Hah, I was wondering when I'd come across a schizo on bluelight. We have the same affliction. Be careful about your assertion, though. If my disorder taught me anything, it's to not assume I understand other people if I don't even understand myself. Don't assume you know what opiate addicts go thru if you have no a priori experience. Hell, because of how weird I am, I'm always that bottom 1% who experiences significantly different effects on the same drug as a different user. He has no idea what I go thru and I can only pretend to know what his trip is like. A schizo world is often lonely but don't try to create artificial bonds to fill that void, it's as unproductive as doing drugs IMO.
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BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic
Heroin Hurts
- Thread starter EyeLurk
- Start date
Hah, I was wondering when I'd come across a schizo on bluelight. We have the same affliction. Be careful about your assertion, though. If my disorder taught me anything, it's to not assume I understand other people if I don't even understand myself. Don't assume you know what opiate addicts go thru if you have no a priori experience. Hell, because of how weird I am, I'm always that bottom 1% who experiences significantly different effects on the same drug as a different user. He has no idea what I go thru and I can only pretend to know what his trip is like. A schizo world is often lonely but don't try to create artificial bonds to fill that void, it's as unproductive as doing drugs IMO.
?? that’s deep. But I also put out my backstory. An artificial bond is still a bond ?? I’m not offended by your comment and I’m most definitely not afraid to be who I am and want to know more about another human beings affliction. ? plus I know how they get down around here ?? I’m not scared ?
Nicomorphinist
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There is an experiment that I would like people who are not on narcotics but may have some laying around the house to try. Take one dose when you are not in physical pain or an unenviable state of mind. I think if you feel anything at all, it will be a touch of nausea and maybe a headache. And that will actually be it. It will be over in 1 to 10 hours depending on the drug. I don't even count fentanyl as a narcotic in the same sense as morphine -- it is a pharmacologically dirty (not a bad thing) general anaesthetic, so that doesn't count, and it has to be something you can swallow or dissolve under your tongue or comes as a nasal spray.
If you do feel really grand from it, maybe you can benefit from them. Narcotics were the anti-depressants and preferred anxiolytics in some cases until the late 1950s and are certainly easier for doctors and patients to manage and much less toxic than what has replaced them. Read the package insert about how to get off Prozac and things like that and tell me about physical dependence and habituation.
Not even something really potent like smack or hydromorphone will automatically make someone want to take it again under such circumstances. Not only are narcotics, like all drugs, inert substances with no ability to cogitate or move on their own and get into someone's bloodstream, I aver that narcotics are in fact much subtler drugs than things people take for fun like alcohol, C-Jam, pot, meth and some others, and people take narcotics because they need them to regulate their nervous system, viscera, and/or bones to feel better, to feel about as good as a lot of people do, and who is anyone to take that right from them? Managing one's nervous system is about as basic a human right as I can imagine.
The only people who do not fit that profile are big time poly-drugs users who quaff, pop, smoke, snort, shoot, rub into their belly, or stuff up their arsehole anything upon which they can lay their hands, and, when cutting down their chemical use, find themselves feeling sick because of the narcotics in their diet. And what exactly did they do to earn being treated like the government, a lot of the medical establishment, and others treat them?
Another case is people using narcotics to come down off meth, C-Jam, and things of that nature. That is in fact a medicinal use.
If you do feel really grand from it, maybe you can benefit from them. Narcotics were the anti-depressants and preferred anxiolytics in some cases until the late 1950s and are certainly easier for doctors and patients to manage and much less toxic than what has replaced them. Read the package insert about how to get off Prozac and things like that and tell me about physical dependence and habituation.
Not even something really potent like smack or hydromorphone will automatically make someone want to take it again under such circumstances. Not only are narcotics, like all drugs, inert substances with no ability to cogitate or move on their own and get into someone's bloodstream, I aver that narcotics are in fact much subtler drugs than things people take for fun like alcohol, C-Jam, pot, meth and some others, and people take narcotics because they need them to regulate their nervous system, viscera, and/or bones to feel better, to feel about as good as a lot of people do, and who is anyone to take that right from them? Managing one's nervous system is about as basic a human right as I can imagine.
The only people who do not fit that profile are big time poly-drugs users who quaff, pop, smoke, snort, shoot, rub into their belly, or stuff up their arsehole anything upon which they can lay their hands, and, when cutting down their chemical use, find themselves feeling sick because of the narcotics in their diet. And what exactly did they do to earn being treated like the government, a lot of the medical establishment, and others treat them?
Another case is people using narcotics to come down off meth, C-Jam, and things of that nature. That is in fact a medicinal use.
