My brain can't handle psychedelics!

[grafittibob]

I am going to agree with the other on this one. I think you are normal, but just that your experiences have gone wrong somehow.
Set and setting are two major keys, especially on psychedelics.
Going into the experience with the right mindset usually helps create a more positive trip.
Are you anxious beforehand? Are you stressed out?

The only thing that weirded me out was the weed part.
But then, judging from your posts, you don't seem to be a regular user.
Therefore your tolerance is low, thus making the effects more pronounced.
Maybe try breathing exercises before and during to calm yourself.

 

[Aporia]

To make this short and sweet-there is nothing wrong with your brain. You are experiencing what psych's can do to you...
Mushrooms very commonly cause confusion.
If you can't deal with it, it's no problem but trying to convince yourself that there is something wrong with your brain and trying to keep doing them without facing what is really going on with you (honesty is really a big deal with these substances) you could damage your psych.

 

[Flickering]

My set and setting for each trip...

DXM 125mg - Alone in my room, early in the morning. I was excited about having my first-ever experience with drugs. It was a let-down, of course - I just got dizzy and nauseous.

DXM 300mg - Alone in the my room, at night. I was in a bad mood after work and probably shouldn't have taken it. Nonetheless, it went well. By the time the effects kicked in, I'd put myself in a better mood. The rest of it was anti-depressive.

DXM 600mg - In my room, with a friend. I'd spent the whole day hiking out in nature. By the time my friend arrived, I was getting impatient, but mostly I was just eager to start. Wouldn't say I was in a bad mood. Room is always clean and comfortable before I start tripping.

Mushrooms 2g - In my room, alone but with a friend on standby outside (who unfortuantely went to bed when things started going bad). Once again I was excited to begin. The only thing I can think might have caused this to go bad is that I'd spent much of the day playing videogames.

Marijuana, 4 hits - At my house / in public, with two friends. Admittedly, I was not in the best mood. I'd taken a big san pedro cutting the day before and it had done nothing. This had really pissed me off, and that was why I spontaneously decided to smoke some pot, to get some mild psychedelic experience and to see what it was like. I was pretty chilled out as we smoked it. I had eaten a fair bit of sugar in the day to that point. I also followed each inhale down with calea zacatechichi, a dream herb tea. We went out in public briefly, which didn't concern me until I started getting the weird physical pseudo-hallucinations. I was a lot more comfortable when I got back to my room, because I knew the only thing I had to worry about was getting through this, but it was still very ugly.

Since everyone is so sure my experiences were standard-issue and simply unlucky, I'm going to experiment with very low doses of MDMA and 2cb if I can find it, after I've seen the neurologist (to be safe). The short duration and usually smooth ride make them ideal cautious choices. But if anyone knows someone who's had similar experiences, please still put them forward.

If you think about it, your perceptions of this world are a result of your brain interpreting signals, like a computer running a program that is essentially just 1's and 0's. If you mess with the signals by using psychedelics, your reality is affected. Reality is not concrete and I think you are realizing that. That's the fun in it IMO.

Yeah, that's a good description for how it felt each time. Like I was hyper-aware that my perceptions were just part of a program of sorts, and I no longer felt attached to the program. Reality certainly no longer felt concrete. But I can't convey how all-pervading and whacked this felt. It wouldn't have bothered me so much, as I've said, if I'd taken a much larger dose of something heavier. It's the low doses, and the consistent results, that concern me. But I suppose it's possible I'm just sensitive to weed and shrooms.

But that still doesn't explain the lack of hallucinations on DXM and shrooms? Or rather, that they suddenly cut out on the shrooms.

 

[TheAppleCore]

Well, first of all, take it slow. I think you're getting into these substances too deep, too fast.

Secondly, you can't necessarily chalk it up to a neurological disorder. Sometimes these painful experiences can be caused by subconscious concerns we have, or fears, or doubts. Try to ensure, before you trip, that you're content with yourself and your surroundings, and your life in general. Make sure you've been respecting your health, eating well, sleeping well, and exercising. Make sure you've been tending to all your responsibilities. No guilt for the past, or anxiety for the future.

