole blanket experience being so often so similar, minus our individual nuances and subjective tweaks, always was fascinating to myself.

I'd like to add

Protip #2: Don't replace your vices. After a few strong years of opioid use, primarily the harder ones, getting off of them was made simpler by taking up an ethanol and benzodiazapine. Now, having worked through the both classes, it was substituting what for me was a minor inconvenience to something that almost caused brain damage to quit.

A few days back in, feels good to be able to read fiction again without having to restart every paragraph.
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I have always had conflict over such advice, though I do believe that yours is founded on good logic.

I think that replacing your vices can be done in one of two ways. Some people will argue both ways are bad, but hear me out.

By replacing your vice, and assuming all drugs have a unique addictive potential (which obviously varies due to the individual - which is why there are no clear cut rules in terms of addiction recovery for all people), there is "trading up" and "trading down" for replacing a vice. Switching from alcohol habit, to a chocolate habit, is probably a really good move. Even if you gain 10 pounds from chocolate. Obviously some people wouldn't like that, but still, chocolate is much safer.

Another version of trading down would be to accept you are going to be psychologically dependent, but trade it down for a different psychological dependency without a physical one (for example, switching a heroin habit for a weed habit; yeah you can blow a lot of money on either one, but weed won't leave you in a state of utter hell after you wake up the next morning like heroin will).

So, by all means, if you can trade drinking for something that is less neurotoxic, or something that isn't physically addictive, I would do so. However... that's not to say it will solve your problems, and it may only create new ones. Hence, why everyone's different, and not all "methods" of recovery work for all people.

While you can argue that "trading vices" for a more addictive drug just because it's cheaper or more available is definitely not a good idea, and you may argue that trading vices in principle is still not a solution to the problem (which you are allowed to believe - I just don't buy into it), what I mean to specifically highlight by discussing this so in-depth is examples like ORT medications, like Suboxone and Methadone.

I don't believe I could have quit using heroin successfully without Suboxone. I don't consider it "trading vices". I mean, yeah, if you were to take an in-depth look at me using heroin, and me using Suboxone now a days, you are going to probably criticize me, a lot, and I probably would too if I were trying to make your point.

However, there is just a huge difference in my opinion. Buprenorphine is a partial agonist opiate, and it has a ceiling effect (most opiates of abuse, i.e. heroin, morphine, oxycontin, etc., are full agonists, and do not have ceiling effects, codeine does but that's the only full agonist w/ a ceiling effect I can think of, off the top of my head). I would like to point this out, because this means that buprenorphine is less desirable/less full-on-euphoria when compared to full agonist opiates, and buprenorphine also doesn't have the same "more drug = more effects" sort of correlation that full agonist opiates have. Most drugs actually work that way, you get more effects with a higher dose. However, buprenorphine is quite different, and I don't care to get into a much longer explanation into this.

In summation, I have managed to comfortably taper with buprenorphine down to using a very minute fraction of what I began on (for ORT, btw if you don't know, ORT = opiate replacement therapy). I know for a fact this would have *never* happened with me and heroin. Some people with nerves of steel can taper down with heroin, but I was simply unable to. It's the only drug I have ever had such an addictive pull towards, and the pull was so strong I was unable to do anything but give in.

Suboxone has been nothing like that for me. Additionally, I have heard a lot of people's stories regarding methadone that makes me aware that it is a good ORT standard for some patients (Suboxone doesn't work well for some people for a variety of reasons, people like my now passed friend FlyWithCloudNine was a good example).

I believe that being able to trade an all-consuming heroin addiction for an exceedingly successful taper with Suboxone, is definitely worth doing. Especially for people, like me, who tried so many times to give it up without ORT. I once got passed the physical withdrawals completely, and I still relapsed.

So, in summation (again, lol) - your pro tip IS good advice. I just don't consider ORT to be "trading vices" so to speak. :) (Oh, and an example of "replacement therapy", or at the very least, detoxification, for alcohol could be anything from a benzo, to a barbiturate, or other sedatives like propofol which actually show a lot of promise due to the resistance of building a tolerance to propofol over the first 1-2 days of detoxification.)

Sorry to pick hairs and everything too though seriously, but I just wanted to clarify. Some people in Other Drugs will talk down about ORT because they may not have tapered before cessating, for instance, and they still had to withdraw in a not-so-painless state. Or, maybe they were able to cold turkey but they see people who can't and choose ORT to help restore their lives as "weak". I disagree with this notion.

However your example was spot on; trading an opiates habit for GABAergics like alcohol and benzodiazepines habit (key word: habit) is definitely not worth it. Sorry to take up such a long rant!
 
Absolutely correct. When I originally mentioned our nuances and minor differences, yet shared overall blanket attributes shared with cessation of a substance, I meant more specifically that while I have had many folks i've known personally, including myself, try to substitute one substance for another they often resulted in trading one addiction for another.

In my personal experience, I went from heroin, to bupe, to alcohol. Alcohol was MUCH more difficult to jump from, so that jumped to benzodiazapine, (which had only been a problem in the past with near-death OD's that result from combining them with opioids), which jumped to benzos AND alcohol.

However, I've also seen friends attempt to QUIT drinking, and ultimately substituting that ADDICTION for an opiate addiction. She went from using small amounts of hydrocodone for ethanol WD's to a full-blown, gram-a-day heroin habit within a few months.

Trading vices was probably not the best way for me to word my intention, and sobriety causes me to use more words than necessary. But I think it's safe to say that trading one ADDICTION for another ADDICTION is almost always unwise ultimately.

Then again, that's just another nuance. I hope everyone is feeling as good as they can today!

EDIT: After re-reading your passage of Bupe and MMT, I agree even more. Personally, I had no intention to quit using opiates after my last opiate overdose. However, the option aside from SOME sort of treatment was to be homeless for a while, so I began suboxone therapy. While I have tapered myself from the drug, the doctor continues to prescribe a slower taper. The main point here though is that I had ZERO intention of quitting heroin when I began the treatment.

Two months later, which was in early 2006, I went my first month not spent in an institution without heroin since the first bundle. Since then I have used strong opiates at most on four occurrences a year, which for anyone who has struggled with strong opiate addiction can understand as an accomplishment as close to being "clean" as possible without full abstinence. If GABA drugs that work as effectively as bupe come to common light one day, we would be very fortunate, although it seems the approach of treating alcoholics with a Valium prescription might not be the wisest course of action in many cases. I know my first and second-hand experience would validate this.
 
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Benzodiazepines aren't nearly as addictive as booze, thats total bullshit,you don't get the bodyload feeling with benzo's I'd rather drink than take benzo's cus half nthe time i feel fuck all from the benzo's
 
jungo87 said:
Benzodiazepines aren't nearly as addictive as booze
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Benzodiazepines are much more specific in their effects. Both benzos and alcohol can be range between merely inconvenient all the way to fatal. Individual differences in use and physiology are going to make for enough variation that placing them in a better or worse than hierarchy as far as withdrawal isn't all that useful.

If one wants to place benzos in the superior category I'd look more at benzos much more benign effects on overall health than alcohol's (organ damage etc). Withdrawal w/ both benzos and alcohol requires some respect.

I'm feeling a strong inclination to sober up a while. Its been too much for too long with alcohol.
 
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