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Nicomorphinist
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There are certain cuts that can make street smack hurt, but in and of itself, heroin or diamorphine which is 3,6-diacetylmorphine, is a 3,6-diester of morphine and serves to deliver morphine faster and in greater quantities to the central nervous system, just like nicomorphine. It achieves a similar thing by a different method than hydromorphone, oxymorphone, dihydromorphine . . . So diacetylmorphine feels greeeeeaaaaat! It is really good when your spine is screwed up and it feels groovy doing it . . . I do actually prefer M myself, however . . .
Smack hurts
Smack scars
If you mix it with oil from a car
Any vein
You can feel
Please use your filter wheel
Ground glass can cause the pain
And sand is bad for veins
Look out for a cloud
In your rig when using tap water or rain
Ooooh oooh smack hurts
I do D, I know
And even so
I know a thing the Krankenschwester
Taught me about morphine esters
They really work a lot
They really work a lot
Just if you're cooking up
Don't shoot it when it's hot
Ooh, ooh smack hurts
Some folks think of dissipation
Or fast decline of the whole nation
Some rehab shitheads with their ratiocinations
They're not fooling me
I know it isn't true
I know it isn't true
Smack's like nicomorphine
If it's pure and true
Oooh ooh smack hurts
Oooh ooh smack hurts
Smack hurts
Smack scars
If you mix it with oil from a car
Any vein
You can feel
Please use your filter wheel
Ground glass can cause the pain
And sand is bad for veins
Look out for a cloud
In your rig when using tap water or rain
Ooooh oooh smack hurts
I do D, I know
And even so
I know a thing the Krankenschwester
Taught me about morphine esters
They really work a lot
They really work a lot
Just if you're cooking up
Don't shoot it when it's hot
Ooh, ooh smack hurts
Some folks think of dissipation
Or fast decline of the whole nation
Some rehab shitheads with their ratiocinations
They're not fooling me
I know it isn't true
I know it isn't true
Smack's like nicomorphine
If it's pure and true
Oooh ooh smack hurts
Oooh ooh smack hurts
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FuckinAcidMan
Bluelighter
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it's like having a really crazy/interesting/unhealthy to be around ex girlfriend i wanna see even tho it's a bad idea
i've only done oxy/hydrocodone mostly, I can't imagine the cravings that heroin probably leaves in it's wake
i've only done oxy/hydrocodone mostly, I can't imagine the cravings that heroin probably leaves in it's wake
Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
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- 84,998
To me its a contradiction to say a strong pain killer hurts, when I did enough it felt beautiful right to the end. The consequences of my addiction were very painful though.
OMG ? a real live Bluelighter. You the one I was looking for and you bought more with you? Thank you ?
Thank you ?
Thank you ? I understand that example cause it feels like you’re living life and it’s exciting and invigorating
??? OMG you took it to the end zone with this. I’m about to google this. ?
Is that the song love hurts love sca
is this love hurts by Nazareth ??
Quere
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This is so true. When I was a teen I was taking DHC with my buddy and although I'd used it a bunch as well as regular codeine and loved it, he hadn't got high before.
So I gave him some, and some more, and some more and he keeps telling me he doesn't feel anything lol.
Then he tells me he keeps falling asleep and having weird dreams and I'm like, oh shit this guy is fucking nodding out hard but he didn't even feel the buzz lol.
Opioids in alot of ways are much more subtle than weed or alcohol.
And what I can't stand is when 'straight' people tell me 'oh I'll never do meth or heroin cause I know I'd like it too much and become addicted' it's like we as a society ascribe magical powers to these drugs as though they can take you over or this idea that heroin is the ultimate pleasure in the universe and you do it once and then the rest of your life is hollow without it which is just not how it happens.
FutureReference
Bluelighter
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You don't seem to mean harm but your sentiments are judgmental. We all have different plights and you went from "heroin hurts" to then generalizing all opioids. As a veteran of 5 tours and 20+ years in active service, "the greatest feeling I knew" was normal life. Not being in chronic pain all day. Opioids are a godsend. I am not fully myself but am able to just walk my dog and do things I cannot do normally anymore. It has not effected my family or friends as, well, why would it? If anything it has given me more time with them that normally would be spent in bed.
Everybody uses things for their own reasons and you cannot judge or assume especially considering you have never even done an opiate lol. It is far from "the best feeling" and literally just provides relief. A buddy of mine had issues getting medication after the military and was on heroin for 4 years. He is now on Opana and describes heroin as a "dirty feeling that barely gave relief". Recreationally it may feel good, but so does Xanax or Marijuana. Diamorphine is given medicinally in some instances and opioids have saved more people than you realize just by giving them part of their life back.
Everybody uses things for their own reasons and you cannot judge or assume especially considering you have never even done an opiate lol. It is far from "the best feeling" and literally just provides relief. A buddy of mine had issues getting medication after the military and was on heroin for 4 years. He is now on Opana and describes heroin as a "dirty feeling that barely gave relief". Recreationally it may feel good, but so does Xanax or Marijuana. Diamorphine is given medicinally in some instances and opioids have saved more people than you realize just by giving them part of their life back.