 

[Aporia]

You'd be surprised at how the mind can fight off the experience. That is what it sounds like your mind has been doing. Even if you're not consciously aware that you are doing it you may have some preconceived notions about these substances and if you haven't confronted these fears you will experience the feelings/lack of trip that you were describing. The mind is a very powerful thing and it is not unheard of for it to fight the trip, which would cause confusing, panic, fear, lack of visuals, body load, especially body load because your body is now taking the brunt of the trip and not your mind.

 

[TheAppleCore]

Also, I'd highly recommend LSD as opposed to mushrooms for someone new to psychedelics.

 

[MrGrunge]

Well, first of all, take it slow. I think you're getting into these substances too deep, too fast.

This. I don't recommend anyone jump straight from second to third plateau DXM trips. If experiencing all a third plateau trip has to offer is enticing for you, then you must prepare yourself. I would say start at the 300 mg level and slowly work your way up in increments of 50 mg or so. Experience is the key mitigating factor in how well you'll be able to handle a trip, especially with DXM. Take it easy and don't psyche yourself out: there's nothing wrong with you.

 

[undisclosed]

.....after I've seen the neurologist (to be safe).
.

Do this if you feel you need to, if it helps put your mind at rest. But do you really think a neurologist is going to find something entirely different to your brain than everyone elses? Do you really expect him to find out such a thing when you're not even intending to be entirely honest about the reason you're seeing him?

Different situation/context but it reminds me of my ex. She'd go and ask people for advice on an issue but without being totally forthright and really giving them the whole story. She'd paint a picture for them that painted herself in a good light whilst leaving out all the "bad stuff" that she feared might make them think less of her or judge her. How the hell can you ask for advice but not be truthful about where some of the issues may lay? All you're going to get is what you want to hear, not the truth about the way the advisor see's the situation given knowledge of ALL the facts.

In my view, you have something buried in your subconcious that you are uncomfortable with, thats the reason your brain put it there. You need to know its OKAY for this to have happened, it's perfectly natural, it's a normal defence mechanism. When you trip and really "let go" have no fear of what you may face, you'll find that the secret(s) you hold can still remain entirely private, no-one else need ever know. But you will know and you can deal with your troubles from an entirely fresh perspective.

It's that insight you gain on psychedelics that is unique about this class of drugs. Discovering sides to yourself that you'd buried so deep, your concious mind didn't even know or barely acknowledged they existed. Once you find out what they are, they can be resolved.

But first, you must let go.... relax.... face your fear.... enjoy the ride, coz I PROMISE you will come out the other side a richer, more wise person. And for good measure, forget about just enjoying pretty patterns and beautiful colours. Yup, they're there, but you will also see some stuff that will scare the shit out of you and it's THAT stuff that you will ultimately learn the most from.

 

[DwayneHoover]

The mind battles mightily to avoid revealing things that it has worked hard to bury. The resulting "Obfuscation Maelstrom" [(C) DwayneHoover :D] can take a wide variety of forms as parts of you try desperately to distract consciousness from the looming psychedelic revelations whose big footsteps can begin to be felt approaching. Revelations about the shadow-play "reality projection" that the mind itself constructs from raw sensory input. Like the little man behind the curtain it is obsessed with maintaining its big illusion of what "reality" looks and feels like. You may get sick, go crazy, have an immobilizing attack of fear or depression, think you are dead, get hyper-paranoid, go unconscious, have inescapable thought loops, or just general mass confusion, any gambit is possible, its limits are only your own imagination. 8(

But in the end the successful tripper comes to realize that it's only you doing it to yourself. This is what you must discover.

 

[Flickering]

Hmm.

In each bad trip, I was absolutely convinced that something had gone wrong. It wasn't supposed to happen this way. My brain isn't reacting to it like everyone else's does. At the same time, I had this wry thought of "Yeah, sure, like you won't get high again two weeks from now and the same thing will happen." Well. I am desperate to use hallucinogens, because I believe they're the only thing powerful enough to help me get where I need to be. I get knocked down once, twice, three or four times? What does it matter, if I'm dedicated? The risk, though, is that I'm right, and I take it too far. Drop two tabs of acid and wake up gibbering in a mental ward six months later. But I've spent the morning reading bad trip reports on pot (instead of working), and a lot of people had far worse experiences than I did. Still, there are indicators that my bad experiences have been the result of some neurological dysfunction... I dunno... indecision.

So let's look at it from a psychological point of view. I have to admit that this is possible. I suffered some childhood trauma that had a deep effect on my adult life. I'm a sane, functioning human being, but I'm also in an unusual state of mind most of the time - very insular, introspective, nihilstic, existential and mildly anxious. Not to mention depressed. I feel emotionally detached from myself and others. I feel like my life is pointless and like I'm barely living it at all. I feel dissociated to the point of mild derealisation disorder. The universe feels solipsistic and hostile to me, and fundamentally, I wish I could be somewhere better and that I don't belong. End sob story.

Is it possible for both mushrooms and marijuana to bring all that stuff out in a flurry of insane thoughts and feelings about the universe not being real, about all existence being confined to my present (warped) emotional/physical experience? Of course. Granted I never knew weed could be that powerful, but it's possible. So okay. Thanks for all your help. I will approach with caution, again. I am abandoning my psychonautical principles (I had rules about how regularly I'm allowed to trip and on what substances etc.) because frankly, the suspense of waiting weeks at a time to see whether my mind can handle the drug or not is unbearable. I'm sick of putting myself through that, I'd rather know now, so by the end of the week, I'm going to find something light and take it.

 

[Flickering]

About the neurologist: my plan is to say I suspect I have a couple of disorders (and I do suspect that, though in my understanding they are typically psychological, not neurological) and I'd like to have an MRI scan or whatever would be appropriate. In reviewing the results, I bring up that one of the reason I suspect the disorder is neurological is because I've tried hallucinogenic drugs several times, and each time it led to a state of psychosis with few of the typical effects associated with each substance.

The problem is that if I say outright, "Tell me whether I can do drugs or not," the answer's going to be "no." Unless I just happen to meet a neurologist who's pro-drug, which isn't likely. I mean what are the chances of finding a guy who'd say, "Yeah, don't try weed again, but you should be okay with MDMA."

Also, I'd highly recommend LSD as opposed to mushrooms for someone new to psychedelics.

How about LSA?

 

[DwayneHoover]

You may by chance come across a doc who has no problem helping you figure out how to get off on psychedelics, but, um, ya know, like, good luck with that.

Most would probably just say "Maybe they're just not your thing. You ever hear the one about the guy who goes to his doctor and says doctor it hurts when I do this so the doctor says then dont do that?"

 

[MrGrunge]

How much experience do you have with psychedelics? If this is a sudden change from you normally being able to enjoy them, then maybe there would be enough of an argument to say that something might be off. But if you've felt like most of your psychedelic experiences have been "off", then chances are the only thing wrong is your perception of the events.

Personally, I think you're just over-reacting.

 

[Flickering]

You may by chance come across a doc who has no problem helping you figure out how to get off on psychedelics, but, um, ya know, like, good luck with that.

Yeah, exactly.

I was more hoping that the neurologist might go, "Ahh yes, see that seretonin deficiency in your hippocampus? [Or whatever, I don't know.] That's not normal. Drugs, you say? No, with a condition like this, you will only ever experience powerful delusions, and if you do enough of the wrong thing, it can tip you into schizophrenia." Or something. OR simply "No, I can see absolutely nothing wrong with your brain. Drugs, you say? Don't do drugs. Drugs are bad. M'kay?" Personally, I'd count the latter as a doctoral recommendation to keep using psychedelics.

But if you've felt like most of your psychedelic experiences have been "off", then chances are the only thing wrong is your perception of the events.

I've had five experiences total. One was mediocre, one was good, the rest were varying shades of fucked. I'll go ahead with my experimentation and doctor's advice plan, and see if I'm overreacting. Hopefully I am. These experiences can be, well, very convincing.

 

[MrGrunge]

I've had five experiences total. One was mediocre, one was good, the rest were varying shades of fucked. I'll go ahead with my experimentation and doctor's advice plan, and see if I'm overreacting. Hopefully I am. These experiences can be, well, very convincing.