Yea ?? that’s what I was thinking. I’m not even going to lie sometimes it sounds like an elusive exclusive club but anybody can get in but the lifestyle is how you continue or leave the club ??
Nicomorphinist
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Yes indeed . . . another Nazareth song I always found interesting was "Hair of the Dog" because I had no idea what 90 per cent of the lyrics were -- I thought I heard, for instance "big faker, salt shaker/I've been told about Cruz/Shake up a midnight soda/What they've been sayin must be true/Red hot mama/Burnt pyjamas/They aren't going to stick to meeee" and so on
Yes I understand. ?? I did miss the point of separating heroin opioids and opiates. I can’t imagine living with a physical pain everyday ? but bluelight always says don’t ever use pain meds recreationally because there might be a day when you really need them and they won’t be as effective because of the tolerance you built. I also know that the body changes so meds change and that’s under doctors supervision
I only knew that because I heard it in a commercial ??
Nicomorphinist
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All correct, and there is indeed enough of a subjective and objective difference amongst, just to mention the strong opiates and semi-synthetics, the effects of morphine, 14-dihydromorphinones like hydromorphone and oxymorphone, morphine esters, dihydromorphine, and hydromorphinol that they really all should be available for medical use in all locales -- and then there are others like morphazones, halogenated morphine derivatives, and morphides which clearly have still different structure-activity relationships. And oxycodone and hydrocodone can be used up into the same range and have their own unique profiles of action and feelings.
The cleaner feeling (and scalability: I definitely think it can actually be used to kill more pain without causing unconsciousness than a lot of other narcotics) of oxymorphone, the pins and needles of morphine, and a dirtier, maybe more everything-but-the-kitchen-sink feeling with morphine esters are probably due to a number of things, with the more obvious ones the relative histamine release, the effect on other neurotransmitters and hormones, and the receptor-activation profile, and what if anything the drug does to other non-opioid receptors. Certainly the unusual stimulation of oxycodone probably has multiple causes too -- if it is not mixed with something it keeps me up like dextroamphetamine and has that methylphenidate-C-Jam dopaminergic stimulant feeling. There was another third element that I later pegged as being a little like pyrovalerone . . .
Both of the above also may have to do with the fact that there are other opioid receptors, and subtypes of the current four, thought to exist and the ζ opioid receptor was finally confirmed in 2017 I think it was, and also the nociceptive, NMDA, and Gaba systems may be more complex too and may have additional receptors in them as well.
Nicomorphinist
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"Hair of the Dog", named for the album, originally called Heir of the Dog for obvious reasons, is an interesting song and I hope becomes a rallying song for people fighting the people pushing the fake opioid cri$i$ . . . the chorus is, of course "Now your're messin/With a son of a bitch" &c
Nicomorphinist
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I also think that (and I guess this happens often enough that I have seen it referred to at least obliquely in some books on related subjects) that even someone who shot smack or hydromorphone or dipipanone as their first narcotic experience when they had no pain and were feeling all right in general, they would have the fraction of the rush that is a physical effect of histamine release and vasodilation, but not the rest of the rush, or any of the bang, which would be replaced with a rapid jolt of nausea, maybe projectile vomiting, and a headache similar to that of caffeine withdrawal. So it would be like the result of the experiment with Vikes or whatever along with a hot flash.
When people feel better, they feel good: the euphoria comes from transition from an unpleasant state to a good one in large measure, and even the part directly caused by any part of the μ and δ opioid agonism would be this rapidly increasing, quickly dissipating, je ne sais quoi that the uninitiated experimenter will not enjoy at all, mainly because he or she will not notice it in all likelihood, and even if it is noticed, not know what it is. If they get that feeling that is described from hydromorphone (Dilaudid) and oxymorphone (Blues) in Drugstore Cowboy, the maybe the experimenter was in more distress or depression than they realised.
After any kind of drug haul everyone in the crew indulged. I laughed to myself as I pictured blues or Dilaudid in such great amounts that the spoon would literally be overflowing. Upon entering my vein the drug would start a warm itch that would surge along until the brain consumed it in a gentle explosion that began in the back of the neck and rose rapidly until I felt such pleasure that the world sympathised and took on a soft and lofty appeal. Everything was grand then. Your worst enemy he wasn't so bad. The ants in the grass they were just you know doin' their thing. Everything took on the rosy hue of unlimited success You could do no wrong And as long as it lasted life was beautiful.
-- Drugstore Cowboy,
pp 32 of the 1990 Edition
by James Fogle
Copyright © 1974 Delta Publishers