I remember my first third plateau experience. I had only consumed LSD once before it, and done DXM only a couple times. During the trip, I was convinced that I was either going to go insane, or die. I thought "Man, so many people seem to think the third plateau is cool, but this is nothing but complete hell. Either I'm just not ready for it, or something has gone terribly wrong." After doing further research into the drug I learned that my experience was common. "Delusions" are a common theme of most psychedelic trips, the key is to ignore them, or at least view them with skepticism. They only become a problem when you take them to heart, and start altering your behavior accordingly.

By all means, go see a doctor (never anything wrong with that), just realize that everything you've described is simply a by-product of psychedelic experimentation. Sometimes you get good trips, some times you get bad ones. It took one of my friends nearly ten trips before he had one that he would describe as "good". He said that it took him awhile to acclimate to, and accept, the psychedelic mindset. Since then, all of his experiences have been positive.

EDIT: I just read your trip report on marijuana, and I gotta say, it sounds to me like you have a problem "fighting" the effects of the drugs. Having similar problems myself (and given your admission of 'childhood trauma'), it sounds to me like you have control issues...does that sound accurate at all? People with control issues have a hard time 'letting go' of their ego and just going along with things, not limited to, but including, drugs. I would suggest that your problems are entirely psychological rather than neurological. If you have issues that you haven't entirely resolved with yourself, I would urge you to see a psychologist rather than a neurologist, as problems that exist within the psyche are much harder to diagnose (and treat) than those that exist within the brain. If seeing a psychologist is out of the question, shoot me a PM and I can give you a few tips and strategies for overcoming certain anxieties and stress that occur with your drug use that worked very well for me.

 

[Flickering]

It took one of my friends nearly ten trips before he had one that he would describe as "good". He said that it took him awhile to acclimate to, and accept, the psychedelic mindset. Since then, all of his experiences have been positive.

Wow... that's dedication. One (experienced) friend told me he was amazed I was still going after two bad trips. I hope it doesn't take me ten tries.

But if it has to, so be it.

I'm trying to think what I can get and where in the next week. I can get...

MDMA, but it will be laced slightly with speed.
LSD, but that's fairly powerful and long.
San pedro, but that's even longer, and I really don't want to be trapped in a trip like the ones I've been having for an entire day and / or night.
Morning glory seeds, maybe but same problem as above.
Legal high ecstasy substitutes some shops sell around here, though I'm not sure how legit or safe they are.
DXM, of course, though I question how much I stand to gain by going near that stuff again.

 

[Jabberwocky]

I am sorry to bring this up again, for anyone who's followed it and found it annoying. The issue is that my brief career has been more than a little fucked. I have resigned myself to the prospect of probably never being able to use drugs again. I will have to resort to less powerful means such as lucid dreaming to achieve my goals. It's severely disappointing, but I want to consolidate, and to that end I'm putting this topic out there. Is there anyone who has had similar experiences, or knows someone who has? Does anyone know of a condition that might cause what I'm about to describe? I am going to see a neurologist about this, but until then I'm doing as much independent research as I can.

What makes it even more frustrating is that I've never heard of anything quite like this happening. As far as I know, I'm a unique case.

Here's how it went. My first two experiences with DXM went fine, exactly the way they were supposed to. The first was an allergy test, really, placing me in the first plateau. Nothing much happened. The second was a blissful plateau-two trip without hallucinations. I felt strongly inebriated and dissociated, but that was about the extent of it.

The third trip, however, went very badly. I took it to what was supposed to be the third plateau, and found myself in a state of mind so heavily spaced out, it was like seeing my life through a projection of a projection of a projection. Thought loops, major ego distortion, memory discontinuity, etc. All in all an absolutely awful night. When I woke next morning, I thought I'd imagined the whole thing, because it hadn't seemed real even while it was happening. And no hallucinations.

So okay, that's a typical enough bad DXM trip. I gave it some time, disavowed DXM use altogether, and eventually tried mushrooms. Two grams. First hour and a half was a normal psilocybin trip, nothing particularly intense, just very euphoric and beautiful. I got slight hallucinations during this 'good' period. Then once again, the trip took a nasty turn and I found myself in an indescribable state of psychosis. My thoughts turned to gibberish for several hours and I walked around my room in a state of extreme confusion. It was overwhelming and absolutely miserable. I awoke the next morning certain that my brain simply had not reacted to the drug as it was supposed to. And from the point where things got bad onward, there were no hallucinations.

Time passed and I talked myself back into it. It was just another bad trip. It was a potent species of mushroom. I've heard of pepole having experiences like that before. So I decided to smoke some weed. A light experience, almost nothing, I'd just laugh a bit and time would pass quickly. And when the time came, what happened? Nothing like that at all. I smoked four small hits, and ended up with a major distortion of the nervous system, unpleasant heavy sensations all across my body, feeling my tongue like it was in my nose, my chest like it was my stomach, etc. At the peak, I had to struggle not to slip into total insanity in my head. A dreamlike delirium, lunacy, it was a fight just to remember who and what I was. Nothing nearly as intense as the mushrooms. But still absolutely wrong.

Why did this happen? Why can't I use drugs? Is there anything that would explain this phenomenon? I'm so frustrated... I just wish it would work properly. Instead, every time I ingest something, it's a guaranteed ticket to an acute psychotic episode. And no hallucinations. What is wrong with my brain, for fuck's sake? I've been through the desert on a horse with no name, but the horse bucked. I've looked into experiences from people with mental conditions I might have - micropsia, depersonalisation disorder. No one describes anything like this. And considering how many other avenues I've taken to my goal, and how every one of them has fallen flat despite how they work for most people, I'm starting to think I'm simply cursed or something.

Again, anyone who knows of a condition like this, or knows someone with a similar adverse reaction, that's what I'm looking for... and please, don't tell me my experiences were normal; they weren't. Especially not on four hits of marijuana.

I am the same in terms of any psychadelic or dissasociative drug now sends me straight into a psychotic episode. I binged quite heavily on MDMA for a year or so before I got my first taste of some LSD. The LSD trip started ok but ended badly in what I can only describe as me babbeling like a lunatic, extreme paranoia, mind loops, and just like you, when these all started, the hallucinations ceased. Obviously these are all the symptoms of a bad trip and I dismissed them as just that and decided to try LSD again to get a better experience. Exact same thing happened to me and whilst all my friends giggled away, and got engaged in their fucked conversations, I paced around absolutely psychotic unsure of whether i'd taken anything or not and mind in a constant loop wanting it to end. I realised that LSD was just not for me and only ever took it a few times after in low doses (quarter of a tab) to compliment some MDMA or such. I then found shrooms and the exact same thing would happen to me every time I would take them. I put it down to extreme anxiety although it didn't quite explain full blown psychosis everytime I had them. Out of no-where the exact same thing started happening everytime I'd smoke bud. Exactly as you describe it in terms of feeling like my tounge was in my nose, my boody feeling extremely heavy vibrating sensations. To this day i've never been able to explain what it was. It's odd, because I take methamphetamine 6 days a week, i'm on SSRI's, i drink heavily, smoke cigarettes, and none of this ever makes me feel like I do the moment I have 1 puff of bud or take even a gram of shrooms.

I even tried DXM with a few friends and consumed 600mg. They all tripped relatively hard but I was psychoticly FUCKED. I lay on the lounge with a jumper over my face pleading it to end. I've given up on trying anymore of these type of drugs and I find it odd that meth sits so well with me, and i've never gone into a meth psychosis and generally handle being up a few days a lot better than everyone else. I am also from Australia if that makes any difference.

 

[blackskirt]

I think I was kind of like you OP. When I tried shrooms for the first time, I had researched them thoroughly and took a whole eighth. Even with all that research I really didn't know what to expect and everything I was experiencing (extreme time dilation, negative thought loops and anxiety and the fear of death/insanity/personal injury/incarceration) terrified me. About halfway through the trip, after what felt like days of being stuck in my own mind, worrying about things that mattered to me greatly at the time - I just gradually accepted that this 'lens of psilocybin' was going to be the way that I perceived reality, that this is what psychedelics were about.

My sense of ego and my connection with my body and this world were erased (not without great difficulty - you probably won't hear this often, but I even peed myself), I was experiencing full synesthesia (what I can only describe as "mushrooms" merged with all of my senses, of smell, taste, feeling, just everything). "I" didn't exist anymore, it was much like being dead, or not being anything at all. After a few more hours passed from the peak, I gradually felt my connection with this world returning - learned how my mind worked, how the world worked, learned to use my body again over the next hour or so. Although my body and the world felt and looked nothing like the way I remembered them to. I was noticing things throughout the whole day that I'd taken for granted - cleaned up every inch of my home and talked to people I cared about.

I've had a new respect for psychedelics ever since and have tripped a few times since then, to great personal benefit. Psychedelics aren't party drugs and shouldn't be taken carelessly - don't fight them, go with the flow and learn as much as you can about the way they can affect you and heal you.

 

[Thorns Have Roses]

An amorphous whole of shifting bloblike textures that is my body and every experience - I am just a TV screen that watches and is watched - I'm a spectator but what does that make me? - I don't exist at all and the people in the front seat are hallucinations - the universe is so tiny and compact and it's nothing more than what I'm seeing - everything I hear is lying to me - every sensation is just a thought in the great infinite machine and it doesn't really mean anything - I can disappear from this transient reality any time I want, it's only a dream - a dream for what? I am nothing but an entity that is all of existence, creating what it wants just by thinking about it, but all the things I think about are so boring and plain and lack substance - those faces I'm thinking of are my 'family', but they don't exist and I don't feel attached to them - I don't have a body, I'm just a swirling mass of texture -

I would consider that a good trip. I'd say you just have trouble letting go and enjoying yourself.

you don't believe what the road bend is grasping at the seams of a lettuce box

That's the only part that sounds psychotic. Word salad is what they call it.

 

[Flickering]

The LSD trip started ok but ended badly in what I can only describe as me babbeling like a lunatic, extreme paranoia, mind loops, and just like you, when these all started, the hallucinations ceased. Obviously these are all the symptoms of a bad trip and I dismissed them as just that and decided to try LSD again to get a better experience. Exact same thing happened to me and whilst all my friends giggled away, and got engaged in their fucked conversations, I paced around absolutely psychotic unsure of whether i'd taken anything or not and mind in a constant loop wanting it to end. I realised that LSD was just not for me and only ever took it a few times after in low doses (quarter of a tab) to compliment some MDMA or such. I then found shrooms and the exact same thing would happen to me every time I would take them. I put it down to extreme anxiety although it didn't quite explain full blown psychosis everytime I had them. Out of no-where the exact same thing started happening everytime I'd smoke bud. Exactly as you describe it in terms of feeling like my tounge was in my nose, my boody feeling extremely heavy vibrating sensations. To this day i've never been able to explain what it was. It's odd, because I take methamphetamine 6 days a week, i'm on SSRI's, i drink heavily, smoke cigarettes, and none of this ever makes me feel like I do the moment I have 1 puff of bud or take even a gram of shrooms.

So. There it is. Thanks for chipping in.

The good news there is that at least you can use MDMA. Assuming we have the same thing, I consider that a big plus. And perhaps if we try some phenethylamines, at very cautious doses, we'll have better luck? Some of them (correct me if I'm wrong, anyone) are chemically similar to MDMA.

A few questions:

Had you ever smoked weed before?
Did you ever try DXM at a lower dose? (I was fine at 300mg.)
In the psychotic episodes, did you feel as though your body's sensations no longer meant anything or made sense?
Did you ever in your life have episodes of Alice in Wonderland Syndrome, or experience strong spontaneous delirium?

I reckon we should both see a neurologist - what you're describing sounds like the exact same thing and I bet it has a name.

And ho - lee - fuck, initial consultation for the first enquiry I made is $370. $215 refundable by Medicare, as we're both in Aus. That's not to mention the MRI and follow-up appointment. Depends how much this interests you, I suppose.